SuzukiSavage.com - Halvors O2 tuning

rfw2003

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Re: Halvors O2 tuning
Reply #75 - 09/24/12 at 11:34:54

Halvor, isn't that just a narrow band Lambada sensor/guage.

If so then it's gonna be awful hard to dial in the jetting with that as narrow band sensors aren't really accurate enough to give you the readings you need. They are more useful to just telling you that you are either rich or lean as compared to a lambada of 1, or in the case of gasoline burning engine a 14.7:1 ratio.

You really need a wide band sensor and gauge/controller to do what your trying to do.

R.F.

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1996 Savage, Corbin Seat, K&N filter, Slip Streamer Enterprise II windshield, LED bullet signals, Cat's eye LED tail light Ryca reverse cone long muffler

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Halvor

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Re: Halvors O2 tuning
Reply #76 - 09/24/12 at 12:08:28

You might be right about that. I do not know what kind it is. But the numbers make sense. When breaking on the motor it leans out. And it pops excactly on o2=20. But the measurements might be wrong? But it looks very right when driving.

I tried with 180 main for fun. I did not expect results. It went to lean very fast again. I tried to losen the tank cap. I though I had solved it becauce it did not go to lean for a kilometer or so. I was riding and shouting solved solved.... But down a steep hill it started to go to lean again. After that it was like before. I seems lik bigger main jets results in faster lean conditions. I drive on pri. But I would like to try the raptor???

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Savage 96, Enfield muffler. Lowered forks. Progressive springs Drag bar. big head light. GL1000 fender. small back light. Black. mini turn lamps, vm36 180-20. o2 sensor ! K&N

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rfw2003 Serious Thumper Offline SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 1108 Yantis, TX	Re: Halvors O2 tuning Reply #77 - 09/24/12 at 12:31:32 An easy way to tell, is that most wide band o2 sensors have 6 wires on them. Less then that it's a narrow band unit. R.F.
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Halvor

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Re: Halvors O2 tuning
Reply #78 - 07/09/13 at 03:48:16

Finally finished. To make a long story short: I found out that my sensor shows high o2 on both rich and lean conditions. I found out by leaning out the engine downhill. I have tried several jets between 150 and 300. THeese are the sizes where the engine will not run clean anymoore. Another thing I learned is that afterfire can make the sensor wrong. A ignition switch off sets the sensor back to normal. I think it resets. I tuned after the sensor and what resulted in highes speed. THe sensor show optimum mix up to 75 mph with the 180 jet. After that, WOT, it shows high o2 (19). I suspect my home made exhaust is not optimal? With jets bigger or smaller the high 02 conditions were reached at lower speeds. Between 50 and 70 MPH.

I switched to raptor petcoc, vm36 carb (not nesessary). I ended up with 180main and 20 pilot (VM JETTING). It runs quite good. 100 MPH and have wery good bottom end. I can make small wheelies, and it is crazy fun to drive fast in curves.

What can be done now? I might try a bigger muffle to try if it is more power around the WOT? And if the high 02 conditions can be avoided? Maybee it can not run with low o2 at WOT? I have an Enfiled muffler from ebay-india. An open short bottle muffle. I will put in a baffle and try if it is silent enough, and see how it runs. It will provide better breathing, but it must not wear out my eardrums.

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Savage 96, Enfield muffler. Lowered forks. Progressive springs Drag bar. big head light. GL1000 fender. small back light. Black. mini turn lamps, vm36 180-20. o2 sensor ! K&N

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Dave

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Re: Halvors O2 tuning
Reply #79 - 07/09/13 at 07:03:11

Halvor:

I used an oxygen sensor to set up my VM36, and it sounds like we ended up with our jetting being really close. Mu sensor acted very well, and gave consistent readings and made the jetting go really well. For a while I was experiencing a lean condition when I opened up the throttle at normal crusing speeds and the engine was accelerating - but the mixture was good at low and wide open throttle settings. If I was in high gear and opened up the throttle fully the 195 main provided a steady consistent reading and it was at a great ratio for power. The ultimate cure to the lean condition while rolling on the throttle was to drop the clip on the slide needle. I ended jup dropping it twice to get the mixture to be ideal.

My bike ran the best with a 195 main jet, 20 pilot jet, and the needle set 2 notches below the middle notch.

I have not yet gone 100mph....but I bet it will. I get 58mpg when riding at highway speeds up to 65mph. I really like the way the O2 sensor took the guess work out of the process. The only trouble I have with my O2 sensor is that it was made for the inside of a car, and it is impossible to read in direct sunlight. I had to do my jetting in the evenings as the sun was going down or on cloudy days.

NOTE: The jets listed are for the Mikuni VM36 carb, and not the stock LS650 carb.

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Halvor

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Re: Halvors O2 tuning
Reply #80 - 07/09/13 at 08:56:33

Interesting. Do you have stock header and dyna? Drag pipe? Have you tried top speed with a smaller jet without looking at the o2? I have kn airfilter and an opened dyna muffler.

Two interesting links
http://www.mikuni.com/pdf/vmmanual.pdf
http://www.braigasen.com/Mikuni_jetting_chart_four_stroke.htm
Braigasen

says 185 main. I think most end up with 180-185?

100mph is scary on this bike. It feels like a space rocket without control, and do not feel safe. I did 90 mph ut a steep hill.

Fun fun. But curves is most fun. My bike is lowered and stiffer. Big improvement.

Halvor (Norway)

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Savage 96, Enfield muffler. Lowered forks. Progressive springs Drag bar. big head light. GL1000 fender. small back light. Black. mini turn lamps, vm36 180-20. o2 sensor ! K&N

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strang Senior Member Offline Posts: 387 london Gender:	Re: Halvors O2 tuning Reply #81 - 07/09/13 at 16:35:45 can someone outline what parts to buy and where to buy them? how exactly do you install one of these?
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mjs3790225 Full Member Offline Finally making a presence! Posts: 103 Orlando, Fl Gender:	Re: Halvors O2 tuning Reply #82 - 07/09/13 at 16:40:21 Great updates on this thread! Nice work out there.
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justin_o_guy2 Serious Thumper Offline What happened? Posts: 55279 East Texas, 1/2 dallas/la.	Re: Halvors O2 tuning Reply #83 - 07/09/13 at 17:55:46 strang wrote on 07/09/13 at 16:35:45: can someone outline what parts to buy and where to buy them? how exactly do you install one of these? iirc, its all broken down early in the thread,, but, i didnt go look,
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strang

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Re: Halvors O2 tuning
Reply #84 - 07/10/13 at 04:51:14

Just checking this is the procedure:

So to install one of these on your bike you need
- the o2 sensor itself (6 wires as that is a wide band)
- the o2 gauge

Then you drill a hole in your muffler, weld on a nut with a thread that matches the sensor, then screw the sensor into your muffler. Then connect up wires from sensor to gauge.
Is this the deal? Does it make a difference where you put the sensor? i.e. distance from header? Are any makes recommended? Are they all basically generic?

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Dave

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Re: Halvors O2 tuning
Reply #85 - 07/10/13 at 05:24:39

Halvor wrote on 07/09/13 at 08:56:33:

Interesting. Do you have stock header and dyna? Drag pipe? Have you tried top speed with a smaller jet without looking at the o2? I have kn airfilter and an opened dyna muffler.
Halvor (Norway)

I have the stock header and a muffler I made myself. I have a large UNI foam clamp on filter (4"dia. x 10" long).

I have not ever tried top speed......82mph is the fastest I have gone so far and it was still pulling strong when I slowed down. Conditions have not been right for me to do a high speed run...too much headwind or too much traffic.

My jetting method was to first establish the main jet by making full throttle acceleration runs and putting in a main jet that provided a mixture of around 12.6 air/fuel. Then I put in a pilot jet that would allow the proper idle mixture at 1.5 - 2 turns out on the air screw. Then the mid range and partial throttle settings were adjusted to provide a mixture of around 13:1 by moving the slide needle clip. My O2 gauge is a narrow band 2 wire oxygen sensor and the narrow band is fine for setting up a gasoline carb. It would not work with alcohol or nitromethane fuels or very rich or lean mixtures. The narrow band sensors are far cheaper than the wide band ones.

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Dave

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Re: Halvors O2 tuning
Reply #86 - 07/10/13 at 06:02:46

strang wrote on 07/09/13 at 16:35:45:

can someone outline what parts to buy and where to buy them? how exactly do you install one of these?

Here is the thread to my O2 sensor install for the stock carb, I have not documented the process for the Mikuni VM36. I am listing this link as an additional resource....not to take away from what Halvors has done. I installed my sensor closer to the head and I did this in a pipe that I only install while I am testing....it is not a permanent installation.
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1348491882/0

You can buy a cheap narrow band guage for $ 50 or less, a narrow band O2 sensor for $ 10, and a weld in bung for $ 10 or so....add some shipping costs and you will end up with about $ 100 in a working narow band sensor.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/52mm-BLACK-7-COLOR-LED-AIR-FUEL-AFR-RATIO-GAUGE-METER...

Working Wide Band kits are around $ 300 with sensor and you still need to buy the part to weld into your exhaust.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Auto-Meter-3378-Sport-Comp-Wide-Band-Air-Fuel-Ratio-K...

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verslagen1 YaBB Moderator ModSquad Offline Where there's a will, I want to be in it. Posts: 28886 L.A. California Gender:	Re: Halvors O2 tuning Reply #87 - 07/10/13 at 07:19:21 I made a short Tee section for the O2 port that goes in between the muffler and header. It's just long enough to push the front mounting bolt of the muff to the back hole of the bracket. This allows me to install it temporarily on any muffler.
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justin_o_guy2 Serious Thumper Offline What happened? Posts: 55279 East Texas, 1/2 dallas/la.	Re: Halvors O2 tuning Reply #88 - 07/10/13 at 08:08:28 working in a body shop, some guys had one specialty tool, someone else had a different one, no one had them all, we just loaned them back & forth, so no one had yo buy all of them,, this is a buy it, use it, park it tool. you guys connect the dots,,
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Dave

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Re: Halvors O2 tuning
Reply #89 - 07/10/13 at 10:14:06

justin_o_guy2 wrote on 07/10/13 at 08:08:28:

working in a body shop, some guys had one specialty tool, someone else had a different one, no one had them all, we just loaned them back & forth, so no one had yo buy all of them,,

this is a buy it, use it, park it tool.

you guys connect the dots,,

I bought my O2 meter and sensor about 25 years ago.....and I have used it 3 times. I used it the first time when setting up Webers on a sports car, then just last year I used it on a Savage, the again this year when I changed to the Mikuni VM36. Once you have the carb jetted properly you don't need it again.....till you make some other major change. I probably have abot $ 25 invested for each time I used it.....and the ability to know what is going on was worth the price of admission to me. I would have eventually gotten the right jets by trial and error....eventually!

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« Last Edit: 07/10/13 at 18:45:41 by Dave »

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