SuzukiSavage.com - Hi. New guy here with a couple quick questions.

Blue04Savage

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Re: Hi. New guy here with a couple quick questions
Reply #15 - 08/13/12 at 12:43:30

Alright cool. My bike only has 3500 miles on it right now, so i'm assuming that i'm good to go for awhile before I have to worry about adjusting valves, and the cam/timing chain correct? I'll just have a motorcycle dealer do that for me.

Any way to know when the valves need to be adjusted? I mean they sound loud to me as they are, but i'm told that is normal for these bikes, so i don't really know what "actual loud" is for these. Does that make sense?
Thanks again.

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Oldfeller--FSO

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Re: Hi. New guy here with a couple quick questions
Reply #16 - 08/13/12 at 12:49:29

Bill brings up an interesting point -- Savage oils vs "motorcycle oils"

A Savage, because of the flat tappet cam system it uses, requires 1,200 ppm of ZDDP to stay healthy. Some here say 1,500 ppm, some say 1,800 ppm. Key thing is there isn't enough ZDDP in any (but two) of the readily available oils.

BTW, Even Walmart counts Rotella T and T-6 as motorcycle oils -- Bill, ya gotta get with the program there, buddy.

Locally available motorcycle oils are now all rated (all but the two Rotellas that is) with JASO MA-2, a brand new oil standard that lowered ZDDP levels from 1,200-1,350 ppm down to 800-1,100 ppm. They did this because of all the new 2013 catalytic converter, fuel injected motorcycles coming out this year. So, JASO MA-2 is not good enough for a Savage engine's flat tappet cam/valve system.

Read this from our Tech Section and don't listen to Bill. Easy enough to remember to do, I think.

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1344471565/0#0

(Bill is entertaining though, you can tease him some if you want to. Just remember to be nice to him --- soon enough we will ALL be lined up on the porch with him, a rock'n and a cacklin' at each other in Billish. For example, you could ask him how to adjust your valves on your Savage, I always find that one entertaining.)

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bill67

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Re: Hi. New guy here with a couple quick questions
Reply #17 - 08/13/12 at 12:57:36

Oldfeller wrote the text section,He thinks Shell Rotella is the only oil made.Shell makes a motorcycle oil but isn't sold in the USA,Shell says in their motorcycle oil section that motorcycles are twice as rough on oil as cars,That the reason people should use motorcycle oil in motorcycles,On the bottles of Rotella its says nothing about for motorcycle.

Got to read the certs Bill, that fine print stuff where they say what the oil is good for. In with all the various types of heavy equipment that these particular Heavy Duty Engine Oils are approved for you will find JASO MA which in spec speak means "approved for use in non-catalytic equipped Japanese motorcycles that need oil in the 1,200 to 1,350 ppm of ZDDP levels"

Wink

The fine print on the jug counts as "data" and "facts", both of which make Bill break out in a rash,
so he tries to avoid them whenever he can.

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william h krumpen

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bill67 Serious Thumper Offline old tired Posts: 8517 genoa city wisconsin Gender:	Re: Hi. New guy here with a couple quick questions Reply #18 - 08/13/12 at 13:10:25 Type in Shell motorcycle oil,It say nothing about Rotella,One guy tried it and his clutch started slipping he say don't use it in motorcycles
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bill67 Serious Thumper Offline old tired Posts: 8517 genoa city wisconsin Gender:	Re: Hi. New guy here with a couple quick questions Reply #19 - 08/13/12 at 13:11:37 OF tell me something what other oil is good beside Rotella.
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Oldfeller--FSO

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Re: Hi. New guy here with a couple quick questions
Reply #20 - 08/13/12 at 13:15:34

bill67 wrote on 08/13/12 at 13:10:25:

Type in Shell motorcycle oil,It say nothing about Rotella,One guy tried it and his clutch started slipping he say don't use it in motorcycles

Bill, I call you on your sources on that last one. Who said it and where?

Hey Justin -- is your memory getting any better by any chance?

Are you sure you don't remember the Ugly Hillbilly, the BIG Hook or getting his list name changed permanently to Billshutter?

Dozens and dozens of us here use the Rotella products Bill, do you expect to say stuff like that and get away with it?

Hey Justin, what sort of oil does the Judge use? Does your clutch slip?

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Former Savage Owner

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arteacher Serious Thumper Offline Ride as if your naked and invisable! Posts: 2581 London ontario Gender:	Re: Hi. New guy here with a couple quick questions Reply #21 - 08/13/12 at 13:19:08 Blue04Savage.....see what I mean?
Back to top	white '07, Raask exh, Corbin seat, slipstreamer shie, Raptor, Routy's fwd controls, Baron tach, Frisco bars, Isogrips, Headlight and taillight modulators, Dial-a- jet, AME 9 deg chop kit, K&N air flt IP Logged

bill67

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Re: Hi. New guy here with a couple quick questions
Reply #22 - 08/13/12 at 13:20:20

Blue04Savage wrote on 08/13/12 at 12:43:30:

Alright cool. My bike only has 3500 miles on it right now, so i'm assuming that i'm good to go for awhile before I have to worry about adjusting valves, and the cam/timing chain correct? I'll just have a motorcycle dealer do that for me.

Any way to know when the valves need to be adjusted? I mean they sound loud to me as they are, but i'm told that is normal for these bikes, so i don't really know what "actual loud" is for these. Does that make sense?
Thanks again.

With a premium motorcycle oil your valves want need adjusting for 20000 miles.Any good motorcycle mechanic can tell by listening to your bike if the valve need adjusting,Same with cars when I was young. I am 73 years old have had a lot of cars trucks motorcycles snowmobiles bobcats and of lawnmowers.Plus being a contractor a lot of equipment with gasoline motors,Generators power cement finishers and etc,And I never went cheap with taking care of them.

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william h krumpen

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Oldfeller--FSO Serious Thumper ModSquad Offline Hobby is now "concentrated neuropany" Posts: 12647 Fayetteville, NC Gender:	Re: Hi. New guy here with a couple quick questions Reply #23 - 08/13/12 at 13:20:54 Yup, it's called an oil war .... we do that from time to time, don't we? Bill is feeling fiesty today, somebody else answer his questions for a while, I've got to go get ready for work.
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bill67

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Re: Hi. New guy here with a couple quick questions
Reply #24 - 08/13/12 at 13:25:53

Oldfeller--FSO wrote on 08/13/12 at 13:15:34:

bill67 wrote on 08/13/12 at 13:10:25:

Type in Shell motorcycle oil,It say nothing about Rotella,One guy tried it and his clutch started slipping he say don't use it in motorcycles

Bill, I call you on your sources on that last one. Who said it and where?

Hey Justin -- is your memory getting any better by any chance?

Are you sure you don't remember the Ugly Hillbilly, the BIG Hook or getting his list name changed permanently to Billshutter?

Dozens and dozens of us here use the Rotella products Bill, do you expect to say stuff like that and get away with it?

Hey Justin, what sort of oil does the Judge use? Does your clutch slip?

Type is Shell motorcycle oil and you will see it.

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william h krumpen

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bill67 Serious Thumper Offline old tired Posts: 8517 genoa city wisconsin Gender:	Re: Hi. New guy here with a couple quick questions Reply #25 - 08/13/12 at 13:33:34 OF tell me something what other oil is good beside Rotella.
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Oldfeller--FSO

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Re: Hi. New guy here with a couple quick questions
Reply #26 - 08/13/12 at 13:44:07

Bill doesn't know how to find anything, including his own source materials
(this leads some to think he makes it all up outta his own noggin).

He also can't find our own tech section listing on oils.

But then again, he's Bill -- at least he is consistent at that.

NEW LISTING: AMAZON.COM PRIME (FREE SHIPPING) OILS)

We realize folks are going to have to get on line to source Savage compatible oils and boosters. AMAZON.COM has the best prices seen so far, so we list the appropriate Amazon oils here along with a notation if they are able to be shipped for free under Prime. We also know this Prime free shipping comes and goes according to whether there is stock on hand at your nearest Amazon owned warehouse, so PLEASE watch your shipping charges as you check out for any unplanned surprises.

IF YOU WANT A REAL "overkill" SUPER-OIL (way way beyond reasonable needs) Redline 10W40 Motorcycle Oil is $11 a quart here (bought by the case). This motorcycle oil whups everybody on ZDDP by like twice over, so don't be looking for a measly mere JASO rating on it. Bill looks at this red stuff and is filled with angst and longing as it is within our $12 a quart budget and his Klotz is only half the oil this is and Klotz costs even more (and then you have to pay for shipping on top of that). Specs are here http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=109&pcid=21 Free Amazon Prime shipping is at http://www.amazon.com/Red-Line-42424-10W40-Motorcycle/dp/B0084DZ08W/ref=sr_1_...

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rfw2003

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Re: Hi. New guy here with a couple quick questions
Reply #27 - 08/13/12 at 13:49:45

bill67 wrote on 08/13/12 at 13:33:34:

OF tell me something what other oil is good beside Rotella.

He never said no other oil was good for our use, what the purpose of the recommended oil thread was, is for easily locally obtainable oil at a low cost. There are lots of Syn oils, and I'm sure some racing specific dino oils out there that are good for our little savage but most of those exceed the cost proposed plus they are not locally available in the majority of areas around the U.S. Currently Rotella Triple T and Rotella T6 are the only cost effective and locally available oils that are everywhere.

As for you claim that Rotella isn't for Motorcycle use, go pull the tech sheet from Shells site for Rotella Triple protection and you will see that it specifically says for use in motorcycles as well for recommended applications. In another post here I did link to the PDF's on both T6 and Triple T.

Most motorcycle specific oils now are moving onto the new JASO MA-2 spec which is effectively neutering them for use in any motorcycle that uses a flat tappet style system since they are dropping the ZDDP levels so that the CATS will last the 100K miles the EPA mandates.

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bill67 Serious Thumper Offline old tired Posts: 8517 genoa city wisconsin Gender:	Re: Hi. New guy here with a couple quick questions Reply #28 - 08/13/12 at 14:01:25 Auto stores around me carry Amsoil.As far as being high priced oil your only talking maybe $20 a year more for a premium oil.And you can get the right weight oil Suzuki calls for.
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Oldfeller--FSO

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Re: Hi. New guy here with a couple quick questions
Reply #29 - 08/13/12 at 15:28:24

bill67 wrote on 08/13/12 at 14:01:25:

Auto stores around me carry Amsoil.As far as being high priced oil your only talking maybe $20 a year more for a premium oil.And you can get the right weight oil Suzuki calls for.

Bill, as usual you toss out tidbits that aren't completely real.

Back in 1987, a 10w40 multi-weight was a dino oil -- there were no synthetics for motorcycle oils.

Now that we do have full synthetics, they can flow better at low temps while keeping full weight grade much better at temperatures hundreds of degrees beyond what a dino oil can take.

A 5w40 full synthetic is functionally much better than a 10w40 dino, and a 15w40 dino snuggles in nicely between the 10w40 and 20w50 dinos that are listed in the Suzuki owners manual.

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