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[SOLVED] No Mid-Range Throttle (Read 383 times)
l33tl4m3r
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[SOLVED] No Mid-Range Throttle
06/20/12 at 09:56:01
 
First off, hello!

I've been reading around the forums for a couple of weeks now, since I bought my savage, and I have found a wealth of information and a very helpful community! I was very glad to see this!

I bought a 2003 Savage with ~10k miles on it a few weeks ago and have come across a few issues I would like to discuss with everyone, see if I can't find a solution!

I found this post;
[Link in next post]

...which sounds about like my issue.

The bike starts and idles fine, but when I apply the choke, the bike dies. This is not a big deal as the bike starts and the engine sounds strong, I only bring it up because it sounds like the issue the guy in the linked post was having.

My MAIN issue is that after 1/4+ throttle is applied I almost completely lose acceleration and power.

The engine will rev very high if I keep twisting the throttle but the bike does very little to get moving.

The only way I can REALLY get the bike to accelerate without any problem is if I move through the gears slowly with the throttle only applied at about 1/4 open until it get s up to speed.

The post I linked mentioned the improperly set diaphragm in the carb, in fact, most of his post sounds exactly like my issue.

I was curious if there were any other thoughts, ideas, or advice.

I am in Albuquerque, NM, so I am in a very high and dry climate.

Thanks in advance! Let me know if I can provide any other details!
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« Last Edit: 06/21/12 at 21:11:13 by l33tl4m3r »  

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l33tl4m3r
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Re: Dies When Choke Applied - No Mid-Range Throttl
Reply #1 - 06/20/12 at 09:56:14
 
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: Dies When Choke Applied - No Mid-Range Throttl
Reply #2 - 06/20/12 at 10:09:36
 
Look up Serowbots Petcock troubleshooting

Consider a good carb cleaning, could be a vacuum issue, could be a sticky slide, or both, Could be crap in the carb, too I guess.. The age/miles say it sat a lot,,
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OK.... so what's the
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Re: Dies When Choke Applied - No Mid-Range Throttl
Reply #3 - 06/20/12 at 10:13:48
 
Quote:
The engine will rev very high if I keep twisting the throttle but the bike does very little to get moving.


If it will rev really high, but won't go... it's not a carb issue... it's the clutch...
Check that the cable adjustment isn't too tight... if that's okay, you've got clutch problems...
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l33tl4m3r
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Re: Dies When Choke Applied - No Mid-Range Throttl
Reply #4 - 06/20/12 at 10:22:32
 
justin_o_guy2 wrote on 06/20/12 at 10:09:36:
Look up Serowbots Petcock troubleshooting

Consider a good carb cleaning, could be a vacuum issue, could be a sticky slide, or both, Could be crap in the carb, too I guess.. The age/miles say it sat a lot,,


True, it does seem to have sat for quite some time, the big pain I have at this point are the soft screws in the carb I have come across so far.

Slow, deliberate turning and I started to bite into the screws and could have stripped them if I kept turning.

Any tips for getting those screws out?

Serowbot wrote on 06/20/12 at 10:13:48:
Quote:
The engine will rev very high if I keep twisting the throttle but the bike does very little to get moving.


If it will rev really high, but won't go... it's not a carb issue... it's the clutch...
Check that the cable adjustment isn't too tight... if that's okay, you've got clutch problems...


I had also considered this, I am going to try loosening up the clutch cable some to see if the clutch needs to settle more but the odd part is that I only lose power and acceleration after the first 1/4 of the throttle.

From closed to 1/4 or so it accelerates and has decent power response.

I'll let you know what I find when I loosen the cable up some to see if it needs to travel more.

---

Thanks again for the help!
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Re: Dies When Choke Applied - No Mid-Range Throttl
Reply #5 - 06/20/12 at 10:31:24
 
l33tl4m3r wrote on 06/20/12 at 10:22:32:
True, it does seem to have sat for quite some time, the big pain I have at this point are the soft screws in the carb I have come across so far.

Slow, deliberate turning and I started to bite into the screws and could have stripped them if I kept turning.

Any tips for getting those screws out?




Impact driver, best fitting phillips head you can find (JAS if possible).. and BLAP.. out they go!

If they strip with that treatment, they were going to strip anyway.  Use vice grips.   And replace with allen head screws in any case.
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Re: Dies When Choke Applied - No Mid-Range Throttl
Reply #6 - 06/20/12 at 10:57:21
 
l33tl4m3r wrote on 06/20/12 at 10:22:32:
True, it does seem to have sat for quite some time, the big pain I have at this point are the soft screws in the carb I have come across so far.

Slow, deliberate turning and I started to bite into the screws and could have stripped them if I kept turning.

Any tips for getting those screws out?
...............

---

Thanks again for the help!


pb blaster soaking before hand helps, a vice to hold the carb still helps also.

and replace them as already mentioned.
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Re: No Mid-Range Throttle - Dies When Choke Applie
Reply #7 - 06/20/12 at 11:33:28
 
If youll take a #2 Phillips & grind the tip down till the X fits in the slots, youll be ahead. Or, find a JIS tip.
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Re: No Mid-Range Throttle - Dies When Choke Applie
Reply #8 - 06/20/12 at 11:40:07
 
check your vac line for gas or the sewrowbots petcock check.

a good going over of the carb, get it clean, and together correctly.

you're a mile high which is about the only place stock jetting works, so take that into consideration when you have it apart.

apply the penetrating oil, vice grips on the head if you strip 'em.  and replace with good stuff.
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Re: No Mid-Range Throttle - Dies When Choke Applie
Reply #9 - 06/20/12 at 12:36:20
 
I need more information. Some of the stuff you've said is very confusing.

When you say the "engine revs very high" do you mean it revs when the bike is sitting still like when it's in neutral or when the the clutch is pulled? Or do you mean it revs really high when you're moving but the bike isn't accelerating?

Also, when you say it dies when you choke the bike, is this when the bike is warm or cold?

The choke should never be pulled when the engine is warm, it will allow far too much fuel into the engine causing it to run rich and stall. If the bike will only run when the choke is pulled, this means the bike is running off the choke. The choke on this type of carb isn't actually a choke, it's an "enrichment." Basically, it's a separate carb that runs really rich.

I have a feeling this is simply carb related and that you just need to clean the carb.
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Re: No Mid-Range Throttle - Dies When Choke Applie
Reply #10 - 06/20/12 at 13:12:37
 
Thanks for all the tips on getting the screws out, I'll let you guys know how that goes.

I bet the carb needs a good cleaning.

verslagen1 wrote on 06/20/12 at 11:40:07:
check your vac line for gas or the sewrowbots petcock check.

a good going over of the carb, get it clean, and together correctly.

you're a mile high which is about the only place stock jetting works, so take that into consideration when you have it apart.

apply the penetrating oil, vice grips on the head if you strip 'em.  and replace with good stuff.


After checking the clutch cable, the petcock is next in line, gonna make sure it's nice and clean and working correctly.

Thanks for the heads-up on the jetting for my altitude.

Start simple, right? lol!

Cavi Mike wrote on 06/20/12 at 12:36:20:
I need more information. Some of the stuff you've said is very confusing.

When you say the "engine revs very high" do you mean it revs when the bike is sitting still like when it's in neutral or when the the clutch is pulled? Or do you mean it revs really high when you're moving but the bike isn't accelerating?

Also, when you say it dies when you choke the bike, is this when the bike is warm or cold?

The choke should never be pulled when the engine is warm, it will allow far too much fuel into the engine causing it to run rich and stall. If the bike will only run when the choke is pulled, this means the bike is running off the choke. The choke on this type of carb isn't actually a choke, it's an "enrichment." Basically, it's a separate carb that runs really rich.

I have a feeling this is simply carb related and that you just need to clean the carb.


It idles fine, but when I put it into gear, let the clutch out and begin to move as soon as I pass about 1/4 throttle open and the clutch is all the way out the bike accelerates very slowly and no matter how far I turn out the throttle it does not move or respond any faster just simply revs the engine higher.

It does still accelerate but at a slower rate than it does in the first 1/4 of the throttle.

With the choke, as it's very hot around here right now I assume that the bike is dying due to the exact reason you are stating, it is running too rich and stalling out.

Hope this helps and makes sense!

---

Thanks again, everyone!
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OK.... so what's the
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Re: No Mid-Range Throttle - Dies When Choke Applie
Reply #11 - 06/20/12 at 13:17:35
 
You might also check that your wheels are turning freely... No sticky wheel bearings or brakes...
Front brake will have a slight audible drag, that's okay... but it should turn freely...
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Re: No Mid-Range Throttle - Dies When Choke Applie
Reply #12 - 06/20/12 at 13:25:36
 
Serowbot wrote on 06/20/12 at 13:17:35:
You might also check that your wheels are turning freely... No sticky wheel bearings or brakes...
Front brake will have a slight audible drag, that's okay... but it should turn freely...


Will do, I had read that about making sure your brakes were free and not causing a lack of acceleration and had totally forgot to test it out.
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Re: No Mid-Range Throttle - Dies When Choke Applie
Reply #13 - 06/20/12 at 13:28:14
 
It does still accelerate but at a slower rate than it does in the first 1/4 of the throttle.


As throttle opens vacuum is used. Id check the vac line,

Dont go messin with the petcock, just do the Serowbot Petcock test.

If the vac line isnt the problem, ( easiest proof is replace it), Id bet the slide is sticking, clean the carb up & No OIl or even fingerprints on the slide.
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Re: No Mid-Range Throttle - Dies When Choke Applie
Reply #14 - 06/20/12 at 13:32:49
 
justin_o_guy2 wrote on 06/20/12 at 13:28:14:
It does still accelerate but at a slower rate than it does in the first 1/4 of the throttle.


As throttle opens vacuum is used. Id check the vac line,

Dont go messin with the petcock, just do the Serowbot Petcock test.

If the vac line isnt the problem, ( easiest proof is replace it), Id bet the slide is sticking, clean the carb up & No OIl or even fingerprints on the slide.


Now, with the vac line, I should be able to turn the petcock to on and pinch the vac line causing the engine to idle higher until it dies, yes?

Should I just pull it off and look through it?

Or am I confusing this with another test method, lol? It's very possible, I've done a LOT of reading lately!

EDIT: Also, if the vac line is the issue would switching to Primary correct my lagging acceleration?
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