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Loud knocking, I'm going in... (Read 532 times)
SinglesGoinSteady
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Loud knocking, I'm going in...
02/24/12 at 11:48:53
 
I bought my '98 (5700 miles) for a street tracker conversion.  It had a loud knocking sound (does not sound like chain lash).  The sound is like heavy metal hitting heavy metal deep inside.  You can feel it in the bars.  The knock is NOT there at idle, but, with any throttle it comes on then gets drowned out by typical motor noise at high rpms.  It does sound like it could be a valve smacking something, but, from what I read there is a gap between the piston and valves at TDC.  So maybe it's a loose bearing or wrist pin.  It just seems so unlikely for a motor with so few miles on it.  

I already checked the cam chain tensioner and had an extension welded on.  It was out quite a ways, like 0.61".  I borrowed a boroscope and my next step is to look in the cylinder, bottom of valves and top of piston for signs of damage.  Then take the valve cover off and look for damage and the valves and check the gaps.  After reassembly and firing up, if it still knocks, I guess time to take the head off.  If you have any suggestions, let me know.  Thanks guys.
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: Loud knocking, I'm going in...
Reply #1 - 02/24/12 at 16:04:54
 
Drain the oil into something clean a magnet wont stick to. Run a magnet thru it & see what kinda metal you get.
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Re: Loud knocking, I'm going in...
Reply #2 - 02/24/12 at 17:33:41
 
Most likely wouldn't last long if the valves and piston were fighting.

I had an '88 with a knock, turned out to be a burnt piston.
you could see it from the top, little melted section.
colapsed on the rings.
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SinglesGoinSteady
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Re: Loud knocking, I'm going in...
Reply #3 - 02/24/12 at 20:29:03
 
I got the boroscope in the sparkplug hole, amazing technology.   Cylinder looks good, I can see the arrow on it and I can see the arrow on the piston top.  Piston top is clean and shiny except one big quarter size looking spot of oily carbon gunk.  But, one intake valve looks like it has a little chip out of the edge.  Exhaust valves are white, lean?  Intake valves look black and sooty.  Waiting to hear from a friend tomorrow to confirm if I'm seeing a chunky off the valve, but, otherwise it looks like time to yank the motor...  Any thoughts are appreciated.  See my sketch below haha.
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Re: Loud knocking, I'm going in...
Reply #4 - 02/24/12 at 21:01:47
 
Interesting project.  Sorry for the captain-obvious question but have you checked the valve timing.  Maybe it jumped a tooth before you fixed the cam chain tensioner?

I'd replace both intake and both exhaust valves, since you have a suspected collision on an intake valve and the exhaust valves may have gotten excessively hot. A few savages have dropped exhaust valves, probably because of the heat.  See if the white spacer mod has been done on your bike.. if not, do that and bump the main jet up one.
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: Loud knocking, I'm going in...
Reply #5 - 02/24/12 at 22:11:05
 
LOng version

both intake and both exhaust


Short version

All Four
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SinglesGoinSteady
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Re: Loud knocking, I'm going in...
Reply #6 - 02/24/12 at 23:29:14
 
Roger all of that guys.   Bout'tard:  I did the valve check, but, may in my unfamiliarness have done it in the intake TDC, but, it ran the same as before, feeling rather gutless.  Will check again before head removal.  P.S. long live Trailer Park Boys.
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SinglesGoinSteady
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Re: Loud knocking, I'm going in...
Reply #7 - 02/24/12 at 23:30:30
 
What is estimated time for engine removal for a Savage newbie?
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Boule’tard
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Re: Loud knocking, I'm going in...
Reply #8 - 02/25/12 at 07:12:17
 
Maybe one of those Ryca conversion guys like MotoBuddha will know how long it takes.
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Re: Loud knocking, I'm going in...
Reply #9 - 02/25/12 at 07:55:10
 
I've done it in 2 hours, but I've done it a few times.   Grin
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Re: Loud knocking, I'm going in...
Reply #10 - 02/25/12 at 09:00:08
 
Burnt valve, too lean...
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justin_o_guy2
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Re: Loud knocking, I'm going in...
Reply #11 - 02/25/12 at 09:07:18
 
Ive seen a couple of Quick Cheap Easy engine stands from some of these guys,,IDK where the pics are, Sounds like youre gonne be wantin to build one.
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Re: Loud knocking, I'm going in...
Reply #12 - 02/25/12 at 09:13:30
 
This stand took about thirty minutes..


 It uses the stock engine bolts and holes for mounting..
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SinglesGoinSteady
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Re: Loud knocking, I'm going in...
Reply #13 - 02/25/12 at 09:48:44
 
Engine stand, haha I wish.  I'm in an underground parking garage in my apt bldg. This could suck...but a good learning experience  Grin
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SinglesGoinSteady
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Re: Loud knocking, I'm going in...
Reply #14 - 02/25/12 at 17:58:02
 
It's all coming along, thank god for Clymers.  Got it ready to dismount.  It was a pregnant dog getting some old phillips screws out and unflattening those washers, not to mention getting the belt nut off.  Crescent wrenches prevailed, however.  Head/cylinder off Monday to see what's in there... A savage buddy also suggested taking the bottom end into the local Suzuki dealer to see if they think the bearings are okay, since we never determined the cause of the loud knock.
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