SuzukiSavage.com - Left over part

MMRanch Serious Thumper Offline Evil flourishes if Good Men do Nothing. Posts: 5833 LYNCHBURG TN Gender:	Left over part 01/24/12 at 21:50:30 I had a part left over from the Savage today ! This front sprocket is off a Kawaski 454 (25 tooth). Guys ............. IT CAN BE DONE
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Serowbot YaBB Moderator ModSquad Offline OK.... so what's the speed of dark? Posts: 28623 Tucson Az Gender:	Re: Left over part Reply #1 - 01/24/12 at 22:29:01 Tell me more,... tell me more... ...
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MMRanch

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Re: Left over part
Reply #2 - 01/24/12 at 23:00:58

The splines are the same , the Tooth pulley part is the same (just 2 teeth bigger),

The middle of sprocket is thicker. I removed (angle grinder against spinning sprocket) 25 thousands on the inside and about 800 thousands on the outside.

While I had it in the Lath I trued up the side of the sprock .0010-15" just to make sure clearance was no problem. but befor I did anything to it I tried it on and it fit great. The Kawaki mounting method is with the thin splined washer held in place with two 6mm bolts and a slot near the end of the shaft.

I tinkered with it for 2 hours fitting it . But thats one of the things I like to do.

I can hardly wait to get Baby back together to try it out !!!!! Shocked

Lancer give the misses a rest and let me know about the cam. Grin

I want the best fuel millage possible. power has allways been ample , with the bigger dommed piston it should be even better.

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MMRanch Serious Thumper Offline Evil flourishes if Good Men do Nothing. Posts: 5833 LYNCHBURG TN Gender:	Re: Left over part Reply #3 - 01/28/12 at 11:28:29 Kuri O-Yea gear it up AND keep the belt !!!!!!! The one I found is for a EN500 Kawasaki , I'm glad to see there are more just like it (EN454). When you thin the middle be carefull not to take too much off the motor side or it will rub.
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kuri77

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Re: Left over part
Reply #4 - 01/28/12 at 11:50:40

Looking at parts list it appears that the 25 tooth pulley is available from 1985-1990 454LTD and 1990-1995 EN500 models. There are some available now on ebay. Here's one

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1985-Kawasaki-EN454-EN450-454-450-LTD-front-sprocket-...

The other one is
http://www.ebay.com/itm/KAWASAKI-EN500-Vulcan-Belt-pulley-front-sprocket-belt...

Thanks for discovering this MM. For any one interested in what kind of change it will be I can tell you that going a couple of teeth higher on my KLR650 has made high speed riding a hell of a lot more comfortable and way fewer vibrations. Can't wait to see MM's report. Think I'll wait for his more knowledgeable critique of the mod before I tackle it though. He might end up with a few refinements. Don't see any down side here except for people who like to do jackrabbit starts and think the initial launch has been lessened a little.

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MMRanch

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Re: Left over part
Reply #5 - 01/28/12 at 12:20:55

The part that engages the transmision splines on the Kawasaki is wide-er than Suzuki's sprocket.

Where Suzuki uses a NUT and bentable washer ,,, Kawasaki uses a sloted shaft and a splined washer held in place by two 6mm bolts.
I doin't know which is better but the splines are the same and its easier to take materal off than put it on. !

I'll brobley have to wait on part from the Suzuki dealer befor I can put the head back on mine... may be a while....

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justin_o_guy2 Serious Thumper Offline What happened? Posts: 55279 East Texas, 1/2 dallas/la.	Re: Left over part Reply #6 - 01/28/12 at 16:44:21 I doin't know which is better but the splines are the same and its easier to take materal off than put it on. ! Boy, aint that the TRUTH!!?? Ive proven that with a tape measure & circular saw several times..
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Serowbot YaBB Moderator ModSquad Offline OK.... so what's the speed of dark? Posts: 28623 Tucson Az Gender:	Re: Left over part Reply #7 - 01/28/12 at 17:42:30 Remember JOG,.. ...measure once,.. grind twice... ...
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vulcan2go YaBB Newbies Offline SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 4 BC, Canada Gender:	Re: Left over part Reply #8 - 02/06/12 at 16:44:56 Can you just use an angle grinder to take off the excess on the center hub, or do you need to put it in a lathe? Also did you need to move the rear axle ahead much to accomodate the new front pulley? Thanks, DJ
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MMRanch

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Re: Left over part
Reply #9 - 02/06/12 at 20:12:30

Vulcan2go DJ

Ya know when objects are spinning its easier to get an even cut , that was the whole reason for the lathe.

This ain't rocket sicence ... anyway to get the center down to about the right thickness with-out taking too much off the back side will work. Long as the nut will fit on to keep it in place !

After sliding the tire all the way forward to get the belt back on I had to adjust it back about 5/16" to tighten it up. Plenty of room in the swingarm slots !

Doin't be shy about it , there's nothing hard to it ! Just two more teeth on the front !!!!!!

Yeaaaaaaaaaaa.

Cheesy

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verslagen1 YaBB Moderator ModSquad Offline Where there's a will, I want to be in it. Posts: 28884 L.A. California Gender:	Re: Left over part Reply #10 - 02/06/12 at 21:13:17 is that sprocket aluminum or steel?
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LANCER

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Re: Left over part
Reply #11 - 02/07/12 at 02:26:11

Quote:

Lancer, give the misses a rest and let me know about the cam. Grin

I want the best fuel millage possible. power has allways been ample , with the bigger dommed piston it should be even better.

Here's the cam spec's for you, but there's no rest for the misses. Wink

CAMSHAFT VALVE LIFT IN/EX DURATION @ .050

Stock camshaft .254/.244 224
Webcam std. .256/.256 226
Stage 1 .264/.264 239
Stage 2 .275/.275 245

Effects of duration:
220-235 => Low End Torque
235-250 => Midrange Torque
260 + => Top End Power

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MMRanch

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Re: Left over part
Reply #12 - 02/07/12 at 09:15:52

Versey

The sprocket is steel ... I chucked it up in the lathe to cut it down but the teeth were case hardened (just dulled the highspeed steel cutter) so I switched to the angle grinder.

It didn't have to be in the Lathe but since it was allready there I just put it on 320RPM and started grinding !

Cheesy

Lancer Thanks for the specs. I'll compair them to what I built mine up to and get back-with-ya , Just go ahead and act like a couple of bunney rabbits ! Grin

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MMRanch

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Re: Left over part
Reply #13 - 02/09/12 at 20:39:12

Lancer

Let's see if I understand the Duration thing :

stock is 224 ( just what is this number taken from ? )

could it be the combined duration of intake + exaust ? as in 112 degrees each ?
or

total time from exaust 50% open to intake 50% closed ? leaving (360-224)=136 degrees for compression and power stroke ?

Lips Sealed

I just mesured mine with a Dial-indicator @50% open - is about 82-+83 degrees on the cam .... Starting and finished position on the cam is the same as stock but it opens quicker and closes quicker due to fatter lobe.

If it doesn't make any more sense to you than it does to me .... well I'll try it and post any noticeable changes in performance. Tongue

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verslagen1

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Re: Left over part
Reply #14 - 02/09/12 at 22:46:18

from wiki...

Duration

Duration is the number of crankshaft degrees of engine rotation during which the valve is off the seat. As a generality, greater duration results in more horsepower. The RPM at which peak horsepower occurs is typically increased as duration increases at the expense of lower rpm efficiency (torque).[citation needed]

Duration can often be confusing because manufacturers may select any lift point to advertise a camshaft's duration and sometimes will manipulate these numbers. The power and idle characteristics of a camshaft rated at .006" will be much different than one rated the same at .002".

Many performance engine builders gauge a race profile's aggressiveness by looking at the duration at .020", .050" and .200". The .020" number determines how responsive the motor will be and how much low end torque the motor will make. The .050" number is used to estimate where peak power will occur, and the .200" number gives an estimate of the power potential.

A secondary effect of increase duration is increasing overlap, which is the number of crankshaft degrees during which both intake and exhaust valves are off their seats. It is overlap which most affects idle quality, inasmuch as the "blow-through" of the intake charge which occurs during overlap reduces engine efficiency, and is greatest during low RPM operation. In reality, increasing a camshaft's duration typically increases the overlap event, unless one spreads lobe centers between intake and exhaust valve lobe profiles.

good graph here...
http://www.compcams.com/Pages/416/valve-timing-tutorial.aspx

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