Versy, don't you think the vac line dies first?

Then if you replace it, what goes next?    (I will amend the symptom list to make it clearer that you have to fix the vac line because I agree -- if you don't fix it you aren't going forward from there)

Thank you for the feedback, I know this topic irritates you to no end and I appreciate it.

Amended time line with inputs added  (dates moved into text to make it clearer)



1)  Vac line getting cracked/holey is the first item in the time line.
(note:  this time line assumes you fix the vac hose and keep it fixed by yearly replacement or honestly, you will never get past step #1)
 year 7-10

2)  Diaphragm getting partially stiff and failing to flow enough gas at full speeds is the second item in the time line.  
We generally call this "stumbling at highway speeds".
years 7-15

3)  "False reserve" indications start somewhere about here too.  years 7-15

4)  Getting an occasional (rare) stuck float at the ends of float bowl travel (3 raps with the screwdriver handle fixes it) starts somewhere around here too.  These generally happen when the bike "runs out of gas" on the open road when you still have like a half of a tank of gas.
years 7-15

5)  Diaphragm getting so stiff you can't start the scoot sometimes after it dies on you.  years 15-25

6)  Last comes diaphragm pinhole/crack death and the gush of gasoline down into the air box and the sump.    years 15-25

And I think I understand something else that I didn't before -- because of the age of the bikes when you bought them you jumped right into the thick of things (into the more advanced problems).

Serowbot wrote on 08/22/11 at 14:31:04:


Run both a clear Vac hose and Fuel line on a stock petc0ck. No problems yet (knock on wood). Had the tank off over the weekend and noticed both lines that are now 2yrs old are stiff, so I will replace them next chance I get.

I've been considering the Raptor changeover for some time now, but have yet to have any of the symptoms on my garage kept 2005 so I haven't bothered yet.

Tick, tick, tick, just waiting  

Of,
why don't you give it up. You're beaten,...you even sound like a beaten man,....just grabbin for straws anymore. You accuse me of not backing up what I say. Well I don't have to ! I am defending OEM saftey equipment on our motorcycles, and I have no reason not to.
You're saying it's all junk,....well,....if you ask me, I think you are the one that is obligated to back up your reasons for condeming perfectly good equipment. You seem to know it all,......well lets be backin up you're talk ! You can't do it,.....w/ anything credible that is ! All you have done is get all the gullables here all paranoid that anything that happens to their bike just has to some how be caused by the pethingy.
If you don't know any better, I feel for you,.....but some how I think you're smarter than what you have shown in these pet threads.
You don't have to "poor Routy" me,.....I'm doing just fine, and so is my s-40 BTW,......really, I have never had a better running motorcycle in my 50 yrs of riding.
So, tellya what, go pedal your paranoia on some more nubies that will listen, and don't worry about me beating you down any farther,......cuz I'm outta these pet threads ! I have got a life !

Routy, please don't go .... without you there is no opposing viewpoint being expressed and little progress gets made.

I'm sorry you think that vac petcocks have nothing wrong with them, but I think Serobot has the right of it, you have a relatively new bike and nothing is wrong with yours yet.

Verslagen is different, he bought old bikes that already were pretty advanced in their symptoms, so he has a different viewpoint that is based upon that.  His bikes all drooled out the vac tube at one point in time and he had to fix them by rebuild or by swap out (on his first bike, was this pre-Raptor, but Bobo mods and "running in prime" existed?).

I bought mine used, but with only 480 miles on the ticker (hubby bought it for his wife so they could tool around together but she got pregnant and never rode again).  So, I had the opportunity to go through the whole chain of symptoms.

And you my friend shall be blessed with the same opportunities that I had -- given enough miles and time.    When your time comes, you will pick your best course based on what is known then ....  you do have rebuild kits identified now thanks to Verslagen's good work.

Yup, but you have to admit it is quick/free/easy way to find out what sort of aggravation your vac petcock has just handed you.   It is easy to suggest to a newbie that they carry a big screwdriver in their saddle bag until they finally resolve all their petcock issues -- ain't so easy to teach them how to do fine filing work inside a carburetor without screwing things up any)

Now, when the Raptor went in and the fuel level quit going up & down due to starvation (float stayed in the middle like it is supposed to) the float sticking stuff stopped completely.

And I didn't allow the bowl to go empty, I was "running out of gas" with over a half tank of gas in there by that point in time and having the dickens of a time getting gas back into the bowl when it stopped me by the roadside (prime didn't seem to be working very well either by then, why I cannot say -- don't know)

My petcock was having me off pretty good by then ....


======================


List modifications made -- Versy are the dates all pretty much in the ball park with what you saw on your two older bikes?    The older symptoms have a pretty broad time span, but they are based on the earliest latest anyone said that they saw them.




Amended symptom time line with inputs added  (dates moved into text to make it clearer)



1)  Vac line getting cracked/holey is the first item in the time line.
(note:  this time line assumes you fix the vac hose and keep it fixed by yearly replacement or honestly, you may suffer some of the symptoms shown below just because your vac hose is leaking and won't hold suction)
year 7-10

2)  Diaphragm getting partially stiff and failing to flow enough gas at full speeds is the second item in the time line.  
We generally call this "stumbling at highway speeds".
years 7-15

3)  "False reserve" indications start somewhere about here too.  years 7-15

4)  Getting an occasional (rare) stuck float at the ends of float bowl travel (3 raps with the screwdriver handle fixes it) starts somewhere around here too.  These generally happen when the bike "runs out of gas" on the open road when you still have like a half of a tank of gas.
years 7-15

5)  Diaphragm getting so stiff you can't start the scoot sometimes after it dies on you.  years 15-25

6)  Last comes diaphragm pinhole/crack death and the drool of gasoline down the vac line into the air box and the sump.    years 15-25

Prime is a fuel pathway that bypasses the vacuum actuation portion of the OEM petcock.   It also bypasses the reserve gas function, so if you run in prime you gotta watch your gas level or mileage so you don't run it bone dry and leave yourself stranded.

We really don't have a choke like you normally think about it, we have a fuel enrichment circuit that can add (stage 1, first click out) a little bit of gas or (stage 2, second click out) a large amount of gas.

Choke pushed in all the way is how you are supposed to leave it when running ....


owner manual and shop manuals here ....

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?board=tech;action=display;num=1138554254