SuzukiSavage.com - When is a battery really dead?

Doug A YaBB Newbies Offline SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 27	When is a battery really dead? 06/04/10 at 14:18:23 I let my son take the savage for a spin and he left the key "on" and drained the battery. After jump starting it and riding it around for a half an hour I tried to start it again and got "zilch". Do a have to buy a new battery or am I doing something wrong? Thanks, Doug
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bill67 Serious Thumper Offline old tired Posts: 8517 genoa city wisconsin Gender:	Re: When is a battery really dead? Reply #1 - 06/04/10 at 14:26:47 Be sure the water is up and charge it,If it don't work then the battery is shot.
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Doug A YaBB Newbies Offline SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 27	Re: When is a battery really dead? Reply #2 - 06/04/10 at 14:32:24 Doesn't running the motorcycle do the same thing as a charger? Sorry if this is a dumb question.
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Phelonius

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Re: When is a battery really dead?
Reply #3 - 06/04/10 at 14:48:52

When there are little + + signs on each of it's eyes.
Actually, if you ran the bike for a period of time and it did not charge, there are two poxsibilities.
One is that the battery is indeed dead.
The other is that the charging system in the bike is not working correctly.
Put the charger on the battery again. Disconnect the charger and chech battery with a volt meter.
Start engine and check voltage with the engine running.
Rev it to about 3,000RPM and check voltage at that engine speed.
It should be about 13.5 to 14.5 at the reved up speed if the charging system is working.

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bill67 Serious Thumper Offline old tired Posts: 8517 genoa city wisconsin Gender:	Re: When is a battery really dead? Reply #4 - 06/04/10 at 15:08:33 Doug A wrote on 06/04/10 at 14:32:24: Doesn't running the motorcycle do the same thing as a charger? Sorry if this is a dumb question. Running the motorcycle charges it but if the water is too low it want charge.If it was ok before he left the key on the alternator is most likely ok
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Routy

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Re: When is a battery really dead?
Reply #5 - 06/04/10 at 21:12:30

Doug A wrote on 06/04/10 at 14:32:24:

Doesn't running the motorcycle do the same thing as a charger? Sorry if this is a dumb question.

The answer is yes,......... kinda.

No one has ever said how many amps is available to charge the battery. But I'd bet no more than 2-3 amps ??
So if you were to charge (ride) a stone dead battery at 3 amps for a 1/2 hr, that replaced all of 1 1/2 amp hrs in a 20 amp hr battery.
At 3 amps charging you would have to ride the bike for at least 8 hrs to fully charge it. You'll do much better charging the battery w/ at least a 6-10 amp charger.

On edit, Im not sure that we should be charging a 20 amp hr battery any more than about 4-6 amps, if that much Undecided

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« Last Edit: 06/05/10 at 03:38:17 by Routy »

Rich
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Charon

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Re: When is a battery really dead?
Reply #6 - 06/05/10 at 06:24:33

Quite a while back I put a clamp-on ammeter on my S40, and got a charging current of at least seven amps just after start-up. That quickly dropped as the battery voltage came up. Seven amps would charge the battery in three hours, but it is really too high a rate for sustained charge for the stock 14 amp-hour battery.

Lead-acid batteries have some odd quirks. One is that, with a really discharged battery, the electrolyte is close to pure water and is not very conductive. That means the dead battery accepts very little charge current at normal charge voltages. But it accepts a little, and that little begins the charge. As the charge increases the electrolyte becomes more conductive (sulphate from the plates is transformed into sulphuric acid) and the charge current increases. Your best bet for your badly-discharged battery is to put a low-rate charger, no more than two amps, on it and leave it for several hours (overnight is good). Be advised many "smart" chargers will see the low voltage from a dead battery as a faulty battery and will refuse to charge at all.

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Eschew obfuscation.

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Doug A YaBB Newbies Offline SuzukiSavage.com Rocks! Posts: 27	Re: When is a battery really dead? Reply #7 - 06/05/10 at 16:32:56 Thanks for the info. I will go buy a charger and charge it overnight. Its a Big Crank that I bought last fall that has been run all the way down twice. I hope I can save it.
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Dj12midnit Serious Thumper Alliance Member Offline If you'r here and I'm here isn't this our time? Posts: 1036 Lynden Wa. Gender:	Re: When is a battery really dead? Reply #8 - 06/05/10 at 21:50:30 The charging system is not really a charging system. It is to maintain the charge. Check the water and put it on the charger.
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Routy

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Re: When is a battery really dead?
Reply #9 - 06/06/10 at 06:19:08

According to the battery experts, when a battery is run stone dead, it will loose some capacity,.....do it twice,...it would loose even more, but thats one reason for having a battery w/ 200 CCA, while 150 CCAs is maybe plenty to start it,....even in cold weather. But supposedly the most important thing is that a battery does not spend a long time in a discharged state. The sooner the battery gets back to full charge, the less capacity it will loose thru "desulfasion" Thats the main reason a battery setting thru the winter in a 1/2 discharged (or less) condition, takes a heave toll on it. In my experience, I have never seen mayor damage from a battery that has been stone dead a couple times from.......like leaving headlites on. And yours being an AGM battery has a better chance of no noticeable damage from the discharges.
Doug A wrote on 06/05/10 at 16:32:56:

Thanks for the info. I will go buy a charger and charge it overnight. Its a Big Crank that I bought last fall that has been run all the way down twice. I hope I can save it.

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Rich
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Digger

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Re: When is a battery really dead?
Reply #10 - 07/05/10 at 19:46:33

Doug A wrote on 06/04/10 at 14:32:24:

Doesn't running the motorcycle do the same thing as a charger? Sorry if this is a dumb question.

The word on the street on my Gold Wing forum is that using the alternator to charge up a near dead battery is hard on the bike's charging system. This is because the battery can accept lots of amps when it is in a near-discharged state.

Dunno if the same situation holds for the mighty Savage.

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Digger

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Re: When is a battery really dead?
Reply #11 - 07/05/10 at 19:47:50

Doug A wrote on 06/04/10 at 14:18:23:

I let my son take the savage for a spin and he left the key "on" and drained the battery. After jump starting it and riding it around for a half an hour I tried to start it again and got "zilch". Do a have to buy a new battery or am I doing something wrong?

Thanks,

Doug

The best way to be sure is to fully charge the battery, burn off the surface charge, then subject it to a load test. If it fails, then you need a new battery.

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Digger
2001, Metallic Glacial Blue, Raptor Petcock, Verslavy (first hole) (otherwise, mechanically, the bike is stock), 13,xxx miles
I don't own a cage.
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Max_Morley Serious Thumper Offline LT650 Luxury Touring & sidecar rig Posts: 1490 Moses Lake. WA Gender:	Re: When is a battery really dead? Reply #12 - 07/05/10 at 20:47:48 Dj12midnit is correct, the onboard charging system (alternator) is a battery maintainer not a low or dead battery charger. Charge to at least 80% before expecting the system to do the job. Max
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