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need carb cleaning advice (Read 436 times)
Serowbot
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Re: need carb cleaning advice
Reply #15 - 09/15/09 at 22:00:22
 
You've checked everything......  but it's still happening...

O.K.,... you've missed something.
It has to be one of only two things... only two ways gas can get in.

So start with this.  Pull the petcock vacuum line from the carb and block the tube with a golf tee or a screw or something,... cap the vacuum tap on the carb with a plug or something... set your petcock to prime. Be sure to set it to prime!...
Now,.. it can't be the petcock,... that's bypassed.  Like this...




If it still won't run right, and is still leaking,... it is the float system... either the float don't float, or is set wrong,... or the needle or the needle seat is damaged or dirty.
Leave the petcock bypassed 'till you get the carb straightened out.
If the float floats in a cup of gas, by a new needle and seat and replace them.

There's only a couple of things it can be... you'll get it...


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verslagen1
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Re: need carb cleaning advice
Reply #16 - 09/15/09 at 22:40:42
 
Here's an alternate way to check the float level...
get a clear fuel line,
on the bottom of the carb you might have a drain nipple,
plug the line in there,
hold the line up next to the carb,
open the drain with the petcock to prime
the fuel level should come up to the top of the bowl.
right where the gasket is.
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Bryan
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Re: need carb cleaning advice
Reply #17 - 09/16/09 at 18:48:09
 
Okay, I'm pretty sure it's not the float or float needle.  I took the carb off tonite, and the float level was fine.  I held the float up and poured a little bit of gas into the carb, and no gas came out until I let go of the float, so the float needle is fine.

So...  I started it up, choke 1/2 out.  After 30 seconds, pushed the choke in.  It ran a little bit, no more than a couple minutes, and started sputtering and died.

Next I set the petcock to prime, and started it.  It took a few tries, but once it started, it ran and stayed running.

So is it my petcock?  Even though there's no fuel in the vacuum line?  Is it safe to run the bike on prime without plugging the vacuum line?

If it's the petcock, is there any way to fix it without doing the manual conversion?  I don't wanna replace it with a manual petcock either; I'm way too forgetful.  So is my only option to replace the petcock?  There's gotta be a way to fix it...

I saw an OEM petcock online for $70.  Is that a normal price?  I'd try to find a used one, but if this one's already giving me trouble, with only 2500 miles on it, I don't know if it'd make any sense to put a used petcock which would likely have more miles on it...

Advice?
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Re: need carb cleaning advice
Reply #18 - 09/16/09 at 19:32:56
 
running on prime,... you will have no reserve.  and you will still leak...

You should at least pull the petcock and see what's up with it... it sounds like the vacuum diaphragm is slightly torn.  Not enough to leak into the vacuum line on it's own, but leaking when the engine vacuum is applied.  

You do need to do something more than just run on prime,... the leak will only get worse...
Only options I know of,.. convert to manual, replace with stock,... go to Raptor.  I recommend the Raptor, it's just a better design all 'round and way cheaper than a used stocker.
I have one,... I never shut it off unless there's a problem or I'm pullin' the tank.

At the least,... block the vacuum line as shown in the pic above... that will stop any vacuum or gas leak... then you can run on prime, but you will have no reserve,... and on position will work as a partial shut-off, but may leak due to the torn diaphragm...  This is a half-a$$ sorta' fix, that will get you down the road for a while.

The stock Suzuki petcock is crap....
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Re: need carb cleaning advice
Reply #19 - 09/16/09 at 21:36:09
 
Serowbot wrote on 09/16/09 at 19:32:56:
running on prime,... you will have no reserve.  and you will still leak...


What if the reason it was leaking in the first place was because I was flooding it?  I mean, it would idle, then die, and so I would start it while giving it lots of gas, and keep giving it gas to keep it running.  Could it be possible that nothing was ever wrong with the float or float needle, and it was only leaking fuel because I was giving it way too much gas to keep it running (due to a malfunctioning petcock), forcing fuel through the needle valve, flooding the float bowl, and forcing it out of the vent tubes?

Serowbot wrote on 09/16/09 at 19:32:56:
You should at least pull the petcock and see what's up with it... it sounds like the vacuum diaphragm is slightly torn.  Not enough to leak into the vacuum line on it's own, but leaking when the engine vacuum is applied.


So if I take the petcock apart and there's a problem with it, I should be able to see what's causing it?

Serowbot wrote on 09/16/09 at 19:32:56:
Only options I know of,.. convert to manual, replace with stock,... go to Raptor.  I recommend the Raptor, it's just a better design all 'round and way cheaper than a used stocker.
I have one,... I never shut it off unless there's a problem or I'm pullin' the tank.


So if I get a Raptor, it's okay to leave it on all the time?  It won't cause fuel to leak into the crankcase or anything?  For some reason I feel like I've read something warning about that...

Serowbot wrote on 09/16/09 at 19:32:56:
At the least,... block the vacuum line as shown in the pic above... that will stop any vacuum or gas leak... then you can run on prime, but you will have no reserve,... and on position will work as a partial shut-off, but may leak due to the torn diaphragm...  This is a half-a$$ sorta' fix, that will get you down the road for a while.


So if I do run on prime, I need to block the vacuum line?  I can't just put it on prime and ride it around as is?

Serowbot wrote on 09/16/09 at 19:32:56:
The stock Suzuki petcock is crap....

If the stock petcock's such a bad design, I wonder why they went with it in the first place.  I mean, it's more complicated than the kind like the Raptors, so it would seem like they could have saved money by going with a simpler design, like something that doesn't use vacuum.  Do most bikes have petcocks like the Raptors, or vacuum-operated petcocks like ours?
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Re: need carb cleaning advice
Reply #20 - 09/16/09 at 21:46:26
 
Err, to many fn quotes.

"What if the reason it was leaking in the first place was because I was flooding it?  "
You can't flood it like a car, there's no accel pump.  All you can do is give it more air.

"So if I take the petcock apart and there's a problem with it, I should be able to see what's causing it?"
Maybe, might be nothing wrong, could be blocked with corossion.  that you could fix.  personally, i like the vac operated petcock.

"So if I do run on prime, I need to block the vacuum line?  I can't just put it on prime and ride it around as is?"
need to block the vacuum port on the carb.  i'd put a catch bottle on the other to see if any gas appears.
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Re: need carb cleaning advice
Reply #21 - 09/16/09 at 21:56:32
 
Wow!... lot a questions!... Grin

1.  No,... the float needle would have stopped it from going through the vent tubes.  No matter what you did,... the float bowl system is only fed by gravity.  Fuel was leaking from above the float needle through the vacuum line and filling the vent tubes from above....

2.  Yes,... you will see the damage... the place to look is on the back of the petcock, 4 screws hold the plate on...

3.  It's not recommended, but in the dozen or so bikes I've owned over several decades I've never had a problem... your float could possibly stick and gas would leak... never happened to me yet...
Many other people I know do the same... back in the 60's and earlier, bikes tended to leak more often and shutting off was much more important.  BMW's were famous leaker's...

4.  Block the vacuum line....

5.  Probably liability, safety, CYA (cover your a**), reasons... why do they put a warning "do not drink" on a can of Drano?...

If I were you,... I'd go with the Raptor,... makes pullin' the tank easier too... Two friends here swapped theirs out, before they ever even had a problem.  Simple, is elegant... and more reliable...

about $30.00 and you never have to worry again.  See if your local shop will match online price and you'll save shipping.  
Ours did... Wink

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Re: need carb cleaning advice
Reply #22 - 09/17/09 at 09:46:38
 
Okay, no more "fn" quotes, but I do have a couple more "fn" questions Cheesy

Other than the possibility that the petcock is leaking fuel into the vacuum line, is there any other reason why I should block the vacuum line when running the bike on prime?

Will I have to make modifications to the bike in order to fit the Raptor petcock on, other than plug the vacuum port on the carb? (i.e. will I have to drill holes in the gas tank, etc.)

I'm gonna go ahead and take the petcock apart, look at it, and run the bike on prime with a catch bottle coming from the vac line of the petcock to see if it catches anything.
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Re: need carb cleaning advice
Reply #23 - 09/17/09 at 10:05:04
 
No
No
cool  Cool
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Serowbot
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Re: need carb cleaning advice
Reply #24 - 09/17/09 at 10:38:57
 
Possibility of leaking gas?...
Most important is that you block the vacuum tap on the carb to prevent the engine from sucking air...

a catch bottle may not show gas leaking, because there will be no engine vacuum drawing from the tube...  so, not a useful test...  
a better test is to suck on the vac line... but, it's no fun...  
suck, but don't swallow...
Raptor is a better fit than the stock, direct bolt up... just block the vacuum port...  I used a carefully sized screw,  rubber caps will rot away every 6 months or so..
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Re: need carb cleaning advice
Reply #25 - 09/17/09 at 12:28:25
 
Suck, but don't swallow??? C'mon, Bot, sure a technically inclined bunch like us can provide a better advice!!! Grin  Grin  Grin  Grin
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Re: need carb cleaning advice
Reply #26 - 09/17/09 at 13:37:54
 
Quick question..

What is this?
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Serowbot
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Re: need carb cleaning advice
Reply #27 - 09/17/09 at 14:47:07
 
PhilM wrote on 09/17/09 at 13:37:54:

Idle mix screw..... it's under a brass plug on a new bike...
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Serowbot
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Re: need carb cleaning advice
Reply #28 - 09/17/09 at 14:49:08
 
dasch wrote on 09/17/09 at 12:28:25:
Suck, but don't swallow??? C'mon, Bot, sure a technically inclined bunch like us can provide a better advice!!! Grin  Grin  Grin  Grin

toke on it, but don't inhale?.... Huh
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matt
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Re: need carb cleaning advice
Reply #29 - 09/17/09 at 16:22:38
 
now your just wastin gas
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