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rear shocks and spring rates (Read 731 times)
buttgoat1
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rear shocks and spring rates
02/26/08 at 19:44:05
 
I have been looking at the 812 series Vintage Progressive shocks but cringe at the price tag.  I have seen some similar covered 11" "lowering" Sportster shocks on Ebay, but they are heavy duty spring rates.  I am wondering how it will handle the Savage.

When I compare the location and angle of the Sportster shock to the Savage, the Sportster hits behind the seat whereas the Savage almost directly under the seat, so based on leverage, the Savage rider should place more weight on the shock than the Sportster rider.  Based on this observation, The Savage should do fine with a heavier spring rate.

Anybody have any thoughts?

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vroom1776
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Re: rear shocks and spring rates
Reply #1 - 02/26/08 at 19:51:58
 
For what it's worth, I've got solid struts on my savage, so the spring rate is infinity.  It handles very well, but gives a bumpy ride.
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Re: rear shocks and spring rates
Reply #2 - 02/26/08 at 22:08:17
 
I think 412's are what some are useing. A sportseter has 150+ pounds more than a Savage, so sportster shocks would be harder, unless U run them on the lowest preload compared to the highest on a Savage. The fact the shocks are rite under the Savage seat translates into even more spine shock, because the wheel movement goes through the shocks and rite into the body,instead of through a part of the frame that is farther back that does'nt align the shock with the spine. I belive most any shock you choose will be at least 1/2" longer than the stockers, which is good, and should'nt be very asteticaly noticeable, and the extra rear lift will translate into a greater lean angle, so if you are currently dragin the pegs a lot, you'll notice it takes more to drag em. These stock shocks are terrible, almost anything aftermarket should be an improvement. I seen some shocks with piggy back gas resovoirs that would fit, and were'nt too $$, but I think they would hit the saddle bag supports. BTW, stock sportster shocks are'nt much better, and the ones on the customs,huggers,low for sure are'nt.
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buttgoat1
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Re: rear shocks and spring rates
Reply #3 - 02/27/08 at 20:39:38
 
well, I think the solid struts would be more than I want.  
I also see that progressive offers the 812 style covering kit for the 412's so that may be an option, anyone have the dimensions of the 412's?  

I also see that someone did a post about cutting the stock springs, so I suppose I could alwasy do a spring swap and trim if I found the springs to be too stiff.  

isnt tinkering fun?
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klx650sm2002
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Re: rear shocks and spring rates
Reply #4 - 02/28/08 at 01:33:14
 
Has anyone thought of using a couple of monoshocks, like this but on both sides.If you get two off a light bike it might just work.

Clive W  Smiley
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buttgoat1
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Re: rear shocks and spring rates
Reply #5 - 02/28/08 at 12:13:15
 
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buttgoat1
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Re: rear shocks and spring rates
Reply #6 - 02/29/08 at 05:02:32
 
c'mon folks, help me out!!
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Reelthing
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Re: rear shocks and spring rates
Reply #7 - 02/29/08 at 06:57:19
 
well if you search around on the site we have documented the spring rates - calculated and measured the amount of lift longer shocks cause as well as the other issues with kickstands, oil sight glass, difference between progressive models, metric bushing shocks vs. sae bushing, and so forth.

here is a basic posting from the time period

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1138678827/#5
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Re: rear shocks and spring rates
Reply #8 - 02/29/08 at 07:03:08
 
I had a set of sporty shocks on my Savage for a while, about 11.5-12" I think, and they worked pretty well.  They were certainly better than the stock Savage shock.  One factor is that I am a 200 lb'r, so the heavier springs on the shock worked well for me, but I really liked the extra travel  the shock had ... no bottoming out.  I was satisfied with the overall performance of the shock.  Later I swapped it out for a set of Progressive 412's I found on ebay, which was really a step up in ride comfort...very cushy.
Later I was fortunate to find a pair of Progressive 418's on ebay and so put those on in place of the 412's.
I must say that the 412's made a cushier ride than the 418's, which are more firm (came from a superglide) and make for a better performance ride for hard core cornering and such.  

I hope this is helpful for you.
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buttgoat1
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Re: rear shocks and spring rates
Reply #9 - 02/29/08 at 09:28:41
 
thanks a lot, guys. that is very helpful.
I did use the search function but never came up with the posting you linked, Reelthing, thanks again.

I am pushing 200# plus gear, and occasional rider.
Based on what I see, it looks like a 12" heavy duty shock with low preload will be just the ticket for me.
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skrapiron -FSO
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Re: rear shocks and spring rates
Reply #10 - 02/29/08 at 13:49:43
 
I have a set of progressive suspension 412's on my Savage.  They are a HUGE improvement over the stock rear shocks.

The only problem I ran into was the mounting studs.  The Harley 412 shocks have a 1/2" bushing.  The savage uses a 13mm stud.  I had to machine a new set of bushings to fit.  But my God, is it ever worth the effort!

They were $269.00 at my local HD dealer.  It took about an hour to mount them, including cutting the new bushings.
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Everything I say is fully substantiated by my own opinion.
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Reelthing
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Re: rear shocks and spring rates
Reply #11 - 02/29/08 at 21:42:57
 
buttgoat1 wrote on 02/29/08 at 09:28:41:
thanks a lot, guys. that is very helpful.
I did use the search function but never came up with the posting you linked, Reelthing, thanks again.

I am pushing 200# plus gear, and occasional rider.
Based on what I see, it looks like a 12" heavy duty shock with low preload will be just the ticket for me.


12" causes several problems - the belt will rub the guard, the oil sight glass is out of wack unless you angle the front up when you check it, and the kick stand is too short without adding some under it the bike acts like it will fall over.

go for the the 11" or 11.5" unless you are ready to deal with these issue - progressive has chart on spring rate vs. model number -

the 115/155lb are pretty stiff the 125/170lb are dang stiff - more than that it rides screwed up like a hard tail in the corners as all you have is the bounce of the tire - get you killed and bust your back - a proper suspension is important - not just for the ride but it keeps the tires on the ground - grab a brake with the tires bounce'n and you'll see what I mean
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Reelthing
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Re: rear shocks and spring rates
Reply #12 - 02/29/08 at 21:45:39
 
skrapiron -FSO wrote on 02/29/08 at 13:49:43:
I have a set of progressive suspension 412's on my Savage.  They are a HUGE improvement over the stock rear shocks.

The only problem I ran into was the mounting studs.  The Harley 412 shocks have a 1/2" bushing.  The savage uses a 13mm stud.  I had to machine a new set of bushings to fit.  But my God, is it ever worth the effort!

They were $269.00 at my local HD dealer.  It took about an hour to mount them, including cutting the new bushings.

buy the metric shocks and they come with the proper bushing - the 42xx is a metric
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skrapiron -FSO
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Re: rear shocks and spring rates
Reply #13 - 03/01/08 at 08:10:18
 
Yes, that is correct..  I got the 412-4005C, which is the 11" progressive shock for the FLX, LX, and FXR Harley.  It is a heavier spring than what came with the Savage. (being that the bikes the shock is intended for is 150-200lbs heavier than the Savage.)

I could have ordered the metric shock, but I was impatient and the Harley dealer had the 4005c in stock....

The correct metric p/n is 412-4233C.
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Re: rear shocks and spring rates
Reply #14 - 03/01/08 at 08:26:44
 
Reelthing wrote on 02/29/08 at 21:42:57:
the 115/155lb are pretty stiff the 125/170lb are dang stiff - more than that it rides screwed up like a hard tail in the corners as all you have is the bounce of the tire - get you killed and bust your back - a proper suspension is important - not just for the ride but it keeps the tires on the ground - grab a brake with the tires bounce'n and you'll see what I mean


maybe I'm crazy, but I love the way my bike handles.  Now, I've never grabbed and (rear) brake while the wheel was off the ground (yet)...
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