Hi All,

I picked up an very used (but mostly running) '87 this past July, and have been gradually restoring it.  When I got the bike, it didn't have the airbox or connector tubes, so I bought one of the metal-mesh cone filters and hooked it straight to the carb.  Following Balderdash's suggestions found here http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?board=RubberSideDown;action=display;n...,
I stepped the pilot up to a .055 jet.  

When I put the carb back on the bike, I got no idle unless I had the choke pulled out to the first notch - pushing the choke all the way in would idle so low that the engine would nearly die.  I drilled out the cap over the idle-mixture screw, but the screw was varnished in place, so had to drill it and use extractors, then replaced the screw, spring, washer and o-ring. (Does the O-ring go ON the screw, or just in-front of the screw in the hole? I put mine ON the screw.)  With the new screw, I fired the engine back up, and tried adjusting it, but it seemed to make no difference at all when I'd tweak the mixture screw - from all the way in to 3 full turns out, the non-choked idle was still near stall.

SO I removed the carb again,  disassembled it (except for a few of the air jets), and blew an entire 12 ounce can of carb-cleaner through every orifice and hole I could find (including the airjets I'd left in).  I put the carb back on yesterday, but the idle is still so low the engine dies, unless I use the choke.  It runs pretty well on 1/2 choke...

Can anybody offer any suggestions?  The Clymer says not to use wire to clean out the orifices, but I'm starting to wonder if maybe I've got a piece of brass or something (from all the drilling) stuck somewhere in the idle circuit that blowing-out won't remove.

Thanks for any advice,
Dave

I hate to say it but you need to take it apart again, including every single jet in the little thing.   Get more carb juice and you can use tiny wire if you  are careful to clean the passageways.  I take small electrical wire, strip the insulation and unravel the strands of copper wire and use them to go through the passageways... GENTLY

Every little hole needs to be open and clean.

If that '87 has the stock carb and it looks like it does that's a very big pilot jet. The carbs we a good bit different - might should go back to stock 47.5 jet  

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?board=tech;action=display;num=1098869040

Thanks for the replies, folks.

Barry: The idle speed screw is about midways.  Idle was pretty decent before I started, maybe a tiny bit high for a single.   I've tried a few more twists up, but it didn't seem to make much difference, the RPMs are still in the basement. I got the gas about 3 weeks ago (had to replace the petc0ck on the tank).  And also have an inline filter as well.

Rockin John - Thanks, that looks alot like the fiche at BikeBandit - and neither really shows where the o-ring is supposed to be when assembled. So your o-ring is sitting down in the carb when you take the mixture screw out?  When I finally got mine out, the o-ring was down in the carb so had to get it out with a piece of wire.  When I went to put the new one in, I just figured it went on the screw with the washer and spring - it seemed to fit OK, and I didn't know where else to put it other than leave it loose down in that circuit.  Am I wrong about that?

And John and Reelthing - should it at least idle with a too-big jet?  I could understand if a too-small jet made the idle go so low, but I'd think a too-big one wouldn't drag it down to stalling. I've got a 47.5, so I may try it.

Lancer - thanks, I was afraid somebody was gonna say that. heh.  At least it's getting cold outside, so I don't feel like I'm missing out if I'm inside with a disassembled carb instead of out riding with cold fingers...  I'll give the electrical wire a shot.

Does anybody know where the idle circuit dumps into the airstream?  Is it those three tiny holes right above the butterfly?  I guess I'll  need to feed the wire "backwards",  right?

Thanks again,
Dave

DavidD wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:11:


Dave,
When cleaning your carb I am assuming you stripped it down?  All the jets out type of thing?  As for the pilot circuit.  Make sure you take out the pilot jet and make sure that is clean.  (always becareful with carb spray to keep it out of your eyes..nasty stuff)  Then open the butterfly with one hand via the thottle linkage, insert spray can tube up the tube where the pilot jet was, then look in the engine side of the carb.  Not spray!  Alot of fluid will come back out the pilot tube but you should see some come up through the 3 holes.  Depending on how the stream goes in that could be anything from a burble to 3 shots coming out the holes.

Depending on the storage conditions, those little holes can be the down fall of a carb job.

Lastly, if it idled before did you induce an air leak when you reassembled it?  Was it in the manifold/rubber boot fully and the clamp tight?  any signs of cracks in the rubber boot?  That could destroy an idle also.

Good luck

John - thanks for mentioning your different parts.  I pulled my carb tonite and removed the mixture screw - the new one that BikeBandit sent is definitely different than the original one. The original was brass, the new one is steel (I guess).  The original had 2 steps near the needle-end - the main shaft steps down to a smaller diameter that's about 3 mm long, then that steps down to the needle which is also about 3 mm long (all eyeballs, no ruler handy).  The new one is a single step - main shaft down to a cone-needle.  As well, the "needle" part of the new one is about 2 mm shorter than both steps on the original, and the point of the needle looks a bit smaller/pointy-er.  Actually, from the end of the threads to the tip of the needle, the new one is about 2 mm shorter altogether, although the main shaft on both seems to be about the same length.

Ron Ayers and Crotch Rocket both list the mixture screw, and the fiche pics LOOK like the two-stepped screw - not that I really trust any fiche to match reality.  The part numbers are similar between the two sites, but not exact.  Guess I'll order both, since they're only $4, and see which, if either, is the correct one.

Blue - thanks for the tips.  As far as I can tell, the boot is OK - doesn't look dry-rotted, isn't hard and brittle.

GJ - it worked fine with the cone filter originally, the problem started after changing the jets.

Old carburetors behave a lot like old mistresses  

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