SuzukiSavage.com - A Very "Interesting" Thing...Continues

Hell, Billy Full Member Offline back in black, again Posts: 176 a dirt road, somewhere in R I	Re: Very "Interesting" Thing Just Happen Reply #15 - 10/29/07 at 19:41:20 Sounds like classic vapor lock, check your tank cap.....or maybe the internal tank filter is clogged? Sometimes, it`s more than one thing, tho. Retrace what you last did to it, trouble shooting 101. Hmmmmm B
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Reelthing Serious Thumper Alliance Member Offline Fish or ride that is the question Posts: 5397 Houston,Tx Gender:	Re: Very "Interesting" Thing Just Happen Reply #16 - 10/29/07 at 19:43:26 got any gas in the vac line?
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youzguyz Serious Thumper Offline Posts: 2538 San Antonio, Texas Gender:	Re: Very "Interesting" Thing Just Happen Reply #17 - 10/30/07 at 01:31:55 Something to do with the decomp, or as Ed L suggest, the valves. How else could it be sucking air in through the exhaust? Wait.. is there a bulge in the tank?? (Somebody had to say it. )
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Savage_Greg

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Re: Very "Interesting" Thing Just Happen
Reply #18 - 10/30/07 at 04:59:01

Ed L. wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:10:

My guess is the valve lash is too tight. The engine runs till it gets warm then the valves move a little bit and stay open just enough to loose compression out the carb. It cools back down when you are checking it and then everything goes back to where it will start again. Of course it could be a bad valve seat or binding valve springs but the lash is the easiest to check. Kind of humorous in a twisted sort of way Wink

. Hope it is a easy fix.

Don't really think so, though. I did adjust the backlash to .005" when I finished the cam install, however, as I posted somewhere else I found the clearance to be too loose on Saturday during a routine check. I readjusted it and then rode 80 miles on Sunday.

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LANCER

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Re: Very "Interesting" Thing Just Happen
Reply #19 - 10/30/07 at 05:03:06

OK, so it runs again after sitting for a while.
Starts, runs, dies, wet & black plug, sucking muffler, blowing carb.
What causes both valves to remain open at the same time after it gets warm?
This makes me think about what Ed said ... but you said you adjusted and then readjusted the valves.....did the valves readjust themselves again after running? Loose valve adjusting nuts?

IF THAT IS NOT IT THEN YOUR ENGINE IS DEMONIZED !

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Savage_Greg

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Re: Very "Interesting" Thing Just Happen
Reply #20 - 10/30/07 at 05:04:59

SavageWahine wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:10:

It's a refresher course in feeling helpless!! Tongue

Wish I could help, but I'm absolutely of no use!
Good luck!
Say... there is no way that the vacuum is so strong that it sucks the choke back in and too much fuel so that you flood the bike? There's no gas in your oil is there??

Can't say that I've fallen into a feeling of helplessness 'cause I know that I'll find it...I'd never be able to do bike repairs if that could happen to me. Tongue

The thing with the bouncing choke made me think of an intake valve problem.

I checked. No gas in the oil. In fact, I needed to add some oil...which kinda surprised me too.

Had to do some "paying" work yesterday afternoon and wasn't able to finish my testing...more today

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Savage_Greg Serious Thumper Alliance Member Offline Don't go around your ass to reach your elbow... Posts: 7844 SW Washington State Gender:	Re: Very "Interesting" Thing Just Happen Reply #21 - 10/30/07 at 05:08:02 forrest wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:10: Did you ensure the fellpian tubes are clean? They appeared to be when I removed the diaphragm on Saturday (when I changed to a thinner spacer)... Yes, I was in the carb on Sat. but it ran all day on Sunday without trouble ???
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Savage_Greg Serious Thumper Alliance Member Offline Don't go around your ass to reach your elbow... Posts: 7844 SW Washington State Gender:	Re: Very "Interesting" Thing Just Happen Reply #22 - 10/30/07 at 05:09:36 bill67 wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:10: Maybe low speed jet fell out That's interesting. A thought, but it did start just fine.
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Re: Very "Interesting" Thing Just Happen
Reply #23 - 10/30/07 at 05:13:09

Hell, Billy wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:10:

Sounds like classic vapor lock, check your tank cap.....or maybe the internal tank filter is clogged?

Sometimes, it`s more than one thing, tho. Retrace what you last did to it, trouble shooting 101.

Hmmmmm

B

Gas drained out of the float bowl on my first check and when I switched it to PRI, it still would not start because the plug was wet. Then I checked the bowl again and got more gas...

What I LAST did to it? I'd have to pull the cylinder again Grin

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Savage_Greg Serious Thumper Alliance Member Offline Don't go around your ass to reach your elbow... Posts: 7844 SW Washington State Gender:	Re: Very "Interesting" Thing Just Happen Reply #24 - 10/30/07 at 05:15:56 Reelthing wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:10: got any gas in the vac line? I checked that one late yesterday after my second start. Line was dry. Not a drop. I switched the petc0ck around too just to see if anything seemed strange. I left it off and plugged the carb nipple to eliminate it anyway.
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Re: Very "Interesting" Thing Just Happen
Reply #25 - 10/30/07 at 05:21:53

youzguyz wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:10:

Something to do with the decomp, or as Ed L suggest, the valves. How else could it be sucking air in through the exhaust?
Wait.. is there a bulge in the tank??
(Somebody had to say it. Tongue

)

The bike started and stopped in the same exact manner late yesterday. Compression was good but I didn't do a leak down test. The suction might be part of the issue with the decomp system leaving the exhaust valves open during the cycle....which I wonder if that should be disconnected for a compression test anyway...but the compression was good and the manual doesn't mention it

I'm glad that you said it. You beat John to it Grin

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smokin_blue Serious Thumper Offline From Cafes to Streetfighters! I build them all! Posts: 830 St. Paul, MN Gender:	Re: Very "Interesting" Thing Just Happen Reply #26 - 10/30/07 at 05:22:12 Cam to crank timing dead on? if it is sucking through the exhaust and pulsing through the carb sounds like cam timing off.
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Re: Very "Interesting" Thing Just Happen
Reply #27 - 10/30/07 at 05:29:58

LANCER wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:10:

OK, so it runs again after sitting for a while.
Starts, runs, dies, wet & black plug, sucking muffler, blowing carb.
What causes both valves to remain open at the same time after it gets warm?
This makes me think about what Ed said ... but you said you adjusted and then readjusted the valves.....did the valves readjust themselves again after running? Loose valve adjusting nuts?

IF THAT IS NOT IT THEN YOUR ENGINE IS DEMONIZED !

Okay...I got sidetracked in the afternoon and didn't finish looking. On Saturday, I did change the needle spacer and readjust the valves. Then the bike ran normally all day on Sunday. Must have had a dozen starts.

There were however a couple times that the engine seemed a little sluggish BUT I kinda thought it was due to the chain conversion. But as long as it ran, I didn't think about it much.

For everyone, here is an interesting bit of thought...

When Julie came home last night and I discussed the bike problem, she said, "Oh yeah, I meant to mention that when I was following you, that there were a few times that I smelled gas."

DOH!

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Reelthing

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Re: Very "Interesting" Thing Just Happen
Reply #28 - 10/30/07 at 06:14:57

For real, the worst case I've had of running ok goes to crap after it warms up was a sticky slide - in my case cause by a greasy finger prints - formed a little ring at the bottom, after the carb warms up the metal expands and the slide would hang/drag going back down - of course if your sucking a little through the vac line it'll sure go rich.

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Savage_Greg

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Re: Very "Interesting" Thing Just Happen
Reply #29 - 10/30/07 at 07:21:54

smokin_blue wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:10:

Cam to crank timing dead on? if it is sucking through the exhaust and pulsing through the carb sounds like cam timing off.

Yeah, it does sound like that, but honestly to set the cam timing is pretty much fool proof. That is, as long as you do Step One correctly and set the crank at TDC Tongue

Besides, it does run correctly, that is, until it dies.

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