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Clutch slipping (Read 66 times)
Holodeck
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Clutch slipping
09/07/07 at 16:40:01
 
I have 16.5 k on my 02. I change oil every 2k with a good grade of car oil except last time was synthetic.

Last week I finally finished the mods for the carb, air fillter and muffler. Big increase in power. On a test run out on the road at 50 in 5th gear I rolled it on hard, the motor exploded with power and rpms.... then the clutch started slipping.

I would like to think that the mighty thumper was just to much for the stock clutch, but since I have riden the bike like a maniac from the day I bought it I think maybe the clutch was just about ready to go anyway.

My question is for those who have been into the 40 odd parts of this clutch - what should I expect doing the job ? I am not much of a wrencher, but I do like the satisfaction of being able to fix the bike myself.

Thanks for any insight you can give me.

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Re: Clutch slipping
Reply #1 - 09/07/07 at 16:58:34
 
First thing I would do is check into using synthetic.I read somewhere it is not good for some bikes because of the clutches.As dumb as this sounds it's too slippery.
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Re: Clutch slipping
Reply #2 - 09/07/07 at 17:14:46
 
Well, I've only done one clutch on a bike and it was not on an LS650 / Savage but it really wasn't that hard.  Just remember to get new oil, a new filter, a new side engine cover gasket and new springs (it seems that springs don't always come with the clutch kit).  Bike Bandit or Dennis Kirk seem to be good places to get this stuff.

The only trouble I had was that the gasket moved when I was putting everything back together and I didn't notice.  It started leaking oil on my driveway almost immediately.  So, I had to take all the side cover bolts out again and fix the gasket (which fortunately was not damaged).  You are supposed to check all the metal disks in the clutch for warpage.  I did a quick check on mine but I'll admit I didn't go overboard with this.  The job took me about three hours, but that included the second tear-down to fix the leak.  If you are mechanically inclined and have decent hand tools you should be able to make sense of it.

I don't know if there are any particular things on the LS 650 to watch out for - I would get a shop manual before I jumped into it.
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Re: Clutch slipping
Reply #3 - 09/07/07 at 17:22:38
 
Suggest first try using MC oil instead of auto oil.  It has additives for the clutch (sulfides?).    

If you want synthetic,  Wallymart , Mobil 1 V-Twin $8.63 / qt.   Not sure if the "V-Twin" label actually give you any more hi temp capibilites like it says.  
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Re: Clutch slipping
Reply #4 - 09/07/07 at 17:53:16
 
I am not sure when the last time you changed the oil was, sounds like 500 miles if changed every 2k but I may try changing the oil out again to get rid of the syn prior to ripping into the clutch. Wouldn't hurt any and may save the a few bucks and some work.
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Re: Clutch slipping
Reply #5 - 09/07/07 at 17:57:09
 
I have been reading as much as I can find lately and it seems that many car oils have "energy saving friction modifiers" mixed in that can wreak havoc with wet clutches.  That seems to be THE reason it is not wise to use car oil in motorcycles. I changed my oil two or three times - just to be sure it wasn't oil related.  It's worth trying before you tear into it.  Although, with the price of some motorcycle oils, I am not sure its cheaper.
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Re: Clutch slipping
Reply #6 - 09/07/07 at 18:15:56
 
If you determine the synthetic car oil is not causing the slippage and decide to tear into your clutch then do this next. Put large washers behind your clutch springs and put everything back together before buying any clutch parts. This will likely solve your slipping clutch.
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Re: Clutch slipping
Reply #7 - 09/07/07 at 18:33:23
 
You will note the casting the clutch springs sit in has milled areas for each spring. Close inspection will reveal they are different depths. The casting isn't the same thickness throughout & they mill each foting for the clutch springs so each spring is under the same load. I measured the thickness of each washer & ground them to fit inside the milled area, so as to not have uneven pressures across the clutchpack. Only used approximayely 1/8 thick washers & no more of that little OOOZE feeling when I am slamming thru gears.
I am running Shell Rotella _T oil, It is just under $9.00 a gallon at Walmart. (Wrll, till oil hits $75.00 a barrel, then it'll go up I guess)

I am betting it's the oil, tho. NOt too likely it's the clutch, IMO.

EDIT* What I meant was, the clutch isnt shot at 16K miles. The mods didnt create a torque monster that cant be contained by the clutch , certainly not with a 50 MPH roll on.  Thats the same clutch you had before the mods. IF it will slip at a 50 MPH roll on NOW, it SHoulda been slipping at 10 MPH in first accelerating away from a stop sign BEFore the mods. I believe the oil is the big deal here, & you will likely spot some slipping as you run thru the gears if you run it aggressively. When I did the carb, exhaust & air filter, I started feeling some slight slippage. When I did the cam chain, I did the washers. Problem solved. I rode it for several thousand miles after the mods before I did the clutch.
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Re: Clutch slipping
Reply #8 - 09/08/07 at 04:19:13
 
i got my savage with 16k on the clock and the clutch was already slipping.
i replaced it and added washers at the same time. i didn't measure anything but you could see the old discs were worn compared to the new ones.
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Re: Clutch slipping
Reply #9 - 09/08/07 at 09:24:35
 

All the disel /fleet/ auto oils are excellent and are good bang for the buck.
The so called "energy conserving oils" are so thin, that we don't use them any way. Usually they are 0W-20, 5W-20, 5W-30, and may be some 10W-40. If You  stick with 20W-50 or 15W-40, You will never get "slippery" oil.
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Re: Clutch slipping
Reply #10 - 09/08/07 at 10:13:42
 
I've got the same issues, but I can roll it hard in any gear and get slippage.  Make sure you got plenty of freeplay in the clutch lever.  Turning will tighten the freeplay up some.  The book says about 1/8", I've got a 1/4".

Just got a set of barnett hd springs for the savage.  Soon to be installed.   Grin
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Re: Clutch slipping
Reply #11 - 09/08/07 at 11:22:45
 
I let the clutch lever adjuster be pretty sloppy. It disengages fine for stoplights & by letting it be sloppy, hauling it in is easier on the fingers than whenit is adjusted as far out as possible. All it takes when shifting is to ease the pressure on the clutch anyway. That accompanied with the throttle makes the shifting slick & easy.
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Re: Clutch slipping
Reply #12 - 09/08/07 at 13:21:21
 
Verslagen, Thanks for the post, were did you get the springs ?
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Re: Clutch slipping
Reply #13 - 09/08/07 at 15:22:36
 
scored them on fleabay.

p/n mt10-4

fits several bikes
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Re: Clutch slipping
Reply #14 - 09/10/07 at 05:45:34
 
I agree with the suggestions above - namely:

(1) While many auto oils may be fine for your bike, be careful about which ones you use.  Many have additives that can cause slippage in wet clutch applications.  I recommend using motorcycle-specific oil - especially when using synthetic.  When you change the oil out, run some simple 10w40 witjout additives through the bike for a few days, drain it, and then go for your motorcycle-specific synthetic oil.

(2) If you still have slippage after the oil change, changing the springs (or shimming them with washers) is easy.  Lancer is an authorized dealer for Barnett and I got my clutch springs from him.  Don't forget to get a new gasket for the right side cover.  While you have the right side cover off, take a peek at your cam chain tensioner adjuster.
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