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Counting cam chain needs (new improved) (Read 121 times)
steely
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Re: Counting cam chain needs (new improved)
Reply #45 - 09/13/07 at 18:29:58
 
I'm in for one with everything!
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Re: Counting cam chain needs (new improved)
Reply #46 - 09/13/07 at 21:16:43
 
ME too, with the works.
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Re: Counting cam chain needs (new improved)
Reply #47 - 09/14/07 at 09:00:43
 
Can they put a special mark on the chain?

Maybe 'SS' or anything to denote it's a special chain?
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Re: Counting cam chain needs (new improved)
Reply #48 - 09/14/07 at 09:53:01
 
justin_o_guy2 wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:09:
OHH, IF what I think I saw is correct, I think I see one reason for a shorter cam chain life in more recent years. Did someone say in 03 or so they changed the spring in the tensioner for a stiffer one? If so, that would possibly cause it to "Grab a tooth" on the tensioner "Ratchet" & pawl & then the engine jug "growth" at temperature stretches the chain, allowing the tensioner to reach 18mm sooner. I will look at a softer spring, for mine.

There is an issue of spring travel. If it has a long travel from fully compressed to fully open over the service life of the adjuster, it will have to start out with a lot of tension. If you start out with too little tension, it will reach the max extended length before the end of the service life and it won't automatically adjust the chain slack any more.

Hmm. Maybe that's not a bad thing <g>.

Ken
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Re: Counting cam chain needs (new improved)
Reply #49 - 09/14/07 at 11:11:11
 
The chains will be marked M as that is the only marking that goes on the outside of a Morse chain.  Asking them to custom stamp side links is kinda expensive sounding to me.

=========================

Asked and got Morse's take on cryo treating nitrided pin chains -- they would already do it if it offered any advantage on a nitrided pin chain.  It does not have any real benefit they can determine by endurance testing or by microanalysis.

Cryo works by partially converting retained austinite into martinsite, thus making the steel more consistent and increasing its physical properties.  It also stress relieves a part to a degree that cannot be done otherwise.   This is good if you have cracking issues or stress failure issues.

Nitriding affects the first .002" of the pin's depth.  There are 3 zones created.   White zone which is extremely hard but porous (collects a good oil film and holds it) the Primary Conversion Zone which is thin (less than a quarter thousandth of an inch) in which all material is converted to nitrides and there is no austinite to convert to martinsite.  Then there comes a .0016" thick transformation zone in which you taper from 100% nitrides to 100% base material.   This last zone would only be marginally affected by cryo as austinite has already been partially converted into nitrides and it isn't there to be converted to martinsite.

Nitrides are already "as hard as it gets".

Our chains only wear into the first .001" of the pin's depth before we run out of adjustment travel.  We would never get "deep enough" to see any transformation benefit from cryo.   Lastly, cryo works best on parts that like to break in use where the full through body benefits of cryo can play to maximum advantage.  

Our chains don't break, they wear out within the first .001" of pin wear depth.  Our links don't stress crack.  The chains we have now literally are only wearing halfway through their total life span before we have to throw them away because we run out of adjustment.   We never get deep enough for the cryo benefits to play out for us.

The Primary Conversion nitride layer on the pins and the highest nitride bearing part of the Transformation Zone is all the wear depth we will ever see.

I don't think cryo is all that worthwhile for the cost it will add.



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justin_o_guy2
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Re: Counting cam chain needs (new improved)
Reply #50 - 09/14/07 at 11:39:24
 
Cryo seems to be a great idea, for some parts, the cam chain just doesn't seem to be one of them, at least not the Morse chain. maybe the OEM chain isnt nitrided & may possibly benefit from the treatment, but I am sure not ready to spend more than necessary.
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Re: Counting cam chain needs (new improved)
Reply #51 - 09/15/07 at 09:53:00
 
I'll take 2 ( two) with the treatment. Grin
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Re: Counting cam chain needs (new improved)
Reply #52 - 09/15/07 at 12:33:28
 
2 with or without go with the majority

allan.
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Re: Counting cam chain needs (new improved)
Reply #53 - 09/15/07 at 13:07:18
 
If the material condition of the chain components is in fact more than adequate as it comes from Morse and the cold treatmetn  thing will not benefit then why should we spend the time and money ?  
If something will help then I am all for it, but if not then I see no reason to waste time and money.
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Re: Counting cam chain needs (new improved)
Reply #54 - 09/15/07 at 13:20:30
 
I think what Morse is saying is with their nitriding treatment, cryo isn't needed.

If you didn't do the nitride, then cryo would be a benefit.

On the plus side for cryo, the entire chain gets it.  Whereas the nitriding is only done to the pins.
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Re: Counting cam chain needs (new improved)
Reply #55 - 09/15/07 at 20:03:14
 
I'm in for a chain and tensioner.
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