SuzukiSavage.com - NOT a battery question?

skatnbnc Serious Thumper Offline Spinning Pink Posts: 1286 New Bern NC Gender:	Re: NOT a battery question? Reply #30 - 04/18/07 at 11:39:22 Voltage meter not going work. Ohhhkay. How do the gargage guys test it? Does the battery have to come out? I ask because I want to know BEFORE i go there. Same problem as mentioned earlier - its a girl thing.
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Reelthing

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Re: NOT a battery question?
Reply #31 - 04/18/07 at 11:52:08

Yes you can check the battery while it is in the bike - black to ground any where on the bike that has no paint and is metal and red to the plus side of the battery - you should be able to see it. This needs to be done after the bike has sat several hours without a charger on it to allow the float charge to bleed off - first thing in the morning after it sits over night is good - it should read over 12.4v hopefully 12.8 or above.

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skatnbnc Serious Thumper Offline Spinning Pink Posts: 1286 New Bern NC Gender:	Re: NOT a battery question? Reply #32 - 04/18/07 at 12:31:14 Thanks for the continued support during this issue. I'll see if I can get this load tested Thur or Friday. Possibly Sat, but a number of garages are closed on the weekend here. Anything else I can or need to do between now and then, or just get it checked then go from there?
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Reelthing Serious Thumper Alliance Member Offline Fish or ride that is the question Posts: 5397 Houston,Tx Gender:	Re: NOT a battery question? Reply #33 - 04/18/07 at 12:37:05 what do the volts read?
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Savage_Greg

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Re: NOT a battery question?
Reply #34 - 04/18/07 at 15:20:34

grandpa wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:04:

Greg - can't judge a battery by it's age. Seen too many people change everything else because the battery was only a year old. I sold auto batteries made by Johnson Controls (Every AutoZone and Diehard battery among other brand name batteries). Reputation to be the best battery in the business. There is a reason there is a warranty on batteries. Stacks of plates and solder joints all subject to failure. A battery that is allowed to run an extended time low on water is subject to early failure. I fully agree that trouble shooting should be first!! However the symptoms are a possible battery shorting out when warm. Have seen it way to much.

No you can't, but let's face it. The battery isn't a year old and it hasn't been run very long. It's not very likely or common.

I had one with a broken internal buss a few years ago. It had all the voltage but no amps. Read it with a meter just fine, but no load.

But rather than telling her what I think, I'm trying to find out what she sees and knows.

I don't want to suggest that she get a new battery and then she come back and start this thread all over again...with me being her cause for wasted money either.

In my time in this forum, I've seen a lot of unnecessary parts purchased...

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Savage_Greg

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Re: NOT a battery question?
Reply #35 - 04/18/07 at 15:34:21

skatnbnc wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:04:

I went and purchased a voltage meter a few minutes ago. (no problems starting for that errand, go figure) I am assuming I need to take the battery out again and test it, or not take it out? What is the best way to test this? And I know someone mentioned what the meter should read, and now I cannot find that post. Tongue

- - - - - - - -
>>How much water did you have to add to the battery?<<
About 2 turkey baster full for 6 cells. (3/4 cup total maybe?)

>>Were any of the cells below the "low" level line on the side?<<
YES.

>>Or did you just add a little bit to each cell?<<
YES i added some to each cell to bring them all up to the midline level marker. Some cells needed more water than others.

>>Did you really feel like the battery needed water after you went through all that trouble?<<
Yes because about 3 out of 6 cells were really low (below the LOW line) and the rest were close.

>>Did you say that there was NO CLICK OR SOUND, at all, of any kind, from anywhere when this problem happens? NONE? <<
No sound. Nada. No click, no noise like it makes when it decides to actually start (i can HEAR the click before the starter then - just a split second)
- - - - - - - - - -

Soooo depending on the meter reading, I might need a new battery. I did save the weblink you guys gave to the enclosed cell type.

Good that you got a meter. Be real handy from now on...

Sorry, if you think I'm being redundant, but I stated my reasons above. I can't see or hear what you have and I never rush to judgment with someone else's money.

I just ask all this because intermittent problems can be the most deceiving of them all. What appears to be a dead battery, can just as easily be a bad connection in a very small wire on your handlebar...

Okay. 3/4 of a cup total does seem a bit much.

Does it turn over rapidly when it does start, or does it sound like it's doing all that it can do?

If it does, then pull the battery and take it to Auto Zone for a load test.

PS - don't get battery acid on things you care about Tongue

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ALfromN.H. FSO Serious Thumper Alliance Member Offline Dragon Slayer Posts: 1421 Rochester, New Hampshire Gender:	Re: NOT a battery question? Reply #36 - 04/18/07 at 15:48:53 my battery went dead over the winter so I went out and got a sealed battery and a Battery tender jr. After changing it, I put the charger on the old battery and it charged up nicely. So I guess you could say that i Bought a new battery for nothing, But I see it as peace of mind. And now I have a back-up if I ever need one.
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Reelthing

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Re: NOT a battery question?
Reply #37 - 04/18/07 at 15:57:23

Savage_Greg wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:04:

Good that you got a meter. Be real handy from now on...

I just ask all this because intermittent problems can be the most deceiving of them all. What appears to be a dead battery, can just as easily be a bad connection in a very small wire on your handlebar...

Okay. 3/4 of a cup total does seem a bit much.

PS - don't get battery acid on things you care about Tongue

Certainly agree with all of this.

By the way is the bike still in warranty?

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grandpa

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Re: NOT a battery question?
Reply #38 - 04/18/07 at 15:59:14

skatnbnc- you can improvise a test with your battery in your bike with your meter. Hook your positive meter lead to the positive battery lead. The negative test lead can hook on any unpainted surface. Engine bolts or cooling fins work great. Assuming you are doing a cold start, your battery voltage should be appx 13.5 volts. Start your bike. During the time your starter is turning, the voltage will drop a volt or so. Assuming it starts just fine, run it until you think it won't and repeat the test. If you have a no start and your voltage drops to 2 or 3 volts then it's a 99% chance your battery is bad. The only real way to be 100 % is a load test out of your bike. The battery tester in my old "Zone store would only go down to a 200 amp load test ( auto batterys are 400 +). I would imagine our bike battery is 100 or less. Would need to check the owners manual or the battery catalog to be sure. If a parts store can not do it, possible a small engine repair shop might be able to test it. Have never tried one but a motorcycle battery and riding lawn mower batteries are one and the same.

Greg - we have the same goal in mind. Just don't want to write off the battery because it's only a year old. I spent five years at the 'Zone and gave it up because I ran into conflicts with upper management because I went out of my way to test parts as much as possible and save my customers money. That is contrary to the the stock holders desire. I was moved to several different stores that had sales problems and pulled appx 20 % of my customer base with every move even though they had to drive across town. In spite of saving my customers money, I had the highest average ticket sale of any store in town. Go figure that one out. I certainly don't know it all and will never claim to. We are all in the same boat together.

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Reelthing

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Re: NOT a battery question?
Reply #39 - 04/18/07 at 16:16:57

grandpa wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:04:

Assuming you are doing a cold start, your battery voltage should be appx 13.5 volts

Let's get this sorted out - a rested battery (say no charge put to it in anyway over night) - that is one that has bled off the float charge is not going to measure 13.5volts. 12.8v is likely to be the high end and 12.4v the low end - below that it will not reliably fire the savage.

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Savage_Rob Serious Thumper Alliance Member Offline Mechanically Inclined Amateur Posts: 6972 Texas (Dallas area) Gender:	Re: NOT a battery question? Reply #40 - 04/19/07 at 06:16:13 Savage_Greg wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:04: don't get battery acid on things you care about And if you think you just might accidentally spill a little, keep some baking soda handy while you're messing with it to neutralize any spills.
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skatnbnc

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Re: NOT a battery question?
Reply #41 - 04/19/07 at 06:35:36

You guys, I really appreciate all the advice, but I am starting to feel like I'm in over my head. I've never used a meter, and never charged a battery.

As an added bonus, when I got home last night, the voltage meter was not in the bag (there were other items purchsed). In calling the store I discovered it was still sitting on the counter. So until I go back to pick that up, I cannot do a test.

Meanwhile, in re-reading the posts on this topic, something came back to me. The orginal owner talked about finding out the hard way that the last position on the ignition switch is for PARK.
And I never have been able to see water in the battery window. So two things are applicable ~ the battery has been run for months with low water, and the previous owner drained the battery at least once previously.

In plain english please tell me this:
- can I use the voltage meter I purchased to test the bike battery? If not I will return it.

- if the voltage is too low should I try recharging or just go for the new battery?

- where can I get the current battery properly re-charged?

Each bit of advice seems to narrow down the options so it is a good thing to have the forum!

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Savage_Greg

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Re: NOT a battery question?
Reply #42 - 04/19/07 at 09:41:55

grandpa wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:04:

Greg - we have the same goal in mind. Just don't want to write off the battery because it's only a year old. I spent five years at the 'Zone and gave it up because I ran into conflicts with upper management because I went out of my way to test parts as much as possible and save my customers money. That is contrary to the the stock holders desire. I was moved to several different stores that had sales problems and pulled appx 20 % of my customer base with every move even though they had to drive across town. In spite of saving my customers money, I had the highest average ticket sale of any store in town. Go figure that one out. I certainly don't know it all and will never claim to. We are all in the same boat together.

Yep. Just gotta remember that we are the stock holders here. You won't have to change stores either Tongue

Besides, I know I was a newbie once Grin

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Savage_Greg

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Re: NOT a battery question?
Reply #43 - 04/19/07 at 09:49:01

skatnbnc wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:04:

You guys, I really appreciate all the advice, but I am starting to feel like I'm in over my head. I've never used a meter, and never charged a battery.

As an added bonus, when I got home last night, the voltage meter was not in the bag (there were other items purchsed). In calling the store I discovered it was still sitting on the counter. So until I go back to pick that up, I cannot do a test.

Meanwhile, in re-reading the posts on this topic, something came back to me. The orginal owner talked about finding out the hard way that the last position on the ignition switch is for PARK.
And I never have been able to see water in the battery window. So two things are applicable ~ the battery has been run for months with low water, and the previous owner drained the battery at least once previously.

In plain english please tell me this:
- can I use the voltage meter I purchased to test the bike battery? If not I will return it.

- if the voltage is too low should I try recharging or just go for the new battery?

- where can I get the current battery properly re-charged?

Each bit of advice seems to narrow down the options so it is a good thing to have the forum!

Ask yourself this...Do you want to do your own bike troubleshooting or minor repairs?

If you answered yes, then keep the meter.

As for recharging...I don't believe that anyone is suspecting your battery is low on charge, so why a charger at this point? If your bike starts the first time, then the charge is good. It is other possibilities that we are discussing.

There is a difference between full charge and full load. That's why the suggestion for a load test.

A meter will tell you the charge on the battery. A load test will tell you about the battery's strength. If the load test indicates bad, then you need a new battery. If the load test indicates good, then most likely you will have a use for the meter.

If you answered yes, get a charger too.

If you answered no, then go to the dealer.

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skatnbnc

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Re: NOT a battery question?
Reply #44 - 04/19/07 at 12:02:40

Difference on load vs charge - THANK YOU for clarification.

Will swing the bike over to a shop soon (tommorrow maybe) and get the LOAD checked.

When I went to the store to pick up the meter, the guy said the meter will help only if it is not a load problem (confirming all your helpful advice). He also looked at me as if i was insane when I told him I was going to take it apart and work on it myself this weekend.

Why does wearing a skirt get me this kind of response?! Tongue

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