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chain drive conversion (Read 179 times)
Hutch
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Re: Suzuki GS500E works OK?
Reply #345 - 03/30/07 at 07:11:57
 
mpescatori wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:03:
OK Hutch, I have found a german seller with a brand new Suzuki GS500E chain&sprocket set, he claims "No. of teeth are 16/39" which is 2.4375...
...a bit too long, you would think...
20% longer means my 4000rpm cruising would become 3200rpm.

Anyway, for basic information, you said there is full compatibility between the Savage and GS550/GSX models of +/- the same years... what about the GS500?

Thx, Maurizio

The gs500 will not work, it has a larger bolt pattern for the rear sprocket. Tbalm was nice enough to post a list of bikes that have the correct sprockets for the front and rear. It will take you to the JT Sprocket site, for a list of the bikes that used the front or back sprocket you need. It is the second post in the tech/document section about the conversion. Just go there and you will find a LONG list of the models that used the front sprocket. Kawasaki, Yamaha, and Suzuki used the front sprocket, but it depends on how many teeth you want to be able to get the right one from a STOCK junkyard bike. The rear sprocket was used ONLY on Suzuki. That list is a lot shorter. Hope this helps.   Hutch
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Re: chain drive conversion
Reply #346 - 03/31/07 at 04:42:29
 
Yep, I browsed through JTSprockets' website and have found a number of bikes which seem to use the same rear sprocket.

For the sake of being certain, it is a sprocket with 5 fixing bolts, with a 110mm circumference for the bolt pattern.

Front is JTF 513, rear JTR 829

Is that OK?
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Hutch
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Re: chain drive conversion
Reply #347 - 03/31/07 at 08:04:22
 
mpescatori wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:03:
Yep, I browsed through JTSprockets' website and have found a number of bikes which seem to use the same rear sprocket.

For the sake of being certain, it is a sprocket with 5 fixing bolts, with a 110mm circumference for the bolt pattern.

Front is JTF 513, rear JTR 829

Is that OK?


The JTF 513 is correct, but the rear is JTR 816 with a 100mm bolt pattern. The list of bikes with rear sprockets is a lot shorter than for the front, but there still are several, so the sprocket should be easy to find at the junk yard. I am glad you got in touch. Getting the wrong part is never fun.   Hutch
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Odar
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Re: chain drive conversion
Reply #348 - 03/31/07 at 15:45:09
 
Hi Hutch
I did it and was driving today (200 km or125 miles) on different roads, small curvy ones to highway and town, I used the same sprockets that you did 17/43 and bought a SO530 Oring chain 110, did remove 2 links then it was done.
As spacer I used 7 splinced lockwashers, orderd 9 from the Suzukishop but needed only seven to take up the space, I did make a piece it stainless steel, 25 mm dia. in the hole and 40mm outside dia. The thickness of the spacer should be 7,5mm if making one. But ended up using the washers when I got them yesterday.
There was some problems about the Oring chain, its is a bit wider than the one you used so I had to remove the bracket to the chaingard on the swingarm, both on top and at bottom, not to bad at the bottom but the chain bent it backwards so I did remove that one to.
I can still use the chaingard if I want because I made a spacer that has a slice on one side so I can put it on the axel at the inner side of the suspension if I dont want the chaingard.
Its like you say totally diffrent bike to drive, a lot nicer but I think I will go for the 16 in front, going to bay that on monday and make a switch, I found it a bit difficult to find the right gear sometimes 2 or 3 when driving very slow in town, and I didnt have mutch use of the 5 gear exept on highway, gear 4 is now a bit higher then gear 5 was before.
So from the 14,5 % I will try 9,5 instead.
And I think it should have been better to use 17/45 instead of 16/43 because of the tight space to the swingarm at the fronpully, but I am to lazy to change both for the moment.
Final conclucion: I LIKE IT  GrinGREAT Grin
And thanks to Hutch and Tblam and the rest of you that start all investigation and made it possible for this swap.
Pics are comming later.
Sorry for the spelling, but its not my languish.
Odar in Sweden
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Hutch
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Re: chain drive conversion
Reply #349 - 03/31/07 at 16:17:05
 
Odar, glad to hear you like it. I went with 17/43 because I am only 150 pounds and do most of my riding in the country(55-60mph) and some highyway. I found 3rd gear in town for me was just right. This the reason that any ratio taller than 2.53 would be very hard on the clutch and be terrible in town,2nd gear probably. If you have heavy headwinds and a lot of hills, or drive in town a lot I would definately go with the 17/45(2.65 ratio) or 16/43(2.69 ratio).  I think by going to the 16 on the front you will be happy, going by the type of riding you do. You have to remember that the sweet spot for cruising is based on TWIN cylinder motorcycles, not a SINGLE. I am trying to talk a person out of going with a 17/39(2.29 ratio) as I type this. I know he will be not be happy with the outcome. That is why I am glad you let us know of your findings. THANK YOU FOR THE FEEDBACK.  All feedback will make it easier for those in the future to figure out what sprockets they need for their weight and type of riding they do. Thank you again for sharing your experience. After all this is an experiment, and we need all the information we can get.         Hutch
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Re: chain drive conversion
Reply #350 - 04/01/07 at 01:56:41
 
I think you should stop this guy from putting on 17/39  his bike its going to be a dog.
Have you tryed the 14/43 on your bike, not that I want to go back to original gerings but I wonder does it fit or does it hit the swingarm close to the front sprocket?
You know I going to buy 16 teeth tomorow and wonder if it is possible to put it on, might have to bend the top ear for the screw to chaingard a bit out.
This chain is defenitly wider than yours.
Odar
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Re: chain drive conversion
Reply #351 - 04/01/07 at 03:23:05
 
Hutch wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:03:
The JTF 513 is correct, but the rear is JTR 816 with a 100mm bolt pattern. The list of bikes with rear sprockets is a lot shorter than for the front, but there still are several, so the sprocket should be easy to find at the junk yard. I am glad you got in touch. Getting the wrong part is never fun.   Hutch


ouch !!!
Shocked
I'm glad I didin't order right away, the rear sprocket I had quoted only has 5 bolts and a 110 mm diameter,
the 816 you quote has 6 and a 100mm diameter!!!
Talk about incompatibility !!! Embarrassed
I see the JTR816 comes in all sizes from 38 to 52 teeth, I'll probably go for the 45 and buy 17, 15, 13 teeth for cruising solo, city, two up respectively.
I've always liked close ratiuos for mountain driving, never been much of a high speed addict but I do like to feel the bike climb up the steep ones, rather than just survive in 3rd.

Chain type, 50, I thought chain types came in 3-digit sizes?

PS Can I use the JTF 513 only, or can I use the JTF 566 as well? (without the two small fixing holes)
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Maurizio Pescatori, Esq.
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Mikuni BST40, K&N filter, Stage2 cam, Verslagen tensioner, Sportster muff, 120 proof moonshine, Pirelli MT 66 tourers... and a chain conversion too !
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Hutch
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Re: chain drive conversion
Reply #352 - 04/01/07 at 06:45:44
 
Odar wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:04:
I think you should stop this guy from putting on 17/39  his bike its going to be a dog.
Have you tryed the 14/43 on your bike, not that I want to go back to original gerings but I wonder does it fit or does it hit the swingarm close to the front sprocket?
You know I going to buy 16 teeth tomorow and wonder if it is possible to put it on, might have to bend the top ear for the screw to chaingard a bit out.
This chain is defenitly wider than yours.
Odar
 
Yes I tried the 14 and it was almost the same as the stock gearing. The chain didn't hit the the swingarm at the front or the chain/belt guard brackets, so the o-ring chain is definately wider. I will have to make a note of that in the tech section. I also tried the 16 tooth and had no problems. You can even use the same chain length, it falls a little past the center of your adjustment. You can leave it that long if you want to switch back and forth between sprockets, or shorten 1 link if you decide to run just the 16.The 16 is perfect for hilly riding or town(3-4th gear), but still is better for highway riding than stock. Let me know what you think of the 16.    Hutch
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Re: chain drive conversion
Reply #353 - 04/01/07 at 07:00:58
 
barry68v10 wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:03:
Odar, I think you could take up the extra space with a steel washer.  I still can't see why you can't use a smooth center bore since the stock spacer isn't splined  ???

I don't see why you can't either.  The only splines that you need are on the sprocket and the tab washer.
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Re: chain drive conversion
Reply #354 - 04/01/07 at 07:09:10
 


mpescatori wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:04:
ouch !!!
Shocked
I'm glad I didin't order right away, the rear sprocket I had quoted only has 5 bolts and a 110 mm diameter,
the 816 you quote has 6 and a 100mm diameter!!!
Talk about incompatibility !!! Embarrassed
I see the JTR816 comes in all sizes from 38 to 52 teeth, I'll probably go for the 45 and buy 17, 15, 13 teeth for cruising solo, city, two up respectively.
I've always liked close ratiuos for mountain driving, never been much of a high speed addict but I do like to feel the bike climb up the steep ones, rather than just survive in 3rd.

Chain type, 50, I thought chain types came in 3-digit sizes?

PS Can I use the JTF 513 only, or can I use the JTF 566 as well? (without the two small fixing holes)
 

The chain you need is the 530 series. I looked up the JTF566 sprocket on the JT web site and it says that there is no listing for it. Could you have typed it wrong?? All those extra holes are for is using a puller to get a stubborn sprocket off. As long as you get the front sprocket from one of the models listed for the JTF513, you will have no problem. One other thing to note is that it seems the o-ring chain is wider and causes problems with the 4 belt guard mounting brackets. I am running a non o-ring, and have had no problem at all with the chain hitting the guard brackets. I haven't tried a 13 but it might have a problem with the chain hitting.  Good Luck, and let me know how it works out.   Hutch
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Re: chain drive conversion
Reply #355 - 04/01/07 at 09:57:21
 
Make a note about the spacer for the beltguard as well.
Buy a 3mm thick and with a hole that is 17mm and make it look like a U, then you can chose if you want to use the chaingard or not, take only 5 minutes to switch.
BTW you can remove the top bracket on the swingarm and on the beltgard and still mount it saftley (2 points), dont know way its there at all, cut it off and put on some paint.
Going to buy the 16 and testdrive tomorow Grin
I wait with pics till I am satisfied.
Odar
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Re: chain drive conversion
Reply #356 - 04/01/07 at 10:58:44
 
The JTF 513 is listed as alternative for the JTF 566, but click on the lin566 in the 513 page and it will say the 566 is discontinued.
So that explains it.
I also understand your concerns re: the chain rubbing against the (swingarm?) brackets/chainguard, maybe I understand what you mean maybe I do not - technically - but I do understand what you mean from a purely conceptual point of view - the front sprocket being so small the chain will rub against the swingarm etc.etc.

I remember whan, in the '50s, an Italian mechanic came up with a "hi gear/low gear" contraption for motorcycles, mainly aimed at working trikes (with a small flatbed on the back): the final drive would only reach halfway, where a 2nd stage final drive would allow for two ratios with a floating sleeve, which would engage either a 1:1 ratio chain driev, or a 1.5:1...3:1 chain drive. Easier to see than to describe really. Extremely popular with the heavier trikes that would routinely carry payloads up to 400Kg. (900lbs) Old Guzzis Hercules and the like

Still, a similar contraption would allow to determine two final drive ranges on the same bike for flat or hilly riding, say a 3:1 and a 2.6:1 , just pull over, neutral, twist handle this way or that and you're off !!!

Should research this, actually... Roll Eyes
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Maurizio Pescatori, Esq.
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Mikuni BST40, K&N filter, Stage2 cam, Verslagen tensioner, Sportster muff, 120 proof moonshine, Pirelli MT 66 tourers... and a chain conversion too !
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Re: chain drive conversion
Reply #357 - 04/01/07 at 13:34:42
 
Odar wrote on 12/31/69 at 16:00:04:
Make a note about the spacer for the beltguard as well.
Buy a 3mm thick and with a hole that is 17mm and make it look like a U, then you can chose if you want to use the chaingard or not, take only 5 minutes to switch.
BTW you can remove the top bracket on the swingarm and on the beltgard and still mount it saftley (2 points), dont know way its there at all, cut it off and put on some paint.
Going to buy the 16 and testdrive tomorow Grin
I wait with pics till I am satisfied.
Odar

Odar I tried to modify my conversion instructions with the added part about the shock bolt spacer and give you credit for the idea. Guess what? It told me my post was to long and to make it shorter. I just barely got the spacer part in, but I couldn't give you credit for it, not enough room SORRY!! I can't wait to see how you like the 16 and see some pics.   Hutch
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Odar I tried to modify mRe: chain drive conversion
Reply #358 - 04/01/07 at 14:17:20
 
Hutch
Dont worry my friend, its good if you make it as short as possible.
I let you know tomorrow, and hopefully some pics as well.
Odar
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Re: chain drive conversion
Reply #359 - 04/21/07 at 19:39:05
 
What a beautiful day. Did some work at my son's house and he and his wife took off to Supercross. . My son's father-in-law and I looked at each other. ROAD TRIP !!!!70 degrees, calm winds. Hit M-46 east to Port Sanilac, turned north on 25, followed the Lake Huron shore line all the way to tip of the thumb circled back down along the Saginaw Bay shore line. His 1200 Sportster and my Savage just humming down the sweeping State highway. No racing, just jockeying for position on the next sweeping turn. Average speed 60mph. Great time. When I did my last mpg test on the interstate I went from 52mpg with belt drive, to 58mpg with 17/43 chain. I was averaging 75-80mph. Today with the 55-60mph just cruising,  I got 62mpg. Up 10mpg from stock gearing. At 60mph his Screaming Eagle slash cut mufflers and my Jardine slash cut just fell into a song. It kind of sounded like a three cyclinder Harley. Like I said GREAT DAY. LOVE this chain conversion. L-VYRA is right at home humming down the highway, instead of screaming rpm's like before. Odar, Tbalam, any comments about your chain conversion, now you have some miles on your bikes?      Hutch
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