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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> I bought back my old bike. I have a few questions! /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1686606142 Message started by retro on 06/12/23 at 14:42:22 |
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Title: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questions! Post by retro on 06/12/23 at 14:42:22 Hey everyone. After 2 years of being in limbo, my old savage popped up for sale. If you don’t know that story, well…I don’t feel like repeating that for now. But, the thing I regret selling the most is back in my possession and I’m so, so happy. But here are the changes; New tires, wheels balanced, new air filter, rear turn signal repaired, carburetor rebuilt, front fork serviced, belt inspected, front break pad was replaced, changed break fluid and bled hydraulic system, rear drum break pad was replaced, new battery, rear cable lock for helmet was repaired, ignition coil replaced, and oil was changed. All services were performed by a local professional shop.…oil change was 6 months ago. So what is the issue on hand? Well, I can’t get the idle right…when I first start it, it’ll run for maybe half a minute if that and then shut off due to the slow idle, so I usually just increase the idle until it’s warmed up the motor, then decrease when needed. Not only that, it’s not performing as smoothly as I want it to through shifting gears. It feels rough. There’s oil being spat at me from the fins. I have some pictures. And there’s a dripping, but can’t tell if it’s oil from the bottom of the engine or from the puke tube. I’d also like to change the oil, it gets about 90-115f here in the upcoming summer, and a lot of humidity…im in North Carolina near the VA line, to give an idea. and I don’t know which oil to go with…if someone could point me to some, that would be great, I know there’s factory but I’ve read so much about “go with this it’ll handle the humidity better and run your system cleaner” so it’s about time for a summer change and I’m clueless…I unfortunately lost the majority of my memory on motorcycles due to being out of touch, but also due to a disease I have that causes memory issues. I’m also in need of an oil filter. I tried reading up on oil stuff on the forum, but i got a bit confused. Also, anyone got an easy way to attach a tachometer? I’d like to get some upgrades going after the oil and gasket fix. Possibly a clutch situation. Later on down the road I might need a new gas tank as there might be a rust issue. If I can clean the tank instead that would be nice, as if like to keep that pretty Pearl blue color. I got some pics to upload that I will get to later on. I’m happy to be back, Pearl and I are back on the road! |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by Dave on 06/12/23 at 16:40:27 If it was my bike.....I would get the carb cleaned and checked. Starting with a thoroughly clean carb could be the easiest way to resolve problems.......at a minimum it will eliminate the carb as a potential problem. Some of these bikes are 20-30 years old and the rubber parts in the carb could be getting stiff. (Same for the petock). Oil. Use Rotella T4 or Synthetic T6 in the 15W-40 weight....it works just fine in your Savage and you don't need any additives or any more expensive oil. |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by miatamarty on 06/12/23 at 20:39:21 Might want to get the valves adjusted then a compression check. If there is a lot of oil/mist coming out of the crankcase breather there could be a problem with the piston rings. If the compression is on the low end do a leak down test to see if it's the valves or rings. A competent shop should be able to handle this easily. The carb could be the big problem here but the fact that there is a lot of blow by coming out of the crankcase breather is a cause for concern. |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by ohiomoto on 06/12/23 at 20:55:41 7B6C7D7B667B606D6C7A090 wrote:
Before you go making mountains out of molehills... The fact that you are adjusting your idle based on the operating temperature of the bike leads me to believe some of your issues could be due to user error. If it is don't feel bad because most people who didn't grow up around motorcycles, old gas powered tractors, small engines, or Britsh sports cars don't understand what the "choke" does and why it is needed. http://https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSUg-hzU2SYlXCiATjtebzDBG8_qnG3fo13qzoD0UCl3S-26fqQKzkBCARIGChgO8rfVx0&usqp=CAU MBG choke adjustment cable/knob 1) Regarding your low idle during warmup... That's what the "half-choke" position is for. It brings more fuel to the table during warm up which can take several minutes even in warm weather. It will bring the idle up and keep the bike from stumbling and stalling. This it's only purpose and it's there for this very reason. The standard starting procedure is "full-choke"*, "half-choke" as soon as it is running, and then start riding to warm it up (don't let it sit on the kickstand idling). After 7-10 minutes of riding push the "choke" in fully and see how it runs. If the bike still idles too low, try using the "half-choke" a bit longer. *"Full-choke" may not be needed if the bike has been warmed up for the day but that doesn't mean you should completely ignore it. If the bike has been sitting for an hour or longer, it might benefit from using "full-choke". It should fire up easier which is better for the starter and battery. And NEVER adjust your idle or do any other adjustments while the bike is cold. Riding the bike is the best way to warm it up. Once warm you should set the idle to approximately 1100 rpm and then leave it alone...forever. Also, understand that a bike that hasn't been running recently is a cold bike no matter how hot it is outside. So the "choke" procedure should still be followed as needed. Even in warm weather, the "half-choke" position should be used. You'll know once you get some experience with it. 2) If you are still having issues. Do what Dave said and eliminate any potential mechanical issues. The petcocks on these bikes are known to fail. If you don't have a raptor petcock now might be a good time to try one. Cleaning the carb is good. Buying a "rebuild kit" from Amazon and throwing a bunch of parts that may or may not be correct for the LS650 is BAD. 3) The oil on the fins is likely from the "head plug" in the top of the head. It's a common and known issue. I wouldn't sweat it until you clear up your idling issues. Not sure about the oil from the bottom. It could be oil or fuel depending on what else you find. 4) If you are wondering why I use quotation marks around the word "choke", it's because technically it's not a "choke" even though it does everything a "choke" does. Most people will let that slide on here be we have a lot of new users and I don't feel like being trolled. Not that any of the new users seem to be into that kind of stuff. lol 5) Someoe will try to tell you they never use the "choke" and that it's not needed. Fine but that doesn't mean you should do what they do. ;) |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by justin_o_guy2 on 06/13/23 at 10:42:28 Does it get the same mpg as when you had it? When I changed jets and put a free flowing exhaust on, mine always idled low before it hit operating temperature. I had to raise the idle and use some choke to get it to run right for the first few miles, even in the summer. |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by retro on 06/13/23 at 12:10:43 I didn’t use the choke, today I’m changing the oil (rotella t4 annd proper Suzuki filter from local dealer) and figuring out where that drip is coming from. Wide open throttle, once it hits about 75, almost 80mph? It starts wanting to act like it doesn’t want to give power to the engine and wants to give out. I’m thinking of just buying an entirely new carburetor. As this one has been rebuilt twice. It does have a raptor petcock. Which direction is reserve again? Images help. Thanks. Also mpg is pretty good so far. Maybe like 50-60mpg? I have to calculate that? I could be super wrong. Just a quick check in. Taking care of my pets today as well. |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by Ruttly on 06/13/23 at 13:47:14 DONT PUT THE FILTER IN WRONG ! |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by retro on 06/13/23 at 15:49:21 Yes, I sort of figured that. I am trying to locate the source of my oil leak. It looks like….it’s coming from that bottom screw? But the oil is higher. I don’t know whether because it’s being kicked up higher or what. I let it run on the Jack a bit, and it started seeping from the bottom of the case. This sounds like a gasket issue? I don’t want to touch it any further on that end. What do you guys think? Here are Imgur links, since the files are needing to be so small. Leak locations(?): https://imgur.com/a/TVSVQYG Also managed to upload those fin pictures and there’s a place on the fork that has a gunky bit of oil. Solution for that? Or just dirty? https://imgur.com/a/FDljlop Also, made a rookie mistake. I accidentally started the bike without the top cap on for maybe 3 mins. Didn’t notice any splashing or anything. I was distracted by people talking to me. Turned it off and put the cap back on. A little later, I found out my wrench was the wrong size, so I just rode the bike up the hill to my brothers house to keep it warm. I don’t know if this is due to that or something with a more serious problem. But my bike is smoking from the shown location. Almost from the muffler. I looked inside and it looks MESSY. Like really gunky and oily and just wow, just from what I could see through that little hole. I tried to fix the camera as best I could. But I’m hoping it wasn’t the pipe being moved by the Jack or something. Really considering taking it to a mechanic at this point. I’m not going to ride it or change the oil just yet. I’m a bit afraid of what’s happened and what I’ve uncovered. There’s more oil on the fins now and not only that but there’s oil on the bottom of the exhaust where it comes out of the head (sorry if it’s the wrong terminology) Here’s the new mess: https://imgur.com/a/mK06fBs |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by retro on 06/13/23 at 16:37:56 Update: it appears I’m just a dummy and oil spat out and I didn’t see it. We’re still good. ;) doing the oil now, oils been drained. Just popped out the oil filter. Had a kn-137 in it. I bought a Suzuki one. |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by retro on 06/13/23 at 17:04:42 Update #2: the original idiot that “restored” the bike, threw away the SMALL o ring. Where can I buy another? One didn’t come with the Suzuki oil filter. |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by ThumperPaul on 06/14/23 at 08:18:52 Here's the o-ring for the oil filter. I looked up a 2006 but it should be the same regardless of year. Shipping will be more than the part. You might just want to go to the auto parts store and buy an assortment. The description of the part (D:2.4, ID:15.8) seems to imply a ring thickness of 2.4mm with an inside diameter of 15.5mm. Also I've been very happy with the Rotella T4 15W/40 here in Houston (affordable dyno juice). Glad your oil leak wasn't serious. https://www.revzilla.com/oem/suzuki/suzuki-09280-15007-o-ring-d24-id158?sku_id=1568734 |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by retro on 06/14/23 at 08:24:27 I’ll have to get a new gasket for the crank case (?) where it’s leaking. The eye glass, for the oil level, is that supposed to be full or half full? I cannot remember. I spilled some and kinda eyeballed it to make up for the spillage. The eye glass is full. I took a ride and the gears feel like they’re grinding even more when I shift. In fact, the neutral light is coming on when I shift past it. Never had that problem. There might be too much oil in it….I’m wondering if the clutch lever needs adjusting when it comes to the gears. It hadn’t been really ridden in a year before I got it a week or so ago. Just cranked every week for a while. So I’m basically waking up the bike again. |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by ThumperPaul on 06/14/23 at 08:34:59 Also managed to upload those fin pictures and there’s a place on the fork that has a gunky bit of oil. Solution for that? Or just dirty? https://imgur.com/a/FDljlop. I just saw these pics. I think you have the dreaded plug/cap leak. Look in the cavity just above the exhaust port/pipe. You should see a nice clean nut. If it's black with oil, this is your culprit. Here's a link to the topic. http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1099227295 |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by ThumperPaul on 06/14/23 at 09:09:38 There are marks on the eye glass. Hard to see them if it's grimy down there. Basically between 1/3 and 2/3rds. Make sure the bike is straight up and down (perfectly vertical), on level ground, and not leaning on the kick stand. Here's a link to more info and pics. http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1099572561 |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by retro on 06/14/23 at 10:24:13 1C203D25382D3A18293D24480 wrote:
Good grief. I’m guessing this isn’t an easy fix… |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by ThumperPaul on 06/14/23 at 10:53:21 I feel your pain on the plug/cap leak. The grime on the folk could be fork oil (bad seal) or it could be oil that spayed on it from the plug/cap leak. You might try to isolate it by cleaning off the forks, then taping some plastic around the travel area of the forks. Go for a ride. When you return from the ride, check it. If you get a mess on the outside of the plastic wrap, its from the plug/cap leak spraying it. If it on the inside of the plastic, its the fork seal. It may not do anything on the inside of the plastic if all the folk oil is already gone. Are your front forks really spongy and soft? That would be a sign of low fork oil. Edit: I just looked at the photo of the forks more closely. You are getting quite a bit of fork travel. My travel is about half of that, but I ride pretty normal and don't nose dive the bike hard. It also looks like the one fork boot (on the grimy side) is shinier and oilier than the other. I'm more suspecting a fork seal leak. I'd also expect to see a more equal amount of grime on both if the oil is coming from the plug/cap. |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by retro on 06/16/23 at 09:55:11 Managed to get my hands on a better picture. What will happen if I don’t fix this right away? This is my daily driver and I spent all my money getting the bike back because I love it so much. It’ll be a while before I can have a shop fix this and the carb. Pic: https://imgur.com/a/bwwWk4d |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by Yoshi on 06/16/23 at 21:27:39 Welcome back! I do the same, buy and sell, and buy and sell These are great bikes, very nimble and easy to ride my favorite is that theyre really easy to work on If the oil dribbles don't bother you then just clean it off for now and monitor the oil level. You're probably losing barely any oil from that headplug sweat Always check the oil level after the bike sits for a good while, you dont want to overfill the oil nor not have enough. It'll take you a few seconds to check it once you do it a few times Some people check the oil level right after riding and don't see oil and add excessive amounts, then oil is pushed out from every crevis,especially the air box puke tube I like the oil level above the lower line and below the top line, right in the middle is what I'm aiming for Always check the oil with the bike off the kickstand and level --Now the carburator, I always replace the stock jets with brand new jets when I get a used bike, the pilot is very easy to get clogged I would buy a jet set here on the marketplace and instal 52.5 pilot and 150 main, the bike will run good like that. If you don't feel confident to rejetting the carburator yourslef then give it to someone to instal those jets, if the bike runs right now then new jets is all you need Id you want to learn how to work on your bike then watch some YouTube videos, your most important tool while doing the carburator jetting is a screwdriver, go ahead and buy a #2 JIS -Japanese Industry Specific type, I like the brand Vessel When you're ready for more theres all different write up on the head plug and you can buy an aluminum one in the marketplace |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by ThumperPaul on 06/17/23 at 09:44:18 For the carb... You said it was rebuilt. Did they make any jet changes? Yoshi's advice on the jet sizes is sound proven advice. BUT, do you have access to the air/fuel mix screw? See the link below for location and details... If you see a brass cap, you DON'T have access to the air/fuel mix screw. It almost sounds like your air/fuel mixture could be off. If the jets were changed, there is a 99% chance the air/fuel mixture is not correct. This would cause poor idle and rough performance. Or worse, the bike won't even start. Even if the jets were not changed, the factory preset air/fuel mixture could be off after a rebuild of the carb and how well it was or wasn't cleaned. http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1221818822 |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by retro on 06/17/23 at 17:41:00 407C617964716644756178140 wrote:
I contacted the previous owners. The owner said “just make it run like it’s supposed to.” So I have no idea. A couple years back a guy sent me a jet for me and I put it in and it ran a little better but not optimal. I’ll have to look up what’s going on. Here’s some pics of the carb in the mean time: https://imgur.com/a/jOZtbrx |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by ThumperPaul on 06/17/23 at 18:24:10 This is your air/fuel mix screw. It is exposed and ready to tinker with. See the other link I sent. Turning it clockwise will make the mix leaner. Counterclockwise is richer. Get the bike to idle as good as you can with the idle screw (I'm guessing you can find that). Go for a short ride and get the engine warm and up to operating temp. Now...with it idling, gentle move the Air/Fuel screw 1/8th to 1/4 turn counterclockwise (richer). Pause... Listen... If the engine picks up RPMs in about 5 seconds stop. If the rpm drop or the engine dies, go back to where you started. Then go the other way (clockwise, leaner) and try the same thing. You are trying to find the sweet spot where the rpms are max at the same low idle speed. Once you get it better going in one direction, keep slowing going that way (slowly)... When the rpms drop off, back off the other way about 1/8th - 1/4 turn or so until it sounds good again (highest rpm). You may have to adjust the idle screw down once you find the sweet spot. Be patient and do things slow and easy! The engine may not respond immediately to the little adjustments you make. Listen carefully to what's going to. This is "dialing it in"... |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by ThumperPaul on 06/17/23 at 18:26:20 Here are a couple very good technical articles. I encourage you to spend some time getting better acquainted with the website. There is a plethora of excellent info to learn from!! http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?board=tech;action=display;num=1157720585 http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1309246277 |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by Dave on 06/18/23 at 03:03:24 497568706D786F4D7C68711D0 wrote:
I agree with what Thumperpaul has said.....however I believe you need to lower the idle speed to around 800rpm to properly adjust the fuel/air mixture. (At the normal idle speed of 1,100 rpm the slide is up a bit and adding fuel/air......it is impossible to make an accurate adjustment of the idle fuel/air screw). Get the bike fully warmed up and and hold it upright so the cam oils properly (the left side of the cam starves for oil when running on the sidestand). Drop the idle speed down to around 800, adjust the mixture screw for the smoothest idle, then raise the idle speed back up to 1,100 rpm. This adjustment should take a minute or less once you get used to doing it. Once set......you should not have to change it again - however you can experiment by moving it 1/4 turn either way while riding and see if it affects the amount of noise from the muffler when you close the throttle or shut the bike off. Here is a good video that illustrates the sound you are looking for while adjusting the fuel/air screw. It is a Honda - but the sound you are listening for is the same. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zm5mB3R8Ucw&t=1s[/media] |
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Title: Re: I bought back my old bike. I have a few questi Post by retro on 06/18/23 at 18:47:08 172C2136272B30362D252837440 wrote:
I agree with what Thumperpaul has said.....however I believe you need to lower the idle speed to around 800rpm to properly adjust the fuel/air mixture. (At the normal idle speed of 1,100 rpm the slide is up a bit and adding fuel/air......it is impossible to make an accurate adjustment of the idle fuel/air screw). Get the bike fully warmed up and and hold it upright so the cam oils properly (the left side of the cam starves for oil when running on the sidestand). Drop the idle speed down to around 800, adjust the mixture screw for the smoothest idle, then raise the idle speed back up to 1,100 rpm. This adjustment should take a minute or less once you get used to doing it. Once set......you should not have to change it again - however you can experiment by moving it 1/4 turn either way while riding and see if it affects the amount of noise from the muffler when you close the throttle or shut the bike off. Here is a good video that illustrates the sound you are looking for while adjusting the fuel/air screw. It is a Honda - but the sound you are listening for is the same. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zm5mB3R8Ucw&t=1s[/media] [/quote] Thank you, but I don’t know what RPM’s I’m at, I’m totally blind. There’s no tac. I’m scared to touch anything on the carb. I really feel like I’m gonna screw it up more than it is. In other news, I’ve got a fork seal leak, The bike ran pretty well today, not really backfiring, starts right up…I dumped some carb cleaner in the gas tank a few days ago, and it’s improving the performance I think…but the bike gets so hot and it’s running rich, I know it is. It’s high idle at high speeds. The vibration is bad. Like when I turn the throttle more than half way, it feels like it’s gonna vibrate and the rpm is really fast. I’m scared it’ll blow up. However, I’d I’m easy on the throttle, it’s fine. I lost my air vent cover on the road today. Not the medal one that’s the color of the bike, the one that actually covers the vent. I’m so sad as it’s an OEM part, original to that bike. I can’t find it anywhere. I live in a small town and traced my riding but it’s totally gone. I drained some gas out of the carb from the bottom, where the float is, that screw. Looked at the gas and it’s got some stuff floating around in it, small particles, couple bugs. The gas tank needs to be cleaned, there’s a surface layer of rust setting in, I’m unsure of the condition inside the tank down around where the petcock is. I want to either buy a new tank or have it cleaned. I also hit 17,000 miles today! Also can someone point to me where the puke tube is? |
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