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Message started by gtenginerd on 01/17/21 at 16:32:18

Title: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 01/17/21 at 16:32:18

Edit: since this is becoming a build thread, I'll start going back and adding any important details of how I've gotten to where I am now. For now, I'll replace the starting carb pic with a pic of the bike the day my dad dropped it off. He's getting older and riding less. He needed some space in his garage, so I was the lucky recipient of the bike he rarely rode.

Seat, tank, carb, battery box, air box muffler and header all off yesterday.

Today I rejetted the carb to 50/150, and cleaned it as well as possible. First question: I read something about a white spacer and a washer mod, but couldn't find details. Wut y'all talkin' 'bout? :)

Got the K&N cone filter dry fitted to the carb.

I was looking into removing the rear fender, but didn't have anything to label the electrical wires, so I stopped. Second question: what's the thing that looks like a heat sink between the fender and seat? Does that need to remain?

Cognito Moto rearsets came in, so I'm looking into building the rearset brackets. Planning to get bar and tube stock, make all the pieces and have a custom metal shop down the street do the welding.

Last question: Anyone have suggestions for a battery box?

Title: Re: It has Begun
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 01/17/21 at 17:36:14

What has begun?

The heat sink looking thing is the regulator/rectifier. It must remain as part of the harness, and it requires air flow to ensure a long life.

Depending on what as begun may dictate what you can/will do with the battery box, and maybe the R/R.

The white spacer mod is a way of shimming the needle to a higher position. Two #4 washers will accomplish the same result as shaving the white spacer.

Title: Re: It has Begun
Post by gtenginerd on 01/17/21 at 18:27:26

Thanks Gary...

Started the winter project I'd been asking questions about over the past few months.

Trying to do a scrambler/brat style seat (see pic of it laid on bike). I've got the seat loop and seat, just need to figure out what to do once the rear fender is off. Moving the foot controls, and maybe an 18" rear wheel are all that's planned other than that. Hopefully done in time to ride again when it warms up.

Title: Re: It has Begun
Post by Slowlane on 01/17/21 at 18:39:26

You have no fear....I admire that....the only thing I might add is that you can get a smaller battery and eliminate the battery box completely. It's a bit expensive but you can even install it upside down. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008R0L05Y/ref=ox_sc_saved_title_3?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&psc=1

Title: Re: It has Begun
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 01/17/21 at 19:07:57

Ok, now that I see what you are doing, why not build an electronics box for the battery, R/R and start solenoid that you can mount under the seat. All you need is some .032 aluminum, a workbench bending brake and some pop rivets.

That rear fender assembly is about 40 pounds and worth eliminating if you can. The bike will have a nice clean look without it.

Title: Re: It has Begun
Post by DragBikeMike on 01/17/21 at 23:20:41

That looks pretty cool. I'm likin the handlebar setup.

White Spacer Mod: Reduce the thickness of the plastic washer (piece 6) that sits on top of the eClip (piece 7) for the slide needle (piece 10). Usually, reducing the thickness by about 50% does the trick. Thinner equals richer mixture, thicker equals leaner mixture. I personally prefer to just replace the plastic washer with some #4 steel washers from the hardware store. That way, you have more adjustability and you preserve the plastic washer so you can restore to stock if you don't like the results.

Title: Re: It has Begun
Post by gtenginerd on 01/18/21 at 09:42:54

@Slowlane, love the battery idea. Seeing the picture doesn't do justice for the size. Size, weight, and orientation flexibility, make that an obvious choice for my application.

@Gary, I'd thought about getting a piece of stainless used for kitchen backslashes and doing the same thing. It's .02 thickness instead. Is that a bad idea?

@Mike, thanks. That's helpful. I got the carb kit from lancer and am guessing that's what the 3 random washer were, lol.

Title: Re: It has Begun
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 01/18/21 at 10:00:52

Working with stainless is like working with razor blades. I'd much rather work with aluminum.

Title: Re: It has Begun
Post by LANCER on 01/18/21 at 10:32:27

“@Mike, thanks. That's helpful. I got the carb kit from lancer and am guessing that's what the 3 random washer were, lol.”

The 3 washers are to replace the white plastic spacer, use 2 or 3 depending on the needs of your engine, depending on whether your engine is stock or modified and the altitude of your location and your weather.
Your exhaust system is a major factor as well. The better it flows the more fuel needed if you have a heavy throttle hand like mine is from time to time.
It happens. [ch128526][ch127949]

Title: Re: It has Begun
Post by ohiomoto on 01/18/21 at 16:32:48

You're basically trying to copy most of the RYCA build/parts. So any RYCA build thread that still has pictures is your friend.

You might want to look at my build. I was able to use the rear tank mounts and rear fender mounts to hold my hoop. I ditched the stock tank, but the concept would be the same. I put my battery under the seat as Gary described and I made rearset brackets. I hung mid-controls, you could do rearsets.

I have a DYI mid-control thread linked in there that should have a couple of other ideas for you.

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1472222031/0

This is what my stock tank concept looked like. (I ended up using the gold GT185 tank in the background.)
http://suzukisavage.com/yabb2.2/Attachments/IMG_20161028_243105070_001.jpg

Title: Re: It has Begun
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 01/18/21 at 19:39:21

On page 5 of my DRZ build thread (linked below) you’ll see the under seat electronics box I made for this build. I was able to fit a Battery Tender branded LiFePO4 battery in this box that is about the size of two stacks of playing cards in size. This little battery spins the bike up perfectly.

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1484061156/60

Title: Re: It has Begun
Post by gtenginerd on 01/19/21 at 18:48:03

@Lancer, thanks for the info. I've never worked on a carb other than taking the bowl of and cleaning/spreading carb cleaner all over to get the lawnmower working. I'm afraid I'm going to screw something up working with the fuel/air mixture. I would have said it ran rich. It would crank without choke in summer, and back fire on decel. After replacing the muffler with a small cone eng, it didn't back fire anymore when shutting off. I'm at 500 ft elevation, but may occasionally ride up to 1500 or so. I'll need to see what jets I took out, but saw 50/150 is a good start. Should I go ahead and do the washer mod, while I have the carb off?

@Ohio, I found the dimensions of the rearset brackets, that's very helpful. Bought some bar stock today and plan to work on that soon. How did you fix the brake cable and shifter rod to the new foot controls? Also the kickstand doesn't look easy. :-/

@Gary, check, aluminum, not stainless. Got the sheet and pop rivets today. My metal working is going to look like $#!1 compared to you and OH. Can the r/r be mounted to the bottom of the box?

Edit: rear fender off

Title: Re: It has Begun
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 01/20/21 at 06:07:22

6477666D646A6D667167030 wrote:
Can the r/r be mounted to the bottom of the box?

It most certainly can. That's a great spot for it.

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 01/20/21 at 10:37:56

First chance to see what it may look like. I'm getting excited now.

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by ohiomoto on 01/20/21 at 15:46:18

Good start there. General rules are that you want create a straight line of some sort with the seat and tank. In a perfect world the end of your seat or some other part of body work will line up over the rear axle. This doesn't mean that you can't take liberties, these things lead to a better looking bike.

I didn't use the stock rear brake cable. I found a set of pegs and controls from an XS400 and just made them fit.

I more or less stole all of the best ideas I could find on here and made it as simple as I could. I broke it down into smaller chunks and made sure it was operational along the way. I didn't touch my stock forward controls or kickstand until I had the seat and tank in place. I didn't do the seat and tank until I had the suspension done. I did most of my jetting before I even started my build. The worst thing to do is take everything apart and not get it put back together.

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by LANCER on 01/20/21 at 16:53:49

Yes, go ahead and change out the white spacer while you’ve got the carb out.
Be careful with the tiny screws in the bottom of the slide, they are soft metal and strip easily. I open the jaws of a vice just slightly to slide the needle between them until the slide is sitting on the vice top, then tighten the vice just a little. This will hold it in place and provide a solid base to use a small impact driver or good fitting screwdriver to remove the screws without stripping them. Replace the stock screws with good stainless screws.

If they strip out and you need to drill them be careful doing so.

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 01/27/21 at 19:30:03

The carb is back in, and the bike cranked up fine and ran well. I had one issue, but I think I figured it out. It wouldn't crank and I could tell it wasn't getting gas. After checking the tank level and petcock, I figured it had something to do with the line that used to run from the engine to the air box. Now that I removed the air box, I figured it couldn't get a suction. I put my finger over the line and it cranked up. I assume I need to plug this. Lmk if there's a better method.

I've started on fabbing seat mounts and rearset brackets. The seat mounts should be fairly simple. I have them almost ready to install, and kind of copied ohiomoto's.

The rearset brackets are going to be tougher, and moving the controls, probably harder. Below is the template I made for the first step of the bracket. I have some tube steel, that I'll cut to about 2" long and will attach to the bracket. Then the mounting plate that the rearset will attach to. I'm thinking threaded rod connecting each side together for additional support like the ryca mount.

The wife is out of town this week so it's just me trying to keep the kids alive right now. Not much progress this week. ;D :D

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by verslagen1 on 01/27/21 at 19:49:38

2F3C2D262F21262D3A2C480 wrote:

The only line I know of that runs from the engine to the airbox is the breather.
around a half inch line? Don't plug that.

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 01/30/21 at 08:12:59

I don't know much about metalwork, so bear with me...

Does welding this up as shown (without foam template of course) present any issues?

Is there an easy way to join the outside (top in picture) mounting plate so it can be adjusted/swiveled to get the placement of the rearset where I want it, once on the bike? Hopefully that makes sense.

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 01/30/21 at 10:14:19

Update: All pieces for seat loop mount and rearset brackets cut.

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by Dave on 01/31/21 at 05:26:10

2330212A232D2A213620440 wrote:

Is there an easy way to join the outside (top in picture) mounting plate so it can be adjusted/swiveled to get the placement of the rearset where I want it, once on the bike?

You could use two different diameters of pipe.....one the bike side and one on the peg side. The pegs could slide inside the tube and you could rotate it where you want it.....and use either a pin or set screw to lock it in place.

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 01/31/21 at 06:22:16

If it’s all set up and ready to go, you’d be shocked how inexpensive welding can be. Moreover, you don’t have to worry about vibration.

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 01/31/21 at 07:23:40

Thanks Dave and Gary.

I like the idea of a swivel, but after looking into it more, I'm going weld them back and parallel to the ground. Headed to a friend's that's pretty good at welding. I'll update here once complete.

To afix the rearset mounts to one another, I was thinking threaded rod with nuts on both sides, so they're easier to install and remove if needed. Thoughts?

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 01/31/21 at 07:51:57

I think a treaded rod is a great solution. Be sure to use nuts and lock nuts on all four sides.

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by Edub on 02/02/21 at 23:00:29

You're making great progress! Subscribed!

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 02/05/21 at 05:26:53

Not pretty, but I think it's decent for a first time welder.

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by norm92de on 02/05/21 at 08:37:41

Not too bad at all. In fact great.

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 02/05/21 at 08:57:34

Looks good. 95% of it will be out of view. That and paint hides all sins.

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by Edub on 02/05/21 at 09:54:20

4B5849424B4542495E482C0 wrote:

Not pretty, but I think it's decent for a first time welder.

Those welds look pretty good, actually! What kind of welder are you using? It looks like a bit more heat might have helped with penetration, but I’m sure they’ll hold in this application. Did you use slugs at the tubing intersections? I can’t tell from the photo.

Are you designing this to be a bolt-on seat frame, or will you be welding this assembly to the bike’s frame. If I was an inexperienced welder, my recommendation would be to design this as a bolt-on assembly.

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 02/08/21 at 16:17:00

Used a lincoln 110 mig welder. We tried adjusting the heat after I burned a couple holes in the tube when I started. The tube being thinner than the bar steel, probably meant we adjusted it too low for the bar. But I stopped putting holes in the tube. :-/

I did make it removable. Had to pick up longer bolts for the front/tank mount, and new ones for the rear mounting point after drilling out the fender threads.

Now on to electronics. I've made a plate to mount the r/r and starter solenoid, and cut down the battery box to be the same size as LiPo, but I need to organize the wires and rewire the rear lights.

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by Edub on 02/08/21 at 20:12:23

2635242F26282F243325410 wrote:

Lincoln makes a good welder. My question was more about whether you use gas or flux core wire in your machine, apologies did not being specific. Gas will give much cleaner welds, but costs more. Thanks for the photos, they answered my other question, about whether you were cutting the frame or not, and whether your subframe was going to be bolted or welded on. Great photos and progress, thanks for sharing!

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 02/21/21 at 07:04:10

@edub: it was flux core...easy for me to learn, but did require quite a bit of cleanup.

Status update of things recently completed:
More welding to afix the mounting plates to the seat loop.
Painted the seat loop.
Made a mount for the license plate holder.
Painted the battery box that I chopped up.
Mounted battery box and seat loop.
Used a 1.5" x 2" flexible plumbing connector to mount the new cone filter.
Wired up the rear lights.

Next Up:
General wire cleanup - The wires for the tail light are 26 gauge or something tiny and the solderless connectors required too much heat for the tiny wire. Going back to traditional soldering and heat shrink. I have a few 4 pin aviator connectors I might use to keep the flimsy wires secure.

Small aluminum fender to shield the electrical - from the ride around the block yesterday, enough muck from the road dirtied up the clean bike to make me want to do this.

Steel Braid Brake Line - This has been sitting on the shelf for months and I never got around to it.

Muffler Mount - after taking off the bottom plate (idk the name), I don't have anything to secure the muffler to. I need to make the aluminum bar a couple inches longer and it will attach just fine to another mounting hole.

Rear Wheel - I purchased a hub off ebay and had it sent to Buchanans. Going with a 18x3.5 so I can fit the AVON Roadrider MKII 130/70 x 18 on it. The hub just arrived there on friday.

Foot Controls - I cycle a good bit, and the biggest difference I can tell is the lack of ability to control the bike with my core based on my foot and leg position. I think I'll really love this bike after I get this done, but it's going to take some planning. The kickstand and brake cables don't have a clear solution for me yet.

Title: Re: It has Begun - Scrambler Build
Post by Edub on 02/22/21 at 23:49:12

Great progress, it's coming along nicely! Looking forward to your next update, keep the pictures coming!

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 02/25/21 at 20:19:34

I was super disappointed with the first pass at rewiring the rear lights. Here's the revised version with aviator connectors. These will get mounted to the inside of the extended aluminum fender I plan to make this weekend.

No duct tape and bailing wire yet...

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Edub on 02/25/21 at 20:40:27

I meant to ask you this before, what seat are you using? It looks good!

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 02/26/21 at 06:24:24

687B6A616866616A7D6B0F0 wrote:

Here's the revised version with aviator connectors.

I've never heard them called that before. Aviators would actually call them BNC connectors. They are typically used for coaxial antenna connections.

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 03/05/21 at 03:35:18

@edub: Tuffside Seat with upswept tail and rear band stitching.
https://www.tuffside.com/2-Tone-Universal-Brat-Seats-p/tuff_uni_flatseat.htm

@Gary: I went down a rabbit hole on the connectors and naming...long story short, the aviators are recent chinese design (withholding comment) adopted by folks here doing custom usb cable design. They've worked well for me so far.

Update: Not much progress. I actually went backwards some. I made an aluminum plate with a mount for the connectors and it works great. The issue was I got too excited and didn't double check everything before going out for a ride. The new license plate mount didn't have enough clearance with all the travel the new rear shocks provide, and I hadn't gotten locknuts for the screws holding it. Mid ride I heard something and looked down. The mount was dangling right above the tire from the electric cable. Pulled over, disconnected electrical using the trusty new aViAtOr ConNeCtoR :D and came on home. I ended up heating up the aluminum bar stock I used for the mount and bending it to get the extra clearance. Put it back together, turned the key and saw smoke come out of the license plate light. I should have check the connection to the light after the stressed from dangling. The wires were stripped and shorted out. No license plate light atm. :-/ on the bright side, I love the bike. It's really fun to ride and I can't wait until I can get the rearsets on.

Brake line this weekend, rear wheel gets here next Friday. May enjoy it/ride it some before trying the rearsets. Replace the tires and put on rear wheel and do rear sets in a few months.

The only question I have today...could I have screwed something up when swapping the front springs over to the racetech springs? They're stiff as can be and almost hurts to go over railroad tracks. I put the right amount of fork oil and cut spacers as directed.

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 03/05/21 at 05:44:24

What rate springs did you install? What is your weight? Which part number springs did you choose?

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Edub on 03/05/21 at 08:03:56

Gary’s asking the right questions, of course! I’ll have to re-read your posts, I don’t recall if you got the cartridge emulators or not. They are adjustable, which may help, but the spring rate is a critical first step, before playing with damping rates. Did you measure your static sag after installing the new springs? If so, what did you get? This may help experts much smarter than me help diagnose the issues.

Looking good overall. Sorry to hear about your clearance issue, but it’s good the damage wasn’t worse. I thought that might have been one of Craig Chappell’s Tuffside seats. They look really well made, although I’ve never sat in one. Is it reasonably comfortable?

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 03/05/21 at 11:06:06

@Gary, They are Model # FRSPS3234080 - 0.80 Spring Rate. I'm 175#, 180# after a long weekend. I called and talked to their technical sales guy and gave him all the info and he said for my weight I should cut the spacers flush with the top of the tube. No cartridge emulators...yet.

@Edub, Didn't measure sag after install. The seat is comfortable enough for me, but I'm doing max 1 hour rides, mostly scooting around town.

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 03/05/21 at 12:14:37

3B2839323B3532392E385C0 wrote:
@Gary, They are Model # FRSPS3234080 - 0.80 Spring Rate. I'm 175#, 180# after a long weekend. I called and talked to their technical sales guy and gave him all the info and he said for my weight I should cut the spacers flush with the top of the tube. No cartridge emulators...yet.

I think RaceTech suggested the wrong springs. I used the FRSP S2938070 springs on my bike. I too weigh 175-180 and the part number I noted are 0.70kg/mm springs. I also think the FRSPS32340XX might be a bit too large...but the S2938070 series only goes up to 0.75kg/mm - so if the tech miscalculated the rate...that would lead him to the larger spring. The ID of the fork tubes is 33mm and you have installed 32mm springs. For reference the OEM springs are 29mm (as are the part number I've used). Anyway...

When you spoke with Racetech, did you tell them that your Savage was much lighter then the OEM bike? Just by loosing the rear fender assembly you shaved about 40 pounds from the bike - that is significant. My cafe racer weighs in the 295 pound range, and 290-300 seems to be fairly typical of the genre'.

I think the preload suggestion is a correct starting point...for springs of the correct rate. Edub asks the correct question, what is the static sag and race sag. You should see about 35-40mm of race sag and 10-15mm of static sag. Read post #4 of my suspension set-up thread => http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1498156004

My suggestion, return those springs for the part number I noted above. Preload with 15mm. I would use a larger air gap then the OEM suggestion of 75mm. I would suggest 100mm for now, and 140mm after you install the GVE's.

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 03/07/21 at 18:12:33

The brake line is replaced. It was much easier than I expected.

I measured the baseline and static sag and was confused as it looked off compared to what you mentioned. Once I confirmed, I never made it back out to remeasure and reassess. Looks like I've got about almost 3 inches (70mm) of static sag. WTF. I'm not sure what's going on, but it explains it being so uncomfortable. I plan to take caps off and check spacers, and go through what I did on the install. I'm not sure how it could be that far off.

Thanks Gary and Edub

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 03/08/21 at 06:32:11

3 inches of static sag? Something is very wrong. Are you sure you had 15mm of preload? The OEM springs are 394mm in length. The springs you installed are 340mm in length (FRSPS3234080). Did you cut new spacers that were at least 54mm (2 inches) longer than the original spacer?

Based on the diameter, free-length and rate - I would replace those springs with FRSP S2938070 springs. BTW, I just checked racetech's site and they now offer the 29380 series springs in rates from 0.70 up to 0.95 kg/mm.

BTW, more bad news, those fork stanchions are pitting and need to be re-chromed or replaced. They will eat through your fork seals in short order. You can try polishing them with 00 steel wool, but they look a bit too far gone in my opinion. At the very least, polish the ones you have, and when the fork seals fail you can install new tubes with the seals.

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 03/08/21 at 08:18:16

Spacers are definitely the issue. Cut them flush as instructed and they weren't 2 inch longer than stock. I'll revise spacers and polish forks for now. make plans for long term. Thanks a bunch Gary!

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 03/08/21 at 09:14:31

Put your new springs next to the old ones, that's how much longer the spacer needs to be.

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 03/08/21 at 12:07:33

Well, I messed that up pretty bad. Not sure what I did. Guess I cut the spacer after there was load on it or something...wow.

The number on the spring doesn't look like any of the model numbers suggested. I'm guessing that's not the model number, right?

Since the new spring and spacer are the same length as the old spring, could I just add the old space on top, with the right size washer in between? See right pic. Or should I got try to find something to use for a new spacer?

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 03/08/21 at 13:29:04

Racetech doesn't make the springs. That is a manufacturers part number, but the rate is correctly noted. Like I mentioned above, I think that spring is too short. But if you are committed to using it, reinstall the spring in the fork leg and with the tube fully extended measure the distance of the top of the spring to the top of the fork tube (maybe just a few mm's longer). That is the required spacer length. The threaded portion of the fork cap is about 15mm, so that will get you your 15mm of preload.

It does appear that you could stack the spacers. You would have to put a washer between them. But the correct solution is a single spacer cut from a length of 1-1/4" PVC (I think Schedule-80 comes in 1-1/8 which is a better size) with a washer between the PVC and the spring, and a second washer between the cap and the PVC. Subtract the thickness of the washers from the measured length of PVC.

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 03/22/21 at 20:40:17

Short update. Replaced spacers on the front forks. It rides much better, but I still need to call racetech to talk through replacement.

While I was working on it, I also scrubbed the rust on the sanctions. Can't tell it was ever there. I'll keep an eye on the seals though. Thanks Gary.

I went out of town, and when I returned, noticed a small oil puddle under the bike, wtf... It's coming from the left side on the case behind the shift rod. Any thoughts on how to diagnose and fix? I'm also a bit worried I caused this, since it wasn't leaking last fall. :-/ :(

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 03/23/21 at 06:35:47

I would put a wrench on it and see if it turns at all. But in the top photo, I believe I see some cracking in the case. It could be just the way the oil/dirt have formed. The case shouldn't crack on its own without some trauma.

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Ruttly on 03/23/21 at 10:11:18

Try tightening all the long engine mounting bolts that go thru frame and engine. Clean area , check oil level , ride it , recheck for leaks.

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by SoC on 03/23/21 at 16:40:42

Ruttly, Thanks for the useful info. I put my 2011 in the rack last week to install a new Delkevic muffler. Of course to do that I had to remove the stock. To make that as easy as possible I pulled the entire assembly with the header, to put it up on the bench to work on it. So a couple days ago I walk by te bike and there is a small oil stain on the floor under it in area that gtenginerd experienced. This bike had never leaked any oil in the over 18 months I have had it, so I was a bit perplexed. I cleaned up the floor and examined under it and could not see anywhere there was sign of oil leaking on engine. I placed a fresh paper towel under it to see what happens and haven't been to shop since (on vacation this week) to follow up.

Anyway to get to point, to remove exhaust assembly I had to pull the guard for it attached with the said bolts of the right footpeg. Think (read hope) that this is the source, as that's the only thing that was done to bike since I last rode it almost 3 weeks ago, it had sat for 2 weeks before I statred working on it and no oil stain in that spot. I feel better with the knowledge and hope that it will all be fine when I get back to working on it next week. I just could not figure out or see where the oil was coming from as it appeared to be in that area on the bike but I was like "there's nothing there to leak oil".

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by badwolf on 03/23/21 at 19:16:42

The 2 footpeg bolts go thru the engine. When you have them loose for awhile it is common to seep some oil from the center split of the engine. Should go away when you tighten the bolts back up.

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 03/23/21 at 20:21:19

So you're saying I shouldn't jb weld it like this rear diff... ;D
https://i.redd.it/64360qwm3vo61.jpg

So this is all making sense in an embarrassing way, but I have no shame, so...

My dad dropped it on that side a few years ago, nothing major. Low speed, in a turn, some gravel on the road, too much front break. That's the story I got at least. No leak afterward. I've been working on the bike and didn't realize the screws through the muffler mount on the bottom of the bike were also securing the bottom of the motor mount (see picture). At the same time I screwed up the suspension and rode this thing like a flintstone car, bumping hard on the road. After a couple rides I realized the bolts needed to be reinstalled on the motor mount, but probably loosened things up some and have allowed the leak to occur. Some newbie mistakes, but it's honestly therapeutic, so here we go with more garage time trying to fix it.

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 03/24/21 at 05:48:19

I'm not trying to be insulting or disrespectful, but I need to make a point here.

I'm seeing a trend in your mechanics and maintenance practices. I don't think you are visualizing the necessary steps to perform maintenance and you are not inspecting your work to see if you have achieved the desired result. There seems to be a bit of haphazardness to your approach. So far the results have been comical...but you seem to have the potential to turn this haphazardness into a deadly situation. My suggestion:

Buy or download a manual for the bike
Prior to performing maintenance on the bike, create a punch list of required steps
Purchase and use a torque wrench. Put all torque values on your list
Stop from time to time to review what has been done, and what are the next steps
Take your time, but stay focused
Upon completion, go through your punch list and check off each item
If something doesn't seem right, it probably isn't

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 03/24/21 at 06:34:38

No offense taken. You are completely correct. You've given the gut check I needed to slow down and be more thorough. I appreciate that. I've got the manual and a torque wrench, just need to put them to better use.

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by niceast on 03/24/21 at 20:54:26

Did you ever figure out that leaky side stand.

seems common
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1457549790/2

I have it too. after riding it will drop 2-3 drops of oils. I fill 3 tablespoon every thousands.

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 04/05/21 at 19:52:42

Spring Break, coaching soccer and baseball, new job and plenty of other things...short version:

Torqued main bolts, they needed it, torqued bolts around leak, nothing glaring...leak slowed to 1 drop per 4-5 days (from multiple per day). Need a smaller torque wrench to test smaller bolts...will report back

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Edub on 04/10/21 at 20:34:56

40534249404E49425543270 wrote:

Good to hear that this helped, hopefully the leak will stop. Looking forward to your continuing updates, I really like the direction you've gone with your bike.

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Dave on 04/11/21 at 03:48:00

The drips may take a little bit of time to disappear. The oil has seeped out of the crankcase joint and gone into the space between the spacer tube and engine mount bolt. A few rides and heat cycles may be necessary to allow the oil to find it's way out.

Don't over-tighten the small bolts - they strip easily. A small wrench and one hand is all that should be used.....just make sure they are snug and not gorilla grip tight!

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Edub on 04/11/21 at 13:51:00

457E7364757962647F777A65160 wrote:

100% agree, and an inch-pound torque wrench is your friend!

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 08/08/21 at 21:12:32

Refreshing this chain. Been traveling for work, entertaining kids during the summer, and riding instead of working on the bike. No problems with the bike, just started to notice some nuances. would like to put together a plan of next projects for the winter. Current list is:

1. Rear pulley wobble
2. cosmetic cleanup and electrical from airbox delete
3. helmet lock relocation
4. horn replacement
(not too likely this winter from here)
5. rearsets
6. gas tank/speedo replacement
7. once the tires are more worn down, put the 18" rear wheel on and new tires front and back

1. Rear wobble - After reading up on the recent posts, I think this is pretty bad on my bike. Measuring wobble tomorrow.

2. cosmetics: Thinking I may put a number panel over the frame where the airbox was. Anyone have some good examples of this? Here's something bezos has available: www.amazon.com/gp/product/B074MJP1Y9/
Thoughts?

3. Helmet lock: Another side effect from my mods, no more helmet lock...haven't found a good place to put it yet. Thinking, I'll just find a spot on the frame where the helmet won't hit the exhaust or dangle close to the ground.

4. Horn: The horn is the last major piece of chrome on the bike. It looks out of place and sounds weak. Seems like a easy/quick fix.

Will keep you posted as progress is made.

Thanks to Gary for suggesting I slow down. It's been a nice relaxing summer, and I spent plenty of time looking over my work and riding, instead of tinkering with no real plan or QC process.

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Edub on 08/08/21 at 21:22:57

Great to hear an update, keep plugging away, but having a good plan is really important. More pics will be welcome as your progress continues!

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Dave on 08/09/21 at 03:52:48

7566777C757B7C776076120 wrote:

3. Helmet lock: Another side effect from my mods, no more helmet lock...haven't found a good place to put it yet. Thinking, I'll just find a spot on the frame where the helmet won't hit the exhaust or dangle close to the ground.

I mounted my helmet lock on the license plate mount. I just used a longer screw in one hole and attached the helmet lock.

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Ruttly on 08/10/21 at 11:56:58

I mounted my helmet lock where stock horn was located. Aftermarket horn is large and had to relocate it. It’s not the best place , but it rarely gets used.

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by Tocsik on 08/20/21 at 15:40:49

Wait. Our bikes have a helmet lock?

Title: Re: gtnerd - Scrambler Build
Post by gtenginerd on 08/22/21 at 12:50:22

Mounted the helmet lock to the old air box mount.