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Message started by eskimo619 on 08/10/18 at 14:51:42

Title: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s40.
Post by eskimo619 on 08/10/18 at 14:51:42

Hey everyone, just bought a 2011 suzuki boulevard s40/ls650 a week ago and am looking to make it run a bit smoother. Bike is in great shape and got it for only $600 due to a dent in the tank. Has 8500 miles. Already replaced airfilter and spark plug. Oil change to be done tonight. Pulled the carb and cleaned it out. Looked great inside. Upon test riding it starts alright and idles okay. Throttle response isnt super crisp but I am used to inline 4 cylinder sportbikes so something to get used to. Seems a tad sluggish at most throttle positions. Also it was breaking up at wot but would cruise to top speed at a mid throttle fine. Pulled the air/fuel screw cap and adjusted to 2 turns out. Somewhat smoothed out partial throttle but no change to wot. Also tested the petcock by capping the vac lines and running on prime, no change although I did order a raptor petcock. After all that I was finally able to break the screws loose on the top of the carb to get to the slide and diaphram etc... pulled the white spacer out and filed it down a bit. Bike ran better especially wot it didnt break up like it did before. Adjusted air/fuel screw again.

I picked up some #4 brass washers at home depot and will see if they fit and try 2 of them. Im pretty much at sea level near capecod Massachusetts so I know my bike is running quite lean, also shown by plug condition. Does anyone think its worth going with a bigger main, maybe try a 147.5 as the stock size is 145? Just want to smooth it out a bit. Just shaving the white spacer down did help a lot. Not sure its a bike ill keep as I did get a real good deal on it to flip it but want it running proper for a new owner or myself if I do keep it around. Thanks!

Edit: just swapped in 2 of the #4 washers, had to sand them down a little smaller od wise but they fit. Bike runs good wot now pulls hard, still a little hesitation throughout the rev range tho. Also when Ibstart the bike and have the idle set its good but after a ride and comming to a stop in my driveway the idle is higher and I have to turn it down. Id like to not have to turn it up on start and down once warm. Is that more of the air/fuel screw needing tuning?

http://https://s22.postimg.cc/saik0yed9/20180805_184606.jpg (https://postimg.cc/image/saik0yed9/)
http://https://s22.postimg.cc/haxcpdqj1/20180805_184557.jpg (https://postimg.cc/image/haxcpdqj1/)

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by verslagen1 on 08/10/18 at 15:35:04

I would recommend setting the main jet 1st before modifying the white spacer.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by eskimo619 on 08/10/18 at 15:38:03

3E2D3A3B24292F2D2679480 wrote:

I would recommend setting the main jet 1st before modifying the white spacer.

I only did the spacer mod as some lists I found for common mods had the air/fuel screw first then spacer mod so I did both of those. Didnt want to change the main right away if those 2 could richen it up enough to run smoother. Its defintely much better. As mentioned first test ride it was spitting and losing power at wot, now it pulls hard and smooth wot. Just want to smooth out the low/mid range.

Also just pulled the plug and it didnt come out white after this test ride. Last ride before I did the spacer mod the plug was white. I sanded it down and just checked this time and no white, not really any color but not as lean as before.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by eskimo619 on 08/12/18 at 16:46:59

Added a few pictures of my bike. It wouldnt let me upload the standard way due to the file size. Also should I post in another category? Thought id get more hits than this especially on this topic. Bike does run better so im not super worried. I did find out my local bike shop carries jets in stock so just have to bring my main and pilot in so they can match them. Figure ill get a 147.5 and 150 main, and a 55 pilot of they have it and dial it in more.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by Dave on 08/13/18 at 13:50:29

0610080A0E0C55525A630 wrote:

Also when I start the bike and have the idle set its good but after a ride and coming to a stop in my driveway the idle is higher and I have to turn it down. Id like to not have to turn it up on start and down once warm. Is that more of the air/fuel screw needing tuning?

The "Technical Section" is mainly for "how to" articles that have been tried and proven. General Questions about the Savage go in the Rubber Side Down, off topic questions or comments that don't involve a Savage go in the Cafe' section.

Carbs are very primitive and they cannot adapt to changing conditions like fuel injection does (20 times a second). You should jet the carb so it runs well when the bike is warm - and then you just have to adapt your riding style a bit while the bike warms up. You may or may not need to use the choke to start the bike - each bike is a bit different and the temperature you ride at also matters.......if you ride at 30 degrees and your bike sits out overnight - a choke might be useful.

Most of us just add a bit of throttle with the right hand until the bike warms up and idles properly.....it should only take a few minutes of riding if the bike is jetted properly.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by eskimo619 on 08/13/18 at 15:58:51

The main issue I needed to clear up was the breaking up at wot. Just the washer mod cleared that up, for the most part anyway. I didnt spend too much time hammering it wide open lol. Starts up everytime no choke and idles a tad low till warm then it idles fine. Could be that im just not used to the bike so it seems as tho its not riding fine. Im just used to inline 4 cylinder bikes that perform very differently.

I figure ill pick up one size larger main and pilot jet and see how it does. Thought about getting the jetset but already have the washer mod done and wont be adding a pipe or filter so dont need the larger variety of jets. I got such a good deal on the bike that its going to be a quick flip hopefully and just want it running properly for the new owner. Or if it doesnt sell then ill ride it. Raptor petcock arrived today so ill install that soon. Otherwise the bike is great. Super clean aside from the dent in the tank but I probably wont even mess with it because its not that bad of an eye sore with the rest of the bike being clean.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by batman on 08/13/18 at 22:35:40

Generally speaking ,we've found the 150 main jet to be the best all around jet to use , I've road from sea level to about 3000ft without any seeming difference it the way my bike performed, and I fear that the147.5 may not cut it being your at sea level. I would try the 150 first . Larger jets tend to decrease fuel mileage, I doubt you need the 55 pilot jet, being you start the bike without using the choke there's not much sense in going to a larger pilot jet. You said you did the spacer mod using two brass washers ,I'm not sure that the brass washers aren't thicker than the number 4 steel washers we recommend using.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by zipidachimp on 08/13/18 at 22:56:43

At sea level on the other coast, 52.5/150 works a treat. Exhaust is a nice golden hue, plug a nice brown/grey. Response dead on! cheers! 8-)

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by eskimo619 on 08/14/18 at 03:38:34

So a 150 main seems like the way to go. Ill pick one up at my local shop the next day I can make it there after work hopefully before they close. As far as the washers go the package actually said everbilt #4s brass washers. They were a tad to larger outside diameter and I was able to file them down to fit. I originally ground down the white spacer to approx half size but didnt measure. At that half size 3 brass washers were about the same thickness. I ran the bike with the modified spacer, and then ran it with 2 washers and didnt notice much change. Bike ran much better overall both ways. Does anyone have a link for the steel washers? Wasnt able to find the steel ones at homedepot.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by Yoshi on 08/14/18 at 04:15:39

At home depot

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by eskimo619 on 08/14/18 at 04:43:24

Must have walked right by them lol. Ill pick some up today after work. Do these need any modifying to fit? Start with 3 and see how it goes?

Also anyone have a spare 150 main laying around? My work schedule usually doesnt allow me to get to any bike shop before they close but im hoping this week for a short day that may allow me to get there before they close.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by batman on 08/14/18 at 07:43:13

If you don't find the washers at home depot , try Lowes.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by eskimo619 on 08/14/18 at 14:20:43

I bought these at lowes as they dont carry the everbilt ones. Guy that helped me said these should be the same. Second pic compares brass washer I first bought and steel washer bought today. Brass is a tad thicker than the steel.

http://https://s15.postimg.cc/b0t0xi2if/1534281517491180644854091080505.jpg (https://postimg.cc/image/b0t0xi2if/)
http://https://s15.postimg.cc/aixvh5cs7/15342832449016635373066534195146.jpg (https://postimg.cc/image/aixvh5cs7/)

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by batman on 08/14/18 at 15:52:30

which means your running a bit leaner than if used steel.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by eskimo619 on 08/14/18 at 16:27:44

So I should be running 3 of the steels correct?

Edit: looks like 3 steel washers are the same height as 2 brass which is whats currently in the bike now.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by batman on 08/14/18 at 23:41:25

If you still don't feel that the bike is running it's best at mid range rpm(normal highway speeds) then I would change the two brass washers for two steel washers , that would raise the needle two "tads".( slightly )higher.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by eskimo619 on 08/15/18 at 03:15:22

I like what you did there haha. Ill try 2 steels as well as a larger main and see how it does.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by IslandRoad on 08/15/18 at 07:26:12

52445C5E5A5801060E370 wrote:

I like what you did there haha. Ill try 2 steels as well as a larger main and see how it does.

Do the washers first, and test ride, before doing the main. The jets are cumulative - they affect each other - pilot, needle, main. I found that adjustments to the needle made much more difference than changing the main jet.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by eskimo619 on 08/15/18 at 07:29:43

Alright, ill try 2 steel washers and see how it runs and will adjust air/fuel screw if needed. Its not that far off so hopefully this does it. If not ill grab a larger main and go from there. Havnt had much time to spend in the garage with work this week so far but might have some time to tinker with it this evening.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by LANCER on 08/15/18 at 09:57:19

392F373531336A6D655C0 wrote:

Keep in mind that the main jet primarily affects the 3/4-full throttle range.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by eskimo619 on 08/15/18 at 10:11:30

I was originally having issues in the 3/4-wot range as it was breaking up almost similar symptoms to a coil issue. After I did the initial grinding of the white space that issue was solved, for the most part anyway. Bike starts up fine no choke. I may also just need to let it warm up more before riding. It just has that little bit of hesitation through the lower throttle positions but its much better than when I first got it. Ill see how it responds to 2 steel washers. Hopefully thats all it needs to smooth out and I can stop messing with it. If I keep it long enough I may throw a pipe and filter on and rejet but for now just want it reliable.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/15/18 at 11:48:17

may also just need to let it warm up more before riding. It just has that little

I start up, drop in gear, go.
If you're not able to ride it on a nice day right after it's fired up, sumpin ain't right.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by madmikesmech on 08/15/18 at 14:51:51

Hello, great topic!
I ride from between 1822 - 2209 feet above sea level elevation most always on my rides. I have a Jardine turn out pipe, Raptor petcock.
I run a Lancer JetSet 155 main, 55 pilot, 2 steel washers instead of the white plastic spacer, and my pilot mixture screw out 2.75 turn. Float level to spec as per Clymer book. Runs like a RAPED APE, throughout the entire rpm range. I was in email communication with Lancer, and that is what he suggested to start with. Spot ON! OF COARSE the mixture screw adjustment will vary, but as far as the jet sizes to start with LANCER KNOWS HIS STUFF. Bite the bullet and purchase a jet kit from him!

Mike

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by eskimo619 on 08/15/18 at 15:50:21

Carb talk is always fun haha. Id buy the jetkit from Lancer but I dont have any plans to add a pipe or filter. Just want it to run better and not so lean like they come from the factory. Im swapping in 2 steel washers this evening and will see how it rides. I got such a good deal on it ill most likely sell it for a quick profit but if it doesnt sell then I may consider a pipe down the road lol. I have a 1992 Honda shadow 1100 I ride when I want a little more power and sound. But the s40 is so light and nimble its a completely different ride.

Edit: Installed 2 steel washers in place of the brass washers. Bike started fine no choke. Let it idle for about a minute. Initial take off had some hesitation in the lower throttle positions. Once fully warmed up it smoothed out and pulled hard all the way up to 80mph, as indicated on the speedometer. Think I can live with how it is. Definetly much better than it was when I bought it. Now to see if it sells or if Im keeping it.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by batman on 08/15/18 at 17:37:37

The difference between Islandroad and your jetting has to due with his more open muffler and the fact that at his elevation starts at sea level , both these require richer jetting. Lancer know carbs better than any of us ,but I think he would agree( I assume) that the suggested jetting put forth by all of us is "ballpark " and will allow your bike to run, but each bike is different and may require small changes to reach their best performance. Making one change at a time allows you to test and if there is a negative result ,you can reverse the procedure .

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by eskimo619 on 08/17/18 at 17:31:15

So I havnt really been able to ride the bike much due to it not being registered but I did ride it a few miles today in the backroads near where I live and the bike is running well. Pretty smooth through throughout the rev range and rides good at wot cruising 80mph as indicated by the speedometer. Dont think ill mess with it anymore. Now to see if it sells or if ill be keeping it for a while longer.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by eskimo619 on 09/03/18 at 18:37:41

So I the bike sold today. Didnt even have it a month. Bought it for $600, spent a little tuning it up and sold it for $1400. Im sure I could have waited and made a little more but the dent in the tank would have held me back a little. Still a quick almost $800 profit. Was fun for the few miles I had it. Will definetly have another sometime, maybe one ill keep and modify. I appreciate all the help and im sure ill pop in here every now and then.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by eskimo619 on 09/20/18 at 16:32:28

So I still own the bike. It was sold but heres the story. I tell the guy im still waiting for the title to arrive in the mail. He says thats fine and he agreed to pay $1100 up front and remaining $300 when title comes in. He pays me $1100, we fill out a bill of sale. He rides the bike home probably a 40 minute ride or so. Next morning he texts me saying bike has a bad valve. Im like no way and ask what happened. He says nothing happened and it rode to his house perfectly. Im like okay so no way it has a bad valve. He tells me his father who is a bike mechanic listened to it and heard a backfire and said it has a bad valve. I had already told him the quirks with these bikes and their lean condition and people that try to tune out the "sneezing" from the exhaust. I tell him again and he says okay. Few hours later asks to return it. Im like fine didnt even want to make it a big deal, he says he will give me $100 for my troubles and will return bike back that next evening, so basically 24 hours from when he bought it.

I ask if hes riding it or putting it in a truck and he says ride it. Im thinking well it apparantly has a bad valve so why would he ride it? I knew it was fine so let him do what he wanted. He makes it to my house and bike sounds as good as it did when it left. I ask how it rode he says great. I tell him bike has zero issues. He then tells me he still wants to buy it back when the title comes in. Makes no sense lol. He also proceeds to tell me he took his girlfriend for a ride on it for about 2 hours that day. Im thinking well thats messed up considering that morning it had a bad valve lol. All in all he rode the bike about 180 miles before returning it to me. He also used my helmet to be able to ride the bike home and still hasnt returned it. So yeah I still own the bike and its still for sale. I occassionally bomb down my backroads with it but it just sits in the garage on a trickle charger till someone buys it. Gotta love when this happens.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by norm92de on 09/20/18 at 17:27:16

There seems to be something missing from this discussion.

What is the exact thickness of any of the washers?, brass or steel?
Without that info what are we talking about? :'(

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by eskimo619 on 09/21/18 at 15:56:12

So I have a question now that the temp is cooling down. I never need to choke to start the bike however if i use it, it will actually make the bike stall out instead of idling high. I end up just turning the idle knob up a bit until the bike warms. Only thing I did to the carb was the washer mod and bike runs great. But with the cooler temps im noticing the difference in startups. I know its common for colder temps to affect bikes but want to make sure I have everything adjusted properly so cold starts arent an issue.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by batman on 09/21/18 at 22:59:30

Are you aware that the choke has two positions ,1/2 and full ? Mine usually only uses the 1/2 choke, and then only briefly .

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by eskimo619 on 09/22/18 at 03:32:30

77746178747B212D150 wrote:

Are you aware that the choke has two positions ,1/2 and full ? Mine usually only uses the 1/2 choke, and then only briefly .

I have tried both positions and both seem to just actually choke the motor out instead of bringing up the idle. Ive only owned the bike just less than 2 months and havnt really had a need for the choke but yesterday was a bit cooler than usual and I noticed the change. It fired right up no choke like always but idled really low. I could feather the throttle and it would rev up and down no problem. Im sure if i hopped on and went it would have warmed quickly and been fine.

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by Dave on 09/22/18 at 13:02:21

67647168646B313D050 wrote:

Be careful with brass washers. When I could not find any steel #4 washers at the local hardware store.......they had brass ones so I bought them. The OD of the brass washers I bought was just a tiny bit bigger than the steel ones - so the brass washers would not go into the hole in the slide.......that would have resulted in the needle being raised way too high.

If you are using brass washers....make sure they are not to big to fit into the recessed hole in the slide (where the spring and needle go before you screw the plate on...the inside bottom of the slide).

Title: Re: Another carb/washer mod thread. 2011 Suzuki s
Post by eskimo619 on 09/22/18 at 14:43:32

I did away with the brass for steel washers that fit very well. Bike rides well throughout the rev range. Just had me baffled that when the choke is applied it stalls out the engine. But I started it up today and backed the mixture screw out a bit and the bike idled good. I dont know whats up with the choke but it still rides well.