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Message started by HAPPYDAN on 11/25/17 at 15:37:47

Title: What were they thinking?
Post by HAPPYDAN on 11/25/17 at 15:37:47

Had a chance to look through the used M/C tent in Gorst on Friday. Dozens of late model Harley Davidsons. A few "others", nothing remarkable, except - a 1979 Honda CM185T, aka Twinstar. Never seen one or heard of one. The bike is in excellent condition, has a full fairing, hiway bars, saddlebags, 6000 miles, asking $999. But what were the Honda engineers thinking? 302 pounds, 185cc twin, single carb, 10 hp, estimated top speed 57mph :-?. Compare that to my S40, only a little heavier and 30 hp. And what does it say about he who had it? Set up for hiway cruising at...45mph? If I thought there was any hope for the slug, I would have made a ridiculous offer just to give them a chance to get rid of it!

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by piedmontbuckeye on 11/26/17 at 07:22:21

Sorry to shake up your world, but the Savage is not set up good for much of anything except looking at it or bragging. Highway travel?? ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by badwolf on 11/26/17 at 08:27:29

"set-up" Is the key!
You can use the s-40 as raw material and set it up for your tastes.
The looks can be changed to suit your likes, the ride can be changed, range and speed range can be changed with a bigger tank and gearing.(within reason) A wide range of windshields and bags, boxes, can be fit on our bikes.
If you are looking to replace the performance of a sport bike, and the ride of a Gold Wing, with a s-40 you WILL be disappointed! But if you are looking to have a old style Thumper and are willing to invest some time, effort, and cash, to make it the way YOU want it is the place to start.
This site has a bounty of info to help you and like minded people to give advice.

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by jcstokes on 11/26/17 at 09:41:48

I guess it depends on the highway.

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by HAPPYDAN on 11/26/17 at 10:28:11

I guess you missed my point. Why would anyone (Honda?) design a mid-sized motorcycle with the performance of a moped? Personally, I like the stock performance of the S40 - not too fast, not too slow. At my age I've burned off enough testosterone and adrenaline to appreciate it's modest capabilities.

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by IslandRoad on 11/26/17 at 10:56:00

Personally, I love the way my S40 rides on the Highway (the highest legal speed here in Australia is 110kmh). I love how the engine runs up around the 4500 rpm range - it pumps along beautifully, and still had plenty of torque to overtake. As someone here said "fun at legal speeds!"

However, I have modified the riding position so that I don't need to hang on quite so tight to stop the wind blowing me back off the bike.. I experimented alot to find a middle-ground position for highways, and running around town. I sacrificed the handling on the twisties to achieve that but that was a matter of choice :)

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by SALB on 11/26/17 at 17:22:21

Reminds me of Kawasaki's old Eliminator 125. ;D I don't think the fairing or highway bars were factory. It was more of a commuter bike.

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by MMRanch on 11/26/17 at 21:56:28

Dan

I had a twinstar 185 back .... long time ago ...

It was a neat little bike , top speed was about 75 mph and it was Fun !

My ex kept it when I got a 250 Rebel and we rode a lot of local rides. It kept up with the Rebel just fine.

Then I sold it to my little brother and him and his best buddy wore it out to the tune of close to 30,000 miles . One time they even rode it to Florida from middle Tn. It would cruse at 60+ just fine ridding double (two 125# boys) .

If there is a young or small NEW rider in your future you would do very well to set them up with it for under $1000.oo ;)

----------------------------------------------------

piedmontbuckeye

I'll have to differ with ya about the Savage not being good on a trip . Sure ya need to put the larger front pulley on it if ya want to run 70-75 ish for tank after tank full .
I did a 600+ mile day last summer going to Lancer's in Ok from middle Tn.
and the year before did an 800+ mile day coming back from Texas after ridding it all over South Texas Hill Country for a week . 1300+ miles from home (did take two days to do the 1300 miles) . ;)

Don't sell the little Savage short ... put proper gearing on it and just go !

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by Dave on 11/27/17 at 03:39:12

It could be the Twinstar wasn't really made for the US market - it is possible it was a huge seller in an Asian country where smaller bikes are more common.....and for some reason they brought it to the US.

There are a lot of other models that are never sold in the US....that I sure wish they had. There is a style of motorcycle they call "underbone" as the frame goes low like a girls bicycle.....and I would think these would sell well for folks who want scooter lightness - but the better handling that comes from having larger diameter wheels.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underbone

And when you race them.....the young fellows crash a lot!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRWK5JojHAg
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRWK5JojHAg[/media]

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by IslandRoad on 11/27/17 at 10:41:03

Wow! The only thing more impressive than how easily they seem to crash, is how well they seem to handle evasive maneuvering!! 8-)

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 11/28/17 at 09:48:31

Didn't know Honda SuperCub was the most produced vehicle.
Didn't know there was a race class.
Didn't know about the UnderBone design .
Good stuff. Crazy race action.

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by HAPPYDAN on 11/30/17 at 14:55:58

From the scant information I can find for the 1979 Honda CM185, it was an early attempt to make an entry level full sized cruiser, mild mannered for the first time adult rider, or the mileage conscious city commuter (remember the Energy Crisis?). It was soon upgraded to 200cc, and then 250cc. It was later replaced by the 250cc Rebel. I can see some collectors value here, but I don't think it would be a serious ride. The performance specs are quite close to the current Honda Grom.

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by oldNslow on 11/30/17 at 17:14:42

underbone in plus size:

https://rideapart.com/articles/honda-x-adv-scooter-crossover-adventure-beast

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by engineer on 11/30/17 at 17:50:04

Over the last few years I have seen many Twinstars listed on Craig's List for this area. I talked to a guy who owned one and he said he bought it for his wife but he sometimes rode it around on summer evenings just to get a breeze and cool down a little after a hot day. Most of the ones I've seen are in good condition and have low mileage for their age. Some people are not as serious about bikes as many of us and just like to ride around a bit and don't need or want much performance.

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by MMRanch on 11/30/17 at 18:48:52

Hay ! ... Look what I found !!

https://www.cmsnl.com/honda-cm185t-twinstar-1979-z-usa_model7279/info/
0 to 60 mph in only 12 seconds .... I think the old Honda CL175 was a little quicker ?

It was a Fun machine

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by Dave on 12/01/17 at 05:00:18

7B4544485A4647290 wrote:

underbone in plus size:

https://rideapart.com/articles/honda-x-adv-scooter-crossover-adventure-beast

The awful soundtrack in that Honda video is bad enough to keep me from buying one! >:(

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by HAPPYDAN on 12/03/17 at 09:15:01

0A180A18150609040F470 wrote:

And you're dead on. The CL175 was a poor "dirt bike", but a real hellion for mixed riding conditions, from freeways to logging roads. Oh, BTW, the spec sheet I found for the CM185 said top speed was 57.5mph. It's the ".5" that sells it.

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by batman on 12/07/17 at 12:05:03

The specs I read said top speed 75, and hp not 10 but 17. single carb aside( it made the bike easier to tune and cut cost) ,it's a twin with 185cc ,I'm thinking that 17 hp is more likely than 10. With a shorter stroke ,and higher red line,I think 75 mph might be true.(even the cb 200 made 20 hp)

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by MMRanch on 12/07/17 at 14:36:17

Sometimes I think I'd like to have something like a old 250 street legal dirt bike , but then I don't need the up-keep hassle. I've had the idea of finding a DR200 for some time now but ain't done it yet ... it might be about 17HP ?
Kind of think , instead of getting a Coleman 200 scooter I should have just got the DR then ... might just get one anyway when the January credit card bills come due and all those used bikes get posted on Ebay ! ;D

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by IslandRoad on 12/09/17 at 20:29:35

617361737E6D626F642C0 wrote:

... might just get one anyway when the January credit card bills come due and all those used bikes get posted on Ebay ! ;D

Now here's a bloke with his finger on the pulse! ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by MMRanch on 12/09/17 at 23:15:18

Well , Thank You Very Much IslandRoad , I do try to think ahead as far as possible ! 8-) I suspect you must do the same . ;)

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by IslandRoad on 12/13/17 at 00:12:33

6A786A78756669646F270 wrote:

Well , Thank You Very Much IslandRoad , I do try to think ahead as far as possible ! 8-) I suspect you must do the same . ;)

Sometimes to a fault! 8-)

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by MMRanch on 12/13/17 at 09:10:25

IslandRoad

Did ya put a dual purpose tire on the Savage or do ya got a second bike ?

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by HAPPYDAN on 12/15/17 at 16:33:15

5053465F535C060A320 wrote:

Here's the reference:
https://www.bikez.com/motorcycles/honda_cm_185_t_1979.php
The 250cc Rebel is closer to what you quote.

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by batman on 12/15/17 at 18:25:41

Happydan , You may be correct ,but you can look at the same place (bikez) and find that the1981CM-200T is rated at 17 hp only 19 cc's larger (buy making the stroke longer-.10 inches) they made a 7 hp increase, and these are the kind of numbers that I had expected to find in the 185T ,guess it took Honda a while to wake up. the 185 is rated @7500 ,the 200 @ 9000rpm ,so I think the 185 may have had a bit more hp than what it was rated for.

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by IslandRoad on 12/17/17 at 22:59:08

56445644495A5558531B0 wrote:

IslandRoad

Did ya put a dual purpose tire on the Savage or do ya got a second bike ?

I wonder if that question was meant for someone else?

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 12/18/17 at 13:14:43

So that's a no?

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by MMRanch on 12/18/17 at 21:11:17

There are so many bike of so many kind , I've had dirt bikes and I think the most favorite was a Honda XL 200 - but it wasn't street legal so I got rid of it. Those semi knobby tires drift sideways on pavement so easy its fun and predictable .
IslandRoad , I thought you might be a man of two or more bikes . So , I was kinda asking about your other bikes.

Sorry for any confusion ...

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by IslandRoad on 12/18/17 at 23:05:05

584A584A47545B565D150 wrote:

Ah! Now, I see ;D

I would love to be a "man of two or more bikes" ... alas, starting late, and the restriction of circumstances, dictate that my journey is going deeper rather than wider, at the the moment.

In the last year I have really developed a love of riding, and also a deep appreciation for the heritage of all the classic styles that people on here emulate in their builds (cafe racers, bobbers, trackers, choppers etc).

For now I'm making the most of my one little bike, and it's own special character.

Title: Re: What were they thinking?
Post by MMRanch on 12/20/17 at 11:23:34

For now I'm making the most of my one little bike, and it's own special character.

IslandRoad , you hit the nail on the head with that one , These LS-650's got as much or more Character than any other bike I've ever had ! I've got three bikes and the LS is still the first choice for 90% of my ridding. ;)