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General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> I see the light!!! (carb problem)
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Message started by youzguyz on 07/24/16 at 14:02:38

Title: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by youzguyz on 07/24/16 at 14:02:38

And, in the pictures, you can see the light too!
The problem is.. you shouldn't.
This is the 2nd time Thumper has developed cracks in the slider diaphragm. I can't remember the miles when it first happened. Maybe Lancer has a date of when he sold me one I replaced it with, then I can cross it back to my oil change log.

Versy.. I see from way back when that you fixed yours with some kind of goop: http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1438491696

How did that work out for you?

http://i.imgur.com/058DQ48.jpg?2

http://i.imgur.com/NwavQQw.jpg?3

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by verslagen1 on 07/24/16 at 14:11:44

you got some odd looking puckering going on.
which is the reason for your holes
and those are a lot larger then what I had.

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by youzguyz on 07/24/16 at 14:21:06

The puckering isn't as bad as the pictures show. I just think it is old age. I'm guessing 75k miles since I changed it last time.
I will just bit the bullet and order new OEM .. appx $128

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by batman on 07/24/16 at 15:30:05

Youzguyz, With the kind of miles you roll,and the heat in texas,I think you should go for the new one.If you repair,and it fails on the road......? I don't know if you use Ron Ayers but the number is 13500-24BO and you were right on with price $128.37

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by KennyG on 07/24/16 at 17:48:21

Food For Thought

Guyz, When it starts to get that expensive to repair, would it pay to purchase a different kind of carburetor?

I know in years past I had Mikuni carbs that didn't have rubber diaphragms. I have recently spoken to Lancer about the possibility of putting a Lectron Carburetor on my S40

I am not sure that spending $500.00 to save $128.00 is a wise investment.

Kenny

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/24/16 at 18:06:05

75000 miles/$128.00= lotsa. miles per dollar
I'd be happy with it..
And how many more hunnert thousand miles is it gonna run before the chass, seat, everything is just tired?
One day you Might just wanna hang it from the rafters and call it a trophy.
Maybe Suzuki will give you a new one.

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by batman on 07/24/16 at 20:19:20

If they used his bikes in an ad they should give him one with a gold plated frame!

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by youzguyz on 07/25/16 at 04:30:23

batman. Ordered it yesterday.

Kenny. I've considered going with a different carb, but I am trying to keep Thumper as stock as possible (and using minimum parts) to see what long term problems can occur.

JOG. Someday, it will totally grenade. But, not today!! I am seriousely considering sending the head off to Lancer to get the valves done. The oil useage is getting to be a bit much. Ain't had it open that far yet.

For the moment.. Thumper has the carb from Hamish as Hamish is on the stand for an oil leak.. and I fear it is the head gasket. I'm going to put some pressure in the crank case today to see if I can find out exactly where it is leaking. Guess I should have torqued those head bolts when I had the head cover off. Oh well.. Do what I can before it gets too HOT!

Thumper will get his carb back when I get the new slider in.. but, I have to able to RIDE!!

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/25/16 at 08:16:19

am seriousely considering sending the head off to Lancer to get the valves done.

People I've talked to have said that if you do that then the compression will be better than your rings and they will crap out.

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by LANCER on 07/25/16 at 08:19:31

5E707B566774667D150 wrote:

Did we talk about the Lectron carb ?
My memory can be a bit sketchy at times.

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by KennyG on 07/25/16 at 09:06:38

Lancer,

We talked about the Lectron and you said it is really good even though you don't sell them.

My bike is running so good right now I am reluctant to make any changes, but I probably will when the weather has cooled off enough to work in my garage.

I have thought also about the Mikuni that you sell.

Kenny G

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by youzguyz on 07/25/16 at 11:13:32

2D3234332E2918281820323E75470 wrote:

JOG. The issue with the valves is I am burning oil. Just reseating (cleaning, lapping, whatever) the valves and changing the seals shouldn't cause the compression to sky rocket to the point of blowing out the rings.
IF I do replace the piston with a high compression 94mm (not sure yet).. well, new rings will be put in place as well.

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/25/16 at 13:11:30

Mmmkay, I'm not the pro,, it's just stuff people told me, sounded reasonable to me, but, hey,,might be a load..

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by Kris01 on 07/25/16 at 13:46:26

You can buy lapping compound at AutoZone. It's a simple job (other than getting to the valves) that shouldn't take you more than an afternoon.

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by youzguyz on 07/25/16 at 14:00:20

665F445E1D1C2D0 wrote:

You can buy lapping compound at AutoZone. It's a simple job (other than getting to the valves) that shouldn't take you more than an afternoon.

I looked into doing it myself. Read all the different methods tips and tricks. Yes, I could do it, but I'll be content to have Lancer do it, as he will do it all including porting and such.
"Reworked Cylinder Head:... Hand lapping of valves (includes new valve stem seals) & intake/exhaust porting to maximize air flow to increase power and efficiency. The head is blasted on the outside and inside the ports as well. $250"
One of the big problems with ME doing it.. is it is HOT here, and I don't have suitable work space.. that I am allowed to do suitable work in.

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/25/16 at 14:43:02

I'm cheap. I have a place. Fans, water, beer. $250.00 and freight? Heading off to ship. Valves,porting, all done by someone who Has experience? Heck,, it's a neaux brainer..

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by verslagen1 on 07/25/16 at 14:53:20

67716B64796B67641E0 wrote:

The issue with the valves is I am burning oil. Just reseating (cleaning, lapping, whatever) the valves and changing the seals shouldn't cause the compression to sky rocket to the point of blowing out the rings.
IF I do replace the piston with a high compression 94mm (not sure yet).. well, new rings will be put in place as well.

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by Kris01 on 07/25/16 at 17:18:33

657369667B6965661C0 wrote:

[quote author=665F445E1D1C2D0 link=1469394158/0#13 date=1469479586]One of the big problems with ME doing it.. is it is HOT here, and I don't have suitable work space.. that I am allowed to do suitable work in.

Same here. $250 is not a bad price. You pay for the quality, not the labor.

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by youzguyz on 07/26/16 at 01:35:02

32213637282523212A75440 wrote:

[quote author=67716B64796B67641E0 link=1469394158/0#11 date=1469470412]The issue with the valves is I am burning oil. Just reseating (cleaning, lapping, whatever) the valves and changing the seals shouldn't cause the compression to sky rocket to the point of blowing out the rings.
IF I do replace the piston with a high compression 94mm (not sure yet).. well, new rings will be put in place as well.

For the most part, burning oil comes from the rings. The result of that is heavy carbon deposit on top of the piston.
You can remove the header and confirm that the valves aren't coated. Lapping the valves just improves compression and improve heat transfer.
And with your high mileage, I'd want to go to the next size piston as the bore is most likely tapered due to wear.[/quote]

Maybe.. I won't know for sure until I open it up. Compression tests and other symptoms "imply" that it is not the rings.. or at least not significant.
Compressions is 145 dry and 150 wet. 5 lb difference "indicates" that the rings are doing OK. Also, I don't get smoke on RPM increase. When I chop it off, it smokes a bit sometimes. Another "indication" of valves seals instead of rings.
I will take a close look at the cylinder and mic it out to see if something needs done. I can probably rent or borrow a bore gauge.

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by LANCER on 07/26/16 at 04:19:42

Most auto parts stores have tools to check out.

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by Dave on 07/26/16 at 04:50:48

How long do the valves and valve guides last on these bikes? Those might be worn enough that new seals will be short lived - as the valves might be too loose in the guides.

Title: Re: I see the light!!! (carb problem)
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/26/16 at 05:38:17

IF all 135,000 miles were at60 MPH and 5,000 RPM , then the motor has 135,000 Minutes of 5,000 RPM ,,
675, 000,000 revolutions on it. I would not expect to see much wear.

I'm sure 60mph and 5,000 rpm aren't even gonna line up, it's just a general idea of what the engine has been through.
Factor in idling at stops, running through the gears, the Revolutions per Mile goes up...
The engine probably has spun over well north of a billion times.

I would not be surprised if Suzuki would want to autopsy that motor.
Wouldn't it be good to get a new one for next to nothing?