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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> The Cafe >> Bang For The Buck /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1455307251 Message started by old.indian on 02/12/16 at 12:00:51 |
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Title: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 02/12/16 at 12:00:51 Quite a few riders are always looking to "up grade" their rides and that seems to always equate to quite a bit of $$$ and a new/bigger motorcycle. I'm being different and saving $$ by tweaking the S40. Given that I bought "The Thumper" in 12/15 with 3,984 miles on the clock for $1,800 complete with OEM windshield, luggage rack and set of soft saddlebags. Since then I've re-jeted, installed a K&N, EMCO (Dunstal style) muffler and Michelin Commander ll s (140/90-15 rear) as well as a raptor petcock . To date I've turned another 3,500+ miles on the clock, including the 900 mile round trip to Jerome, AZ . This year I've added a Corbin (Thanks Dave) and a set of 4"FCs (thanks Marketplace). A couple hundred miles shake down run this past Tuesday and I feel that I can run 500+/- miles of back roads a day in comfort. I've already pulled the trigger for a stage 3 cam from Lancer (to be matched with some ports work by a local machinist). As well as a cam chain adjuster and head plugs from Verslagen (Preventive maintaince while I have it on the bench.) 8-) Given that I am comfortable at 60 MPH on backroads (and avoid Interstates if at all possible). When everything is said and done, I'll have invested a total of (roughly) $4,000, and have a motorcycle that is as good, if not better, as any costing three to five times as much. 8-) 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Kris01 on 02/12/16 at 18:11:28 Haha! A true fan! :) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 02/13/16 at 02:49:06 Yep, the Savage can be a good bargain in motorcycles if you buy one used and spend money on upgrades wisely. Glad you found a good one and are racking up the miles. :) Buying a worn out one really cheaply might not be the best bargain if it needs major engine work.....so be careful to find one that needs little or no engine work. My recent Rescue Bike project only had 3,800 miles on it and it needed a cam and rockers, and a Versy head plug to fix the oil leak.....luckily I had some good used ones. If the engine has damage to the cylinder head- it can be very expensive to get a replacement head/cam/rockers. And getting used saddlebags, windshields, seats, etc. from the Marketplace on this forum can help. When folks buy bikes to make Bobbers or Cafe's bikes they sell the stuff they don't need at really good prices.....sometimes just enough to cover shipping, |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Art Webb on 02/13/16 at 07:49:57 true, the real reason I swapped mine for the Swing was as a credit building move, I could have easily and much more cheaply upgraded the S40, and probably have been happier maybe I should swapped it for a newer one, and financed that oh well, S wing is a better highway machine, and I ride highway a lot now, six years (or less) and it's paid for and I have a shiny new credit history |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by KennyG on 02/13/16 at 07:59:38 Old Indian, It would be nice to see pics of the Dunstall muffler and maybe you could share some installation tips. Kenny G |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 02/14/16 at 07:48:22 No pictures yet. :-[ Note: While it is on the bench for the stage 3, head work, cam chain adjuster, and head plugs. I decided to hone the jug and sneak in a 94mm Wiseco piston. At this rate I should probably install a sound system and announce my pending arrival by blasting Wagner's "Ride of The Valkyries" 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Art Webb on 02/14/16 at 08:23:11 DOOO EEEET! |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by badwolf on 02/14/16 at 10:40:19 Da dat da da, Da dat da da! FINE! |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by raydawg on 02/14/16 at 13:30:19 You find some peyote on those back roads chief ? :-* |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 02/17/16 at 18:51:12 After some squinting and head scratching, I'll be looking at the near vicinity of 40 HP at the rear wheel on a bike, rider, and kit of 575 pounds after I'm done. 8-) Now if I can sneak out of the house and putt the backroads to Pennsylvania this summer with out the wife putting out a contract on me. :-/ |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by MMRanch on 02/17/16 at 20:25:17 putt the backroads to Pennsylvania this summer Whats in Pennsylvania ? |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by badwolf on 02/17/16 at 20:31:55 This summer I plan on getting to Steamtown in Scranton. Large Steam RR museum. You might not like riding across Pa thou, NO straight roads! He, he. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by KennyG on 02/17/16 at 21:01:09 If you like railroads visit the Strasburg Train Museum in Strasburg, PA. http://www.strasburgrailroad.com/ Take the ride on a steam train from Strasburg to Paradise, and visit Intercourse, PA while you are there. Kenny G |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 02/17/16 at 21:35:33 485A485A57444B464D050 wrote:
My daughter's family moved to rural Pennsylvania last year and the Four Stroke Single Cylinder Club (FSSNOC) is holding a meet near by in June. A side trip to #1 stepson near Ashville would include a ride on the Blue Ridge etc. 8-) Great senic riding, a chance to visit my granddaughter and annoy my son-in-law, good company with other old riders, great food (at #1 stepson's)...... How many more reasons do I need ? 8-) 8-) 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by badwolf on 02/17/16 at 21:45:50 Kenny, I heard about Paradise watching ''Amish Mafia''. I'll keep my eyes open. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Art Webb on 02/18/16 at 07:08:30 Sounds like a great ride, and it involves Pennsylvania, who knew? (I am negatively biased due to incredibly moronic and asinine family in Pottstown, I avoid the whole state ;D ) and steam train museums and rides, sweet! I'm a sucker for old tech |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 02/18/16 at 07:22:32 I want to go to the Coolspring Museum in PA some day......lots of really cool and really big Thumpers! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8vAJy8f31Rs [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8vAJy8f31Rs[/media] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pXiNo3zxnw [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pXiNo3zxnw[/media] |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Art Webb on 02/18/16 at 07:59:57 I didn't run the vids to preserve my Data, but man is that tempting me I wonder if any of the cool old 'machine museums' are around in Texas anymore there were a few in my school daze I had to be almost literally dragged out of |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 02/22/16 at 12:01:51 :-?Ever notice that once you get started in to a project the "change orders" start coming in ???? :-/ I started this a couple weeks ago with a "new to me" Corbin seat. Then for added comfort came 4" FCs .. Hum. I'd like a smidgen more mid range, so a stage 3 cam. Well while I've got it apart a cam chain adjuster and head plug. OH YEAH . To take advantage of the new cam I should get the ports cleaned up... OH look, a Wiseco 10.5 CR 94mm piston.... Well while I have it on the bench I may as well see about an improved cam chain......Then, last night I decided that I really, really miss having a tachometer on the Thumper. SO..... :) BUT... I'm STILL well under $4K. 8-) 8-)NO 'bot ! I ain't going to add no blue lights to the under carriage like your "home boys"... 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by LANCER on 02/22/16 at 16:45:16 "NO 'bot ! I ain't going to add no blue lights to the under carriage like your "home boys"..." Yea, there's no need for that stuff. After all, you are just being practical, and doing practical stuff. ;) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by pg on 02/22/16 at 16:50:31 23202862252228252D224C0 wrote:
Okay OI, how about a couple pictures? Everyone likes pictures! "home boys" from Tucson....... :-? Best regards, |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Gus on 02/23/16 at 08:03:46 162D2037262A31372C242936450 wrote:
I don't mean to hi jack this thread but I can't help myself. Dave, what in the dickens did someone do to a bike with under 4000 miles on or to ruin rhe head? Let it set and idle for a week????? |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Art Webb on 02/23/16 at 08:05:53 Did it also have the plug wires that light up with each spark? |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 03/02/16 at 08:21:41 ::) Like all projects, this one keeps growing... ::) The list now includes (besides the Corbin seat, 4"FCs, K&N filter, tires and Carb work already done), Stage 3 cam, Head machining (ports etc.), 10.5 CR piston, cam chain adjuster, tach, 1.75" exuast header and Harley muffler. All I can say is "Beware the Indian Thumper..." 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by LANCER on 03/02/16 at 08:31:21 Yea, stuff just keeps on happening. 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by verslagen1 on 03/02/16 at 08:50:20 494A42084F48424F4748260 wrote:
Tell me about this one 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 03/02/16 at 11:06:40 352631302F2224262D72430 wrote:
Tell me about this one 8-)[/quote] I'll refer this to "Super Thumper"... 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by pg on 03/02/16 at 15:57:13 56555D1750575D505857390 wrote:
OI, this question isn't directed at your work. But why would someone change the cam? It coordinates and times the valves, how much better can it get? Best regards, |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 03/02/16 at 16:08:20 3225232F2030420 wrote:
OI, this question isn't directed at your work. But why would someone change the cam? It coordinates and times the valves, how much better can it get? Best regards,[/quote] It can get a lot better....the stock cam is really mild. The cams that Lancer sells can get you some extra duration and lift.....and extra torque and HP! I have been running a Stage 1 for a couple years, as soon as the Nitrided cam chains are available.....I am going to try the Stage 3. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 03/02/16 at 17:18:26 786F69656A7A080 wrote:
OI, this question isn't directed at your work. But why would someone change the cam? It coordinates and times the valves, how much better can it get? Best regards,[/quote] pg: The cam will allow the valves to open further and longer allowing more air/fuel mixture into the combustion chamber and the spent/ exuast gases out. The machining of the head ports as well as the larger inner diameter of the new exuast header and muffler allows for a less restrictive air flow into and out of the combustion chamber. The new piston (10.5 compression ratio vs. 8.5 CR stock), makes the combustion chamber more efficient and the power stroke more effective. The end result is a more efficient and effective motor (greater horse power and torque). The cam chain adjuster and nitrated cam chain are "preventive maintenance" that I might as well do while I have it apart. Cam terms/ definitions: Lift= Amount (how far) a valve opens from completely closed to completely open. (Rocker arms also pay a part in this function) Duration = Time (in degrees of rotation) that a valve remains open. The combination of "Lift" and "Duration" directly affects the amount of fuel/ air mixture drawn into the cylinder on "Intake" and conversely, how efficiently the burnt gasses can be purged from the cylinder by the exuast stroke. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 03/06/16 at 08:13:58 Without the head machining (?$?) I'm at $3,300.00... Bike, tires, seat, FCs and engine upgrade parts, gaskets etc...... :-? (AND BEST OF ALL.!!!! The wife is starting to look favorably on my ridding to Penn. in June. :) :)) Beware the Indian Thumper !! :o :o |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Ed L. on 03/07/16 at 15:52:20 You need to hit the Delaware Water Gap if near Scranton Pa. Nice twisties and a lot of fun. Check the Freemansburg Hill Climb, don't know when it happens but if you are in the area during the event it's a must see!! Used to ride that area before moving to Florida which is the land of flat straight roads. >:( |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 03/13/16 at 09:59:58 465542435C5157555E01300 wrote:
Tell me about this one 8-)[/quote] 8-)I managed to get Super Thumper to sell me one of his early production / prototypes. 8-) He was talking about possibly listing them on "The Marketplace" at some point. I look upon it as a win/ win modification. Gain in performance by reducing exuast flow restriction (stock header = 1.3" I.D vs 1.7"+/- I.D ). And an improvement in the reliability of my air cooled motor by getting rid of the hot stuff (exuast gas) faster...... 8-) 8-) :) Yep !!!! I'm definitely going to hook up a sound system and announce my pending arrival by blasting "Ride of the Valkyries "..... :) :) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Gus on 03/13/16 at 17:34:12 Has anyone experienced any adverse effects to the starting system by puttin a 10.5/1 piston in one of these Savages or does the compression release seem to take care of the increase in compression OK? |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 03/13/16 at 18:06:29 36392E33383065383B3365570 wrote:
The compression release and starter work fine with the Wiseco...at least for my riding conditions. My bike is stored in a heated garage, and I never ride the Cafe' bike when it is below 60 degrees. I have the 95mm and it starts instantly.....I am not sure what would happen at 30 degrees when the oil is thick and the battery performance is lower. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 03/15/16 at 09:35:56 My Honda ST1100 is a great bike and most likely has a couple hundred thousand miles left in it - but it is a bit tall and heavy for my 30" inseam. I might have to go look at (and ride) this - it is local, and has always been stored indoors: 2000 BMW K1200 RS, with only 23,000 miles for $ 4,000. It has removable saddlebags that are not shown in the photo. (Of course.....I would have to get matching clothes and helmets, and a few turtle neck shirts with the BMW logo). |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Gus on 03/15/16 at 10:58:06 That is an extremely nice sled and a good buy. It's hard to find one with less than 50000 miles on it. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by MMRanch on 03/15/16 at 22:30:10 Dave ??? ::) ??? Can we still ride with ya , if you buy that THING ??? :o :o |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/16/16 at 04:07:18 Thats a slick ride. Do the due dilligence. Check for a forum. Maintenance issues, and how hard is it just to get past the Tupperware,, |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 03/16/16 at 04:37:40 Yep.....the BMW is most likely a bit more complex than the Honda. I have a friend that is very knowledgeable about these bikes, and will get him involved if the bike fits me physically. I am certain that maintenance on the BMW will be more complex and more expensive than it is on the Honda. It is a bit intimidating to have to learn the care and feeding of a whole new bike breed. What the world really needs is a good 3/4 size touring bike for those of us that are just too small for the Goldwing or ST1100. The ST1300 has a better seat height - but it still is a big and heavy motorcycle. The Honda CTX700 would be a better fit for me - but I can't spend $ 7,500 for a new motorcycle. Maybe I should ride the ST1100 for a few more years....then look for a used CTX700 as I get a bit older. And yes MM....I will still ride you you guys. And next years project will be a Savage made for touring - but it will be a single seater and may become my bike of choice when I go on these SavageForum trips. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by MMRanch on 03/16/16 at 08:33:06 Dave Can't ya lower the height of the ST1100 ?? Well I like the wide seat, floor boards , taller gear , and wind shield on my S-40 ! ;) This year the handle bars that came on my Sportster are now on my S-40 in place of the Drag bar. They are wider, taller and set back a little . The S-40 rides like a bigger bike now but it lost a pound. the original drag bars was leaded on the ends. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 03/16/16 at 08:47:19 The forks could be dropped easily on the ST1100 - the back is not so easy as it is a single shock bolted to the frame and swingarm, without any links. There was a company that made a shorter shock - but it is not longer available. I am thinking maybe a used Honda NT700 might be a good bike for downsizing to. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by MMRanch on 03/16/16 at 12:34:46 JOG yea! ;) I'm sure that 700cc Honda has all the power needed to cruse above the Speed-Limit anywhere , Up or Down , in the US. Some of the fellers in my CMA group ride monster bikes and I have to wait for them to catch-up a lot ! So : Bigger is NOT Better , but we all have know that for a long time now . ;) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 03/16/16 at 13:00:02 041604161B08070A01490 wrote:
:) Which is exactly what I've been saying on this tread all along. :) There is no reason why an S40 cannot be set up for solo touring with out requiring a second mortgage. Travel light and ENJOY the ride.... |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 03/16/16 at 13:27:26 For one person I agree, the Savage can be made into a bike that will do the touring job just fine. I am looking for an affordable way my wife and I can ride around together. She will never go on any overnight trips with me, and we just need enough room for the two of us to ride comfortable, and have enough space for rain gear and an extra coat for the chilly ride when the sun goes down. (Friday nights are "date night" for us, and we ride the motorcycle when we can). |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Gus on 03/16/16 at 13:35:44 Right now I'm in the process of figuring out a set of bags for the Savage. I'm looking at military artillery shell cans. My Savage is silver so I thought Id paint them with that silver toolbox paint. Still thinking it through. I could just use this but id rather ride the Savage. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/16/16 at 19:35:29 44474F0542454F424A452B0 wrote:
:) Which is exactly what I've been saying on this tread all along. :) There is no reason why an S40 cannot be set up for solo touring with out requiring a second mortgage. Travel light and ENJOY the ride.... [/quote] Tis true,,, and I think Paladin may have had The most comfy seat. A windscreen, some power, maybe some gearing.. Some suspension stuff,, go all day, I got over 12,000 miles on it in a year, running around town and over about forty miles once or twice a week, to see a doctor. No windscreen, and that got old. How much energy is spent just Not getting blown Off at seventy? How much of the fatigue could be changed by having a comfortable seat? Is there any gain from swapping shocks? I think it's been Proven that taller shocks make it handle quicker, but is there a Fatigue factor? |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by MMRanch on 03/16/16 at 20:21:04 I have taller shocks , just cause I have 32" inseams . also I now have more ground clearance for my Floor Boards . I put 12 inch shocks off Ebay, think they came off a pre 04 Sportster ? |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Gus on 03/16/16 at 20:28:48 405240525F4C434E450D0 wrote:
So hey fit OK huh? I've been wondering about that. Also did it give you any more clearance between the inner fender and the tire? I'd like to put a taller wheel on the back. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by badwolf on 03/16/16 at 20:35:24 Do you think a taller wheel will clear the swingarm? |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 03/17/16 at 04:00:59 A taller tire will clear the swing arm - you can't go much bigger than the 140/90-15 without having to work on the fender or swing arm for clearance. I have 18" diameter wheels on my Cafe' conversion - but then you slim the tire width down to a 120/80 or 130/70 and it can still clear the swing arm. As the rim diameter gets bigger - the available tires get narrower - unless you to to vintage sizes like 4.00-18 - but then the vintage tires are not very up to date on rubber compounds or tread design. If you ever decide to use a Kawasaki front pulley which has 2 more teeth and provide better gearing for touring - then the wheel gets moved all the way forward so the belt has proper tension.....and a 140/90 just barely clears the swing arm. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by MMRanch on 03/17/16 at 06:42:18 The thing about taller shocks is the "Swing arm angle" changes. Turns out the drive belt is tightest when the swing arm is level. So , when the swing arm falls below "level position" the belt gets looser. Then when you sit on the saddle the swing arm get level again - drawing the belt tight. Then ya hit a bump and the swing arm get above level and the belt goes loose again. This happens all the time anyway , but longer shocks gives ya a different starting point in the cycle. I weigh 190# , so 12" shocks work good for me. ;) I believe 12.5" is about as tall as you can get on the "Swing arm / Frame Combo." :) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Gus on 03/17/16 at 06:49:21 MMRanch, I think we got it now LOL!! Lotsa good info here thanks for weighing in guys. Do you accommodate, at all, for the difference in angle with the tension of the belt, MM? |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 03/17/16 at 07:14:15 Hey MM......you gotta stop mashing that "POST" icon! My Cafe' bike has 13" shocks, and I believe that is about as far as you can go. I do have to make my belt a bit loose when I am not on the bike, as it does tighten up when I get on the bike, and it tightens up even more when the suspension is compressed by a bump. Going up to 13" with the standard rear fender looks a bit weird, as the fender is really high above the tire. In order to lose the Cruiser look and get the bike to look more like a Cafe' or Tracker, and to quicken up the steering, the common practice is to use 13" rear shocks and drop the forks a couple of inches....this would look a bit weird with the stock bodywork and seat on the Savage. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by verslagen1 on 03/17/16 at 07:30:28 0B303D2A3B372C2A3139342B580 wrote:
Yep, I think that was a record... 5. 2 & 3's are common, but 5 wow. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by MMRanch on 03/17/16 at 18:30:25 Yep, I think that was a record... 5. 2 & 3's are common, but 5 wow. ? :-? so the internet blinks out and I don't think it worked , but still post even though it doesn't show on my screen ? Thanks for the Heads-Up. :) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Art Webb on 03/17/16 at 20:44:22 JOG asked How much energy is spent just Not getting blown Off at seventy? How much of the fatigue could be changed by having a comfortable seat? answer: a lot and a lot simply putting a screen on my S40 made me a willing 70MPH rider, where before i was a willing 60 mph rider, and a reluctant 70 mph one Never did get the seat fixed comfy, but I know from other bikes I've ridden that had better seats that a good seat makes a world of difference |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 03/17/16 at 21:28:40 I've found that a 'screen and a comfortable seat makes all the difference on a long ride. At the third or fourth day of an aching back from leaning into the wind and your tail feeling like the seat is a 2X4 on edge. It just ain't all that much fun anymore..... :-? |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 03/18/16 at 05:08:37 I rode the BMW K1200RS last night......it was really nice. The seating position was low, the weight was not excessive, and it was smooth and powerful. The seating position brought my feet up a bit higher than I would have liked, the tank was wide, I could flat foot easily when standing still. The fellow that owned the bike took my wife for a ride on the back....and she loved it. The wind did not beat her up like it does on our ST1100. Even with all that - I just don't think it is the right bike for me. It is a very intimidating work of art beneath that bodywork, I have no idea how to work on that thing. The 1,200 cc engine is very smooth and controllable - but 100 mph comes sooo fast it is scary! I think I need a smaller/lighter/less powerful motorcycle that will be our "riding double" bike for the coming years. I am going to go ride a Honda VT700 and see if they have enough power and room for us. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Gus on 03/18/16 at 08:51:16 German engineering is intimidating in the beginning. I remember when I bought my first Mercedes diesel ten years ago. There was a lot to learn and it wasn't all just mechanics. Much of it is hard to explain but Germans design things from a different thought process than Americans. That first Mercedes I bought is simple in comparison to the latter one I bought. But today. I have a completely different understanding of the vehicle itself and the purpose for which it was built. Long story short, the old 1976 Mercedes is still carrying my youngest son to school every day. The thing is a tank and with in excess of 300,000 miles on it; the doors still shut like the door of an old freezer that's never been out of the basement. The 1995 Mercedes is fast approaching the 300,000 mile mark and shows no signs of slowing down; not even an oil leak. That is the difference and today I understand and am comfortable with the layout and design of that German engineering. It's rock solid and made to work on. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/18/16 at 09:31:06 Dave, have you considered a Miata? Or, any little two seater? |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 03/18/16 at 10:49:47 6A757374696E5F6F5F67757932000 wrote:
No......I don't need or want a sports car. I want a 2 wheel Barcolounger for 2.....that doesn't require a 34" inseam and weigh 750 pounds. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Gus on 03/18/16 at 11:02:16 I'd be interested to here how a test ride goes on one of those Honda 700's. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 03/18/16 at 11:17:05 7A75627F747C2974777F291B0 wrote:
There is one a couple hours ride from here for sale.....but the weather over the weekend is going to be crappy (possibly some snow showers tomorrow). I read some road tests where they claim they are a bit under powered, and need a sixth gear - but this could be coming from the same test folks that just climbed off the new UberHP Guzzumacati! One of the problems withe the big touring bikes is that I want to be able to load it onto my trailer and tow it behind my little car, and loading a 750 pound motorcycle by myself is really scary. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Gus on 03/18/16 at 12:52:48 I hear you Dave; on the 750 lbs. part. I've got no desire to wrestle with a big bike anymore myself. Not from any standpoint. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/18/16 at 16:15:51 72494453424E555348404D52210 wrote:
No......I don't need or want a sports car. I want a 2 wheel Barcolounger for 2.....that doesn't require a 34" inseam and weigh 750 pounds.[/quote] I'm So able to get where you're coming from. There is just no reason why we can't have such a machine available to us. The engines and power trains are , IMO, well inside the engineering and manufacturing capabilities of the human race. I don't see any reason for an engine to propel two people down the road at eighty MPH and get them from zero to sixty in eight seconds to have to be 1,400 CC's. But, I'm not an engineer, either. Just seems to me that another 250/300CC's otta do it. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 03/18/16 at 18:26:05 JOG: I think a 600 - 800 twin is plenty of engine for a sport touring bike, or small touring bike that can carry two people. I have a friend that traveled all over the Rockies on a BMW K75 about 20 years ago, and he said it had plenty of power. He said you may not be able to blow past 6 cars at a time when passing - but it had plenty of power for normal riding. I am starting to think the NT700 might be a good bike for my wife and I, and one that is reasonable to load on a trailer. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/18/16 at 19:18:14 There's a trailer out there that sits flat, ride on, raise it up.. Can't remember what they are called. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Rodger on 03/19/16 at 07:09:49 Dave: Used to ride all over the western U.S. and Canada on a 1984 BMW R80RT air cooled opposed twin, loaded with now-ex-wife and camping gear. True, we weren't "blowing the doors" off cars we passed but I never felt the urgent need for Tim Taylor-esqe MORE POWER!! lol What I liked about the Beemer is what I like about the S40: simplicity, light weight, and ease of maintenance. (Ummmm...anybody interested in a very well maintained Vulcan 1500FI? ;) ) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by MMRanch on 03/19/16 at 10:28:06 Wow Dave : I was just looking at your next bike ... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_Deauville almost made me want one ! Its lighter than my Harley and more HP. ! ;) plus luggage and storage space --- plus more fuel by a 1/2 gal ! :) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 03/19/16 at 10:56:45 47585E5944437242724A58541F2D0 wrote:
It is not just the loading scare that is putting me on a weight reduction mission to replace the ST1100. It is also the fact that I can just barely reach the ground on the bike, even with a seat that has been lowered by removing some padding. And it is the fact that when you are height challenged, any dip when you stop can be just the place you set your foot when you come to a stop....and once the brute starts over (bike...not wife) you can't stop it from falling. With careful riding and planning you can most often avoid those tip-overs - but not always. And if you happen to set your foot on a little bit of gravel or a slick spot....it can make it impossible to hold the bike up. Since I am just barely able to touch the ground - my legs pretty much have to extend straight down alongside the bike - and this give me very little leverage against the weight of the bike......my size 10 outriggers just can't get very far away from the bike to help lever the bike upright. We also have a problem with the seat being so long. Since my short arms and legs make me sit right up against the fuel tank - I am a long way in front of my wife who is sitting at the back of the seat leaning against the top box and pad. There is about a foot of space between us, and the wind gets between us and beats her up badly. Her head is in constant turbulent air, and she is exhausted from fighting the wind. We are going to try a taller windshield, and I imagine that will help....currently the short windshield allows the air to just touch the top 1/3rd of my helmet, and then the airflow drops and hits my wife from the neck up. She can't slide forward on the seat as her sitting space is a couple inches taller than mine, and the footpeg position would be uncomfortable if she were to move forward. The ST1100 is a great motorcycle, and for someone 6' and above it is an ideal Sport Touring bike. I am just a bit too small to use it as our "dual up" bike as I approach Senior Citizen status. I looked at a BMW F800 bike today and it would be great for me as a solo rider - but the rear seat doesn't look comfortable for a rider. It is not nearly as bad as the sport bikes that put the rider up on a perch with their ankles 6" below their butt.....but it is not a touring bike seating position. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/19/16 at 11:20:04 There's a road , T intersection, and the curves up for about twelve feet as you approach the stop sign. Your foot is lower than the bottom of a line between the two tires, and even the Savage was something to consider. The Guzzi? Hope for a no traffic, run the sign. If traffic, pull parallel to the road I want to be on, stop, foot down on the side I can touch. . And if you happen to set your foot on a little bit of gravel or a slick spot I call that The Power Splits. And I've been seen picking up a bike after doing it. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old_rider on 03/19/16 at 15:39:19 That's why I did not purchase one Dave... I have a 31-32" inseam and with the seat being anywhere from 5" in front to about 12" in the back, it shortens my legs a bit to probably about 27", so I had to tip toe a bit. And it was a little top heavy to boot. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by MMRanch on 03/19/16 at 16:09:57 Hay Dave ! : http://www.sloansmotorcycle.com/default.asp?page=xPreOwnedInventoryDetail&id=1166794&p=2&s=Year&d=D&t=preowned&fr=xpreownedinventory Whats the point in working all the time if ya don't get to spend the money ? ;) they are perdly !! |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/19/16 at 16:45:41 http://www.airtow.com/flatbed-model-specs/ I Really thought Dave was taller. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Gus on 03/19/16 at 17:55:38 08333E2938342F29323A37285B0 wrote:
Dave, I've noticed that this passenger seat issue is a real problem with most bikes under 1000cc's |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 04/05/16 at 19:37:25 Officially started my project today... Bike on the lift at 10 AM and motor on the bench 2 hours later.... Note: No wonder why this motor is so limited. The intake is fairly clean, but the exuast port is terrible. VERY restrictive. :o Any effort to increase performance should include porting. :) This should not only improve performance, but reliability, as the engine should run cooler with a less restricted exuast gas (heat) flow. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by HovisPresley on 04/05/16 at 20:41:17 8-) Good luck with the project, old.indian. I've just ordered a stage 3 cam from Lancer. I already have a new Wiseco 95mm piston/rings/pin. Good luck and keep us up to date on your progress :) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 04/07/16 at 15:30:14 WARNING !!!! I got the engine torn down today with the following surprises... (note that I bought the bike Dec. '15 with 398x miles with "normal" tire wear and now has 7150miles) ...Cam chain adjuster at near max extension and clutch worn. Very slight scuff on piston skirt. Cylinder wall will hone nicely. I have to think that the PO limited himself to 1 to 5 mile trips OR he went full twist from day one. The cam, followers etc. show clean and unscored..... This bike showed clean with no visible abuse when I bought it. But it is good that I tore it down when I did. I doubt if that cam chain extender would have lasted another 4-5 k miles..... |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Gus on 04/07/16 at 17:00:41 6C6F672D6A6D676A626D030 wrote:
WOW! Mine has just over 4xxxx now. I thought I had some time to get that Versy cam chain adjuster.... Mebee not!!! :o |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 05/14/16 at 10:31:47 Here we are in the middle of May and it is taking a skosh bit longer than I planned to collect everything... And of course with the inevitable "change orders" the budget has increased. BUT if the mail stagecoach gets through the Thumper "should" be back together and running before Memorial Day.... 8-) After break in I hope to get it in and dyno it. (At 6,000 feet I don't expect the same numbers as sea level, but the torque and HP curves will tell me what I need to know... ;) New or changed bits and pieces as part of "The Project" (from the bottom up.) New cam chain and Varsi's adjuster, Barrett clutch, Wiseco 10.5 CR 94mm piston, Lectron 38mm carb, ported and blueprinted head (with Varsi's head plug), stage 3 camshaft, 1.75 " header and Dyna muffler, 12" shocks, tachometer, and Kawasaki front pulley... 8-) I expect about a 30% gain in torque and horse power, as well as an addition 500 to 1K RPMs from these modifications, without sacrificing reliably (if I don't go crazy). |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by LANCER on 05/14/16 at 16:35:52 393A32783F38323F3738560 wrote:
Yea, that can be the hard part sometimes. ;D |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/14/16 at 18:55:27 With all that going in, knowing what the throwout is made of, I'd sure be tempted to cut one out of billet. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 05/20/16 at 16:59:52 The last piece of the puzzle arrived Wednesday afternoon. 8-) Started putting the puzzle back together at 9 this morning and broke at 12 to do the "Honeydos" for the rest of to day .... ;) Got done : Jug honed and cleaned, Wiseco piston installed, reworked head and stage 3 cam installed(with Varsi's head plug), valves adjusted, new cam chain and Varsi's adjuster installed, New Barrett HD clutch assembled and ready to install... With a little bit of luck, and some help from my friends in the "Over the Hill Motorcycle Gang and Political Whine and Moan Society", I'll have the motor in the frame tomorrow... 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by springman on 05/20/16 at 18:51:50 Old Indian that all sounds really impressive. Keep that project can't wait to see how it all turns out. Best of luck to you. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by HovisPresley on 05/21/16 at 07:00:27 7576746F68616B6768060 wrote:
+1 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Art Webb on 05/21/16 at 07:30:37 +2 |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/21/16 at 09:21:52 Are the springs in the clutch meaner than stock? The throw out is a known weak link. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 05/21/16 at 20:51:59 504F494E53546555655D4F43083A0 wrote:
Slightly, but I don't expect to be abusing it. From the condition of the original cam chain and piston, the original owner neglected proper break in and twisted it too soon..... That new Wiseco piston is beautiful. Almost to pretty to hide inside the jug... I didn't weigh them, but the new Wiseco "felt" a few ounces lighter than the stock 94 mm. I think that porting and blueprinting the head is the key to getting the most out of this engine. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/22/16 at 14:00:38 There is a coating for the jug, but I don't know what it costs. I'd sure hate a report that the throw out gave up. I shimmed the springs with One washer and matched thickness of them. Mine gave up a few thousand miles later. Busted some stuff up, close to home, inexpensive but not hassle free. I ditched the shims. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by pg on 05/24/16 at 17:03:24 OI, did you get it back together yet? Give us a progress update when convenient. Best regards, |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 05/24/16 at 17:22:46 Engine buttoned up, new 25 tooth pulley, Intruder 800 shocks on, belt on and all necessary trimming of guard(s) etc. completed. Battery box, carb etc. tomorrow. Thursday = make contribution to dentist's mortgage . Friday ???? "Fire In The Hole !!!!!!!" ???? :-? My "? Friends?" in the over the hill motorcycle gang and political whine and moan society are making wagers as to how far I get on day 1 before the thumper comes out from under me.... (I'm in the process of changing my Christmas list.... :-/) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by KennyG on 05/24/16 at 21:12:11 Indian, Are any modifications needed to use the Intruder 8oo Shocks? Kenny G |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 05/25/16 at 06:27:27 517F7459687B69721A0 wrote:
No Big Deal 8-) http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1364087944/7/#8 |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Art Webb on 05/25/16 at 06:48:19 I for one don't think the bike will be coming out from under yoThe dentist I deeply distrust however then again I distrust all dentists except mine ;D |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 05/27/16 at 11:36:46 Dentist... Between the wife and I ...... :o $$$$ Friday & Murphy arrived today...Tried to spin it over to circulate the oil....Too tight !!!! Head cover DOES come off with the engine in the frame (FYI).... Culprit = Clutch binding (my own fault !!!!) No damage .. Except to my self esteem..... :-[ |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Art Webb on 05/28/16 at 07:40:55 I limit financial damage from dentists by limiting procedures If it can't be filled, it gets extracted, no caps, crowns, root canals, or any of the rest of that high end stuff that ultimately doesn't save the tooth anyway ;D |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/28/16 at 19:46:04 26353330222525470 wrote:
That's exactly how my cousin in Kentucky does it. All three of his teeth look great! Actually, that's what I do. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Art Webb on 05/30/16 at 09:32:41 lol, I'm missing one so far the attrition begins |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 05/31/16 at 13:12:01 :o :o :o :o :o IT'S ALIVE !!!!!! :o :o :o :o :o ](Except for the Tachometer) :-[ Film at 11...... :) :) :) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 05/31/16 at 18:11:57 That's pretty exciting! I think I had a tach issue when I got my Cafe' running.....I had the wrong side of the coil wired to it. Have you ridden it yet? |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by gizzo on 05/31/16 at 23:31:27 4D5E585B494E4E2C0 wrote:
Still got all mine. I'm kind of attached to them... 1 nightmare of a root canal so far. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 06/01/16 at 10:29:00 :)As of the morning (6/1/16) "The Project" is officially complete. The bike is buttoned up, re-assembled, and test ridden.... :) Final cost, including original purchase price, due to "change orders" is slightly over $4,500.00 :-[ ::) 2007 S40 + set of Michelin lls (140/90-15 rear), Intruder 800 shocks, 25 tooth front pulley, Ion battery, Lectron 38mm carb (& kit), ported and blue printed head, Versi's head plug, Stage 3 Cam, 94mm /10.5 CR piston, new cam chain, Varsi's fail safe adjuster, Barrett HD clutch, 1.75" OD header (Heat wrapped), Dyna Muffler, 4" forward controls, and Corbin Seat. 8-) 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by HovisPresley on 06/01/16 at 10:39:01 That's great to hear 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by thumperclone on 06/01/16 at 10:47:56 494A42084F48424F4748260 wrote:
its after 11 where is the film?? ;D |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Art Webb on 06/01/16 at 11:16:41 Sweet! |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by springman on 06/01/16 at 14:13:39 Sorry for showing my ignorance, but what exactly is a ported and blueprinted head? Oh, other than not understanding that part it sounds really cool. Waiting for the 11 o'clock news clip. :) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Oldfeller on 06/01/16 at 14:55:21 Blue printed means all wear items replaced/refurbished -- it was put back to nominal running clearances and specs with oversized bearings or pistons, etc. (Factory specs?) Ported means the exhaust and intake ports were smoothed but always made larger and a better shaped, supposedly using a flow meter to maximize the measured flow numbers at around the air intake speed of the motor when running at maximum hp. If referring to a two stroke, the port start height can be altered as well. These two items are generally considered mutually exclusive and when they are used together in the same mouthful of air they can cause the automatic "uh huh" reaction to take place. ;) ..... however, blue printing the block and porting & polishing the heads are proper separate items both to do and to discuss. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by springman on 06/01/16 at 18:23:34 Interesting. Sounds expensive. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 06/01/16 at 18:34:58 3734362D2A2329252A440 wrote:
Not really, when you consider every thing that happens in the process and the gain in efficiency and potential. :) http://i68.tinypic.com/1y927b.jpg http://i66.tinypic.com/16j0nxh.jpg |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 06/02/16 at 11:50:58 6F4C4446454C4C4552200 wrote:
In my case, "blue printing" refers to magnafluxing the head to find any hidden flaws or cracks, straighten all mating surfaces, testing spring tension and replacing as necessary, checking and replacing as needed valves, guides, rocker arms etc. etc.. Even with out the "porting", my head was improved over the standard head as installed in the factory. 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Art Webb on 06/02/16 at 20:30:05 I'm just gonna drop this here http://www.enginebasics.com/Advanced%20Engine%20Tuning/Blueprinting.html |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by HovisPresley on 06/03/16 at 18:50:07 I look at it like this... If I rode a newly-fettled Savage with... * the sensible mods done, ie. Versy's adjuster + headplug, Raptor tap, Dyna * all the engine mods, ie. cam, Wiseco, big-bore pipe, carb tuned to suit *longer rear shocks, 140/90 tyre .....I'd be very happy! The fact that it's got a Barnett clutch, Kwak pulley, Li battery, forwards, and a decent seat makes it even more desirable. But most of all, the pride, knowledge and experience gained in actually doing it yourself, and making it your bike, is priceless :) Nice bike, Mr O-I 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 06/04/16 at 06:39:20 1D3A233C260527302639302C550 wrote:
:) Thank You HovisP. :) I "built" the Thumper with the idea of being able to ride. Be it to Pie Town, New Mexico (275 miles round trip) for a cup of coffee and a piece of pie, or to Canada, across and back. :) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Art Webb on 06/04/16 at 07:09:41 OI it's a sweet build, congratulations, and I hope you get many sweet miles out of her |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 06/16/16 at 16:35:44 Completed the first 500 miles of "break in" using a 4,000 RPM "redline". 8-) So this morning I did my part and went through everything. Changed oil and filter (Magnetic drain plug clean with no bits and pieces in the oil or filter.) Spark plug = slightly rich, OK. All valves clearances = .004 ok (*note. Access is MUCH easier with Raptor petcock and the chrome head cover bits off.) :) All head and jug bolt torque settings = good. Header collar bolts tightened. FYI... At 6,000 ft. above sea level, and in 5th gear the bike will go from 3,200 RPM to 5,000 RPM* in a heart beat. AND that is with the 25 tooth Kawasaki front pulley. Per the math, with 140/90-15 rear and 25 tooth front pulley, 5,000 RPM in 5th gear = 80MPH... :o * "Redline" for second 500 miles of break in.... 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Art Webb on 06/16/16 at 16:54:08 sweet! |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Gus on 06/16/16 at 20:31:47 Nice OI, nice! May the wind be always @ your back brother! |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by springman on 06/16/16 at 21:10:06 Old Indian, I agree with Hovis. Such great pride that you can take on this build. Beautiful. I take my hat off to you sir. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 06/24/16 at 11:50:02 800 miles into the 1,000 mile break in. I stopped at the scale today, on the road/ fighting weight is exactly 400 pounds.... :-/ (Plus 195 pounds & 6' of old geezer in the saddle.) I'll dyno it in a few weeks and post the graphs.... 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by springman on 06/24/16 at 11:55:15 Keep the info coming Old.indian. Yours is one cool build. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by pg on 06/24/16 at 17:11:10 OI: The only thing your bike is missing is the fender ornament. http://https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/4d/67/4e/4d674e02f0841fbb0f0a691b2fd572ed.jpg Best regards, |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by justin_o_guy2 on 06/24/16 at 18:00:38 I couldn't ride with that dudes face poking out, unprotected. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by pg on 06/24/16 at 18:17:27 I can't ride if a turtle is poking it's head out.. :-/ Best regards, |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by justin_o_guy2 on 06/24/16 at 18:47:23 Ewwww,, |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 06/24/16 at 19:27:35 3A2D2B2728384A0 wrote:
I would have to change the front fender to use that one... HOWEVER, the 1937-38 Sport Scout had a version I can use. Now if I could just find one.... 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 07/02/16 at 21:25:59 Completed break in today with 350 (+/-) mile run round trip to Zuni, NM. Only 20 unavoidable miles on I-40. Rest on route 66 and highway 53. NO problems (except when I got stupid, missed a corner and did a little moto crossing through the sagebrush. No damage to bike. Rider has sore back.) :-[ Considerable wind. Headwinds, tailwinds and cross winds. Lot of tribal police and sheriffs deputies out. (Tribal police are NOT to be messed with.) Got the hairy eyeball from guy on new Indian with XX thousand dollars worth of "Indian" accessories on bike and himself. I'll try to get the bike on a dyno fairly soon.... 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Gus on 07/03/16 at 19:55:17 OI, don't let hat thing get away from you! |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 07/17/16 at 09:51:14 Working on get some dyno time..... Taking bike out early before temps hit 90+. Engine pulls THROUGH 7,000 in 1st, 2nd and 3rd gears. 4th and 5th = ????... Beyond my comfort level.... (Way Beyond!!) Gas mileage in 55 mpg range @ 60/65mph. Far more comfortable ride with the 12" Intruder 800 shocks. 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/17/16 at 10:08:58 What RPM did you get to in fourth and fifth? What was indicated MPH? What tire you running? Some of these guys have it all worked out.. Transmission gear ratios, RPM, tire size, Cha Ching, translates to MPH. That speedo lies like Speedos with a sock in them. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 07/17/16 at 10:37:36 736C6A6D70774676467E6C602B190 wrote:
Rear Tire = 140/90-15 Michelin , Front Sprocket = 25 tooth , Numbers = 3,660 RPM = 60mph (math by Dave). 195 pound, 6 ft. rider (sitting upright, no windshield ) 5,000 RPM in 5th on level straight at 6,000 ft. above sea level. (Too busy paying attention to the road to eyeball speedo at the time... ) :) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/17/16 at 12:57:29 Numbers = 3,660 RPM = 60mph (math by Dave). 5,000 RPM in 5th= MPH? I Used to be able to See how numbers worked sometimes,, now ain't when.. 1,830= 30 915 = 15 5,000/ 915= 5+ 5X 15 = 75,, meehhhh,, a hair over 80.. If you had gone to 7,000, you would've been cutting 100+. If IT will do the 7,000 min fifth.. You're not exactly tiny. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 07/28/16 at 15:13:46 8-) At the dyno this afternoon.... 6,000 feet above sea level 96 degrees F, 24.77 in-Hg, 14% humidity SAE 1.25 Red line 7,000 At the BACK TIRE.... Max HP = 31.73 @ 6,300 RPM Max Torque 32.22 @ 3,500RPM (Note: Torque curve stays 30.0 and above 2,500 rpm to 5,500rpm) Carb is running way to rich at 4,300 rpm and above.... I'll be talking to the Lectron carb techs tomorrow to see what I can do about that. Tweaking the carb, lower temps and more humidity should squeeze a bit more out of it, I'll definitely get better mileage..... Over all, not bad for a baseline.... :) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 07/29/16 at 04:42:02 It is great that the maximum torgue is at 3,500 rpm.....it is right down where you can easily access it - without having to shift to a lower gear. (That is why we love a Thumper!). The HP number is a bit lower than I would have hoped for - however it is rear wheel HP, and you are at 6.000 feet. A normally aspirated engine is supposed to lose 3% power for every 1,000 feet of elevation - so you are down 18% from what it would make at sea level. I don't know how much HP a motorcycle loses in getting the power from the crankshaft to the rear wheel. Most online comments for cars is around 15% for a manual transmission - but some folks claim this number is too low - but they don't use an efficient belt for the final drive.....so let's assume it is 15%. So with a correction your 31.73 HP would become 38.7 HP at sea level, and then with the 15% correction for the drivetrain it would become 45.52 HP at the crank! If the stock bike is around 30....that certainly is an impressive improvement! |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 07/29/16 at 11:27:29 0C373A2D3C302B2D363E332C5F0 wrote:
Thank You for the input Dave, I'm happy with the results. For the number of $$$ I have invested in the Thumper, I have a fairly ideal motorcycle for my style of riding and the type of roads I ride. 8-) 60 -65 mph all day long with the ability to hit 85 + for passing by just rolling on the throttle. 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Art Webb on 07/29/16 at 11:39:45 and that's really what it's all about, the right bike....for you! |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 01/12/17 at 11:51:57 :-[Mission creep January 2017 .....Added Varsi's drilled rotor, Tkat fork brace, and braded brake line while performing maintenance in front end. Installed chain conversion. 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by LANCER on 01/12/17 at 12:15:30 You are getting there ! ;) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 03/19/17 at 09:06:01 3/19/17 Doing the math, the engine mods come out to 37 HP and 39 ft.lbs. of torque on the pavement at sea level. Dyno run was done at 6,000 ft. above sea level, 96 degrees and 11% humidity.... (3% loss of HP for each 1,000 ft. above sea level.) (Honda quotes 12% to 15% loss between crankshaft HP and rear axel. so that would = 45.9 Crankshaft HP and 46.2 lbs. of torque at sea level...) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 03/20/17 at 07:07:11 ::) |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by LANCER on 03/20/17 at 18:39:12 Hot dog ! [ch128521][ch127949] |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 03/21/17 at 02:56:06 54575F1552555F525A553B0 wrote:
The published numbers for the S40 are 31 HP @ 5,400 rpm, and 37 Ft/lb at 3,400 rpm. One of the things I find really interesting about your Dyno run - is that with the Stage 3 cam the maximum torque only shifted up 100 rpm from stock - while the maximum HP shifted up 900 rpm. This big single can still make torque down low where you need it for comfy cruising - and the better breathing from the performance cam, head work, carb and exhaust make the engine breath better so that the engine is still pulling when the stock engine is starting to run out of air. Those of us who ride close to sea level don't appreciate what happens to your Savage up at 6,000 feet. You are running around with 18% less power than we have....and that will really be noticeable on a low HP bike like the Savage. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Ruttly on 03/21/17 at 08:09:05 Sweet ! |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 03/21/17 at 09:28:40 59626F7869657E78636B66790A0 wrote:
The published numbers for the S40 are 31 HP @ 5,400 rpm, and 37 Ft/lb at 3,400 rpm. One of the things I find really interesting about your Dyno run - is that with the Stage 3 cam the maximum torque only shifted up 100 rpm from stock - while the maximum HP shifted up 900 rpm. This big single can still make torque down low where you need it for comfy cruising - and the better breathing from the performance cam, head work, carb and exhaust make the engine breath better so that the engine is still pulling when the stock engine is starting to run out of air. Those of us who ride close to sea level don't appreciate what happens to your Savage up at 6,000 feet. You are running around with 18% less power than we have....and that will really be noticeable on a low HP bike like the Savage. [/quote] The factory specs I have quote torque at 30.5 foot pounds @ 3400 RPM.... :-/ |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 03/21/17 at 09:56:26 This is what I used as the source for the published HP and Torque on the factory bike (your mileage may vary). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suzuki_Boulevard_S40 |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/21/17 at 10:30:15 Considering that the OEM jetting changed down through the years, howizzitt that the HP stayed the same? And, Yeah, everybody's mileage varies. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 03/21/17 at 14:49:01 4B707D6A7B776C6A7179746B180 wrote:
8-) I wonder where I got 30.5 for torque ???? |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Kris01 on 03/21/17 at 17:07:45 2C3335322F2819291921333F74460 wrote:
I've never understood why Suzi would go from VERY lean to moderately lean and back again. The engine and carb stayed the same. Just jet it properly and leave it alone. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by old.indian on 03/21/17 at 17:20:36 1F263D276465540 wrote:
I've never understood why Suzi would go from VERY lean to moderately lean and back again. The engine and carb stayed the same. Just jet it properly and leave it alone.[/quote] Probably something to do with emissions... :-/ |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by gizzo on 03/21/17 at 17:23:04 704B4651404C57514A424F50230 wrote:
I really noticed this the other week on a lower power bike than the Cabbage even. I'm usually around sea level-600ft. Could feel quite a power drop at 5600ft in the mountatins and the idle speed dropped too. |
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Title: Re: Bang For The Buck Post by Dave on 03/22/17 at 04:55:46 The little Ninja 250 I have loses a considerable amount of power when we get to the higher elevations. It has little torque to start with....it is even worse as you climb up the Cherohala! |
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