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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Kawasaki Pulley Conversions /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1384949185 Message started by Dave on 11/20/13 at 04:06:25 |
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Title: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Dave on 11/20/13 at 04:06:25 This thread will start out in the RSD....but after a bit of discussion and working out the bugs I will probably move it into the Tech section. I did this work a little bit at a time over the past 6 months, and unfortunately the photo documentation could have been better. FRONT PULLEY The stock front pulley is a 23 tooth pulley. The Kawasaki EN454 LTD used a 25 tooth pulley....which will decrease rpm's by 8% if used alone. According to the speed chart that Serowbot prepared 60 mph with the stock gearing would be 4,008 rpm....with the Kawasaki pulley it would be reduced to 3,688 rpm. This change will pull the rear wheel forward as a result of the larger pulley diameter - the change does work with the stock sized rear tire....oversize tires may not clear the swing arm. (RYCA bikes with 18" wheels cannot use ths pulley conversion without modifying the swingarm for tire clearance). The Kawasaki front pulley costs about $ 80 new. http://i42.tinypic.com/6qk754.jpg The Kawasaki pulley has a wider center hub and it needs to be machined thinner to work on the Suzuki. This can be done on a lathe if you have a way to hold the pulley - mine was done on a milling machine. The metal is very hard and a carbide tool was used to do the cutting. Front of Pulleys http://i42.tinypic.com/2zdnoz7.jpg Back of Pulleys http://i42.tinypic.com/2v9av5y.jpg The stock Suzuki pulley has the side flanges welded on, the Kawasaki pulley has tabs that are split and they stick out and are very rough - and they hit the engine case and pulley cover. http://i42.tinypic.com/20jl5ee.jpg To provide more clearance I took a flat punch and hammered the tabs a bit flatter. http://i41.tinypic.com/2wftf7c.jpg http://i41.tinypic.com/5oe6pc.jpg The rear post on the engine case interferes with the larger pulley, and has to be trimmed. http://i40.tinypic.com/29fyog2.jpg http://i40.tinypic.com/nm18i8.jpg http://i41.tinypic.com/zstptz.jpg http://i41.tinypic.com/ejixj6.jpg The bolt for the oil seal retainer has an extended bolt head and it can be replaced with pan head screw for more clearance. http://i44.tinypic.com/4i06eu.jpg http://i39.tinypic.com/20k7skp.jpg http://i43.tinypic.com/5e8j90.jpg Finally - You need to install the nut with threadlocker and a good lock tab washer, torque it to 94 ft./lbs. If you have a RYCA you will need to raise the front of the belt guard a little bit for clearance. On my outer cover I had to trim a small place where the outer flange just rubbed a bit on the outer cover - this support matches up with the one that had to be trimmed on the engine case http://i44.tinypic.com/4rqla0.jpg REAR PULLEY The stock rear pulley is 68 tooth, and a Kawasaki KZ750 from around 1983 has a rear pulley that is 65 tooth. The combined change in the ratio is a reduction from 68/23 (2.95) to 65/25 (2.60) - which will reduce the 60 mph stock 4,008 rpm to 3,532 rpm.....a nearly 12% reduction. You cannot use only the rear pulley in this conversion - as there is not enough travel for the belt adjustment to take up the slack caused by the smaller pulley diameter. http://i41.tinypic.com/25su23b.jpg The Kawasaki pulley is cast iron......and weighs 2.4 pounds more than the stock pulley which is made from aluminum. It increases the rear wheel weight from 34 to 36.4 pounds....and I see no way to trim off any fat. The center bolt hole is larger than the Suzuki hole - so you have to make a spacer to take up the extra room and center the sprocket on the hub. The bolt circle is also different - so after I had the hub spacer made I installed the sprocket and marked the new hole locations, and drilled them on a drill press. Kawasaki Pulley http://i40.tinypic.com/sbhfeo.jpg Cutting out the spacer from an aluminum sheet http://i43.tinypic.com/2m791yt.jpg Trimming the inside diamter http://i40.tinypic.com/9j1zkk.jpg Installed on hub and trimming the outside diameter http://i41.tinypic.com/300h83l.jpg Once the pulley was on the hub......it then became necessary to trim the hub to correct for the difference in the pulley offset. http://i39.tinypic.com/2vc6wxu.jpg Trimming the hub to correct the offset http://i42.tinypic.com/9unpl0.jpg After I trimmed the hub and went to install the new pulley, I discovered the bolt threads did not extend deep enough allow the bolts to be tightened - so I had to install some washer on the outside. This winter I will make a proper looking plate to fit on the outside in place of the washers. http://i43.tinypic.com/im1df8.jpg When I installed the rear wheel I discovered I had some play/wobble that I did not like......so I cut some strips of rubber from a floor mat and installed them. The wobble is gone.......now we will see how long that solution will last. http://i44.tinypic.com/ra7t4l.jpg I also discovered that the smaller pulley would hit the left shock mounting bolt. I had to remove the bolt, trim the length of the hex head, and then plate the bolt and put it back on. http://i40.tinypic.com/149bddw.jpg http://i41.tinypic.com/11icsh4.jpg And this is what it look like installed. http://i40.tinypic.com/a4yhec.jpg There is just barely enough belt adjustment to make this work. On my Cafe' conversion I have about 1/2 turn left on the adjusters before I bottom out the axle in the swinge arm. This winter I plan on extending the swing arm table 1/4" and will make the slots a bit longer....while filling up some of the front of the slot. On a stock bike with normal length shocks it might provide a bit more adjustment room. So far I have only gone on a 5 mile test ride as the weather has been too cold to ride much. I really think this is going to be a great change. It now becomes obvious when you shift into 5th gear. My rpms drop to 3,300 at 60 mph (18" rear wheel), and the engine is loping along and sounds great. There are hills in this area that most likely will require shifting into 4th to keep from lugging the engine too much. I am sure this conversion does not provide any higher top speed, and I expect that 4th gear is now the gear to use for speed runs, and 5th is now the overdrive for cruising. I am not sure how well this conversion will work on a stock engine/stock bike/saddlebags, large rider, riding double, etc. My bike has a Wiseco, Stage 1 Cam, better muffler, large foam air filter, etc, weighs about 320 pounds and I weigh 160....and the engine pulls this bike strongly with the new gearing. So far I am very happy with this change......now for the long term testing scheduled for the spring of 2014! |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pully Conversions Post by Super Thumper on 11/20/13 at 07:22:15 You went to a lot of trouble to make this work, nicely done. Why not convert to a chain drive, many more options for final drive ratios? |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pully Conversions Post by Dave on 11/20/13 at 08:00:22 223C35393738243F3E500 wrote:
I really don't like the mess and maintenance of a chain....the belt is nice and clean. Also the Cafe' conversions raise the rear end with 3" longer shocks....and that combined with the location of the rear set pegs and smaller diameter sprockets results in the chain hitting the peg mount, as well as the pivot point for the swing arm. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Dave on 05/13/14 at 15:14:56 I wanted to update folks on this conversion. I have probably ridden my bike about 400 miles since doing this conversion. About 150 miles has been interstate travel at 70 mph, and the rest on local country roads or in traffic in town. The only odd speed that I have noticed so far is 35 mph.....the engine is running just a bit fast for a gentle cruise through town in 3rd gear - while 4th gear is lugging the engine just a bit. I really like this change. I have had to learn to keep the bike in a lower gear, and 5th is generally not used until I reach 60mph. The bike is geared really tall in 1st gear - mostly because of the sprocket change and some because of the 18" rear wheel on my Cafe' conversion. It might not be an ideal situation for a bike that is ridden by a larger rider or when riding double.....but I weigh about 160 and I only have room for me! I have not had any issue with clutch slip...even at full throttle. Cruising down the interstate at 70 mph is a breeze - the bike is right around 4,000 rpm, and it appears the head temperature at that speed has dropped about 20 degrees as a result of the lower rpm the pulleys allow. I will have to check that in 90 degree weather to be sure. Out on the curvy country roads the neighbors don't seem to mind that I am blasting around the countryside - as the engine doesn't sound like it is working hard. They are used to hearing the Sportbike howl.....and it just sounds to them like my bike is far more neighbor friendly as I poot-poot-poot-poot past their property and give a friendly wave;D. Hopefully MMRanch will weigh in on how he likes the conversion after putting some miles on his Savage with this pulley change.....unless he is riding his Harley so much that the Savage is just gathering dust in the barn! Dave PS: I made a decorative cover to hide the extra holes in the pulley. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by S-P on 05/13/14 at 17:46:27 That is really, really cool. If you made a kit for us'ns what don't got a machine shop in our carport, I bet you'd sell a few of these. ;) |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by lnewlf on 05/14/14 at 05:58:48 Awesome Job! When can I place an order for one ;D. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Dave on 05/14/14 at 06:12:15 Well......I am not in the business and posted the info so you could do it yourself. Wth the labor involved, and the cost of new or used parts, this conversion would most likely be in the $ 500 - $ 600 range. The source of Kawasaki pulleys appears to be somewhat limited. The same 1-2 used front pulleys have been on eBay for about a year, same for the 1 rear pulley. These seem to be commercial sellers that have very big prices on their stuff.....and don't care if it doesn't sell quickly. I ended up buying a new front pullley when I was offered a discount coupon for an online parts seller and it was just a bit more than a used one. For the rear pulley I just kept watching and eventually got a good deal on one that was in good condition. If you watch eBay continuously you will most likely find a bargain eventually. I don't have the ability to machine the front pulley myself - my lathe cannot grip it properly. A fellow at the gym I go to owns a machine shop and did it for me as a favor....he said it would have been about $ 150 if he had charged me their normal labor rate. The front pulley can be done alone and it is a worthwhile upgrade. (UPDATE: I have made some mandrels to hold the pulley in my lathe, and I when I can find reasonably priced used pulleys and the time needed to machine them....I do have some for sale in the Marketplace). If you have the tools.....or friends and family that do and will machine the parts for you for free....this is a very worthwhile conversion. It really makes the bike a freeway flier! If you have to pay someone to do this.....it would be expensive. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by strang on 05/18/14 at 06:00:27 Just trying to get my head round this: bigger 18" wheel conversion = "lowering the gearing" = lowers the speed the bike will achieve in each gear. bigger front pulley = "raising the gearing" = raises the speed the bike will achieve in each gear. smaller back pulley = "raising the gearing" = raises the speed the bike will achieve in each gear. Is it essentially back to stock? Did suzuki gear the bike right for the freeway as stock and the bigger back wheel messes this up? or is a stock savage really a city/round town bike and geared for acceleration over high speed cruising? and the 18" just accentuates this? Just trying to get my head round the gearing thing. Kawasaki has belts on a few other models as well, names GPZ305 which looks pretty similar. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Dave on 05/18/14 at 06:57:09 414640535C55320 wrote:
I guess there may be some confusion about what low and high gearing is.....and maybe I got confused as well. When something is geared low....I suppose the thought is that the machine is like a tractor....and goes slow for high engine speed. On the other hand....when you shift into a higher gear....you go faster. Making the rear wheel bigger allows you to go farther with each wheel revolution. The wheel size change is done mostly to lose the Cruiser look and make the bike look more like a standard motorcycle where the front and back rims are the same diameter. Using more teeth on the front pulley makes the pulley a larger diameter, and it drives the rear wheel farther for each revolution of the engine. When the front pulley is larger - it move the belt farther with each revolution of the pulley. Using less teeth on the rear pulley makes the pulley a smaller diameter, and the rear wheel moves farther for each revolution of the engine. When the rear pulley is a smaller diameter - it takes less movement of the belt to make a full revolution of the pulley. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by WD on 05/18/14 at 08:02:17 323533202F26410 wrote:
Savage is geared for commuting on surface streets (no super highways) or slow poking along on country backroads. Riding it on the super slab consistently as shipped will kill it. Accelerated wear on the valves, followers, camshaft, timing chain, tensioner assembly, oil pump, cylinder and rings... That said, I rode/ride both of mine like I want to blow them up and the 98 got a modified timing tensioner at roughly 25K miles and change and has never needed a valve adjustment. The 2003 at 8800 miles and change sounds like a bunch of woodpeckers trying to hammer their way out of a steel oil drum once I get it past 45mph... plan to check the valves on my next day off (tomorrow) and add fork gaiters (for function, not form). May swap the modified tensioner from the 98 into the 2003 as well, since the 98 is still down with electrical issues. Next bike, I'm breaking my own standards and going shaft drive, fuel injected, liquid cooled with self adjusting valves and disc brakes on both ends. VN1500 Classic, Nomad or Drifter (tube tires on wire wheels), maybe a VN1600 Classic or Nomad (tubeless tires on cast wheels), maybe a C90T. Shelby County TN roads are horrible, and the "drivers" are worse... bad place for a small, obsolete machine that needs constant fiddling with to keep it in spec. Based on what I read on our forum all the time, the newer the Savage/S40, the less durable it is. Seems like they quit building them to last about model year 2000. I like my 2003 daily rider, but it isn't even close to the bike my 98 was... |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by pgambr on 05/18/14 at 13:26:32 Quote:
Probably a lot of truth to that - cars, bikes, everything. Everything made in the new millennium hasn't bee the same quality of yesteryear. I suppose the thread got pulled to thin through the engineering & manufacturing process, supply lines, metal grades, so fourth. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Serowbot on 05/18/14 at 19:09:11 Here's a speed chart for Dave's set-up... with his custom pulleys and 18" wheel... http://i600.photobucket.com/albums/tt82/serowbot/DavesRyca_zps7d015a52.jpg |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Dave on 05/19/14 at 04:22:54 Serowbot: Thanks for doing that. It confirms what I thought....after the conversion any high speed attempt I do should be done in 4th gear. Dave |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by MMRanch on 01/12/15 at 23:10:55 I weigh just under 200lbs, run a big windshield/ Bags / Trunk and full fenders /w/ mud flaps. I stated that up front so ya'll can understand the rest of this post. I've got a Michelin Commander 140/90-15 (it's TALL) just by its self the speedometer has about 7% slower reading than the GPS does at any given speed . When I add both Kawasaki pulleys the stock motor don't smooth-out in 5th gear till the GPS is up past 70mph or so then the stock motor pegs out about 85mph (see introduction paragraph) . It's just geared too high to cruse around at 55mph unless I stay in 4th gear. But just running the Kawasaki 25 tooth and tall tire things are much better. They total about 15% over-drive compared to stock. I can bump along at 55mph in 5th gear or enjoy the supper slab at 75 on GPS indicated (65 speedometer) , fuel millage is up to almost 60mpg. / and I get all the way across intersections before needing 2nd gear. I'm in LOVE with it. :) If I took off the windshield and bags , then laided out on the fuel tank...wrapped my feet around the tail-light .... it might even break 100mph. ? ;D A useful note : I've tried a HD belt ... The pitch is 14mm/9/16" like ours ... But ... the belt is too THICK to bend around a 23 tooth pulley. The sportster front pulley is 28-30 teeth. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Dave on 01/14/15 at 04:53:28 I didn't keep track of the mileage on the bike when I installed my double pulley conversion - but I would guess I have about 2,500 miles since the change. My bike pulls the taller gearing just fine.....and I suppose I have lost a bit of acceleration - but it is not noticeable. My bike has a Wiseco, Stage 1 cam, some porting, a Mikuni round slide carb, and it makes noticeably more power than the stock engine. I am going to be changing my speedometer to a new GPS one from Speedhut, and it does have a 0-60 and 1/4 mile feature where I can actually make some measurements....so I will do that sometime in the future just for kicks. If you have the stock engine, I would definitely just start with the front pulley conversion. This larger sprocket does pull the rear wheel forward until almost all of the belt adjustment is used up - so if you can move your rear axle all the way forward and your tire does not rub the swing arm - you will be able to use the pulley. An 18" wheel is too big to use this conversion without clearancing the swing arm. MMRanch had a 140/90-15 Michelin Commander rear tire and was able to do the front pulley change without tire issues. And doing either the front or rear pulley conversion will not increase the top speed you can go...the stock engine is only good for about 85-90 mph (even though your speedometer may indicate a bit higher). You may find a strong tail wind or steep downhill to help make a higher number....but on flat ground with little wind the bike just runs out of power and will never make it to 100 mph. Since I have done the conversion my bike will actually go faster in 4th gear than it will in 5th. In 4th gear the engine can rev up and get higher in the power curve and get to a higher top speed....in 5th the engine does not rev up high enough to make HP/Torque and the wind resistance just wins the battle somewhere just shy of 90 mph. With the double pulley conversion....5th has become an overdrive that is used for steady cruising at 60-70 mph. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by savskad on 04/09/15 at 16:35:54 So, just to be sure, I should be OK with just converting the front pulley for now? I'm looking for a quick solution to raise my top speed while lowering RPMs. Cruising down the highway at 75 MPH+ is a regular thing for me. (I know I know, the Savage ain't designed for that stuff, but I got it because I need moderation, not a sport bike. I just want to cruise a tad bit more comfortably with the engine pumping like crazy.) I don't have the place or the money to do machine work for the rear pulley. I think I could manage to do the front one on my own in my in-laws garage. I have a 4" grinder to be able to trim part of the gear-box case down where necessary. I'm only asking, because I know the rear couldn't be done alone. Also, anyone here know how hard it would be to get a rear pulley machined to the right specs? If I say, drew up some schematics in autocad based on the needed dimensions between the kawa pulley and savage pulley? Thanks. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Dave on 04/09/15 at 18:07:43 Yes, the front pulley can be run by itself. It does require moving the rear axle up near the front of the belt adjustment - but there is room. A larger diameter rear tire also helps - and both will make your speedometer read a bit slower than you are really going. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Serowbot on 04/09/15 at 18:12:39 60726560787277130 wrote:
The pulley itself requires some pretty extensive machining also... |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Dave on 04/10/15 at 03:25:14 4C5A4D50485D504B3F0 wrote:
The pulley itself requires some pretty extensive machining also... [/quote] The pulley is some form of very had metal. The fellow that machined mine used a vertical mill and a carbide cutter. Mounting the pulley in a lathe is difficult (impossible on my 12" swing lathe). I have just torn down a Ninja 250 transmission from a blown engine, and the transmission shafts are the same size and spline as the Savage/Kawasaki pulley - so I am going to use them to make a mandrel to hold the Kawasaki pulley for machining on a lathe. I need to put new headstock bearings in my lathe before I try to machine a pulley. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by savskad on 04/10/15 at 06:09:33 5E485F425A4F42592D0 wrote:
-------------------------------------------------- What machining does the front pulley need? I read where the rear one needs some work, but the front one, all I saw was hammering the little bits of metal flatter. The rest (for the front pulley) was just trimming the body so the pulley would clear it. Am I missing something? |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Dave on 04/10/15 at 06:18:58 362433362E2421450 wrote:
-------------------------------------------------- What machining does the front pulley need? I read where the rear one needs some work, but the front one, all I saw was hammering the little bits of metal flatter. The rest (for the front pulley) was just trimming the body so the pulley would clear it. Am I missing something?[/quote] The hole where the Kawasaki pulley mounts is too wide for the Suzuki shaft....the pulley needs to be machined to make it narrower. Look at this photograph. See how the black stock pulley has the flat surface at the front...while the silver pulley has the hub sticking up from the surface? The same thing occurs on the back....and some of this thickness needs to be machined away. http://i42.tinypic.com/2zdnoz7.jpg |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by savskad on 04/10/15 at 11:58:40 Ahhh ok....pardon me for missing that part. So the part circled in red is what needs to be trimmed, right? and the corresponding spot on the back side of the pulley? Other than that, no other machining is necessary? |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Dave on 04/10/15 at 12:49:59 Just machining on the front and back....you have to get it machined so the offsets from where the belt rides to the hub face on the front and back match the stock pulley. On the front the hub goes away almost completely flush with the flat area. The flattening off the little nubs also makes it so less filing/grinding needs to be done on the pulley cover. If you look close in this photo you can see where the CNC end mill machined the front of my pulley. You only need to machine out as far as the lock washer extends on the front, and the diameter of the spacer over the shaft on the backside. (And you can see that a couple of the bumps have been flattened in the far end of the pulley face). http://i42.tinypic.com/20jl5ee.jpg |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Kris01 on 04/19/15 at 20:54:43 Dave, how much of the front pulley did you have taken off? Are both sides machined flush with the face of the pulley? Do we need to worry about the thickness on the back side so the pulley is spaced correctly or can it be shimmed with washers? |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Dave on 04/20/15 at 02:58:08 5F667D672425140 wrote:
I didn't cut my own front pulley.....I took it to a friend who owns a machine shop and he cut it on his milling machine and used a carbide bit. I took him the Kawasaki pulley and the original pulley, and he machined off whatever it took to make the pulley hubs match. Most of the hub comes off on the front just like the stock pulley....and there is some hub left on the back just like the stock pulley. The spacing has to match so that the belt can be in alignment with the rear pulley. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Kris01 on 04/20/15 at 19:10:33 Ok, gotcha. I may try this instead of chain. The Kawasaki front pulley by itself will yield a ratio of 2.72:1. I was wanting a chain ratio of 2.71:1 but the chain requires a lot more maintenance. Coincidentally the Kawasaki pulley is almost exactly the ratio I was looking for. Thanks! |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by DesertRat on 04/20/16 at 06:39:54 1F24293E2F23383E252D203F4C0 wrote:
http://i44.tinypic.com/ra7t4l.jpg I'm stealing this idea, Dave ;) between you and Bot, I'm building a bike of stolen ideas ... :D |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by badwolf on 04/20/16 at 11:32:35 Dave, I have been looking on ebay, and found several front pulleys for the kaw vulcan quite cheap. http://www.ebay.com/itm/252305379440?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT Do you know if they are the same as the ones off the old 450's we're using? They count 25 teeth, and LOOK the same in the pictures, but??? If they work I would get one, turn it to fit, and be able to supply a few guys at a reasonable price who want to gear up. I thought cost plus $50 and shipping. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Dave on 04/20/16 at 12:35:03 Badwolf: The pulley you listed looks the same.......and I just checked the parts lists for them....same part number 13144. It looks like they are the same....who knew?! I have a few EN454 pulleys I bought when the price was right, and I have made a couple of mandrels to hold them in my lathe. I have cut the backside of one and it works fine, and now I need to modify the second mandrel to hold the pulley while the front side is being cut. I was going to wait and see how long it takes me to get one of these puppies degreased, machined before I put a price on the work.......I suppose it would be cheaper if you only did the machining and let the others do the cleanup. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by badwolf on 04/20/16 at 12:49:53 Dave, I did not know you were working on the same thing/idea. Don't want to step on your toes. When I did mine just chucked it up in the 3 jaw and that worked fine. Seemed to be enough interest here from time to time that someone should offer a couple and see if people are willing to actually pay something or just dreamers/bitchers. I'll let you handle it as you're already invested. Good luck! |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Dave on 04/20/16 at 13:29:39 The 3 jaw chuck on my 12" lathe won't grip the outside of the pulley, I am using the transmission shafts from a Ninja 250 to make the mandrels, they are the same size spline. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by badwolf on 04/20/16 at 13:49:20 How are you fastening the pulley to the mandrel and still able to turn the inside face? |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Dave on 04/21/16 at 03:17:49 To cut the backside, the mandrel uses the Kawasaki bolts to fasten the pulley onto the Mandrel. I use a second Mandrel to cut the face, and it hold the pulley using the outer surface. The shaft of each mandrel is just short enough that they don't extend out to interfere with the cutting. I will post some photos. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Dave on 01/10/18 at 03:44:01 I no longer use the rubber floor mat shims to eliminate the pulley wobble, I use a brass bushing. http://i60.tinypic.com/29axgzt.jpg Here is a link to the thread. http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1480506578 |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by faffi on 07/08/18 at 13:11:37 If one were to fit an 18in rear wheel with a 140/80 tyre, the swingarm will need to be extended a little. The rear pulley off the Z750 could help move the rear wheel where the tyre may not interfere with the cross-brazing, allowing the mentioned taller overall rear wheel.. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Armen on 07/08/18 at 13:56:22 As far as 18" wheel hitting the brace, I cut the brace a bit and added a second straight piece in front to make up for the rigidity lost. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by faffi on 07/08/18 at 14:41:08 Good idea. Ideally, one would probably want to have a different, lighter swingarm instead of the heavy steel item. A lighter wheel would also be beneficial. Then again, all these things make for an escalated cost and/or machining requirements. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by DragBikeMike on 07/09/18 at 23:03:50 Killer post Dave. Gives all the nitty gritty on the pulley conversion. The pictures are great. I'm surprised I didn't come across it when I first joined the forum and scanned through the old posts. You did a fabulous job on this one. Mahalo for the awesome info. |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Roadster on 01/29/21 at 19:31:45 Hi Team Suzuki Savage! This general idea of longer legs is great! Nothing has changed since my moped years. I did not drive my 2004 much before I took it apart and converted it to a sit-up-and beg -roadster of my liking but now with this 25 tooth mod, it is a very calm and collected steed in deed. 1st gear felt a bit long in the beginning but now I am fully used to this. The EN500 pulley was $12 on eBay including shipping and I found an Intruder bushing (as a backup - I did not need it. It has the same part number) for $25 with shipping. The HF drill press was on sale for $69 + tax 6% ( I should have bought a baby WEN for $10 more - the spindle on the HF had 1mm of play, needing some creative crimping - now it is not so bad but took me a day) and the drill press wise was $24+ tax, The HF 125mm angle grinder was $17 + tax, the cutting and grinding wheels I had and flat bar. Not so expensive and the souvenier drill press and grinder are mine to keep! Garage walls etc. have a gray hue from grinding - this is a budget build. The pulley's price included loose rivets on one side of its belt guide - I hammered the worn-out rivet ends flat and the pulley has been silent so far. I did this conversion somewhat differently, please feel free to comment. I took some pics in the process, see below. My lathe-for-the-poor does not reserve a picture, only the final product can be published with modesty, as in 'good enough'. The difference in my method from the previous is that I gained 4.5mm more spline width by turning the Kawa pulley around and instead of having to machine that sides of the pulley down to Suzuki's 15mm width from the 19 achievable, I cut off 4.5mm from the bushing that usually covers part of the splines. Then I only needed to machine off some 8mm from the new 'nut' side. As far as I can tell, the Kawa pulley is not 'handed' but behaves the same in reverse rotation as it does in normal rotation. In this Suzuki application, the Kawa's shaft locking method (two M6 bolts holding a toothed washer) is not used and Suzuki's locking method of bent ear of the toothed washer works just like on the old Suzuki pulley. The advantages of this method are quite clear, at least to me - 35-45% less machining work and 15-17% more spline width. I am not a machinist over basic angle-grinder-and-drill-press -level so this method is really a big advantage to me. The pulley shaft gasket bolts etc. need to be changed to low-profile ones anyway and the aluminum pulley cover needs some rib grinding no matter if the Kawa pulley is used in its narrow spline form or wide like proposed here. I don't have a lathe so I improvised one from HF products. Kids, do not do this at home -parameter is set here - you need your eyes and limbs for yourselves. Any machinist can do these cuts safely - the bushing is not made of particularly hard material but the pulley half needs some serious carbide bits - see the previous postings. I was able to shorten the pulley bushing by 4.5mm by using my lathe- for-the-poor with cutting disk. Then, the Kawa pulley fit in fine, albeit now wrong way. Full 19mm spline width of Savage is now available. I was able to cut the pulley's rear side down by 8mm with the same contraption, now it is the front side. My grind-work hides behind the toothed washer and nail polish. I call it the high-friction finish. The original toothed lock washer fits fine as I have about 1mm of the spline free for this, much less than the old pulley allowed but this works just fine - more spline for this purpose is a waste. I added some Locktite on the pulley shaft threads and stepped seriously on the rear brake and tightened the pulley nut hard with a breaker bar, as it was quite tight originally. Without this breaker bar or impact driver this would not have worked - out with the old or in with the new. You guessed - I don't have an impact driver. I hammered the lock washer over a corner of the nut and smeared some of my precious nail polish over the joint to see if they move. Please comment! I just got the bike registered so I will report any failures - but I think this works great. Speedometer is of course showing potatoes - I use the RPM meter only for now as I need 8% (10%?) reduction gear on the speedometer or one operated from front wheel. More likely like that... If you decide to use the same method that I used, please be careful and do this on your own risks and also, make your own measurements as I cannot guarantee the accuracy of my measurements. They worked for me but your mileage may vary as they say! Feel free to comment! Cheers! JJ |
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Title: Re: Kawasaki Pulley Conversions Post by Dave on 01/30/21 at 03:56:56 Good Work! Creative way to reduce the amount of work needed. I cut the pulleys in the "normal" direction as I guess I just never considered they could be flipped - Armen cuts them like you do and flips them around with the inside now being out. The demand for pulleys has dropped dramatically - I used to sell one every couple of months, and recently I have only sold one in six months. If you want to buy a pulley.........I currently have one pulley complete and in a box ready to be shipped - you better buy it now, as I am not likely to go back into production. I am enjoying the progress I have been making on my own projects! ;) |
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