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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1375320516 Message started by Bitterswede on 07/31/13 at 18:28:34 |
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Title: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Bitterswede on 07/31/13 at 18:28:34 Fun project with a 2001 Savage. 1960's Yamaha tank, 1960's Ward's Riverside/Benelli headlight, 1980's Honda 500 Interceptor chin fairing. Forks, swing arm, wheels and brakes are from 1990's Yamaha FZR600. Mono-shock is Yamaha R6, seat homemade Fiberglass. Exhaust is homemade mandrel bent 1-3/4" steel into 9" glass-pack and 3" turn-out. |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by engineer on 07/31/13 at 18:55:20 Nice job, I like it. Must have been a lot of work. Clever use of all those parts from different bikes. And a piece of a Montgomery Wards Riverside gets to live on a little longer. |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by paulmarshall on 07/31/13 at 22:36:33 Now that is beautiful. :o More pics please. |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/31/13 at 22:38:04 Manual decompression? Thats gotta be the most radical Savage build Ive seen,, Now that youve found this place, you have access to several guys who have done some pretty serious engine work. YOu sure put together an eclectic bunch of parts & came away with a cool lookin ride. Hows that thing handle? & what does it weigh now? |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by WD on 07/31/13 at 23:19:59 Sharp looking front sprocket cover, much cleaner than the stock piece. |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Bitterswede on 08/01/13 at 08:37:19 Thanks for the nice comments. I'd like to put up a project thread but I think I'm doing this wrong, maybe a little help for the newbie. I have more photos of the more challenging work and happy to share. Anyway, the inspiration is the Savage motor and the bike is a kind of tribute to the big AJS or Matchless singles but with more modern suspension, twin disc, mono-shock, etc. I love those old 60's Japanese tanks and have built a YZ490 powered Ninja 250 around a 60's Bridgestone tank (photo below). I understand the horsepower thing; the "Ninjaha" only weighs 200-LB and makes about 50-HP. It will get to 70-mph in a blink if you can keep the front down through first and second. But you know, there's no end to that race. At our Cafe Racers meet-up on Tuesday, one rider brought his 6-cylinder, 160-HP BMW, and of course there's always the Hyabusa legend. So, I'll let others fight that fight, and instead, happily ride my 30-HP Savage and listen to that beautiful rumble, knowing it will always start, and always get me home. The reliability of that stock motor is appealing. I know there's a couple things to do, cam chain tensioner, cylinder head oil leak, and when I have the top end torn down someday, maybe a moderate cam will go in. I dunno, we'll see. At this point, I want a ride that's unique, fun and reliable. I once pushed my XS 650 bobber 4-miles home.... whew. Now that I have the 22-cal long-rifle back fire eliminated, I'm pretty happy with the ride. I guess the weight at about 300-LB, the FZR legs are very nice and controlling, the R6 shock rebound damping is completely adjustable and even with the Savage rake the package has no ill handling and with the short forks and increased nose-down rake seems to turn just fine. Here again, I'm not a knee-dragger. I'll add a complete thread on the project but need a little help so I don't do it wrong. Thanks again for the kind remarks, here's the Ninjaha: Swede |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/01/13 at 09:32:56 If a guy wants to eliminate the potential problems, theres one more in there aside from needing a Verslavy. The clutch throwout is not an everyday problem, but it isnt exactly rare either. I Believe its sintered & some just fail. If I was keeping mine, It would get one made of steel, one piece. MIne broke, thankfully it was al low speed & only ruined a cam chain guide. |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by teabowl13 on 08/01/13 at 15:08:42 That's super sexy alright!! PLEASE post more pictures!! ;) |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Jiggyfly on 08/02/13 at 01:05:18 Any info on that fork swap.....FZR6 is exactly what I thought on out using Seems their the sleeper of many a fork swap! |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Jiggyfly on 08/02/13 at 01:05:51 & great bike, BTW |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Dave on 08/02/13 at 04:58:51 Looks like a fun bike......and one that will sure start a conversation wherever you go. As far as your build thread.....you might as just keep this one going. The best way to do the thread is actually not on this site, as the questions can make the thread jump around a bit. Braveteacher did his build thread on another site....and it was fun to watch unfold. http://suzuki-s40-ratbrat.weebly.com/index.html He also has a thread on this forum: http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1361844966/0 |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by ToesNose on 08/02/13 at 19:24:32 Very nice looking bike, innovative mixture of parts ;) |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by paulmarshall on 08/02/13 at 23:04:39 How easy was it to connect the Yamaha FZR600 swing arm? and how much room either side of the tyre is there? |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Bitterswede on 08/03/13 at 09:04:34 The fork swap was a lot easier than I thought; the key seems to be finding a donor fork that uses the same stem head bearings as the LS and the FZR does. There are web-published sources that list stem bearing cross-references but the LS stem bearings seem to be very common in mid-size Japanese bikes. You also might be able to vary bearing cup/cone sizes if the bearing size in the donor forks of your choice happen to be different than the LS. I'm not sure about this but have past experience buying industrial bearings and expect this might be possible. You just have to do the research. In my case, the FZR stem was about 9mm longer than the LS so I cut that much out of the stem in the middle and cut a 45-deg bevel on each piece. Then mounted the FZR T-clamps and forks, slid upper and lower clamps together to the correct LS dimension and tightened. I ran a long bolt through the hollow stem to aid in alignment, just long enough to tack-weld, then removed the bolt and fill-welded the stem and ground it flush in order to permit future lower bearing service. Of course you have to be comfortable with your welding as there are safety implications involved. However, if the stem were to part while riding, it seems to me with the upper and lower clamps secured to the fork tubes that the worse case might be some squirreliness in the front which should warn you to take a look. Anyway, the stem tubing wall thickness is about 4mm and carefully fill-welded should be just fine in my estimation and I am prepared to assume that risk. You have to make that decision for yourself. Another option could be to press the LS stem into the FZR lower clamp, I don't have the equipment for this and didn't want to pay for the service and there are other implications here involving the dimensions of the top triple clamp and nut-arrangement as the LS threaded portion is shorter than the FZR creating fitment issues with the FZR upper clamp... My approach used all FZR forks, triple-clamps, and stem parts and all I did was move the FZR bearings and clamps to match the LS stem dimension. With 200-300 miles on the machine there are no apparent issues. If I were antsy about it, I suppose I could pull it apart and take a look at the weld, but I'm comfortable the front end will not just fall off and riding is too much fun. |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Bitterswede on 08/03/13 at 10:04:41 I took a similar approach to the swing-arm as with the forks and mated the FZR rear-end components complete, at the LS swing-arm pivot. The FZR uses 530 chain and there are plenty of front sprocket and gearing options listed in this forum to make this a very easy part of the swap. Also, the width of the LS front pulley seems to provide plenty of space to shim the 530 front sprocket to match a wide variety of donor swing-arm/wheel assemblies. This also permits the use of all the FZR chain guide stuff and precluded the need to mess with wheel spacers and such. I am also very comfortable relying on Yamaha's engineering and know that rear-end was designed for a lot more HP than I will apply. Anyway, the LS swing-arm is not strong enough for a mono-shock and is extended to the left to clear the belt which is unnecessary with chain. Now the hard part: The LS swing-arm mounts with a smaller bolt outside the frame and the FZR inside. This is completely different which requires cutting off the front end of the FZR swing-arm and completely rebuilding that using only the pivot-ends of the LS swing-arm. There is an important alignment challenge involved plus a lot of 16-guage steel welding to box-in a new swing-arm front end to mate the FZR swing-arm to the LS swing-arm pivots ends. After careful examination, I decided that both the LS and the FZR swing-arm pivots were centered in their respective frames. Assuming the FZR swing-arm was not bent, I welded it to a piece of 3/8" steel, along with tabs to correctly locate the swing-arm pivot axis. Then I cut off the entire front end of the FZR swing-arm just ahead of the cross-brace. Since the LS uses a smaller swing-arm pivot bolt, I had to bush the tabs that I had welded in around the FZR swing-arm. This difference was 2mm in dia and I found the bushings at McMaster-Carr for a couple bucks. I sacrificed the LS swing-arm, cutting out just the little cups that take the swing-arm pivot bolt. I withdrew all the spacers from inside the LS frame swing-arm pivot and installed all of this on the FZR swing-arm axis tabs welded to the 3/8" steel sheet, using the LS swing-arm pivot bolt. I tightened this gently, making sure it was all centered with the remaining FZR swing-arm, also still welded to the 3/8" steel. So, now I had the LS swing-arm pivot ends squared, centered, and secured to a heavy 3/8" steel foundation and could proceed with rebuilding the front of the FZR swing-arm to mate the little LS pivot ends. I had cut the FZR swing-arm on a diagonal and made sure there was a lot of internal structure and a lot of overlap of my pieces to the FZR pieces. IOW, a lot of "diamond" overlaps, and few butt-welds. This did not take that long, really. Once I had it tacked-up solidly, cut it off from the 3/8" steel foundation and completed all the welding. Even though I did this slowly and split the welding action from side to side, the dimension between the swing-arm ends shrunk very slightly, maybe less than 1mm but it would not fit the LS frame. I threw the assembly over the front of my 6000-LB floor jack, repeatedly eased-in some pressure to spread the weldment and after 20-min of careful work, it fits perfectly. I have closely followed this bike for miles and it's rear wheel tracks straight and true. The bike turns very nicely and has no bad habits that would be clues to some misalignment. Surely it's not within GP-bike tolerance but I'm perfectly happy with it for my intentions and the R6 shock provides a plush and controlled ride which helps with that seat foam, fully one inch... Cheers. |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Bitterswede on 08/03/13 at 11:01:06 So, a little on the frame. I cut the back section off the LS from behind the swing-arm pivot to just behind the cylinder head stay and welded in a single back-bone. I left the engine solidly bolted into what was left of the frame for the duration of the build, using this as a method to help maintain alignment. You just have to stuff rags into intake and exhaust ports and cover the engine to protect from welding and grinding. My engine had very low miles so this project did not involve any engine work. I bent and spliced in a a piece of 1-1/2 square steel for a backbone with heavy gusseting on both ends, picking up the cut-off ends of the frame tubes and the swing-arm pivot tube. This allows the carb to stay where it belongs and I found a good rubber "Cobra" right angle elbow to turn the intake to the side for the air filter. Here's the link; http://www.purosil.com/cobra.html The smallest elbow fits the carb, you just have to find an air filter that works. I did some welding on the my air filter sleeve to make this work but the hardest thing seems to be that elbow. Maybe this will help someone out there. The shock mount is pretty straight-forward, I did not use any of the FZR linkage, aiming for simplicity and I sometimes think all that linkage may be as much marketing as anything else. After some experimenting, I had to move the lower mount aft a little but this set up works great. The seat struts are pieces of left over bicycle or motorcycle frame parts. The battery box is under the swing arm but there's not room here for the stock behemoth and I put in an over-sized Earth-X ETX18B Lithium-Ion battery laying on its side. It fits great and cranks the motor like a champ, even without the compression release and only weighs about 2-LB. All the wiring is under the tank and seat and inside the backbone, so very little wiring is visible. The rear-sets and controls come complete from the donor FZR600 that I found out in the yard at Bob's Used Cycle Parts in Phoenix, it's a great place for dreaming. The foot-peg mounts are kind of hard to describe, I think you just have to be creative here or buy the Ryca items. I welded 1/8" steel tabs to the frame tubes using the existing muffler mount tab as one tab, for example. To these I mount both the battery box and separately a cross-tube for the foot pegs. This cross tube is lower than ideal and I used bicycle pedal cranks to raise the peg height and this also clears the chain. Kick-stand is a bolt on item from some long-deceased Honda at Bob's. I just welded nuts to the lower frame tube on the LH side, seems to work fine after some adjustment to keep it from dragging in left turns. I still get sparks now and then, especially with a bump in the turn, like turning into my neighborhood. Enough already, I'm getting long winded. Here's a pic of the frame work. The FZR forks are already in, that was really easy. In this shot I'm using the LS swing arm to guess are shock mount location, etc. Cheers, Swede |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Bitterswede on 08/03/13 at 11:27:14 One more shot of the RH side. Loved the Rizzla+ color scheme, tribute to their sense of style, bikes you can easily pick out on the race course. Photo taken on the Bush highway close to Sagauro Lake. Visible here is the aluminum water bottle mounted to the backbone. Some think it's a nitrous bottle but instead, it's the engine breather. Plumbed that to this bottle with a hydraulic tank breather cap (it's 3/4" NPT). The bottle is filled with copper wool and will have to emptied some day. The mount was left over from the YZ 490 which had some sort of surge bottle plumbed in between the carb and reeds. Another marketing coup I suppose. Anyway, it provided a perfect mount for my breather. Cheers. |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Bitterswede on 08/03/13 at 11:34:50 One more, same spot different angle. Swede |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Bitterswede on 08/03/13 at 12:20:00 OK one more. I couldn't resist the signs. How can you be sure you're in Arizona? Click on the link to the picture and check out the signs. No parking anytime but you apparently can shoot as long as you're not close to buildings. There's a little resort just 100 yards behind me in this photo. LOL Swede |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by paulmarshall on 08/03/13 at 13:31:24 Wow thats alot of work. Here in NZ we would need to get that Certified before it could legally be ridden on the road. |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Bitterswede on 08/06/13 at 11:48:17 3D2C3821202C3F3E252C21214D0 wrote:
At what point would it be necessary to inform the authorities that you were modifying the bike? This bike was already titled and licensed; and as long as the frame serial number remains the same, I can replace a wheel, or an engine, or complete forks or just bolt on a new headlight and it is of no concern to the state. And what kind of expertise might a bureaucrat possess to enable them to assess the safety of any such modification? |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by paulmarshall on 08/06/13 at 12:31:55 69627F7F6E79787C6E6F6E0B0 wrote:
At what point would it be necessary to inform the authorities that you were modifying the bike? This bike was already titled and licensed; and as long as the frame serial number remains the same, I can replace a wheel, or an engine, or complete forks or just bolt on a new headlight and it is of no concern to the state. And what kind of expertise might a bureaucrat possess to enable them to assess the safety of any such modification?[/quote] Any bolt on part is not a problem however cutting and welding of the frame which changes the original design is a different storey. These sort of mods will be picked up at the 6 monthly WOF (Warrant of Fitness) test, if the vehicle is over 3 years old. :( |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Bitterswede on 08/14/13 at 19:47:25 Wow, that's unfortunate. In the spirit of your countryman, Burt Munro, we should be able to modify our rides. He cast his own pistons and set world speed records on cracked tires. So the legend goes. He's certainly part of my inspiration. Cheers. |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by paulmarshall on 07/31/14 at 13:32:25 2C273A3A2B3C3D392B2A2B4E0 wrote:
Hi did the Honda Chin Fairing fit easily? |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Bitterswede on 08/01/14 at 07:00:38 Hi, I got an email about your post, there hasn't been any activity on this thread for 11-months but I'm happy to respond. The Honda 500 Interceptor chin fairing fits quite easily. It's mounted from it's original holes in the top via the top front engine-mount and foot-peg bolt. This bolt is a little wider than the fairing but being plastic you could spread the fairing a little. Personally, I cut about a half inch off each side of the Savage engine mount to tuck it in with the engine side covers, and BTW that steel tube appears to be hardened, no way to saw it had to be ground off. Then on the right side I used the Savage muffler hanger tab on the frame with a little 90-deg bent piece of sheet metal for a bracket. On the left rear side I cut the tail off the fairing and then had to trim it by about a half inch for the diameter of the alternator housing. There is a gap on the RH side where the Savage header used to run, but after a while you stop seeing that. Maybe a good place for an oil-cooler... The bike runs strong, it's my commuter and I've put about 3,000 miles on since my last post. I love it and wouldn't change a thing. With that exhaust turn-out, riders stopped next to me tell me they can feel the blast. When I start it in the garage, it blows things around. A truly fun project and a great ride. Cheers, Scott |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by paulmarshall on 08/01/14 at 13:48:45 Thanks Scott. :) |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Albert Verdugo on 11/14/14 at 08:18:44 WOW! looks very cool! realy like the belly pan and the front lights. ANd changing the forks and add a monoshock, that is hard work! :D |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by inglourioushoko on 10/11/15 at 01:26:09 Awesome build. Really dig the mish-mash of different parts, along with that monoshock. Bravo |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by savagekidd on 06/12/16 at 23:17:20 I know this is an old post but wow, good looking fighters! ;) |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by norm92de on 06/13/16 at 16:10:53 Awfully nice1 A tremendous amount of work very nicely done. Yeah! |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Armen on 06/19/16 at 05:41:47 Nice work! Always nice to see someone go off the beaten path. Congrats! -Armen |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Honda-redrider on 09/29/16 at 20:56:27 I know this is an older thread but strong work! There isn't many ls650 motorcycles running around my area so I love seeing these builds. Great job! |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Ruttly on 09/30/16 at 06:48:18 Very nice , One of a kind , lots of hours , I'm jealous , don't think I like you ;D ;D ;D |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Dave on 09/30/16 at 08:10:59 426564647C69100 wrote:
The fellow that posted the build has not been around for about 1.5 years....likely he won't ever discover that you dislike him. |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Ruttly on 10/01/16 at 19:10:25 Think I told the same to Armen & smokin blue jokingly, the fact is I am jealous of their skills and creativity ! All 3 of them are so skilled it makes me sick . Thought me and my RYCA tracker are pretty cool , but maybe I just graduated from bike building kindergarten and my great bike build is still to come. Back school I go. I like big air cooled singles , I like the happy button , so I'm pretty sure I know what engine I'm gonna use. There are many very skilled builders here at SS , so jokingly I may not like them either. ;D But I will stand tall & proud , me & the RYCA are a force to contend with on the local twisties , see you there on your pretty show bikes and maybe someday I be riding one too ! I think the yz490 rig was also one I was planning was a it490 lower end,yz490 top end in a cafe style honda cb125 frame, plated for the street of course , super light & superfast and illegal as hell in CA !! |
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Title: Re: Projects: Rizzla+ Cafe Racer Post by Ruttly on 10/01/16 at 19:35:08 Dave, You are one of those builders I might not like too ! ;D ;D |
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