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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> The Cafe >> Advice/comments? (NBR) /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1294164114 Message started by PerrydaSavage on 01/04/11 at 10:01:53 |
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Title: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by PerrydaSavage on 01/04/11 at 10:01:53 Hi everyone … many of you, my friends and fellow Members here at suzukisavage.com, are aware that I’ve experienced significant upheaval in my personal life this past year … and since I seem to have hit an impasse, I thought I’d ask you all for your thoughts and kind advice? First a bit of background … my wife and I met 25 years ago and will be married for 23 years this coming April. One natural daughter (age 20), both of us semi-professional career people, owned own home, good social life, no substance, physical or emotional abuse of any kind. I thought that we had a pretty good relationship; never fought, rarely argued, still hung out together as “friends” and did the whole birthday, anniversary thing, etc., etc. We loved each other (or at least I did her). Last Feb., out of the blue, my wife gave me the; “I love you, but am no longer in love with you” speech. I immediately asked her what she wanted (freedom to be “alone”) and if there was anybody else involved (no) … That very day, she started to shut me out of her life and over the next 6 weeks it was a near total freeze-out with us occupying separate rooms in our home … practically zero communication, no discussion and no explanation from her. Those 6 weeks was pure torture for me, so in order to give her the “freedom” she said she wanted, I moved out … which saw me isolated from not only my home, but much of my life, including our daughter and most of our mutual network of friends. I even sold my S40 because my wife disliked motorcycles and I thought if she saw I was willing to make any sacrifice for her and our marriage that she would resume communication … Anyhow I lived alone in the “jail cell” apartment for the next 4 ½ months … my only human contact being my co-workers. Then this past July, a pal from my old neighborhood approached me and said that I was missed in the social circle and that I should consider approaching my wife to suggest that I buy her share of our home from her and move back in. One day later a woman contacted me claiming that she had spent several months trying to find out whom I was and that my wife had been having an affair with her husband, behind my back, since January. This person also claimed that her estranged husband had just purchased a house in my subdivision and that my wife was planning on moving in with him! I contacted my wife with the information of the alleged affair (which she tried to deny) and also the request that I buy her out, to which she readily agreed claiming that she had already arranged “alternative living arrangements” … only to have her write me back one day later asking if I would consider her buying me out as her plans had “fallen thru” (apparently her “fling” suddenly called it off as I later discovered) … I declined, took on a $100K debt to buy her interests and moved back home at the end of August. All was not rosy however … this was the home we built together and lived in as a family for nearly 23 years … now I was here completely alone (our daughter chose to move out to an apartment with her mother) with only the ghosts of my past and our old dog for company. I did see some of my pals every-now-and-again, but they are all family guys and so, frequently have other obligations and I am not one to impose myself or my problems on others. I have not seen much of my daughter these past several months (busy with college) … and in early November my old dog passed away. Needless to say this Christmas was very lonely indeed … the first ever in 50 years of life that I spent mostly alone … which leads me to my point … I have had a lot of time to think and have come to the conclusion that I have not even begun to move on with my life … I have been in either a state of shock or in a “holding pattern” since last February. I have not received any admission or apology from my wife for the alleged affair, or any explanation for her decision to abandon me and our marriage. I have asked for an explanation, but she refuses to address the subject at all. Without reasons I can’t make sense of any of this … I have been devastated to tell you the truth and feel totally drained … as if my very being has been hollowed out. I recently bought another motorcycle (that I could ill afford given my present circumstances) in the hopes that come Spring it might help drag me out of the doldrums … but I’m not holding my breath … I feel lost and miss my wife, daughter, my life and the sense of comfort and purpose that that gave me … I thank you all for bearing thru my post … I just felt a need to get it off my chest a little … sorry for being so long-winded ... all comments deeply appreciated ... |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by gerald.hughes on 01/04/11 at 10:35:43 Wow! I felt cold chills when I read your post. My wife and I have been married 43 years, almost all of our adult life. If she came home and told me that it was over, I don't know what I would do, but I would probably do it very badly. After giving it a lot of thought, I would just like to suggest, that the most important thing for you is to realize that it is not about you. It is about your wife. You are the same person that you were before she came to you with her announcement. Be the person that you are! Move on with your life. I know that sounds simple, but in reality it is. I had a much loved uncle who survived Auschvitz. I was seven when I first saw the number tattooed on his forearm and asked him about it. Over the years, we had many discussions about how you get past something like that. He had a wife, a good job, a daughter, and lots of friends. He told me. You let go of the past, and you get on with it. So, that is my lame advice. Buy a new Savage. Ride a lot. Enjoy the beautiful world that you live in. Become an active person, and see what happens. Get on with it. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by youzguyz on 01/04/11 at 10:59:22 Gerald pretty much said what I feel as well. You have freedom, but you don't know how to use it. Get out, get on with it. Go riding and find people in your area that like to ride as well. Please don't just sit there and be lonely. Don't feel guilty about the situation either. Sit back and ask yourself what you LIKE to do (or would like to do). Hang out in places where those things are done and meet new people. There are a lot of people in the world and all around you. No reason to be lonely unless you want to be. If you can, GET AWAY for a while. Get out of that house. You don't have any responsibility there right now (except work). Take a vacation if you can. Not so much because you need to get away, but because you need to NOT be there!! That is what I would do.. but, I'm not you either. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Boule’tard on 01/04/11 at 11:16:52 Perry, You have my most sincere sympathy. I realize these comments may seem like a trite pep-talk but, for what they're worth.. A couple of years from now it is very likely you will have a new relationship, and you will value that relationship far more than you valued the one with your wife toward the end of it. Sure, the security is gone now, but soon you will have it again, plus the "magic" that is so natural in new relationships and hard to maintain in old ones. I had a similar situation about 12 years ago. A surprise ambush from my wife, then I moved out and made all sorts of concessions, to no avail. Whatever I did, my wife would just ratchet up her demands and consider herself entitled to all prior concessions. The magic was gone and there was NO WAY to get it back, and she soon pissed me off so bad with her lies and theft, that I didn't WANT it back. I eventually took a small amount of cash for my interest in the house, and GTFO for good. I don't think keeping a property that you held jointly is a good idea. Those ghosts are there and that won't help you move on. Even getting out of that whole environment, I was still pretty upset. No dating or doing anything except working on my new house for 2 years afterwards, and stuck in misogyny. Other than the work I got done on the house, it was a bitter waste of life. Now it seems like I dodged a bullet. I would not trade any possible future with my 1st wife for the family I have now. It took forever for things to turn around, but eventually they DID turn around, much to my surprise. Now the loss of the first relationship seems like an investment I never thought I'd see a return on, but then it paid back 100-fold. Maybe the same will happen for you. In the meantime, I'd start a project. Restore an old bike, car, house or something. While you're working on it, some things will probably gel in the back of your mind (sure did for me, to the point where I felt stupid for not realizing the "surprise" had been coming). Plus, the physical activity tends to have a healing effect. Then after your subconscious works out exactly what happened, you'll never make the same mistakes again. That is how it worked out for me, and I wish the same positive outcome for you. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Serowbot on 01/04/11 at 11:42:24 5B594E5D50581254495B54594F3C0 wrote:
+1... especially that bit... You're still the same guy to me Perry... ;)... |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by PerrydaSavage on 01/04/11 at 11:43:19 4C415B424B5A4F5C4A2E0 wrote:
This is only something I have begun to realize ... all I wanted when my pal convinced me and when I bought out my wife's interest in our home was to get back some familiarity in my life ... to be where I thought I belonged ... reality though has been far different. That said, selling and moving now is not an option ... I am too far in debt and selling the house right now would not help financially. The place does need a LOT of work (we were putting off necessary renos/repairs to finance our daughter's education) ... only thing I can see is that over next 5 years, gradually fix it up, try and pay down some of the debt and then see what a sale might do? As for the Bike ... well, I have purchased an '07 Kawi ZZ-R250 and plan on Riding the snot out of it once Spring rolls around ... I just have to hope that I can maintain my freakin' sanity until then ... |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by verslagen1 on 01/04/11 at 11:49:12 Yep, married 15, divorced 5. 2 kids, now 15. They are my anchor, my parents and family also support. My only advice is to forget her, any explanation she can offer will not justify your anguish. Forgive yourself, she said you're boring. Boring is an old shoe that you've worn for 23 years, warm and protected. Exciting is a new pair, that pinches and blows out after a few months. Except yourself for who you are. No need to change. Once you stop walking around as half a person, your friends will come back. They are uncomfortable now because you carry a ghost with you. Loose the ghost. Yes you will miss your old shoes, and they were good when you had them, but you stepped in crap and it was time for them to go. I miss my old house, yet because it's her's now, I am uncomfortable when I'm there. I have a new house now, and something I couldn't have with her, a dog. So go out and get a new one. And give yourself some time. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Angie on 01/04/11 at 12:26:43 All I can add is that you are not responsible for your wife's behavior and/or feelings. You didnt do anything wrong to cause this, she chose to betray you and end your marriage. I dont think its in any way fair for a spouse to blame their unhappiness on the other, to me it is just a way to justify their cheating. We are all responsible for our own happiness in life, though of couse the actions of others affect us. You cant control what has happened to you, but you do have a choice about how you go on from here. Some days its just going to be a matter of putting one foot in front of the other and getting through the day. It will get better, but I think you need to accept that your life as it was is over. There is no getting back to normal, everything has shifted and it will take you some time to get past the hurt and start to heal. Keep the lines of communication open with your daughter as much as you can, and even though she deserves it dont bad mouth your wife. It will just make your daughter want to defend her mom. There isnt any one way that will help you heal and move on, what works for one person doesnt work for another. At first it will be trial and error, taking those baby steps forward. Your life may never be the same, but that doesnt mean that it cant be good again. But you can't move forward while you are looking behind you, well you can but you tend to run into alot of walls that way. Get another dog, start marking off the days on the calander until spring, and don't ever forget that you are not alone. We got your back. :) |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Boule’tard on 01/04/11 at 13:15:32 7A4F5858534E4B794B5C4B4D4F2A0 wrote:
If a new property is out of the question, you can still change the character of the one you have. Since it needs renovation anyway, maybe you can bust down a couple of walls and reduce the number of bedrooms so it seems like less of an "empty nest" and more of an awesome batchelor pad. I also think taking a vacation and stepping up your riding is good advice. There are tons of divorce stories on advrider.com, some guys go nuts and hit the road with nothing but bike and gas money, others just enjoy the opportunity to do more riding without having to beg and feel guilty about it. The comments on those threads are usually envious (albeit from guys with romantic beer goggles on) but the stories are still fun to read and can be inspiring. http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=310834 http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=569453 |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by thumperclone on 01/04/11 at 13:28:12 time for a road trip see if reelthing can take you fishin in the gulf... |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by babyhog on 01/04/11 at 13:29:42 Well, I agree with most of the comments so far. I was on your wife's end of this kind of mess in my past life. I was the one who left a wonderful man, after 11 years of marriage. I still don't fully understand it myself, so I can tell you to accept the fact that your wife probably won't ever give you an answer either. I "thought" that there was more was out there for me... blah, blah, blah. Luckily, he and I both moved on. He is remarried with 2 more kids, and seems to be happy. I never had any more children, but now have 3 step-children and a husband that I love with all my heart. People speak of a mid-life crisis, and I guess that's what I had. In reality, my life was fine. But it is fine in a different way now. Because as good people, we move on and make it fine. I know you will too. And as Angie said, we got your back if you need us. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Wolfman on 01/04/11 at 13:41:23 No your not the same man perry. You've had a big part of your life yanked out from under you, an anchor of stability you might say. The 'anchor' pretty much stabbed you in the back and left you adrift. You got two choices. Wallow in your self pity as you 'drift' through life or set yourself a new course and move on. The second choice is always the better choice but it's also the harder one. It's also the healthier one as well. You got to dig in and move on, keep in touch with YOUR friends, do the things YOU like to do and restructure YOUR life to suit YOU! Play with the house as you can, remodel it to YOUR taste. Ride when you can,GET OUT and DO THINGS! Keep your mind occupied. AVOID the bar scene and alcohol like the plague...at least untill your comfortable with things. It's root hawg or die time, was'nt your fault and you can't dwell on the past. It's time to make a new future for yourself and move on. As for your daughter she will come around. She's busy working on her life and this will of made her a lil afraid of takeing sides to much and she may well be a bit stand offish for awhile...but your still DAD. Yeah it hurts, been there done that(divorce). When you make that turn and crack the throttle on your new road in life things will get infinitely better the farther you leave that big bump in the road behind. It will take time but time eventualy heals all wounds...so to speak. Noone died, noone went to jail, you just went a different way then your partner. It's time to find a new path and quit looking back, history is history. Can't worry yourself to death over something you had no control over and can't change now. You never know, she may realise what she had and come back in time. Then you got to make a REAL hard decision. Stay your own course or try to work things out. He!!, i was divorced about 10 years and the ex has been back liveing with me for the last 14. Sometimes wish id run like he!! and other times kinda glad i took her back. But in the end there's only two choices, lay down and die or move on. Make YOUR choice. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by LostArtist on 01/04/11 at 13:49:01 one day at a time, and something very important, find something, anything, a hobby, write a novel, anything that you like and get involved in it as best you can within your means, finding something that you love and getting involved with that is a great way to show yourself that there's something out there for you, and you'll meet people! and remember, it's okay to be down here and there, you've been through a lot, so you are normal. it's good |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by bill67 on 01/04/11 at 14:25:08 I don't have much advice,But don't sell your house thats the house your kids grew up in and will always be home to them. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by PerrydaSavage on 01/04/11 at 15:02:47 Knowing that you all have my back humbles me greatly ... I thank each and every one of you from the bottom of my heart ... your advice is sound too and I thank you for that as well. No fears of me hittin' the booze ... I take a social drink, but have NO desire to go bottoms up ... have seen the destruction alcohol wrought on my youngest brother's life. Babyhog ... your admissions and comments are honest and brave ... and I find them very interesting in light of the fact that I am trying to find some closure, some reasons for what happened so that I can make sense of things and move on. You are probably right in that my wife hasn't given me any explanation because she may not know the reasons herself? So, it is possible that I will end up having to accept that fact ... The hurt I feel is mixed with a good dose of fear ... hurt because I was abandoned (notice I didn't use word betrayed) by the person who meant the most to me in the entire world ... something I would have NEVER done to her ... the fear comes from having to face the world alone at age 50 without my partner and best friend ... All that said, I can hold my head up with the knowledge that I have done nothing wrong here ... even though it is hard not to blame oneself when you are looking for those elusive reasons ... I cannot wait to get out on the Bike again ... to feel the road under my wheels and to seek out some new friends ... |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Ed L. on 01/04/11 at 15:51:49 I have to agree with Boule'tard, redo the house and make it your's. It is a project that should get your juices flowing again. How about getting a dog or a cat for company. A pet beats the heck out of coming home to a empty house. Healing takes time |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by John_D FSO on 01/04/11 at 17:30:58 A lot of very good advice here. I've been in a similar situation, and it all applies. I did the change of scenery thing, which was easier in my case because we rented, but like people said, since you're planning on doing some "fixing up" of the house anyway, have some fun with it, make it over to your style. Get out, do things, meet people. Gotta confess, the "meet people" thing is kinda hard for me, but that's more due to my work schedule and most of the world being asleep when I'm awake. ;D But as trite as it sounds, things do get better. As happy as I thought I was with her, when I look back at the last couple years together, and how happy I am now, I realize just how unhappy I was, and how much better of I am now. For one thing, I could've never afforded a bike when I was with her, so that's a plus! :D So while it's not good riding weather right now, maybe work on the house (I know, not exactly a fun "hobby"), so you can have some of it done when the good riding weather rolls around, and then hit the road!http://i626.photobucket.com/albums/tt347/redneck72102/Avatars/VroomVroom.gif Hope some of that made sense... :-? |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Skid Mark on 01/04/11 at 17:49:38 Perry: First off my sympathy goes out to you. I can't imagine how low you must feel over this. Second, this forum has again impressed me on how well it's members respond to a fellow who needs someone to discuss a life wrenching situation. Third, me 2 cents: Keep busy on things you need to do and want to do. You love biking so go for it. It is now your life without someone holding you back. Get out and live it the the best you can. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by kimchris1 on 01/04/11 at 18:38:46 Perry, big hugs fella. You have been given some great advice from previous posts. Here is my for what it is worth. After my first husband decided he wanted out after 24 years, I found that it was then my chance to find out who exactly I was. I found out I was more than a daughter, sister, mother, aunt, grandmother and friend to many. I found my own likes and dislikes. I no longer had to please anyone before pleasing myself. This is now your time to do the same. Yes it takes time and some days will be easier than others. Yet you can do it and will survive. Many of us have and have gone on to find greater loves and lives. Do whatever you enjoy when you want and don't feel guilty along the way. Were all here and all you need to do is turn on the computer and find us.. Best wishes to you and I am waiting to read of your new adventures.. Hugs to you.. :) kim |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Boofer on 01/04/11 at 21:35:55 Perry, I do not know you well enough to give advice. I am a man. Men want to fix you and move on. (Not a bad thing, but pretty rough.) Notice the women repeat your problems and actually feel your pain. No offense to the men, because they have given some great ideas. They just didn't get to know you first. Us men just think we are mostly alike and our idea will work for you because it worked for us or someone we know. I am Type II Bi-polar and have been a support group facilitator. You will suffer some of the same symptoms and disorder of the mentally ill. My advice is to hang tough and get some professional outside help. This can usually had for free on a weekly basis in a support group. We are here for you. The fact that you asked is GREAT. You want to go on and figure this out. Keep asking and choose carefully from our "fixes". When you get a backlash in a fishing reel, you start picking around the edges. You can't dive into the middle, but, rather you slowly work from the edges to the inside. The huge problem you start with slowly begins to get smaller. One thing that is very effective in support groups where we know the person on a personal basis is much like dignosing an engine problem. We make a list with pen and paper of what might help you. 10-20 things. Then pick out the ones that actually seem doable at this time. Move slowly. You are grieving. Success will come. You are grieving VERY much like one who has lost someone to death. The very least time to get better from that is about a year for most. Suzuki guys and girls, I hope you see what I mean. No disrespect. You have great ideas, but we can't fix Perry--we can be here for him. Our ideas give him a broad range of solutions. He just has to pick some and try them, but eye to eye contact with someone who can be there for him would be great if he can arrange it. Perry, get on the net and type in support groups for your area. It is amazing to see people change in as little as two sessions...not by talking, but just listening to others with the same problems. I don't know it all, but I am speaking from experience in helping those who hurt. And it does hurt. You have a big problem, but there is even bigger help out there. You have started right. You don't blame, you're not trying to be right or get even. You have the right attitude. You can do it. Boofer |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Boofer on 01/05/11 at 03:54:50 Perry, Just went back first thing today and read other's comments with less physical pain than I had last night. I was too hard on the guys, but I think you all understand. Skills for fixing life problems are like fixing mechanical problems. You start with what you have and build on it. I still say list what you think is doable from the Forum list and your own. People who think no one cares these days should read these replies. Boofer l |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by babyhog on 01/05/11 at 05:46:41 I don't think Boofer was hard on anyone. We all know that there will be many suggestions... that's the point! I personally think "therapy" only works if the person believes in it. I have seen it work for others, but don't really believe in it for me, so I never tried it. This place is about as close as I get to therapy. LOL Perry, you have to figure out what works for you. Ideas are just a place to start. Maybe someone will bring up something you hadn't thought of. Maybe you can try something new. Something you've maybe wanted to do but the ex didn't like, or wouldn't do with you. That's a possible way to meet someone that you wouldn't otherwise have had the chance to meet. Personally, I loved going to Lowe's when I was single. ;) |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by prechermike on 01/05/11 at 06:26:18 It seems like everyone has some advice and the truth is, Perry (or whoever) needs to think about it and decide what is going to work best for them. My advice is to take care of yourself, put yourself in the best position to deal with whatever comes and always conduct yourself in the best manner possible, you never have to apologize for doing the right thing. I am thankful for a couple of things in this post, one that Perry has opened up and sought help. That is always the first and usually the hardest step. So good for you, Perry! Also, I’m thankful for all the replies and input that others have. Some have been through very similar situations and can offer advice as a veteran, others have observations and still others can simply cheer from the sidelines. So good for you, those that responded. Hang in there Perry. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by T Mack 1 - FSO on 01/05/11 at 07:41:13 Perry, Sorry for the loneliness. I didn't get married till I was 34. I worked off-shift for many years and that sort makes dating hard. I had many lonely Christmas mornings. But, always went to "family" at Holidays. Brothers, sisters, aunts, uncles, etc etc..... There is some good advice about redecorating the house. Make a nice "man-cave" in there somewhere. Only advice I would give is keep your daughters rooms untouched. (I thought you were the one that had an adopted child too??????) Maybe throw a twin bed in there but that's it. It sort of keeps it theirs. Does the daughter know the whole story? If not, I would suggest that you have someone else tell her. Coming from you might get the story twisted in her mind. As for your social life...... Join a local club. Maybe one of the service clubs like the "Lions" or some other volunteering organization. Or, maybe a motorcycle club. Good Luck, T Mack. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by PerrydaSavage on 01/05/11 at 08:08:09 Again, I can't thank you all enough for your kind words ... re-affirms what I've always felt about the people here at suzukisavage.com ... the very BEST folk I've ever had the pleasure of being associated with! Yes T Mack I do have a semi-adopted daughter as well ... originally from Bangkok, age 21 and she moved out to attend college a couple of years ago ... still in contact a couple of times a year. As you suggested, Daughter #1 (natural daughter) room will be staying as-is ... who knows when she may want it again?! I really haven't charted a course yet ... as I mentioned in an previous post, I am still just dealing with my life's upheaval on a day-to-day basis. I know that eventually I will have to think beyond tomorrow though ... I don't think that I am ready yet to wade into the "dating pool" ... I was never a "serial dater" even when I was a young fellow, instead preferring the occassional steady G.F. ... so I guess I am kinda unprepared for the dating scene after being in a committed relationship for the past 25 years? One potential area that I see for offering opportunity for reacing out socially might be my part-time gig as a Motorcycle Training Program Instructor, which is scheduled to start up again come the end of April ... every weekend 'til Sept. there will be a fresh bacth of students ... all sharing a common interest of mine! Someone mentioned earlier that I am still in a "grieving" process ... interesting way of looking at what I am experiencing ... it was only the other day that a co-worker said to me that in some ways what I am experiencing might have been easier for me had my wife suddenly died in an accident or something. At first I was shocked to hear him say that (I would NEVER wish that that had happened instead ...), but upon reflection, maybe he has a point ... this is something like a sudden death, only less final? |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by buttgoat1 on 01/05/11 at 09:29:08 Perry, I am glad for you that you are able to open up about such a painful experience. I am surprised at the number of similar stories out there, I too went there and have the T shirt.......... Yes, it is a grieving process, and an actual death might be easier to deal with because this was a selfish, concsious choice on her part to break up your family. Time does help, I read that it takes 1 month/year of relationship to get over a breakup, your mileage may vary. I learned a lot about myself and did some growing also. I think the best thing I got out of it was an improved relationship with my kids. My daughter wrote me a letter saying I was a good dad before but was a better dad after. That doesn't make it all better, but it was something positive out of it. Focus on improving your relationship with your daughters, they know you and even though they are older, they still need the stability that only you can provide, since your ex only seems to be concerned with herself. You may never get closure from her, I know I beat myself up a lot because of the things i did or did not do, I was not the perfect spouse, but neither was she. We did the best we knew how to. Ultimately, love is a choice and she chose not to. Take what you learn from this and you can become a better man. It is good to do things for yourself, but doing things for others is far more rewarding. Try some volunteer work, I got more active in Church and my kids. Stay strong, we are here for you. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Angie on 01/05/11 at 09:47:22 40395975777F25140 wrote:
I have to respectfully say that I dont agree with this part. You dont "owe" your daughter an explanation. What happened was between you and your wife, and it should stay there. I've been through that with my husbands ex wife. She went on and on to the kids about things they had no business knowing, tried to paint a bad picture of their dad, etc. We took the high road and chose not to discuss it with them. Years later now the "kids" look back and realize that all their mom was doing was trying to win them over to her side and that says alot more about their mom than it ever did about their dad. Im not saying that you should refuse to discuss it with her, I just mean that I dont see anything to be gained from giving her details. Then she will feel like she has to choose sides, and thats no place for a daughter to be. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by drharveys on 01/05/11 at 10:32:54 I guess I'll check in late -- you have my sympathy, Perry. There's not a lot to be said that hasn't already, so keep your head held high, take some time to grieve and to heal, and take solace that sometimes the relationship dies before one of the participants. Be strong, and you will come out of this in decent shape. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by buttgoat1 on 01/05/11 at 11:21:28 I am afraid I have to disagree somewhat with Angie on this point. You should talk with your daughters, don't bash their mom, let them know that she made a decision, it is ok to be angry about how it affected everybody else, but is OK to forgive her and continue to love her. You don't have to go into sordid details or be ugly about it. They girls were old enough to know how things really were in the house, my ex tried to tell my kids I was abusive, but they knew better even though they ranged from 6 to 11. They will probably appreciate the honesty and feel relieved that you don't expect them to take sides, but instead to have a relationship with their mom. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by babyhog on 01/05/11 at 11:35:43 That part all depends on the child, I think. Age, maturity, involvement, and how they will handle it come into play. Tell them only what you think they can handle. AND how the other half is going to talk to them about it too, is a factor. Everyone has the right to defend themselves if someone else is trashing them. DO WHAT'S BEST FOR THE CHILD. No matter how hard. My current husband will occasionally say something bad about his ex to their kids. As much as I despise that wicked b!tch, I still caution him to not do that. The kids are older now, and understand, and know how she is anyway, but its still not good. I don't think Perry is in that boat, luckily. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by PerrydaSavage on 01/05/11 at 12:12:19 I would never criticize, demean or otherwise talk negatively about my wife to either of my girls, neither would I or have I done that to anyone else since all this went down 10 months ago ... I do not agree with what she's done and wish with all my heart that it didn't happen, but you don't talk smack about someone you love and care about. I'm not a religious person, but the vow love, honor and respect, for better and worse 'til death do part, I took seriously 22 years ago and still do ... I will discuss the situation with my daughter(s) one of these days when they are ready. Ironically last summer after a visit with #1 daughter, she mentioned to her Mom that she was worried about me and was visibly upset ... next day wife emails me saying, "How dare I upset our daughter" ... like I did it to get at her or something????????? |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by odmanout on 01/05/11 at 14:01:38 I just know I will get stomped on for this, but if your are angry at her (and I would be) get an 11 by 14 picture of her, hang it on the wall, and throw darts at it. After you have worked out your anger, take it down and throw it away. This will symbolize the end of the grieving process and will make you fell a whole lot better! Just don't let your daughter see it. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by PerrydaSavage on 01/05/11 at 17:35:47 I would never stomp ya for that opinion odmanout ... similar advice has been given me by others ... fact is, I've been told that in order for me to move on I WILL have to get angry at some point ... strangely that's an emotion I haven't experienced ... I've felt shock, numbness, sick to my stomach, fear, uncertainty, self-loathing, bone-crushing loneliness, loss, grief, apathy and probably a few other negative emotions since last February ... but anger hasn't been one of them? I honestly dunno what that sez about me ... |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by mick on 01/05/11 at 18:04:12 As most know I have been married 6 times ,and I have never bad mouthed any of them,I married them and loved them all,if I bad mouthed them it would show I didn't like them to start with. I'm afraid and a little ashamed to say that none of them left me,it was always me doing the leaving,so in that regard I can be of no help to you.Get out and party hearty,you have alot to offer. And don't forget rule 1 ,use it or lose it. I'm not giving advice I'm only telling you what I would do. every morning get ready for work like you are going on a date, brush teeth and gargle after breakfast,shave use a cologne, try a new hairstyle. buy a couple of new suits ,a dozen new ties ,highly polished shoes,I am told that all women look at guys shoes to make sure they are not down at the heel. Always buy the best YOU can afford in clothing. teach yourself to cook at least two gourmet meals, become a wine snob (optional) at least know what wine goes with what,And always go for the best looking gal you can see , who knows if your ex sees you out with a real sexy gal ,she just might come back, but this time make her beg a bit ;) |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by John_D FSO on 01/05/11 at 22:21:31 083D2A2A213C390B392E393F3D580 wrote:
Not feeling angry doesn't seem all that odd to me. I don't remember feeling particularly mad at my ex at the time, aside from the fact that she didn't have the decency to cut me loose before she started taking the next model for test drives. >:( Mostly like you said it was just shock and queasiness and so on. To this day, the closest I've come to actually telling her off was to tell her that I hoped her and her new boyfriend treated each other the way they'd treated their spouses (both had committed adultery). Satisfied my need to vent without losing my temper, and for once I left her speechless! :D Yeah, it'll likely take a while for life to get back to normal, took me quite awhile to realize it wasn't the end of my life, and that I could actually have fun without her. Finding a hobby or charity or whatever to help fill time helps a lot. In my case it was OT at work, which wasn't the best thing, but it took my mind off stuff. The point of this rambling? I forget, but anyway, life goes on, and from looking at this post, you gotta lot of people to help you out, or just lend an ear. [smiley=thumbsup.gif] |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by PerrydaSavage on 01/06/11 at 00:30:33 mick my man, you remind me of my father-in-law ... married 4 times and working on the fifth! I do appreciate your input though ... and not bad-mouthing your Exes is a class act IMHO. As for the whole "puttin' on the ritz" as far as attire and stuff ... well, lets just say that when it comes to clothes, it's comfort all the way for me ... I'm a seriously laid-back, casual, "t-shirt and jeans kinda guy" ... prefer hikers and motorcycle boots to shoes. As I pointed out in a previous post, I've never been exactly "forward" with the ladies either! LOL!! New hairstyle?!! ... that's very likely near impossible at this point in my life! LOL!! John (I see you are a FSO too) ... like you, my wife didn't have the decency to cut me loose before taking test drives either ... she's now on her second "beau" since last Feb. I like the line you used on your Ex and her boyfriend ... hope you don't mind if I file that one away for possible future plagarism? |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Boofer on 01/06/11 at 07:59:40 Perry, I really appreciate the fact that you seem even tempered. Your wife may claim your daughter and even take her. I didn't get her age. Your wife is not being the caring, responsible, adult. Your daughter needs to know who is doing right. You need to be that person. Any attempts at revenge just make you look small. I have been married to the first, same, and only one for 34 years. And no, I don't roll over at the first sign of agression. I am the guy who whipped bullies in school for picking on the weak. You have my admiration for trying to do what is right. You have good instincts. Go with them. Your children need, at any age, to know they have a secure family. Be the caring, loving parent, even though it hurts. I have a friend who is 40 years old. She has three daughters and is dying with Mesothelioma. Husband left. Her sister's son wrecked his truck and is paralyzed from the chest down. All this plus driving from Ms to Tx for cancer treatments. We have been helping her at home. I am due for an MRI today after 30+ yrs of severe back pain. Right foot quit last week--just don't work. I would love to have surgery and get well, but I know better. Been here before. Severely depressed. I know a month from now, I'll look at this in a different light. Life ain't fair. But it does have its moments. God bless you. I'll try to check back in when I can. Onward, upward, forward. Don't retreat into hate. Boofer |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/06/11 at 09:38:32 I dont agree that in order to be done with an event in life that was wrongly put on us, we must at some point get angry. Anger is poison, the least amount you can have in life, the better. Psychologists dont know anything, really, they think they do & theyve convinced the masses they do. There are somethings that work & are true but they dont translate into some overall picture that the shrinks have all figured out. We are all different. You be you. Youre cool. Stay that way. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by PerrydaSavage on 01/06/11 at 14:26:41 Jeeze Boofer ... it is true that no matter how bad ya think your story is, there's always someone else who has it worse ... I hope that things work out for you too my buddy! BTW Boof, my (natural) daughter is 20 yrs old, so is an adult and free to make her own choices. She has chosen to live with her Mom. I totally respect that and also realize that she finds it difficult being around me much these past months because she finds the situation weird and I'm really not "functioning" properly yet ... Justin, Boofer ... agreed, anger is a short-term gratification emotion for the most part ... I can probably count the number of times in my life that I have actually been angry on one hand. Neither am I a vengeful person; revenge doesn't interest me. I am not perfect though, I do have my personality quirks (just like everyone else), but I really am not into confrontation for it's own sake. I do value, loyalty, honesty and respect ... the 3 core values of mine that seem to have been trampled thru all of this? All that said, I am a forgiving person ... I have never been able to hold a grudge ... I love my wife unconditionally and would forgive her if she'd give us a chance ... but she is stubborn and has a lot of pride, so that is unlikely ... which is a real shame. I also agree that most Psychologists are full of B.S.!! LOL!! |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by runwyrlph on 01/06/11 at 15:33:34 any chance she'd go to counseling with you? you obviously still love her - if she can get herself straightened out in the head and change the behavior - is there anything done you could not forgive? i know it doesn't usually work that way, but i think reconciliation should be the "best case scenario". - but she's got to change! i'm not trying to preach to you! i can't imagine how painful this has to be - just wondering if it's an option that could be considered? |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by verslagen1 on 01/06/11 at 17:20:45 63746A6464687E070 wrote:
Been down that road, and what's been said is true... "last toll before exit". Quote:
Quote:
It might help if SHE went to a psychologists, but as a couple... I doubt it will help. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by John_D FSO on 01/06/11 at 22:57:20 7B4E5959524F4A784A5D4A4C4E2B0 wrote:
Feel free to use the quote, I was fairly proud of it at the time. ;D A lot of coworkers and friends told me they were surprised I handled it as well as I did in fact. I say coworkers, because she worked at the same company as me, same department too, only in the office. And her new flame was her boss, our supervisor! ::) If I'd only had a dead dog, they coulda wrote a country song about me! :D Nothing wrong with dressing comfy, I rock the t-shirts and flannel shirts most of the time. Hairstyles? Heck, I had a mullet up until about 4 years ago :P (all of it's long now-enjoy it while I got it!). I figure if a woman doesn't like me just because of my clothes or car or whatever, she's too superficial for my tastes. 'Course I'm not exactly a ladies man, so might not be the best advice to follow! :-? |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by PerrydaSavage on 01/07/11 at 03:22:19 Counciling was one of the first things I suggested after she dropped "The Bomb" ... got an emphatic "NO" ... have since read on a few of the many websites devoted to marital break up, infidelity, mid-life crisis, etc. that 99% of the time a refusal by the walk-away spouse to engage in relationship counciling means that they are afraid of being "talked out of" their decision to end the relationship (which means that they may have doubts about their decision) or, they are already engaged in another relationship that has not been disclosed (meaning they are afraid of being found out and then having to answer questions about "why" they decided to have an affair in the first place). Not going to counciling allows the leaving spouse to walk away without actually having to face what they've done IMHO ... As for reconciliation ... she came to me late last July and actually brought that up (it was immediately after she and her affair called it off) and at her suggestion, we had planned to attend a rock concert together the following weekend ... ironic because we met at a rock concert 25 years ago and continued to enjoy live music events together right up until a month or so before the split ... however a day or so before we were to go to the show, out of the blue, she called the "date" off and the ice curtain was lowered again and has not been raised since ... |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by babyhog on 01/07/11 at 05:08:57 Have either of you actually filed for divorce? (I assume that is something that you have to do in Canada too). |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by PerrydaSavage on 01/07/11 at 08:06:44 No babyhog ... neither of us has filed for divorce ... in fact the word has yet to be mentioned between us. Here in Newfoundland most divorces are "no-fault" meaning all joint properties, assets, debts and the like are split 50/50 ... if child custody and/or child support isn't an issue. A divorce can be granted and issued by either partner after a legal separation of one year, non-contestable by the other party. Up here, you cannot legally argue infidelity, irreconcilable differences or anything like that as far as I know ... the cause of the split is legally irrelevant ... |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by piglt on 01/07/11 at 09:03:21 Haven't been on this site for a few days so haven't been "keeping up" I'm pretty much going through the same thing. I know it's not easy but it's just a fact of life now. Luckily my case is a little different. wasn't anyone else involved. Mine is dealing with some serious depression problems. At first it was shock, pissed, how dare you, all of it. Now it's just a fact I have to deal with. A few things I did that didn't change any thing but did help was I made sure people knew what was going on. Got a little sympathy from friends and family but they also understood what was going on. Second, I changed my house, his junk out, mine in. His 8 deer heads came off the living room wall, all of his turkey tails, his phesants, all laying on the basement floor. Gun cabnits got covered with sheets. My photos that I took were blown up framed and put up. His curio cleared out and all of my antique dishes came out of the closet and put out for show. Got rid of his sofa that he loved and got a totally different one His "junk" is pretty much shoved into one area of the house that I don't have to see on a daily bases. He can come and get it whenever. Basiclly I made "our" house my home. It does help!! His VStar Raider came out of the best parking spot in the garage, and shoved in between the tool box and the jeep and mine is in front in the "best" spot. Deleted all the pictures of him off of my camera and computer, number off of my cell. Pretty much everything he liked about this place no longer exist. When he said something about it I told him that this was my house now and he didn't like it he can either move in and change it back, or get himself a house just like this one and do anything he wants with his stuff. Our dog life's can probaly be counted in months instead of years and when I have to put him down he won't be called, he dumped on the dog too! But he will be called once it's over and down with. maybe. Bought a friend for the one cockatiel "we" had. Now "I" have two. Little things can make a difference. Good luck I know it's not easy but life can go on ;) |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by babyhog on 01/07/11 at 10:05:54 053027272C3134063423343230550 wrote:
Interesting. Sounds pretty easy to get divorced. Laws here have changed some over the years. One has to file, then you get a court date to meet with a family law master, then he grants the divorce, if there are no objections, etc. Papers are filed with the court and entered into record. My divorce was fairly easy in that regard. Over in about 10 weeks. My current husband's divorce from his first wife took 18 months! Different county, so the court dates were further apart each time. And every time, she had some complaint, something else she wanted, anything to drag it out. It was a nightmare. (He thought they were divorced the first time we went out, only to find that she showed up at a court date "after" he had already talked to the judge, and she "cancelled" the proceedings) Nowdays, here, if there are children from the marriage, parenting courses are mandatory and required by the state. I think marriage counseling may be mandatory before someone can file too, but I'm not positive of that. Anyway, how do you determine the "legal seperation of one year"? Is there a paper to document when that is? Or do you use the date that you last lived together? February isn't far away. At that point are you just legally divorced without any court documents? Or will she have to go to someone and have it court-ordered? Maybe you need to ask her about it. You need to open some dialogue with her. Good or bad, you need the outcome... me thinks. Hang in there buddy. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by PerrydaSavage on 01/07/11 at 10:27:21 piglt ... I am very sorry to hear about your maritial troubles too ... you seem to be handling it quite different than I though! babyhog ... here in Nfld. the legal separation date is usually the last date the couple lived together as a consentually married couple ... in March, my wife can serve me with divorce papers if she so wishes and then it's legally over and done with. A court date could be set, but I don't even have to show up to make it legal ... or our situation could be like that of one of my pals ... his wife of 6 years ran out on him back in '06 ... both have other live-in partners now yet they still haven't divorced ... they just live separate lives :o ! My wife's profession is that of a certified Legal Assistant (essentially same as Para-legal) and worked in the area of family law for a number of years ... so she knows all of the loopholes and could if she is so inclined, take me to the cleaners ... ::) |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by verslagen1 on 01/07/11 at 11:29:38 Quote:
The definition of date of sparation may vary, but in california, it doesn't mean you have to live in separate locations. So as soon as you become consentually separated, the clock is rolling. If she's agreeable, get it now. My X was in a hurry to get it done and aggreeable. A year later she looses her job. The settlement would be a lot different if it were conducted today. ;D |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Boofer on 01/09/11 at 00:52:39 Perry, It is 2:30 AM here in the South. I am full of muscle relaxers, oxycodone, ice cream and chocolate syrup. Life is good. My dr's nurse called Friday and said I "Flunked" the MRI. Then she laughed and told me they finally found something worth going after. I have been suffering for years with such a mess that no doctor could locate a specific place to gouge, scrape, drill, etc. Three herniated disks and vertabrae have migrated closing around spine and cutting off messages to lower legs. They have no choice but to go in now. Waiting for neurosurgeon brave or stupid enough to try it. I know I'm way past ready. Results are iffy, but it's a start. Looking forward to 8" of snow in Mississippi Mon-Tues. May cause me to have to wait a few days extra. It seems we have some tender hearts on here with good advice. I know some professional counselors who do good work, but my point is not to go lay on a couch and tell all your troubles. I am talking about groups of people who share common problems. I am interested in keeping you positive and relieving some of your stress. The support groups I led consisted of 8-12 people who came just to learn, some to cry, others to understand what their loved ones are feeling. You don't get advice. You participate or not, as you choose. You take what you need and leave the rest. This Forum may be enough for you. I just know people who are living life and come to a screeching halt start missing old connections with humans first. Anyway, enough about you. I'm wondering if I have surgery under Medicare (Obama Plan) and it's repealed by the new guys before the doctor releases me, can I get the doctor paid by one plan and get ME paid by the other one. Imagine what a pile of Savages I could buy for the price of back surgery. ;D Now guys, just kidding. Perry is the subject of this thread. Looking for beautiful snow and possible relief from years of being gripey from pain. Unless....I really am just gripey. :-[ |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Reelthing on 01/09/11 at 19:10:58 2438253D203522333C3F3E35500 wrote:
Great idea - in half a heart beat I'll take you fishing Perry - h3ll it's pretty cold in NewF now - take some vacation and head down to the fishing shack! |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Wolfman on 01/10/11 at 02:56:49 Perry, even in no fault states the judge usualy leans towards the woman. ANY agreement NEEDS to be in writeing and have your lawyer look at it before signing. Fact is DO NOT sign anything untill your lawyer has looked at it! If possible get evidance of the unfaithfullness of your spouse, for your OWN protection. Don't even tell her you have it unless needed. Its a REAL GOOD idea not to even talk to her without a reliable witness for your protection. Divorce brings out a nasty streak in women, even if their the one looking for it. Makes em go for EVERYTHING they think they can get their hands on. Sometimes their idea but usualy her lawyers idea. The longer he/she can drag it out and the more they can get her the more THEY get paid. PROTECT YOURSELF and ALL your property/money. Even civil friendly divorces can take a bad turn. :( |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by PerrydaSavage on 01/10/11 at 03:35:40 Boof my man, I hope and pray that your health problems get straightened out and that you are on the mend SOON! Reelthing ... thank you for the invite my friend ... would love to be able to take you up on it, but I just started a new job and won't qualify for vacation time until this coming Fall ... you guys have a pretty decent motocycle rally down there around that time don't you? Wolfman ... I hear you sir ... my wife and I haven't made any movement towards divorce ... yet ... communication between us is typically the occassional email and mostly prefunctionary ... but I hear what you're sayin' ... |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by babyhog on 01/10/11 at 05:23:00 Please don't just assume that women are out to take you for whatever they can. Thanks Wolfman for clarifying that it can be the lawyers fault. I filed for my divorce and didn't ask for anything. Not even child support! We split joint custody, so why should one spouse take money from the other, if care of the child is equal? We sold our house, split the profit. Only thing I "got" was first right to claim our child on my tax return, and we even noted that if it was more financially beneficial for him to claim him, we'd split the excess. We did not involve lawyers. It "can" be done. We drew up papers ourselves, the law master reviewed and approved. Done. In other words Perry, yes be careful, but be sensible too. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by PerrydaSavage on 01/10/11 at 05:37:53 Sensible and reasonable are the only ways I know how to play Babyhog! I've been told that I am "too" easy going at times ... |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Reelthing on 01/10/11 at 07:22:25 Yep, the LoneStar bike rally is scheduled for Nov 3-6 this year. There’s a spare Savage if you need it. Kayaks to paddle around, birds to watch, and a wine rack in the kitchen if sophistication is needed. Or we can be complete heathens (my normal state) with beach bonfires, beer drinking, talking trash, boats with motors for inshore&offshore fishing, golfcart racing, and a 4-wheel drive truck to retrieve anything that breaks, gets stuck, or in some cases has the tires pointed up. The place has 4 real beds and a couple more that go together quick if other Savage heathens were to show up. The fishing is likely better say in June/July but it can be unbelievably hot/humid then also. Let’s make a plan. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Boofer on 01/10/11 at 07:32:31 Perry, I just got through reading the FEB "Rider" mag. Good article about Newfoundland. If you can't get a copy PM me your address and I'll send you mine. Looks like a place I would love, but I'll never make it that far from home. Keep on chuggin'. Boofer |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by youzguyz on 01/10/11 at 07:43:28 Perry.. you gotta go see Reelthing and the fish shack. Very nice place, really nice guy. He thinks the fish are scared of me though.. I promise to stay on the beach (and probably catch more than you from the dock! ;D ) |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Reelthing on 01/10/11 at 08:32:35 I think it was the furry seat that scared um off by the way look here what done jumped in the boat last Friday before the cold front got here. http://i1093.photobucket.com/albums/i433/Reel_thing/small0008.jpg |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/10/11 at 09:18:50 They are nice. Good goin Gary. You coulda had more on the boat, if. IF Youda had me onboard. |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by PerrydaSavage on 01/10/11 at 09:52:30 Boof ... wouldn't mind seein' that piece on Nfld. buddy ... no need to send the mag ... fire up a scan of the article if you can and then all here at Suzukisavage.com can enjoy! youzguyz ... had the pleasure of meeting Reelthing and his lovely wife when they visited the St. John's (Nfld.) area back in the summer of '06 ... spend an evening sinking a few beer with 'em on George St.! Reelthing ... you sir are a gentleman ... thank you and maybe I'll be able to pull something together by next Fall if I can get my life a bit more straightened away! The company I'll be working for has some engineering business in Houston so you never know. BTW beer drinkin', bonfires, fishin', Bikes and general heathen-ism is OK by me ... I'm not sophisticated enough for wine! LOL!! |
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Title: Re: Advice/comments? (NBR) Post by Wolfman on 01/10/11 at 14:50:57 BH, the point was most states favour the women as the 'Harmed' party and a LOT of women take advantage of that. Pretty much ALL lawyers will as well. Thats not to say the odd man dont try to take advantage of the court system as well. But it usualy swings a lot more the womens way. Less so in recent years but women DO still get a major advantage in the divorce court system. So much for Equal Rights....lol My EX and i had everything all divided and agreed upon, nice and civil. Got one lawyer to take care of the paper work and after 5 minutes with her alone HE became her lawyer and everything went out the window. So I had to get nasty and she ended up getting less in the long run then she would of. My thoughts on lawyers(greedy) and pshchologists(useless) are this. 200 of them at the bottom of the ocean would be a good start. Or like the chinese did in their communist revolution, line em up against a wall and shoot them...lol In todays society so many small insignificant things get blown out of proportion and turned into lawsuits. Lawyers and the system have made people sue happy. People ive known who used psychologists usualy end up more screwed up then they were. >:( |
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