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/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Technical Documents/Reference >> Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1221683647 Message started by T Mack 1 on 09/17/08 at 13:34:07 |
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Title: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by T Mack 1 on 09/17/08 at 13:34:07 So, to help those that want to add a tachometer (tach) to their bikes and to reduce the repeated requests for info, here is a listing of tach's that are know to work on the LS650/S40 Analog (dial) tachometers (Tachs) - Drag Specialties, http://www.dragspecialties.com/fatbook 8K mini-tach, model DS-244133 (Discontinued) Per Drag Specialties replaced by model 2211-0057 see: http://www.dragspecialties.com/product/getProductDetails.do?application=dragspecialties®ions=6&segmentId=1&productId=31762 - Nova-MMB, 12K 48mm 1:1 tach, Note: discontinued, replaced with tach where the mode is set by switches. http://www.nova-mmb.com - Baron's mini-tach , Model BA-7564-00 univesal fitment. http://www.baronscustom.com see Pict at: http://www.phatperformanceparts.com/photos/BA-7564-01.jpg - Barons Bullet Tach 3", Model BA-7570-01. http://www.baronscustom.com/catalog/display/252/index.html - Chinese Made "Tyan" brand, which is sold on ebay by multiple vendors. (Sorry, no one gave me a model number on this, only a picture) see pictureat : http://i22.ebayimg.com/02/i/05/1d/b9/bc_1_b.JPG Digital Tachs - ENM tach Model PT15B2 (includes hour meter) http://www.enmco.com Picture: http://www.amickssuperstore.com/v/vspfiles/photos/ENM%20PT15B2%20Tachometer-1.jpg - Northern Tools, Digital Tach, stock Number: Item# 160590 LOOKS very much one of ENM's tacks' but without the feature buttons. see: http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_524744_524744 http://www.northerntool.com/images/product/images/160590_med.gif Hybrid Tachs (analog segments displayed on LCD/LED display) -Trailtech/Vapor digital speedo and tach (Make sure you get the tach lead with the integrated resistor (or put 600k ohms in there yourself), also will need magnets for Speed pickup). see: http://trailtech.net/vapor.html - Veypor see: http://www.veypor.com/veypor.html If you have a tach that works and is not on the list, please reply. I will add it to the original post. We will clean up the replies afterwards. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by T Mack 1 on 03/19/09 at 05:50:03 Mics info: There are several types of tachs. The mechanical tachs will not work on our bikes without some heavy duty design and machining work. The more expensive direct wire ones hook up to the igition coil. You connect to the small black (with stripe) wire that switches the coil on/off. And to run the power to the tach, there is "switched" power under the fuel tank. I believe it's the orange wire but you should double check a wiring diagram to make sure, for your year bike, the colors stayed the same. The ground can be hooded up to the frame (I used the Ign coil mounting screws). The universal digital tach use a wire wrapped around the sparkplug wire. It should be noted that many of these small digitals have no power wire and run off a internal battery. And most have the battery incased such that when the battery goes you just throw them out. Life of the battery varies and could be related to how long the dealer or distributor had it sitting on the shelf (called shelf life). In theory they should go a few years...... in theory..... :-? |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by diamond jim on 05/27/09 at 17:56:34 So the small universal 8K tachs at the auto stores will not work? If not, why not? |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by marshall13 on 05/27/09 at 18:20:23 464B434F4D4C46484B4F220 wrote:
gotta be 1 that'll work with 1 pulse per rotation of the engine, so an electronic one for a 2 cylinder 4 stroke with a distributor will work, or a cam fired 2 cyl... any will "work" but having to devide or multiply the reading aint so good.... edit: how about a scooter tach? crank fired singles mostly.... |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by John_D on 05/27/09 at 18:22:13 5F525A5654555F5152563B0 wrote:
The few auto tachs I've seen had settings for 4, 6, or 8 cyl. I'm sure you could hook one up to 1 cyl, just not sure what kinda reading you'd get. :-/ |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by diamond jim on 05/27/09 at 18:34:20 It seems like the package of one I read at the auto store said for 2 as well as 4, 6, 8 c ylinder engines. Maybe I optimistically misread the package. So would these show half the actual rpm? Never looked for a scooter tach. Lemme see what I can find... I found this post on a different thumper page (not LS650): "... the two spark waste system will mean a different 2 cylinder or single cylinder 2 stroke setting. I hope my tach can do that, because it's for a single cylinder 4 stroke engine. And the fact that the CDI spark is too short duration for it to trigger a tach signal. Looks like I'm going to have to build a little gizmo like he did. I'm sure glad he supplied a schematic, as I'm pretty fuzzy on electronics." In other words, a lot of work like T Mack said above. Edit: Looks like the tachs from Autometer, the ones designed for go cart racing, work and look like nice quality. They'll put you back $150+ though. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by marshall13 on 05/27/09 at 21:36:49 2429212D2F2E242A292D400 wrote:
one from a single cylinder anything should work, so long as crank fired... it needs to see every pulse as a full rotation.... if it's set up for a crank fired 2 cylinder bike, then it'll read half as fast as it should 1000 actual rpm would be indicated by 500... a cam fired 2 cyl should work though... |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by marshall13 on 05/27/09 at 21:44:32 and the savage isnt CDI... its battery excited induction.. check the wiring diagram... ignition hot lead goes to the coil... if it was CDI, that would sent a 300+ volt spike through the electrics... that wouldnt be so good... it's like a ford electronic iggy, for the most part.. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by diamond jim on 05/27/09 at 22:52:45 Question- on our bikes, does the plug fire only once per cycle (compression) or does it also have the wasted spark on the exhaust stroke as well? Here's a good read: http://www.jetav8r.com/Vision/Ignition/CDI.html |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by marshall13 on 05/27/09 at 23:34:01 303D35393B3A303E3D39540 wrote:
wasted spark... has too... the magnet passes the pickup every revolution, and no crank sensor.... edit: late night posts are bound to contain errors...lol should be "no cam sensor".... and now back to your regular programming |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by PTRider on 05/28/09 at 07:18:45 Is there any information on which tachs work well, and which don't work well enough to bother with? We want one that reads increasing or decreasing rpms with as little time lag as possible, not one that lags way behind what the engine is doing. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by Oldfeller on 05/28/09 at 09:18:16 All of the small cheap electronic tachs lag a second behind as they are averaging the nuts out of things to get a stable progression. Some claim to only lag a half second behind, but big deal, it still lags noticeably. You will have to get a "rapid response" tach which will cost you over $100 to get a "perfect response" to fast changes. Here is some free advice -- don't bother putting a tach on an LS650. You will find out from any $25 cheapie electronic tach that: 1) You rev no more than 3,500 to 4,500 rpm doing what you normally do no matter how hard you twist your wrist. 2) You don't seem to be able to over-rev the motor even if you intentionally try to do so. There is a great debate about this fact. Although it is not stated as a "feature" anywhere in the Suzuki literature we do have a black box on our bike that runs an electronic ignition system. We "may" have an unstated RPM limiter on the bike. The Savage has always had a black box since the word "go" and we have always had a zero history of people blowing up motors due to over-revving them. (letting them run low on oil is a different story -- that kills pretty quick) We DO have a hell of a restriction on the input tract to the head and we also have another hell of a restriction on the exhaust side. Apart from any black box electronic limiters, these restrictions are thought to be enough to flatten out the rpm increase above 4,500 rpm into a flat no gain zone. Some folks have removed their intake and exhaust limiter zones by porting and polishing their heads. Lancer has a bike that has been cleaned up and has a Lancer performance cam in it -- I will ask him at the end of next month (when we go on the Dragon Run) if he can go up & over 6,000 rpm with his bike which would disprove the electronic limiter in the black box theory. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by PTRider on 05/30/09 at 07:17:31 In a review somewhere I read that our engines produce their max hp at 5400 rpm and that red line is 6500 rpm. The engines should be able to produce that in stock form. Could the muffler become restrictive with age & usage? What else could cause a reduction in engine output over time? If the muffler really is restrictive, I'm getting a SuperTrapp (http://www.supertrapp.com/product_sections/detail.asp?ItemID=728-50650)--and a 155 main jet. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by LANCER on 05/31/09 at 09:21:08 I really like the Veypor, it does a lot of stuff, is accurate and reasonably priced. Set up is easy, and the manufacturer provides free online downloads to update the device with new programs/improvements. It is easy to use on the road too. You can install the wiring on up to 4 different vehicles ... 2 bikes (Savage and SRX, '08 Dakota pickup, and hotrod '71 Maverick for instance, or what ever mix you wish. The device can be set up to store data for 4 vehicles of your choice. Just plug it in to which ever vehicle you want to drive/ride, turn it on & go. Get home, unplug from one and plug into another, turn on, select vehicle & go. Accuracy ? From http://www.veypor.com/veypor.html Accurate RPMs The built-in tachometer actually measures every individual engine spark with an accuracy of 5 millionths of a second. It then uses an adaptive algorithm to smooth out and average this value so you see the constant RPM of your engine, not values bouncing all over the place. This lets you get your engine speed exactly right before dropping the clutch and taking off. I liked the Verypor so much when I got one that I applied to be a dealer for them. The price of the unit has actually decreased from just under $200 to the current retail price of $159.99. Anyway, that's my 2 cents. Decided I wanted to add this list of basic features or the Veypor unit. Features Veypor/VR2 Full Instrumentation Portable Dynamometer with plots Full and Pro Tree 1/4 Mile Runs 0-60Mph and Braking Test Timing Roll-on timing for any speeds Graph results for all Runs Save up to 8 runs Calculate Fuel Mileage and fuel level Separate Fuel Odometer Odometer and Resettable Tripmeter Metric or Imperial units Two maintenance hour meters Gear Indicator Lap Timer and Course Analyzer Full featured Rally Computer Store 4 separate vehicle setups Super bright dual-level shiftlight Programmable speed light Download all Run data to a PC (VR2 only) Drag Coefficient Calculation Rolling Resistance Calculation Full-time datalogging for up to 24h Programmable sampling rate View all logging sessions on a PC Time and Date with battery backup |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by speedingman on 08/28/09 at 02:44:28 Just a thought, but may work, if you use a 2 cylinder electronic tach and hook it up to the pick up BEFORE the control unit, that would simulate a 2 cylinder engine, because the first pass is the fire, the second pass is dead in our motors, but would acksualy be the fire for the second cylinder if we had one. :-? The controler for our singles only fires every other pass. Like i said just a thought, worth checking, and would have to check the signal voltage to see if its enough for the given tach. If not you would need a coil to increase the voltage or a resistor if its to high. :o In theory it should work, and it would be very accurate, and we could use any 2 cylinder tach! which makes things alot easier! ;) |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by Boule’tard on 08/29/09 at 05:11:11 Anyone tried the TinyTach TT226R-2C? It only updates every 2.5 seconds, but whaddaya expect for $37. It comes in several configurations for 1cyl, multi-cyl, 2-stroke, 4-stroke. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by T Mack 1 - FSO on 08/29/09 at 19:25:13 7578627B7263766573170 wrote:
The Tiny-Tach is very very similar to the Northern Tools tach . Probably runs the same other than it looks like it has a reset. Tiny Tach http://www.skytek-th.com/images/stories/tacho/tacho02.png Northern Tools... http://www.northerntool.com/images/product/images/160590_med.gif |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by Ruddy on 09/15/09 at 13:54:13 What do you all think about this listing on eBay? http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150371937464&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by seviersavage on 09/15/09 at 17:34:15 I think the general concenses is to stay away from that seller. As for the tach it will work. Sevier |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by babyhog on 09/16/09 at 10:38:31 Wow, thanks Sevier... I was just about to buy the Dyna kit from them. I searched the forum and found the many complaints about them. Good enough for me to stay away from them. Thanks a bunch! |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by seviersavage on 09/16/09 at 11:24:24 BabyH anything you need by way of a carb contact Lancer Seviersavage |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by babyhog on 09/16/09 at 11:27:58 2E2D38333E382F2A343131343C302E5D0 wrote:
Yep, he seems to be the authority here. My husband is pretty handy, but if he gets in a pickle, I know where to go.... thanks again |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by Digger on 11/24/09 at 20:50:42 7E5D5557545D5D5443310 wrote:
Well, I wouldn't quite that far. I've got the ENM model mentioned by the OP, but I use it purely for diagnostic purposes. This one: http://www.enmco.com/perch/resources/1310385447pt16.jpg I've got the wire wrapped around the spark plug wire, with the free end tucked away. When I need to set the idle speed, I just hook the tach up to the wire and set the idle speed. When I'm done, I disconnect the wire and put the tach back in my drawer. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by DesertRat on 10/11/15 at 21:38:19 Will this work on our bikes, if used thru the timing cover? http://www.amazon.com/AGPtek®-Professional-Digital-Tachometer-Contact/dp/B004Q8L894/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top?ie=UTF8 or this one, temporarily wired in: http://www.amazon.com/SODIAL-Engine-Digital-Tachometer-Motorcycle/dp/B00JQ1XRIG/ref=sr_1_13?s=automotive&ie=UTF8&qid=1444624602&sr=1-13&keywords=motorcycle+tachometer |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by verslagen1 on 10/12/15 at 07:30:49 133224322523053623570 wrote:
Before you get that one you might want to try running the bike w/out that cover on. :-? Quote:
You'll find info somewhere on that one, or something similar. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by DesertRat on 10/12/15 at 16:14:13 Isn't our stator behind that cover? That doesn't run "wet" does it? |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by Kris01 on 10/12/15 at 17:18:57 You'd have to mount something shiny to the stator for the tach in your first link to work. I don't think the stator wold smile about it. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by Spamcan on 08/03/18 at 14:43:14 As I've said in another post elsewhere, the bonafide Tiny-Tach works fine... (don't know about the subs on e-bay). I've used three and yes, the un-lit basic model will go inoperative within 5 yrs, or so says the manufacturer. I'm just going to use my Oscilloscope (o'scope) for setting the idle. If I were to mount a tach permanently, I'd probably go for the lit one like I have in my 84 Diesel Rabbit, or just cannibalize it since the Rabbit is half dead (sigh, she were good while she lasted :(. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by zipidachimp on 09/02/18 at 22:32:40 Ryca mini tach works great, $60. Cheers! 8-) |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by IslandRoad on 10/30/18 at 01:42:00 75667F666B6E6C6766627F0F0 wrote:
I concur 8-) It's an excellent tach ... the range is about right ... price is good ... easy to hook up ... and it looks the part. There are a couple of threads on this forum about making custom mounting brackets. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by rangeshooter on 03/25/19 at 13:58:26 I don't see the Ryca tach or speedo on their site anymore. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by jcstokes on 03/26/19 at 22:36:49 You might find those instruments are very similar, if not the same as rev counters and speedos sold in many motorcycle parts stores. I brought my rev counter from a place called Catalyst Cycles. You gould Google them and check their instrument section. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by Ruttly on 03/27/19 at 12:35:29 Call Ryca and ask , tach & bracket $ 79.00 |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by 1997savagedude on 03/27/19 at 15:22:45 These work really well. not so huge on style, but looks ok on my tripple tree. easy as can be to install too. Go to Ebay and put this number in the search. 332514518214 |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by Mike Barnett on 12/29/19 at 16:03:24 Does anyone have any experience with either of these tachometers (RYCA's website says they are out of stock on the Mini)? I know the bike itself doesn't need one, but it would be a good visual learning aid for my wife, who just got her bike and license, and has never driven a manual before (car or bike). Thanks! https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000VSCB94/?coliid=I3U90EG82KCXLS&colid=3TYOHRN3EONLN&psc=1&ref_=lv_ov_lig_dp_it https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000GZTJOM/?coliid=I3B9W0R22C6KGQ&colid=3TYOHRN3EONLN&psc=1&ref_=lv_ov_lig_dp_it |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by IslandRoad on 12/29/19 at 21:57:40 That first one looks exactly the same as the Ryca mini tach (same colored wires too) - the only difference is the (Chinese/English?) text at the bottom of the dial. The Ryca doesn't have that. That might tell you something. However, it's not a very complicated piece of equipment. Personally, I'd take a punt on it. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by IslandRoad on 12/29/19 at 22:01:00 I also found it to be a very useful learning tool. It gave me a lot more confidence to rev the bike properly to get the most out of it. It also helped me learn to read the bike by sound. I can now tell what gear I'm in by using the sound of the bike at various speeds. I wrote a tutorial on installing the Ryca mini tach. I have a feeling it would work for that one too. http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1511551303 |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by IslandRoad on 12/29/19 at 22:06:35 Or, you might be interested in something on this page. This is a company here in Australia that I have bought from often and found them to be excellent. You will pay for shipping but there are a couple of tachs in there for $34 (AUD) The international exchange rate will be in your favour too! Aaaand, if you look through the website you'll probably find a couple of things you didn't know you needed, and you could bundle them. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by Mike Barnett on 12/30/19 at 04:07:19 Thanks for the information --- I'm guessing that take a punt means to give it a try :) Also, is there a missing URL for the Australian company you mentioned? |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by IslandRoad on 12/30/19 at 13:26:08 Yep, 'take a punt' means 'place a bet' 8-) Here's the link to Third Gear (their tach page) https://www.thirdgear.com.au/parts/speedometers-and-tachometers/ |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by Mike Barnett on 01/02/20 at 13:04:54 Just an update - I've ordered a tach from Amazon, and we'll see how it goes! Thanks for all the input. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by IslandRoad on 01/02/20 at 18:37:48 cool. Good luck. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by TheBrendan312 on 03/11/21 at 08:18:57 Does anyone know of anything that has the style of the RYCA or the ones that were on amazon? those are out of stock and I am unable to find any sort of replacement. |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by DragBikeMike on 03/11/21 at 11:18:52 Drag Specialties sells a tach that is exactly the same as the Ryca tach. This old post provides all the details. http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1596265853 |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by TheBrendan312 on 03/15/21 at 11:24:50 787E710D0F080C3C0 wrote:
Thanks Mike! |
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Title: Re: Tachometers that work on the LS650/S40 Post by Jim Rogers on 05/12/21 at 12:13:51 I'm new around here, so sorry if this one has already been posted somewhere. I installed a Trail Tech TTO digital tach, and it's great for what I need. Being digital, it's a little laggy, so it's not a great choice if your trying to reduce your lap times in the S40 while on the track. :) Given the cruiser/chopper vibe of this bike I don't need constant, perfect, real-time info on rpms. I mostly just like to have some idea as to what the bike sounds like at various rpms so I have some clue if I'm shifting at optimal points. It's also nice to be able to see rpms on the highway-- for both curiosity and to be able to confirm that I didn't forget to shift to the top gear! Finally, it's nice to be able to see the idle rpms. Given what it is, I don't think it's the cheapest thing in the world at $39.95 at Amazon (I'd say a good price would be about $20), but it's not too expensive and installation is a breeze. It's battery operated and uses a wire wrapped around the plug wire to pick up the signal. There's no backlight, but, as I said, I only use it as an occasional guide, so not having it at night is not a problem for me. I installed it behind the handlebars, using wire ties to secure it to the brake line guide. The first picture shows a close up of the installation, the second shows it as I see it while riding. Unlike the speedometer, the tach is in my line of sight as I ride, so I usually use the rpms to monitor my speed on the highway. So, if you're looking for a relatively cheap, easy way to see your rpms on an occasional basis, I can recommend this option. http://https://i.postimg.cc/FfDt2g8T/2021-05-02-12-08-31.jpg (https://postimg.cc/FfDt2g8T) http://https://i.postimg.cc/WFzRjqPT/2021-05-02-12-08-47.jpg (https://postimg.cc/WFzRjqPT) |
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