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Message started by verslagen1 on 09/30/07 at 08:43:49

Title: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 09/30/07 at 08:43:49

The art of Zen riding is more fun then Zen wrenching IMHO.  But in order to ride with a clear mind some wrenching must be performed.  In this case every 5k miles.

To check your adjuster you have to remove a few things, gather a few tools and buy a gasket or 2.

Supplies:
You need a clutch cover gasket about $17
Or form-a-gasket, I like Ultra Grey.
And you may need a exhaust header gasket about $4
Your favorite oil.
Oil filter if you like.

Tools:
A 8mm socket for the clutch cover bolts.
A 19mm wrench or an adjustable metric wrench.
A 17mm socket for the foot peg mounting plate nuts.
A 14mm wrench to hold the other side.
A 17 or a 14mm wrench to drop the oil.
A 8mm allen wrench for the filter cover.
A 12mm socket and wrench for the muffler/header.
A Torque wrench
A big flat bladed screwdriver.
And External Snap ring pliers for small rings
And your favorite cake tin to drop the oil in.

Instructions:
Drop oil
Remove filter
Remove the right foot peg, leave the cables on, just get it off and let it hang out of the way, be careful not to over extend the brake switch cable, that little SOB is held in place with a plastic something or other that I've never seen cause I overextended it and it went poof!  Micro roach clips are a good replacement.
Remove the muffler and header together as one piece.
Disengage clutch cable, careful with the little tab that holds it in place, don't bend it any more than you have to.  If it snaps off, you can use a cotter pin instead.
Remove clutch cover bolts, note which ones have seals (3) and which ones are long (2).
http://www.savageriders.com/verslagen/images/ClutchCover.JPG
W marks location of washers, arrows marks location of longer screws.
Remove the clutch cover.

Tip: 19mm wrench fits on the clutch lever to pop the cover loose or use the adjustable metric wrench.  And use big screwdriver on the offsets around the case to ease it off evenly.  There are 2 big pins which align the cover to case and they hang up the cover unless you pull it off evenly.  If you intend to reuse the gasket, you can ease the cover off about an 1/8" all around and check which side the gasket is stuck to, either the case or the cover.  It doesn't matter which, just not stuck to both.

The plunger attaches to the rear guide, aka "tensioner"
And it rests in the housing.  The plunger and the housing together are the adjuster.  Measure the amount the plunger sticks out of the housing.  When it sticks out more than 18mm (.71") It's time to do something.
http://www.savageriders.com/verslagen/CamChainClub/busted.jpg
Note: Past time to do something

To remove the adjuster remove the bolt that attaches it to the tensioner.  And don't loose the spring, it will come flying out.  Then remove the ring that holds the housing in place.  Housing should slip easily off then.  Don't loose the ring either.  And if your pliers has an adjustable stop use it, don't over extend these rings or you'll have to replace it.  That's a buck you don't need to spend.

Several things affect this projection.
Chain Stretch: SSM states the limit for 21 pins center to center is 128.8mm (5.07"),  when new it's 127mm (5").
Guide Wear: No specifications exist for this.  In extreme cases they have been known to separate from the steel backing and clog the oil pump.  So look for deep cracks or loose bits.  Pull the chain taunt (to the right) and the guide to the left and inspect round portion of the guide for wear.
Chain/Sprocket Wear: No sprocket wear has been reported.  Chain wear may contribute to plunger extension.

Once you've finished dropping everything on the floor, replace in reverse order.  Check the condition of your exhaust gasket and replace if necessary.  Check the condition of your clutch cover gasket, replace if necessary.  About 10 ftlbs on the oil filter and clutch cover, 50 ftlbs on the footpeg, 20 ftlbs on the header, muffler nuts tight.  All from memory so check your bibles for the actual range.

Make sure upon reinstalling the cover that your clutch cable hanger is in the upright position.  But if you've forgotten, put a wrench on the arm and swing it up, then you'll have room to swing the hanger up.

Don't forget to use antisieze on the header bolts, you may want to remove them some time in the future.

http://www.savageriders.com/verslagen/CamChainClub/zipd-verslavy.jpg
Leave the folded zip tie in place until the tensioner is bolted into the bike.

Then when it is all bolted in place....take out the folded zip tie.
The tensioner will self-adjust into place....you don't need to do anything.

http://www.savageriders.com/verslagen/CamChainClub/1stHoleVerslavy.jpg

If you chain has stretched enough to extend all the way out.....then use the 2nd hole.
Only once the plunger is all the way out, and it is held in place by a pawl on the bottom of the housing.  
Push it in and compress the plunger, and lock it in place with the folded zip tie.  
Readjust the chain guide to the 2nd hole, and pull the folded zip tie again.
http://www.savageriders.com/verslagen/CamChainClub/verslavy.jpg
I estimate 1mm is about 1,000 miles, it’s a rough guess, and w/out the pin and slot I wouldn’t go past 20mm (.787”).  
19mm (.748”) is the recommended max to prevent damage to the housing.



Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 10/08/07 at 13:50:51

Since these are hard to find, I'll include method's for fixing.


Aeres wrote:
Today I was just replacing my timing chain in the '95 engine I have, and thought I would put in my $0.02 since there seems to be some weirdness going on with these chains and tensioners.

I recently bought this engine used, it was still running but was making a hellova racket, which turned out to be severe chain noise.  The tensioner had ratcheted out beyond the end of the plunger rack, popped out and was about to let the main spring loose into the case.

After pulling out the chain and measuring the 20 links as per the SSM, I found the chain was still within tolerances.  128.3 mm vs. the 128.9 wear limit in the book.

Why would the tensioner plunger pop out if the chain was in spec?  This was a factory build, so there was no shaved head or any other apparent goofiness.  Why was the chain so loose?

I put in a different known good chain, but the new tensioner was still about two clicks from bailing out like the last one.  This was unacceptable.

So my solution was to modify the main tensioner guide.  This guide has a metal insert for strength, so I carefully bent it to provide a longer curve in the center.  Adding this mild curve allowed it to take up more chain slack than the stock shape for a given displacement of the tensioner.

Once I installed this mod the plunger of the tensioner ratcheted out to only 10mm (measured between the plunger shoulder and tensioner face) before it tightened the chain completely.  This means that about 2/3 of the plunger rack is still within the tensioner body.  Much better...

http://suzukisavage.com/images/uploaded/CCAdjChk02.jpg
http://suzukisavage.com/images/uploaded/CCAdjChk03.jpg

Quote:
If I succeeded in loading the pics right (I am a newbie to this forum stuff, as you might be able to tell) you can see the slight bend in the top one vs the bottom one.

So, I'll fire it up tomorrow and find out whether I fixed it or whether I have a new boat anchor.  

I'll let you know what happens...




Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 10/08/07 at 14:37:57


slavy wrote:
I made some mod. to my tensioner- just made the part that slides out longer /welded  about 1" extension/ and drilleed a new hole 12 mm ftom the old one . Now the cam chain tensioner is almost all the way IN. And No, I did not check how does it work, because the engine is still on the bench, waiting for a proper paper work for the bike where it will go.
If somebody wants a picture, just send me an e-mail and I'll send You back a picture.


Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 11/27/07 at 11:22:44

Want to check the condition of the cam chain and can't wait to change the oil?  Lean her over and the oil all runs to the other side making it possible to open her up and check the chain, clutch, or whatever.  Only a little bit (less than a cup/more than a teasp00n) of oil leaks out from being trapped on top of the gasket.   ;D

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 06/25/08 at 20:42:34

You could look at every time you torqued the head bolts which the owners manual say every 3500 miles or every year.  right.  I know we'd rather ride than twist wrenches and getting to the clutch cover off is an hour of low down stuff.  A quick trip to the chiropracter. and an hour to put it back together.

Some adjusters have fallen out at 7k miles.  So 5k seems like a winner.  Take a measurement and make a guess when you want to look at it again.  One fellow here went from 17mm to 23 in 60 miles.  So don't take this measurement for granted, keep your ears peeled.

One thing I would definitely recomend to check out the condition of a new to you bike is to do this inspection asap.  It will tell you how the bike was kept.  If the bike is ran with out oil, this chain and the guides are going to suffer.  And there's a possibility that the owner is selling cause of this as this maitenance is probably in the neighborhood of $750.  Anybody have this done?  How much did the stealership nail you for?

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Digger on 06/30/09 at 19:55:31


62716667787573717A25140 wrote:
......
Instructions:
Drop oil
Remove filter
Remove the right foot peg, leave the cables on, just get it off and let it hang out of the way, be careful not to over extend the brake switch cable, that little SOB is held in place with a plastic something or other that I've never seen cause I overextended it and it went poof!  Micro roach clips are a good replacement.
Remove the muffler and header together as one piece.....


If I may, I'd like to input a slight modification I made to Verslagen's excellent instructions:

I found it was not necessary to totally remove the starboard footpeg bracket from the frame.

I loosened both footpeg bracket nuts.  Then, I tapped the upper-forward long bolt inboard with a brass hammer.  I tapped it in enough so that the forward portion (only) of the footpeg bracket could now be tilted downward, thus clearing the clutch-side engine case.  (Note that you cannot tap in the aft footpeg bracket bolt if the kickstand bracket is in place on the port side of the motorcycle).

This way, you don't have to struggle against the stiff rear brake cable to remove the rear portion of the footpeg bracket from the frame - and you still have clear access to the clutch-side engine case and its bolts.

Here is a picture of the starboard footpeg bracket after performing this procedure:


http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee201/Digger109/StbdFootpegBracked-TiltedForwardE.jpg


IHTH someone!

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Digger on 07/05/09 at 20:26:58


455641405F5254565D02330 wrote:
....
Supplies:
You need a clutch cover gasket about $10
Or form-a-gasket, I like Ultra Grey.
And you may need a exhaust header gasket about $4
Your favorite oil.
Oil filter if you like.....


To the list of supplies, I would add three washer gaskets (Suzuki P/N 09168-06023 or 09168-06024).  FYI, the gasket washers used with some of the head cover bolts are Suzuki P/N 09168-06023.

Some may consider new washer gaskets to be optional when doing this job, however, they are so cheap I put them in the category of "there is no reason NOT to replace them."

IHTH!

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Digger on 07/06/09 at 20:09:27


475443425D5056545F00310 wrote:
.....About 10 ftlbs on the oil filter and clutch cover, 50 ftlbs on the footpeg, 20 ftlbs on the header, muffler nuts tight.  All from memmory so check your bibles for the actual range...


Just for the record:

On my bike (see signature), the FSM does not specify a torque for the oil filter and clutch cover bolts.  If you want to torque them anyway, the generic torque for "conventional" grade 6 mm bolts is 3-5 ft-lbs.

The other torques mentioned above are all close enough for government work.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 07/30/09 at 11:47:23

Checking the Cam Chain Adjuster is a great way to gage the condition of your bike.  How fast this wears is a good indication of how well the head is getting oiled.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by vtail on 08/08/09 at 12:28:17

The Clutch/Crankcase cover bolts (6mm) torque specs are listed at 6.6 to 9.6 ft/lbs. I just torqued them at 100 inch/lbs = 8.3 ft/lbs

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Digger on 08/21/09 at 20:53:59


2220353D38540 wrote:
The Clutch/Crankcase cover bolts (6mm) torque specs are listed at 6.6 to 9.6 ft/lbs. I just torqued them at 100 inch/lbs = 8.3 ft/lbs


FWIW....

For my bike (see signature), the FSM lists the torque range for these bolts as being 3 -5 ft-lbs.  If the bolts are hardened, then the torque range is listed as 6 - 8.5 ft-lbs.

I don't think that these particular bolts are hardened.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 11/10/09 at 21:56:01

For those of you w/o mechanical talent and want to know when to get fleesed by the stealership, teach your ankles to listen to the engine.  Press the sides of your shoes against the top of the covers on both sides.  When the vibes are uneven, your timebomb is ticking.  I've been hearing intermitant ticking for a month now.  Yesterday, the alarm rung, 21mm.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 01/24/10 at 22:48:58

Couldn't find the detailed sketch I know is in the SSM.  
This picture shows new on top and a used chain on the bottom.
And he's measuring the stretch over about 14", not the required 21 pin measurement.
So, stretch out the chain like shown, and it would be good to stretch it a bit.  One end on a nail, the other with a bungee cord, weight, whatever.  count off 21 pins, measure from center to center, but left edge of the pin to left edge is the same.
127mm or 5" is brand new.
service limit is 128.9mm or 5.075"
While you got it in your hand, check for any stiff links.
I'd replace it if you have any.
http://www.ls-650.de/techfotos/steuerketten.jpg

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 02/01/10 at 10:52:36

Here's a chain check procedure I'm trying to work out.

Take the clutch and primary gear off.
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1262974235/5#5

Remove the adjuster assembly.
Tie or hold back the rear guide aka adjuster.
Wiggle the chain links about and check for any stiff links.
mark the leading and last link that you can check somehow (white grease?)
Rotate the engine to make another section available.
Repeat check and rotate until all links are checked.

And please note that when you replace the clutch, on the oil pump drive gear, the teeth should be directly over the drive pin.

And other thing to check is the oil pump gear shaft, push in the gear and check alignment with the drive gear.  Then pull out.  Either way it should not be in danger of coming off.  If it comes off, the dangerous little oil pressure you got becomes non existant.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by MaxMayhem on 05/03/10 at 19:42:40

I think this post probably should be in rubber-side down, but if I get the answer then it will help others with little/no mechanical knowledge like myself ;) when they find this thread.

I get why we do this check, but I don't seem to have found anything in this thread that tells a newbie like myself, what to do to fix the problems.

I mean if the chain is stretched I assume that obviously means replace cam-chain if passed the maximum stretch point.
And if the arm the plunger goes into has become (I think the term used was oblongated) through misaligned plunging, then a new arm is needed.

Am I correct here?

At 17822km on the clock I should check (I bought at 13000km) and without having any knowledge of what has been done mechanically before, it is a sure bet the plunger is not far off popping out of the arm.
I just don't want to check it only to find myself wondering 'ok it's almost farked...so now what?'

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 05/03/10 at 21:02:38

18k km = 11k miles

You're about have way to the point I modified my adjuster to be the 1st verslavy.  I've tried to be very balanced in my response in how to fix this issue.  I've noted the several ways to fix it and my own is posted in the marketplace for those w/o the means to fix it themselves.  What you've stated is true, replace the chain if it's stretched and replace the adjuster if it is ovaled (when the plunger is fully extended, it can wobble back and forth ovaling the housing).  But as many of us have found, the chain is not stretched beyond service limit when the plunger is fully extended.  From that is born the slavy, the extended plunger to retract the plunger and get the full life from the chain.  My contribution is to lock the plunger to the housing so that it won't disengage leaving the chain slack to cause havoc.  This is serious stuff and even though I've sold many verslavy, there's no guaranty something won't happen.  With 20k miles on the chain in an unknown condition, how long will it last?  Mine went 46k and it's still ticking.  Although it nearing the end of it's second life and I plan on changing it soon.  I fondled that chain when I changed it over till I was sure there were no stiff links indicating a flaw.  I know many do not check the chain in this manner.  A stiff link may fail sometime in the future.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 08/23/11 at 12:02:55


6B696F7B6468666D6473010 wrote:
So when checking all this, can the cam tensioner be reused or if over 18mm do you need to buy a new one? can the plunger be reseccured in the body?

If caught in time, the housing will not be damaged and can be reused by putting in a new chain and guides.  When the plunger extends beyond 18mm it is no longer supported enough by the housing and will wobble ovalling out the hole in the housing.

A stock plunger is not secured to the housing and will come out if the plunger extends far enough.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Cavie on 02/26/12 at 03:51:54


66797A767E7D746761150 wrote:
i got bout 17k on mine and have yet to check the cam chain or tensioner, it still sounds quiet but i know thats alotta miles anyways how do you men "21 pins center to center" can someone please clarify how to perform that measurment?? thanx


newbie here nerver have done it but common sence  tells me to streach the chain and measure center to center from one pin to the 20 1ST pin. It should measure no more than 128.9 mm as stated in the post below by verslagen1

So, stretch out the chain like shown, and it would be good to stretch it a bit.  One end on a nail, the other with a bungee cord, weight, whatever.  count off 21 pins, measure from center to center, but left edge of the pin to left edge is the same.
127mm or 5" is brand new.
service limit is 128.9mm or 5.075"

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 03/03/12 at 12:14:55


23302726393432303B64550 wrote:
Some adjusters have fallen out at 7k miles.  So 5k seems like a winner.  Take a measurement and make a guess when you want to look at it again.  One fellow here went from 17mm to 23 in 60 miles.  So don't take this measurement for granted, keep your ears peeled.

One thing I would definitely recommend to check out the condition of a new to you bike is to do this inspection asap.  It will tell you how the bike was kept.  If the bike is ran with out oil, this chain and the guides are going to suffer.  And there's a possibility that the owner is selling cause of this as this maintenance is probably in the neighborhood of $750.


When the chain stretches, the plunger extends.  Put a new chain in and the old plunger is pulled back in.  New guides help too.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Waterdude on 05/03/15 at 17:43:16

I recently pulled the clutch cover and found just what I suspected. My chain tensioner was protruding 20.26mm. When I put a caliper to 6 links I came up with 38.18mm and doing the math I discovered that my chain was stretched beyond the wear limit (That's using the 21 link at 128.9mm). I was bummed because I thought my chain and guides would need to be replaced with only 14,000 miles. Then I got my Clymers from e-bay and found out it is actually 20 links so my chain is right where it needs to be. It's off to get my verslavy mod and put it back together for probably another 10,000 miles. Can't wait to get riding as the KY weather is great. Your Suzuki Brother, Waterdude

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 05/20/15 at 11:47:25


Quote:
When I put a caliper to 6 links I came up with 38.18mm and doing the math I discovered that my chain was stretched beyond the wear limit (That's using the 21 link at 128.9mm)


6 links = 38.18

38.18 x 20/6 = 127.27

127.27-125=2.27 vs. 3.9 max

14,000 x 3.9/2.27=24,000

Yes, I would guess you have 10,000 more miles, but the second half will wear faster unless you've changed your habits of short rides.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by HighME32 on 11/01/18 at 22:48:55

Man, what a bummer!!! Did the verslagen head plug and verslavy install, and adjusted my valves. I was on my way to wrapping things up, filled her up with oil and started moving to other minor service items, when low and behold I noticed a good oil leak coming out of the clutch cover! I have all the bolts in the proper places, washers and all. I installed a brand new gasket from the dealer, which seemed lighter and a bit thinner. I torqued the bolts first at 95in lbs when I wrapped up the job originally. After I noticed the leak, I went up to 100, still leaked, then moved to 105, still leaking. I drained the oil out and will have to take her apart again. All the bolts turn perfectly and grab perfectly. I am thinking of using the original gasket, which I luckily saved in a plastic bag. Any thoughts? I'd appreciate the suggestions. Thanks in advance!

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 11/02/18 at 08:40:26

I'd look to where it was leaking exactly.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by HighME32 on 11/02/18 at 10:38:33

Hi Verslagen, it is leaking underneath the case . Most around the inspection window and middle bolt. I read some threads about putting gasket sealer. I am tempted to do the same with my remaining suzuki bond. Do you think I should use new or old gasket?

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 11/02/18 at 12:08:36


0A2B252A0F077170420 wrote:
Hi Verslagen, it is leaking underneath the case . Most around the inspection window and middle bolt. I read some threads about putting gasket sealer. I am tempted to do the same with my remaining suzuki bond. Do you think I should use new or old gasket?

I don't use gasket sealer, so I can't comment on that.
I do wipe the gasket with oil on 1 side before installing, as I like to be able to remove the cover and still re-use the gasket.
And I don't have a problem with leakage.
If you're leaking on the rear side, it maybe the pass thru for the neutral wire.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by crazymactech on 11/02/18 at 17:45:18

Verslagen, when you talk about your mod and refer to hole 1 and hole 2, which is which?  Is "1" on the left or is "1" on the right?

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 11/02/18 at 18:45:31


6273607B786C606275646269010 wrote:
Verslagen, when you talk about your mod and refer to hole 1 and hole 2, which is which?  Is "1" on the left or is "1" on the right?

Hole 1 is the original hole.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by HighME32 on 11/04/18 at 18:49:01

I figured out the clutch cover leak. The new gasket folded a bit a the bottom and was not sitting properly. I replaced it with the original gasket, which was in great shape, and no more leaks.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Spamcan on 03/28/19 at 12:42:02

2006 LS650. 15k miles. Yesterday I replaced my original cam chain tensioner assy with Versy's modded one. (I bought the bike used last October and the forum's cam chain tensioner discussions made me real nervous!) Used hole #2. Had to replace the gasket. First photo is the original. No sign of previous meddling. Second photo is versy's. That little circlip holding in the tensioner is quite small. I had to find a set of pliers to get between the hooks. Most I looked at were too large or too far apart. Luckily I found an American-made set by "Lang Tools" at O'reilly. $20 but well worth the price. Didn't use any sealer on the new gasket. Seems OK.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Spamcan on 03/28/19 at 12:45:34

Couldn't get it to post the second photo.... here it is... the new tensioner installed.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Bender on 05/18/19 at 20:20:35

Hey Verslagen, I dont have enough posts to PM you, but I need one of your tensioners. I measured mine a few days ago and it is at 18.7mm. Let me know what information you need from me.

Thanks, Chris

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 05/18/19 at 23:08:04


5B4C5F5D4A5F545D41380 wrote:
Hey Verslagen, I dont have enough posts to PM you, but I need one of your tensioners. I measured mine a few days ago and it is at 18.7mm. Let me know what information you need from me.

Thanks, Chris

Activate your email button so I can email you.

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1464804691/25#25

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Bender on 05/19/19 at 16:36:08

@verslagen, okay email button is turned on now, thanks.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 05/19/19 at 17:38:13

You got mail

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Bender on 06/01/19 at 14:59:15

So I got the versy adjuster and replaced it this morning, thanks Verslagen. The pesky circlip gave me a really hard time, it took me about 30 minutes to pry it out with some flat heads, anyone have a trick to prying it off?

Also, I am confused on which hole to use in the adjuster. My old plunger was sticking out almost 19 mm, and on the new versy adjuster, I used the hole furthest from the plunger. Once I bolted it up I pulled the zip tie out and the plunger did not move at all. The chain felt tight by hand, but I don't have a good frame of reference for the tension. And now I am second guessing myself on the hole choice.

How do we know what hole to pick?

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 06/01/19 at 16:42:56

If you were 19 out, then you had to use the 2nd hole.
It's probably loose and will tighten up once it gets going.

Yep, the c-clip is a b!tch.  and the harbor fright tool is a little too big.
I ground where it comes together so I can use it.

If you use a flat blade to push it half way out of the groove, then another can get a grip and twist it out.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Bender on 06/01/19 at 17:26:33

Which one is the 2nd hole? Closest to the plunger or farthest from the plunger?

Also, it sounds like you're saying it doesn't matter once you start riding because it will adjust itself into place.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 06/01/19 at 17:39:14

the 2nd hole is not the stock hole.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Bender on 06/01/19 at 21:59:41

Okay good to know, thanks.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by eau de sauvage on 09/07/19 at 00:05:10


706374756A6761636837060 wrote:
If you were 19 out, then you had to use the 2nd hole.
It's probably loose and will tighten up once it gets going.

Yep, the c-clip is a b!tch.  and the harbor fright tool is a little too big.
I ground where it comes together so I can use it.

If you use a flat blade to push it half way out of the groove, then another can get a grip and twist it out.
[/b]


I'm just checking this thread for clues about the circlip and lo and behold. I have just discovered that they're all too large so I thought I'd file one to fit.

Interestingly It moved out to about 15mm fairly quickly, I'm just doing another oil change since the last check and it's still 15mm out. I probably should have put the new versy adjust in last oil change so I've been a bit nervous the whole time but it has not moved. Everything looks good though I thought it wears faster the longer it goes?!

Do you think at 15mm out I'd be able to use the original factory hole? (I'll be installing my new pinned versy adjuster)

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 09/07/19 at 08:34:34


53415556414745200 wrote:
Do you think at 15mm out I'd be able to use the original factory hole? (I'll be installing my new pinned versy adjuster)

Yes, I'd use the original hole.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by crazymactech on 04/30/20 at 07:30:10

I'm confused when people are talking about first hole and second hole.  From which end is this referenced, left or right?  I have a 2011 with only 10,000 on it and am going to replace the tensioner with the one I bought from Verslavvy.  Should I use the hole on the left, or the one on the right?

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 04/30/20 at 08:43:11

If you had only 1 hole, it would be the factory hole.
If you had an extended adjuster with 2 holes, the original hole would be on the left if you were seated on the right side of the bike with the clutch cover off and it would be aka the 1st hole.
The new hole would be on the right and would be known as the 2nd hole.

Which hole you use is wholly dependent upon the wear and tear on your bike.  I don't like forcing the plunger all the way in to fit the 2nd hole in if there is a substantial amount of travel left for the 1st hole.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Cushman on 05/30/20 at 10:25:40

thanks for the directions to check my cam chain mine is at about 5/8 inch So where do I buy the new style adjuster?

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 05/30/20 at 13:04:57

I don't know....
http://clipart-library.com/images/8czrL6jcp.png

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by CogAtomic on 10/08/20 at 07:12:31

Well I got it opened up easily. At 6000 miles on my 2001 savage (5000 miles are my own) I was actually surprised how far it was extended. Go figure. I'd anticipated putting it back together and riding another week or two, but at this rate I'm glad I checked. Seems like there's no real gushing of when they go too far with these. (I do take lots of short.trips) .... Relieved and sending part to CA today.. glad it's getting cold here in PA)

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Hiko on 10/09/20 at 13:27:31

How far out was it? Useful information for us all

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by eau de sauvage on 10/09/20 at 16:03:59

I found the cam chain tensioner to be 15mm out after 17k kilometres and ordered a Versey CCT, however after another 17k kms it barely moved any more. I put the Versey in anyway but still on the first hole, and after 42k kms, it's still on the first hole.

It appears that there is great variability as to how much trouble people have with this, but in my experience it came out fairly quickly then sort of settled down. But it's not something you want to take a chance with I guess.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by CogAtomic on 10/09/20 at 17:19:35


695C4F4B434B2E0 wrote:
How far out was it? Useful information for us all



I measured it at 14mm. Not quite there but Ive known for awhile about needing to look at it, and prefer to stay ahead of future issues

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by badwolf on 10/09/20 at 17:42:31

Drag Bike Mike looked at the chain tensioner arm by compairing a new one with a old one and the arm bending lets the plunger extend the same as chain wear. I think the cam chain would be good for 100,000+ miles like on a LOT of other bikes IF we could work out the arm bending ( losing it's bend actually ), and the catch on the plunger.
I am trying my idea, but will wait to post it till I get 40 or 50 thousand on it.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Hiko on 10/09/20 at 18:22:17


476B6345706B696D67040 wrote:
[quote author=695C4F4B434B2E0 link=1191167029/45#46 date=1602275251]How far out was it? Useful information for us all



I measured it at 14mm. Not quite there but Ive known for awhile about needing to look at it, and prefer to stay ahead of future issues[/quote]

Mine was out 14mm at 9500 km like you I modded it for peace of mind

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by CogAtomic on 10/09/20 at 18:44:39

The same distance, at close to the same distance. I wonder why so much variance in mileage as to when it finally falls apart. That's cool you caught it too and fixed. I've been liking the Savage so much I hated the thought of losing it to a defect that's so well known. This site is great for getting the word out, otherwise this particular part self destructing in the case would never have occurred to me. I suppose people don't know though, the previous owner didn't know anything about it

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by CogAtomic on 11/02/20 at 20:01:12

I now tentatively have the new/recycled Verslavy installed. Thanks Verslaven. I want to be sure I clear on something, when its situated and bolted in using the first hole, and I finally pull the zip tie, it adjusts itself where the plunger isn't quite as far out as was originally (14mm) but close to that. At that point everything feels stable and solid

But, if I change to the 2nd hole, and then pull the zip tie again, to let it adjust itself into place, the plunger ends up way more compressed, probably close to as far in as it goes.

So, is using the first hole, and having the plunger farther out, an issue? I wouldn't think so, it does its work on the chain and seems okay, and the verslavy is made to not fall apart like the OEM one eventually does. But Im not entirely sure, when I look at pics of the new install here on the forum, the verslavy always looks to me to be almost completely compressed on other people's posts. So I'm wondering if I'm missing something. I hope this makes sense. The picture here shows almost exactly what mine now looks like, as opposed to completely compressed. But reinstalling it from the second hole will result in a more compressed plunger, is that preferable? Hope what I'm wondering here makes sense. I'm probably overthinking this Thanks


Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 11/03/20 at 08:10:01

at 14mm, using the second hole is premature and as you've noted fully compresses the spring putting the highest tension on the chain.
While it's probably within design limits, less tension is advisable.
I would use the 1st hole (original) for less tension.
You have at least 6x1000 miles for max wear before you go to the next hole.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by CogAtomic on 11/05/20 at 02:48:03


263522233C3137353E61500 wrote:
at 14mm, using the second hole is premature and as you've noted fully compresses the spring putting the highest tension on the chain.
While it's probably within design limits, less tension is advisable.
I would use the 1st hole (original) for less tension.
You have at least 6x1000 miles for max wear before you go to the next hole.



Okay cool. That makes sense to me and clarifies it. Thanks Verslagen :)

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by eau de sauvage on 11/11/20 at 12:08:12

Not only that but the whole point of the pin is so that even if the timing chain gets a bit loose there will not be a catastrophic failure. You will probably find that the chain stretches slower as it gets older. So you can listen for any sounds that indicate the chain might be getting loose, without needing to worry. The original adjuster should have been pinned at the factory, although that would make it a bit more difficult to tell when you were at the chain wear limit.

Without the pin if the CTT comes out it's very clear that you've reached the limit because you'll be sliding down the road with terrible clunking noises and grinding metallic sounds coming from the crankcase. But with the pin there will only be a bit of extra clicking noises this can be more difficult to diagnose and may necessitate removing the side cover to check.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by CogAtomic on 11/11/20 at 12:36:15

Thanks. when you put it that way it confirms to my thinking, why I installed the Verslavy, I didn't like possibly not knowing for one how far along that plunger was. And two, the question of when, not if, it would self destruct. The previous owner knew nothing about it being an issue, so I knew it hadn't been replaced, but No idea how far along it was.  Compare cost of the verslavy mod, a little time, and a couple additions to my tool collection, versus the cost for a replacement engine or new bike... I'd rather deal with the former. Having it pinned in so it doesn't separate, plus adding the ability to accommodate chain wear feel like what Suzuki shouldhave done long ago.  But since they burned out on fixing their own defect, thankfully we have the Verslavy. And Verslagen able (and willing) to keep up with demand for the Verslavy. An excellent fix with great documentation,and support basically, here on this forum.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by JED on 09/20/21 at 20:28:36

When installing the cam chain tensioner, does that 10mm bolt need any thread lock or anything else to prevent it from vibrating out?

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 09/21/21 at 04:11:50


212D3F3F29223E2B784C0 wrote:
When installing the cam chain tensioner, does that 10mm bolt need any thread lock or anything else to prevent it from vibrating out?

I've never used it.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Hiko on 09/22/21 at 22:05:42

Now that you have thought about it In the interests of peace of mind you should.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Birchw1 on 10/01/21 at 19:03:45

I bought a Savage a few years ago and am finally getting around to working on it.  I pulled the clutch cover and was pleasantly surprised to see a Verslavy.  It seems quite extended so I am wondering if the cam chain is too stretched. Opinions?
http://https://i.postimg.cc/MKwFVjtp/cam.jpg

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 10/01/21 at 19:28:26

It's in the middle of the slot so ride like you stole it.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 11/08/21 at 15:49:28

The chain headed up ain't even hitting the chain headed down. You're good!

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by TRLREDY on 04/19/22 at 15:49:22

I've read every post in this thread and don't see it.  I'm planning on putting in my new Verslavy tomorrow.  Is there a torque spec for the 10mm bolt that is used on the plunger?

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by Dave on 04/20/22 at 03:59:15


1B343E236D625A0 wrote:
I've read every post in this thread and don't see it.  I'm planning on putting in my new Verslavy tomorrow.  Is there a torque spec for the 10mm bolt that is used on the plunger?


http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1098848534

The torque shown in the table listed is 6-8.5 ft/lbs.  It is a low torque and not all that possible to achieve if you only have a 150 ft/lb torque wrench.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by TRLREDY on 04/20/22 at 04:35:55

Thank you Dave!  I appreciate the info!

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by iggymama on 07/20/22 at 13:57:58

I am selling my 2001 Savage with 9933 miles on it, and a buyer might be interested in doing the Verslavy cam tensioner mod.  Are they still available by Verslagen1, and if so, what is the charge? I live in the Los Angeles area. Do we have to send him the old one?

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 07/20/22 at 15:10:23


696767796D616D61000 wrote:
I am selling my 2001 Savage with 9933 miles on it, and a buyer might be interested in doing the Verslavy cam tensioner mod.  Are they still available by Verslagen1, and if so, what is the charge? I live in the Los Angeles area. Do we have to send him the old one?

Yes still doing them...

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1180206459

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by och on 10/17/22 at 10:28:15

Interesting that Suzuki has never issued a recall or updated the design on this part, if it only lasts 10k miles.

Title: Re: Cam Chain Adjuster check
Post by verslagen1 on 10/17/22 at 11:47:49

In the right hands, 30k+ miles is not unheard of.

However, beginners typically do short miles so low miles are expected.

At any rate, everyone should check their cam chain every 10k miles.

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