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Message started by cigaro on 01/16/06 at 11:20:08

Title: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by cigaro on 01/16/06 at 11:20:08

Since I have a brand new stock carb, is there any or any tweaks that can be done to it short of rejetting that will nudge a little better performance out of it? And if, say, I put the sportster muffler I purchased on, is there anything I can do with the exisiting stock carb to make it play nice with the Harley muffler, short of rejetting?

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by Steve530 on 01/16/06 at 11:47:58

As far I as can tell from my reading on this forum, if you have the stock muffler and air cleaner, you will get better performance and less backfiring if you replace the white spacer with one that is half as thick and adjust the idle mixture.

If you add a high flow muffler and a high flow air cleaner or either, then you'll get a lot more air to the combustion chamber. That will cause a lean condition which will increase backfiring and make the engine run hotter. The only solution is to increase the size of the main jet which will add more fuel and "richen" the misture.

I installed a HD Dyna muffler weekend before last. The engine was running very lean and backfiring more.

I did both this weekend for my 97. I found a #4 nylon washer at the hardware store that is exactly half the thickness of the original spacer. I installed that with a 152.5 jet. I also removed the snorkel.

The engine runs much smoother with those mods. Seems to have more power too. I just got back from a short ride. to test it out. As I approached home in second gear, I decided to roll on the throttle to see how it would respond. The front raised up and I thought I was going to pop a wheelie for a second. :)

So why did you buy a new stock carb?

Steve

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by cigaro on 01/16/06 at 12:08:40

Well, it came with the bike, which is new. I've put 147 miles on it so far. So I was thinking that it should be in good shape, given that it's new. I'm not sure what's involved with putting in the half spacer. Do you have to take all sorts of things off? The bike is running pretty well, given that it's new, I've never done any kind of mechanical work like that and I don't want to screw things up....

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by Savage_Rob on 01/16/06 at 12:43:33

See the Mid-Range Power & the White Spacer (Backfire) (http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?board=tech;action=display;num=1104205157) and Carb Specs. (http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?board=tech;action=display;num=1098869040) threads in the Tech forum.

The procedure is pretty simple. You do have to remove the seat and fuel tank to get the top of the carb off but heck, you almost need to remove those to do anything.

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by Steve530 on 01/16/06 at 12:52:03

I also had to remove the battery box. to get the carb off.

If your bike is running well, you might just want to leave it alone. I know I would leave it alone until the first dealer service.

Does it backfire a lot?

Steve

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by Savage_Rob on 01/16/06 at 12:55:08

Steve530 wrote:

Hmmm... I didn't remove the carb. I just worked on it in place.

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by cigaro on 01/16/06 at 14:18:15

Good advice Steve530. The bike is running well (particularly after it gets warmed up), and I think it does make sense to wait until the first 600 mile service, and maybe until after the one year warranty expires. Still, all of these tips are quite useful. As far as the LS650 goes, this is absolutely vital information.

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by Steve530 on 01/16/06 at 15:05:35

Savage_Rob wrote:

Hmmm... I didn't remove the carb. I just worked on it in place.

I needed to remove the carb to dip it anyway.

How did you manage to get the screws out of the top of the carb while it was on the bike? With it in my hands I still stripped three of the for screws. And I would have thought the top tubes would block access to the carb.

Steve

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by BS37066 on 01/16/06 at 16:14:31

I couldn't get the top off the carb to do the spacer without removing it from the bike. The main jet I could have done in place.

I did the drilling of the mixture plug on the drill press and I'm glad I did. But I can certainly see where that could be done on the bike as well.

If you own a Volkswagon Beetle or a motorcycle, you're not a mechanic until you've held the engine in your hands.

:)

I just realized that you could rotate the carb while it's still on the bike, but it's easier to remove it to do the spacer mod.

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by Dynobob on 01/16/06 at 19:27:11

BS37066 wrote:

I just realized that you could rotate the carb while it's still on the bike, but it's easier to remove it to do the spacer mod.

That's the trick. Rotate the carb. I did mine with the carb on the bike. Remove the tank and seat and it's not so difficult. I stripped several screws, but the pointy vice grips took them out no problem. The screws are too soft. Replaced them with stainless steel allen heads and all is well.

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by SeeAPierce on 01/16/06 at 19:58:23

Quote:

There's no reason to not re-jet...especially if you're looking at a sportster (or any more open) muffler. Review the posts in this forum and everything will go well.

I did the white spacer mod with the carb on the bike - even when the screws stripped out I was able to vice-grip them off. I was not able to vice-grip off the bowl screws, so ended up removing the carb from the bike to re-jet. I replaced all those screws with alan heads, so if I need to change the pilot jet I should not have to remove the carb again.

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by simplyput2600 on 04/05/06 at 10:23:28

i have a bone stock 1999 ls650 and i just purchased at dyna HD muffler, but should i rejet to 155 or 152.2 which one is better? keep in mind i currently have a stock air intake, i will get to the k&n after the rejet and pipe is installed.

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by Savage_Rob on 04/05/06 at 11:13:19

Steve530 wrote:

How did you manage to get the screws out of the top of the carb while it was on the bike?

I just used an offset screwdriver but I did make sure the fit was perfect. Using one even slightly small will make stripping them much more likely. Maybe I just got lucky. Regardless, I replaced all four of those and all four from the float bowl with stainless allen screws. They're a whole lot easier after that. And with a ball-tip allen wrench you can get at them from an angle pretty easily too.

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by Savage_Rob on 04/05/06 at 11:18:07

simplyput2600 wrote:

It's so easy to swap 'em, you'll probably wind up trying both. When I was playing with mine, I couldn't tell any difference between a 152.5 and a 155 so far as how she ran. The only noticeable difference was that I got better mileage with the 152.5. I was using a MAC muffler and a K&N replacement filter on mine, so you may get different results. I'd bet on the 152.5 though.

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by Jim_R on 04/05/06 at 11:59:04

wow thats kinda what I experienced too Rob. I think with the 155 it was a tiny boggy(hardly noticeable) when u opened up the throttle but the 157.5 was way too much. Super boggy with the 157.5.

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by simplyput2600 on 04/05/06 at 16:47:00

i have a 1999 savage, and i just got it jetted, and got a dyna pipe on. the next move is to get the k&n filter. so where do i get the k&n filter, and what is its model # or specifications, so i can buy the right thing.

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by Lion on 04/26/06 at 23:40:41

I am new here so please help me. I want to do the white spacer mod but I don't know where to get a half-sized one. Anyway I have an LS400 (the Japanese version).

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by Savage_Rob on 04/27/06 at 06:27:55

You don't get a half-size white spacer. You either file/sand yours down or you replace it with comparable washers.

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by mmp on 04/27/06 at 08:13:27

For those of you that replaced the screws on the carb with allen head screws (like SeeAPierce), what size screws did you need to replace the carb screws?

I am planning on doing the white spacer mod and re-jetting the main and pilot in the next month or so. Before openning the carb up, I want to have the replacement screws on so that I don't have to run to several stores because I don't always have the best luck when I head to the hardware store (they always seem to be out of whatever I need, but only what I need).

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by Savage_Rob on 04/27/06 at 10:46:39

I'm sure somebody knows because this question has been asked before and the answer is in another post somewhere. However, all I did was pull one screw from the top and one from the bottom and took them with me to Ace Hardware and picked up four of each size in stainless allens.

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by Savage_Rob on 04/27/06 at 10:49:52

Searching on the words stainless allen carb size turned this up, among others.

Another post... (http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?board=RubberSideDown;action=display;num=1133308231;start=9#9)

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by Tammi on 04/27/06 at 11:34:19

Just to add to the post linked by Savage_Rob above, the thread is 5 mm and the pitch is 0.8. You'll need both of these numbers when you go to your local hardware store for the replacement screws.

The lengths of the screws, as indicated in the linked post above, are 10 mm and 15 mm.

Although since both of the holes that you thread the screws into are open ended (that is, they go through to the other side), you can use longer screws if necessary.

Cheers. Tammi

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by Tammi on 04/27/06 at 11:41:44

simplyput2600 wrote:

so where do i get the k&n filter, and what is its model # or specifications, so i can buy the right thing.

The part number for the K&N air filter is SU-6595, and you can order it right from their Web site.

Cheers. Tammi

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by mmp on 04/27/06 at 17:06:00

Thanks Savage_Rob and Tammi. I just want to make sure that I have them in hand before starting to open the carb up. Especially since I am unlucky at find parts I need here in Lansing. I have been to Lowe's, Home Depot, Ace, Autozone and Radioshack and NONE of them carry #4 washers. Hard to believe I know, but this is what I have found by going from one store to the next >:( So, I don't want to run into the same problem with the allen head screws.

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by steelwolf on 04/27/06 at 17:23:23

Somewhere on here it was suggested to go to Radio Shack to get the #4 washers. I couldn't find them at any of the places you looked either. Also they said that sometimes they may scrub the sides. Just a heads up. You may want to just get an extra white spacer and file it to 1/2 since you are gonna be buying parts anyway.

Title: Re: 'Richening Up Stock carb'
Post by Savage_Rob on 04/28/06 at 07:11:53

mmp wrote:

I personally have my best luck with stainless hardware at Ace Hardware.