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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Flat black paint: What am I getting myself into? /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1137363836 Message started by Banger on 01/15/06 at 14:23:56 |
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Title: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself into? Post by Banger on 01/15/06 at 14:23:56 Hey all. I'm wanting to paint my bike this winter. In fact, the tank (yellow) and fenders and airbox covers (black metalflake) are already stripped off the bike and the tank itself has even been emptied, plugged, and had a preliminary sand done on it. However, I want flat black. My idea is to eventually do away with a lot of the flashiness of the bike, because I am attracted to the utilitarianism of the LS650 more than the looks. In an effort to change those looks, I'm thinking of going with a flat black, and I've already stripped the sissy bar and chrome strips on either side of the rear fender and like the look. So what am I getting into? Will, say, PPG epoxy primer hold up to the elements as a topcoat? That was what I was looking at shooting. This is part of a much larger customization, but it's also probably the hardest and most important part, and will need to be done in a couple months. So it's time to make a decision on paint, eh? Help and experiences (especially experiences!) are greatly appreciated. Regards, Banger ======== |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by Jim_R on 01/15/06 at 14:37:49 cant you just get flat black paint and flat clearcoat? utilitarianism ? Sorry my biker brain is limited to two syllable words and bad spelling. |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by Banger on 01/15/06 at 14:52:21 Re: flat black paint and flat clear coat... I can get flat black paint, sure, but I've been thoroughly confused by PPG's numerous product lines. The best I could find lately was to get a special clear coat that works well with a retardant. It's supposed to, at a 10% mixture, take some of the "shine" out of the clear coat. Utilitarianism...you know...doing a job very well and not being overly flashy about it. Regards, Banger ======= |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by Ed_L. on 01/15/06 at 15:33:34 Ah, you are creating a "sleeper", looks unimpressive but runs like a raped ape. Can't help much with the paint, most flat black isn't sealed and will pick up oil and grease. I've seen some rattle can semi-gloss in a clear, try an automotive paint store or talk to a body/paint shop. |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by Steve530 on 01/15/06 at 15:48:29 Why not just get some utilitarian paint? Like a rattle can of Krylon flat black. If it picks up oil and starts to shine, use some degreaser and spray a fresh coat. Steve |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by Greg_650 on 01/15/06 at 16:15:16 Banger wrote:
I've heard of something like that From talking to a painter....it's the way they make a gloss into a semi-gloss or a satin. There is a way, and I'm sure you'll want to find a way to seal it. Or your Utilitarian bike will just turn into a Rat Bike. How about just a polished steel tank with a gloss clearcoat too? Unless there was a little Bondo touch-up done at the factory, that is. Might look good with flat black 8) |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by Banger on 01/15/06 at 18:35:31 Definitely wanna find a way to seal it, then. I wasn't sure if the primer would start to look ratty after a while, but that was my worry. I was hoping there's a good way to do PPG clear in a satin finish. I'll be talking to the paint store about it soonly, I'd reckon. Really don't wanna go for the rattle can job, 'cos I can't be arsed to touch up my paint every three to six months (possibly sooner...I put about 300 miles a week on her as soon as the weather's warm enough to permit riding at 7.30 in the morning). And believe it or not, I gave brief thought to going with the bare metal look on the tank and back fender (running no front fender and no airbox covers) but can't feel too comfy with that. I like rat bikes and survivor bikes, in theory...just not in practice. Besides the paint, I'm getting new rear lights that'll fit under the fender easily (sort of a steel plate with two smallish, round lights), new signals that hopefully mount pretty flush to the rear fender, dual headlights (Euro-style), a new handlebar like the new S40 straight bar and riser combo, and I'm going to see how she sounds and runs with a muffler off my old 1975 Honda CB500T. The pipe looks good on the Zook and fits the mounting bracket and header with no trouble! Adventure awaits. Regards, Banger ======= |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by threezukes on 01/15/06 at 18:54:53 Steve530 wrote:
Yup thats how I painted my bike. I started by just sanding off the clear coat and scratches. I read somewhere that it was not really necessary to strip everything down to the bare metal. Then I used a few layers of grey primer, followed by a few coats of Krylon's Sand Dune color, no clear coat. So far the fenders and side covers are still looking pretty good, but the tanks is beginning to look like it could use a new top coat. I don't think I will though, I kinda like the used look. |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by Dynobob on 01/15/06 at 19:32:09 As long as you use flat black paint and not primer you should be fine. Primer isn't impervious to water and will allow your utilitarian bike to rust. No clearcoat needed - just flat black paint. I'm wondering if maybe satin black might be better ? That's the way the Harley Street Bob looks to me. Not flat but satin. |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by Banger on 01/15/06 at 20:30:12 My stepfather (who will be doing the painting, incidentally) was discussing this with me a couple weeks ago. I definitely like a satin finish, though, regardless of how I go about getting it. Wouldn't the absence of clear coat (even a satin-effect clear as discussed earlier) cause the black to fade pretty quick in UV rays? That's my main concern with this method. Keep these responses coming. Experiences and ideas with painting are helping me already to better understand what I'm about to get into here. Regards, Banger ====== |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by torque on 01/16/06 at 06:48:30 if you want your paint job to last,u must have a clear coat,it will protect the paint from the suns rays,which cause color fading(yes black paint does fade),as mentioned before u can get flat clear coat,just call around local paint shops,or better yet go inside and see the paint for yourself.all u would need to do is add hardner,and reducer then spray it.make sure u stir the paint very good,and always use paint strainers to keep the klumps out. are u doing the frame too? if so u should get candy apple red to paint the rims. then add some whitewall tires and you would have a old school bike. here's a pic of my bike,without the forward controls and 3 foot sissy bar http://www.bikepics.com/pics/pics/suzuki-savage-95-bikepics-460183.jpg |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by Banger on 01/16/06 at 07:57:01 Nah, not doing the frame. Already black and, well, I'm not wanting to fool with it. Less paint, less time, and it won't affect the looks that much I don't think. I'll ask the local paint shop how to make a satin clear coat over flat black automotive paint. I've seen guitars (Fenders, to be precise) going with a satin clear over flat paint colors for a very cool look. That sort of finish in black would seem to be every bit as good as straight primer rattle can stuff, but would likely hold up longer. Regards, Banger ====== |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by vroom1776 on 01/16/06 at 11:54:53 Flat black gets dirty very easily. Everything on it shows. Check out my header pipe... rest of the photo is a little dark to see the filth. http://bikepics.com/pics/pics/suzuki-savage-97-bikepics-502774.jpg Hey Torque, I'd love to see a pic of your bike with your sissy bar. |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by Savage_Rob on 01/16/06 at 12:26:19 I've been considering having my tank, side covers and fenders powder coated flat black. |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by Banger on 01/16/06 at 16:16:07 Can you powder coat in flat black? That might not be a bad idea. I looked into powder coating at one time when I was considering ways to get my front fender chromed and wanted a cheaper alternative. Turns out that's not the way to go...at least, it's not really too close to the true look of chrome. At any rate, powder coating the bike flat black might be cool. And durable, I suppose. Regards, Banger ======= |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by Savage_Rob on 01/17/06 at 06:08:56 Banger wrote:
Definitely. In fact, it used to be one of the few colors you could powdercoat with. Now they have a lot of colors available. |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by torque on 01/17/06 at 06:46:45 vroom1776 wrote:
will do as soon as i can steal jim-r's camera :D |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by Ruth_A on 01/17/06 at 14:15:09 My husband resprayed my old Savage black using Hammerite spray cans (gloss black). It was no problem and looked lovely - much easier to look after / touch up afterwards too. I guess the key is good preparation and rubbing down. He thinks he used some sort of furniture rubbing compound on it (supplied by a mate who worked as a French polisher), so not sure if you'll be able to get that! But I would have thought the usual things (T- Cut?) would work just as well. I'd say go ahead. And when you've done it show us how nice it looks - I'm trying to persuade him to do my current Savage the same way at some stage! So far we've just stripped it down and cleaned and painted under the mudguards to help delay the inevitable rusting. The factory paint under there is so thin it might as well not be there. Ruth_A :) |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by Banger on 01/17/06 at 16:24:37 Not to mention Suzuki's non-use of primer beneath their factory paint. Long known to cause premature rusting, should you get a minor scratch or scrape in the paint at some point. Especially a problem, as you say, below the fenders. I'm really looking heavily into this powdercoating thing, though. Besides probably costing a bit more, it looks to be the most durable, fool-proof option. I've found a place called GPC (Georgia Powder Coating) which is nearby enough to keep shipping charges from being too rediculous. Prices for M/C fenders range, according to the site for GPC, around $150. Tanks would likely be a bit more. Side covers, I imagine, would be miniscule in cost, comparitively. Done all at once, who knows? Maybe a bit of a quantity discount. The fact that these guys have done a lot of work for YearOne and have projects featured in Hot Rod and similar publications seems like a good indicator of their quality. What do you think? Regards, Banger ======= |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by SAMM on 01/17/06 at 16:30:45 Sounds a little high... I can have a local company do my frame with swing arm for $150...Im thinking this will be next winters project... |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by Banger on 01/17/06 at 16:57:28 I'm assuming they're accustomed to Fat Boy fenders, though. As I find the cost seems to be based on the size of the part to be powder coated, I'd think the Zook fenders might be a bit cheaper. To be honest, too, I was thinking of going without the front fender...'cos, well, the bike looks good without it. This is all very formative ideas, but whatever. I'm just looking so heavily at this Georgia company 'cos it'd be cheaper to ship there than to ship to California (where I've found a LOT of powder coat specialists so far) or the northeast. I'm in Tennessee, so GA is a hop and a skip away. Who are you dealing with, offering to do your frame and swingarm for so cheap, if you don't mind my asking? Regards, Banger ======= |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by vroom1776 on 01/17/06 at 17:53:32 As far as powder coating prices, go to a local custom shop and ask them who they use. |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by SAMM on 01/17/06 at 18:06:40 Im in portland oregon, to far for you to ship ...but there must be other places your direction that does retail and comercial jobs..This local guy will even glass bead and prep. the frame to relieve any rust for the $150...I called him a fiew months back , he does small parts to auto and truck frames... He is in Clackamas Oregon a stones throw from Portland |
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Title: Re: Flat black paint: What am I getting myself int Post by vroom1776 on 01/18/06 at 08:43:38 Here's another idea: go to a local automotive performance shop. A lot of those folks do ceramic coating and can do powder coating too. |
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