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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> PLEASE HELP /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1099370436 Message started by tarheel365 on 11/01/04 at 20:17:10 |
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Title: PLEASE HELP Post by tarheel365 on 11/01/04 at 20:17:10 <sigh> my bike left me stranded by the road tonite i managed to park her in a nearby school but i'm not sure what's wrong with her. heres what happened. i'm riding and i slow down to like 10-15mph in 3rd and she started hesitating so i put a lil more throtle. then she back fired 3-4 times and then just started losing power. i pulled over and i tried to start her up again but she wouldn't start. it turns over but just won't start. then i tried again and it ran weak for like 5 seconds then a flame came out of the exhaust.(orange if it matters). i nice rider on a bandit came by to see if i was ok and he suggested the reserve. tried it...nothing. i have plenty of gas. so i figured it could be either the spark plug or the carb. i mean it has been sitting for like 3 months or so before i got it. i need suggestions....also is the spark plug something i can pick up from a local automotive store? thanks |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by Susan on 11/01/04 at 20:44:05 Sorry to hear about your trouble. I moved your topic to Rubber Side Down as I think more people will see it here. Also the Technical Corner is more for long-term technical documents. We have a lot of really smart mechanically-minded folks in here so I'm sure some will weigh in soon with some ideas for you. Hope you're up and running soon. |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by PRH111 on 11/01/04 at 21:13:16 I am going to say you should pull that spark plug and look at it as it may have fouled when you dumped it into 3rd at such a low speed (especially if it had sat for 3 months). You may be able to get it at a local auto parts store...but them darn autolite spark plugs are slightly smaller than the NGK or Nippon Denso plugs (I think 11/16" instead of 18mm) so be careful about using the sparkplug tool on it. You will probably need to write down the sparkplug number for the auto parts store. |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by Greg_650 on 11/02/04 at 03:48:13 tarheel365 wrote:
I wouldn't expect the spark plug to cause you a sudden break down, but I would suspect something with the electrical system as the culprit. Since you have plenty of gasoline in the tank, open the bowl drain screw at the bottom of the carb a little bit. Does gas come out? Before buying a plug, I'd pull the one installed, and check the color and condition. Also, check your battery for proper voltage. When you get the bike home (if not already), let us know what you find. |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by tarheel365 on 11/02/04 at 04:58:45 thanks its still in the school lot. i gotta get it transported to my house. if gas comes out thats good right? could a gunked up carb or fuel line cause this? could it also be the octane rating on the gas i used? i think i put in 87 out of habbit. do i have to remove the tank to get to the spark plug? well good thing its at the end of riding season. thanks for the help |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by Greg_650 on 11/02/04 at 05:45:48 tarheel365 wrote:
Yes, before kids screw it up. Luckily, a lot of schools are closed today for the election. Quote:
Yes, because that eliminates one possibilty. Quote:
Unlikely if it was running fine before it died. There could be foreign gunk in the carb, but if you drain it into a glass jar you'll see. Turn the petc_o_c_k to the PRI position (rearward) to ensure gas flows. That action also tends to flush the float needle.. If there is water or crud, it will be in the bottom of the jar and you can see it. And then you may know your next course of action. Quote:
No. Absolutely not. The Savage is intended to run on 87 octane. Quote:
Most likely it isn't a plug that 'just died", but it could have gotten fouled as PRH said because you were going too slow in 3rd. But stalling doesn't normally cause fouling plugs. To get to the plug, you'll at least need to raise the tank alittle to get to the bolts holding the chrome trim cover. Then you can get to the plug. Yep, gotta take the fuel and vacuum lines off (with petc_o_c_k down in ON position). Quote:
Any time. Good luck. |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by tarheel365 on 11/02/04 at 07:28:16 now that i think about it.....i think it may be fouled plugs. i'm not used to the choke being on the side and i forget to turn it off sometimes. i don't think she has a toolkit either, what size sparkplug wrench do i need? |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by Greg_650 on 11/02/04 at 07:35:54 tarheel365 wrote:
Okay, if you left the choke on that could kill the bike. Also, since it isn't a 2 stroke, fouled plugs are not as serious. If you snuffed it with the choke, then simply turning off the choke and hitting the starter may start the engine. |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by PRH111 on 11/02/04 at 07:42:40 tarheel365 wrote:
I could not find a single plug wrench that would work other than the Suzuki toolkit plug tool. |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by PRH111 on 11/02/04 at 07:51:08 In case you don't know it is pretty easy to check the plug (just hard to get it out). Ground the outer metal of the plug with the plug wire still attached and try to start her up...if it is fouled there will be no spark in the gap. If it isn't fouled there will be spark in the gap. |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by Greg_650 on 11/02/04 at 08:01:44 PRH111 wrote:
Also, hold the plug with some insulated pliers and don't look directly at the spark plug hole. Both can surprise you. Aside from that it isn't easy to do without a helper, since you have to hold the clutch and push the starter button and hold the plug. |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by PRH111 on 11/02/04 at 21:37:08 Greg_650 wrote:
I just tied the clutch down with a piece of twine. I did forget to mention the insulated pliers though! (doh!) |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by tarheel365 on 11/03/04 at 04:57:33 got it started thanks everyone. i replaced the plug (it was black) i also noticed the black hose from the petcock to the carb had been disconnected and i had no gas. i dunno how that hose came off. an 18mm deepsocket and an extension for a ratchet will work to take out the spark plug...but u need pliers to pull it out. but now she runs flawlessly....i'm gonna check the plug later today to see any discoloration......and the weather here is still beautiful. ride safe! |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by Greg_650 on 11/03/04 at 06:23:13 tarheel365 wrote:
Well, that's a lesson. You just ran out of gas. Never expect hoses to come off without knowing.... You mean the smaller black hose with the spring around it? If so, that turned off your petc_o_c_k. If you had flipped it to the PRI position (not knowing about the hose) the bike would have started. That hose should also have a little spring clip on it to keep it in place...but those can get lost. Lugging it at slow speed in 3rd is what caused it to be black. If it had been running nice and hot before a normal shut down, it probably would have been tan color. It really wasn't necessary to change the plug, but since you did you at least learned something. If the bike is running "flawlessly", I wouldn't even check it again. Unless you just want to..... :D |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by tarheel365 on 11/03/04 at 06:35:58 the thing i don't understand is......i thought i had plenty of gas. and when i was on the side of the road....we put the petcock in all the settings(res,pri,on) to see if we could start it. but it didn't start. if i ran out of gas shouldn't i have gas in reserve? when the hose disconnects is it possible for gas to come out? how do i stop the rear brake from squeeking? its soo annoying! |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by Greg_650 on 11/03/04 at 06:40:03 tarheel365 wrote:
Which hose? The one with the spring around it or the larger one? Quote:
Take it apart, clean it, and/or install new shoes. |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by tarheel365 on 11/03/04 at 06:41:17 the shorter black hose. |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by klx650sm2002 on 11/03/04 at 06:48:08 With the vacuum line detached it would be V-lean even on pri, You would be lucky to start it even with choke. Clive W :D |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by Savage_Rob on 11/03/04 at 06:58:16 tarheel365 wrote:
That sounds like the fuel line. |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by Greg_650 on 11/03/04 at 07:11:18 klx650sm2002 wrote:
No, no. That is exactly what PRI is for. It is meant for use after maintenance when the bowl may be dry. It will fill the bowl....and BTW, in the other forum you might remember the long discussions with people confused about which position is actually PRI or RES. Many were switching to PRI when the meant to use RES. It does the same thing just without vacuum control. |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by klx650sm2002 on 11/03/04 at 07:27:01 I realise what Pri is for, but what I was thinking was that the vacuum line would be letting lots of air into the engine side of the carb, leaning it out lots.What do You think. Clive W :D |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by Greg_650 on 11/03/04 at 07:39:56 tarheel365 wrote:
They are both normally black hose....but ....I ask, the one with the spring or the larger one, and you answer, the shorter one. Am I confused? Okay, I think the shorter one would be the larger one too. If it is the shorter one AND the larger one, with both ends ONLY on the LEFT side...that would be the fuel line. Here's the scenerio of what MIGHT have happened. You are riding along feeling real cool. Just the sound of your bike, the wind in your face, and not a care in the world. Right? You are putting through a school zone, and your fuel line falls off the tank or the carb. Gas is coming out, but it is going in the wind behind you and you don't know (I've seen this). You can't smell it. You still have gas in the carb bowl, so the bike continues running while the line is leaking (kinda like a plane dumping fuel). Then the carb runs dry and the engine dies. Well, when the engine dies, you just lost your vacuum on the SMALLER black hose that is normally covered in a spring AND goes to the RIGHT side of the carb. This shuts off your petc_o_c_k automatically too (its job). And when that happened your carb was empty and no fuel was leaking out. So you are left standing there saying, "What happened?" Now, things aren't so cool anymore. You are out in the middle of nowhere by a school. You freak out and panic. "What ifs" are running wildly through your head. You flag down a passing Bandit. You try all kinds of things, but nothing works. So you quickly try to make it to the safety of your home before dark, and post a message for help. Then the next morning you go back with a fresh mind and plenty of light and there is the hose hanging there. Viola. Problem solved. Either that, or one of the school kids was goofing around and pulled the line off just to mess with you, and if that's the case, we don't have a clue what happened....because after all, you orignally stated that you had plenty of gas. ;D |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by Greg_650 on 11/03/04 at 07:45:55 klx650sm2002 wrote:
That is feasible, but if you'll remember...one of my tricks for letting the carb run dry, is to let the bike idle with the vacuum line disconnected from the carb. The bike will idle fine without this line connected, and I think that to actually create a vacuum doesn't require a large orifice in the carb. It just needs to be a sealed line to work. |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by klx650sm2002 on 11/03/04 at 07:51:24 O.K. You're right, it was just a thought. Clive W :D |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by klx650sm2002 on 11/03/04 at 08:07:18 Like a brake line,more of a pressure transfer than a volume transfer. Clive W :D |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by Greg_650 on 11/03/04 at 08:16:56 klx650sm2002 wrote:
That's it. Just enough to move the diaphragm. |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by tarheel365 on 11/03/04 at 08:54:32 i figured thats what happened...so i shouldn't keep it on PRI...but rather ON? oh well....live and learn |
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Title: Re: PLEASE HELP Post by Greg_650 on 11/03/04 at 09:13:09 Right. Put it On and then RES for the extra ~25 miles. If you leave it on PRI, you won't have the RES at all and you'll be dead on the road out of gas. This was discussed a lot in another forum so I have this picture... http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/215/215131/folders/156030/1296639Petcock02web.jpg |
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