SuzukiSavage.com - Print Page

SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl
General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> head gasket replacement
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1093891244

Message started by sunny on 08/30/04 at 11:40:44

Title: head gasket replacement
Post by sunny on 08/30/04 at 11:40:44

my head gasket is seeping. i still have compression so i know it isn't blown, but it looks like i'll be busy this winter...

how difficult on a scale from 1 to 10 is it to do this?
1 being easy...

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by jendesigner on 08/30/04 at 11:42:55

Just curious, how do you know it's the head gasket? Have you replaced the "infamous" plug on your bike?

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by Jon on 08/30/04 at 12:22:44

> my head gasket is seeping.

My bet is also with the plug issue. In the interim before you get it fixed, clean the engine with Gunk degreaser occasionally so the weeping oil doesn't bake onto the fins.

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by sunny on 08/30/04 at 12:23:02

the reason that i know it is the head gasket is because just the seam and the fin below where the gasket is located has oily black junk on it.

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by sunny on 08/30/04 at 12:27:28

and i just washed my bike two weeks ago so i know it is recent, and not baked on or old.

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by jendesigner on 08/30/04 at 12:31:31

Mine had that same thing and it was the plug. When I first got the bike I had the head gasket replaced and when I got it back, it started in all over again. Cheaper to replace the plug first and then if needed, the gasket. To this day I don't know if I really need the head gasket replaced. But it did have 10,000 miles on it.

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by Jon on 08/30/04 at 12:48:26

> Cheaper to replace the plug first and
> then if needed, the gasket.

The cylinder head cover will be off to do the plug, and at the same time you can retorque the head (gasket).

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by jendesigner on 08/30/04 at 12:57:50

That makes since. I had a dealer do the head gasket and they never even said anything about the plug. No, I'm not surprised. I know so much more now, so I chalk it up to experience.

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by sunny on 08/30/04 at 13:36:08

the area underneath and around the plug is clean. the only area with black junk is in the imediate vicinity of the head gasket.

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by Greg_650 on 08/30/04 at 14:27:02

sunny wrote:

the area underneath and around the plug is clean. the only area with black junk is in the imediate vicinity of the head gasket.

Just to be sure....you are absolutely sure that it is leaking from here?
http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/215/215131/folders/156326/1210002HeadOff01web.jpg

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by sunny on 08/30/04 at 15:14:27

yes. that is exactly the place.

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by Jon on 08/30/04 at 15:52:58

> yes. that is exactly the place.

Don't doubt you, but I'm scratching my head. From that area the oil would come from the camchain tunnel. If the head was loose enough to allow oil weeping, you should also be getting compression leakage. Curious.

Any thoughts, Greg?

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by Greg_650 on 08/31/04 at 03:01:49

Jon wrote:

One or two...

There is, in fact, a pressure oil passage next to the cam chain tunnel. And the head gasket has 2 sets of sealing adhesive ridges. There is also an "oblong" ring that seals the area where the oil is rerouted up from the cylinder and through the head. So there is pressure oil present within the head gasket, and the oil can leak out without a loss of compression.

Another thought is that the use of external oil lines on engines like the Enfield Bullet isn't such a bad idea.

http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/215/215131/folders/156030/1210807HeadOff02web.jpg

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by wrench on 08/31/04 at 09:05:19

> Another thought is that the use of external oil lines on engines like the Enfield Bullet isn't such a bad idea.

Until you've owned an Enfield Bullet. The banjo feed line fitting at the head needs to be loosened/tightened at every oil change to let air escape so the rockers get oil. Exterior lines are soft tubing, and they break or pinch, so after a while you end up buying new line. It was the same with all the early bike designs.

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by Greg_650 on 08/31/04 at 14:41:30

wrench wrote:

Oh, I know, and you can tell from my photos that I've been there. I'd rather find another oil line than change a head gasket, but I didn't know other little procedure of cracking the line for air. Most early bikes had them because it was easier for machining/casting the engine parts...times have changed.

Anyway, this old timer finds those chrome, shiny, rounded, shapely, exterior oil lines kinda sexy :P

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by sunny on 09/01/04 at 07:43:34

judging from the friend's reaction when i told him about this problem, this is a difficult thing to do.
am i correct?
or is he just being a control freak again?

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by Greg_650 on 09/01/04 at 14:37:07

sunny wrote:

judging from the friend's reaction when i told him about this problem, this is a difficult thing to do.
am i correct?
or is he just being a control freak again?

Well, this ain't just shade tree experiments with jets :P

First, you have to have tools, a torque wrench, a manual, and the patience to do it yourself. If you want.

It can be done with the engine in the bike, but I won't kid you, you have a lot of work to do. You'll have to seal the headcover, the plug, and adjust the valves too. I can guide you through it, if you are committed. Here is what it looks like....
http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/215/215131/folders/156030/1212861HeadOff03web.jpg

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by sunny on 09/22/04 at 08:32:28

update:
in light of the fact that it was only seeping a little and i still had compression i opted to just wait. now this morning it is doing a slow very messy, drip. but i still have full compression.
so tonight i am going to see if the bolts need tightening.

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by Greg_650 on 09/23/04 at 03:06:47

sunny wrote:

update:
....so tonight i am going to see if the bolts need tightening.

How are you going to do that ???

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by sunny on 09/24/04 at 07:38:13

didn't get to it due to getting sick. blech.

but aren't there two bolts on the cam chain tunnel side to hold the upper part to the lower part?
i'll look and see.

the part of the engine where the head gasket actually is located is still clean. and it's still clean underneath the plug. just from the seam downward, very big mess.

Title: ;DRe: head gasket replacement
Post by AL_DOWN_UNDER on 09/24/04 at 13:59:57

ANYBODY NOT SURE IF ITS THE PLUG OR THE HEAD GASKET . THERE IS A SIMPLE TEST WHEN THE ENGINE IS COLD PUSH SOME WHITE RAG DOWN THE COOLING VENT NEXT TO THE EXHAUST PORT . LET IT SIT OVER NIGHT, THEN PULL IT OUT IN THE MORNING IF ITS GOT OIL ON IT THEN YOUR PLUGS LEAKING. ;D

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by Greg_650 on 09/25/04 at 02:22:36

sunny wrote:

There are 2 nuts, front and rear center, for 2 upside down studs for the head, but I don't believe that just tightening them will help anything. There are also 2 chrome nuts on the cam chain tunnel for the cylinder (near the crankcase). Again, those only hold the cylinder. Any other "tightening" requires the head cover removal.

You say that it is NOT the plug, right?

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by sunny on 09/27/04 at 07:41:25

head seal plug (http://s89319542.onlinehome.us/pics/hsp/)
i am not so sure now.

but what i find incredibly unclear is just where in this array of pictures the bleeping head seal plug is?

all bolts were properly tight when i and my friend checked them this weekend.
i changed the oil and filter saturday and now the right side of the engine is covered in a nice film of clear, clean oil...

i am feeling very frustrated by my own incompetance.

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by Greg_650 on 09/28/04 at 02:33:24

sunny wrote:

He has a photo there (in that amazing collection) but it is a little fuzzy. This is the plug...

http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/215/215131/folders/156326/1248715HeadPlug01web.jpg

It is located above this nut....

http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/215/215131/folders/156326/1248714CylinderNut01web.jpg

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by Greg_650 on 09/28/04 at 02:48:59

And I should refer you to this topic, where I posted about the same problem as discussed in Rider magazine.

To tighten cylinder head nuts or not?

PS- I got a general confirmation email back from Rider, and I'm waiting to see their answer :P

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by sunny on 09/28/04 at 08:14:19

looking at all the pictures, it looks that the head seal plug is a new problem. oh boy.

i reckon that when i decom the bike for winter that replacing the gasket will solve the earlier problem of seeping because the seeping wasn't coming from where the plug leakage is, which is around the front. the seeping was only on the right side...

and i'll prolly get the plug done this weekend. ::crosses fingers::

twofold problem=pita

Title: Re: head gasket replacement
Post by Munson_kl279 on 09/28/04 at 10:52:01

I'm having the same problem with my '86. But it seems to be seeping around the whole area. I haven't really had any problems thus far and it really only seems to happen badly when I've been riding for a longer period of time (more than 1-1/2 to 2 hours straight riding).

I figure since it's almost time for the snow to fly I'll live with it the way it is and when I take the whole bike apart this winter I'll fix it then.