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/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Politics, Religion (Tall Table) >> Gaza how it started... /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1747683078 Message started by zevenenergie on 05/19/25 at 12:31:17 |
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Title: Gaza how it started... Post by zevenenergie on 05/19/25 at 12:31:17 Take a look: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/U_rTXJcTgeQ |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by Serowbot on 05/19/25 at 13:13:25 WWII happened as well |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by zevenenergie on 05/19/25 at 14:03:50 Take a seat... But now you are for the perpetrators. In fact, you are arming the perpetrators. Doesn't that make you just as guilty of genoside? Being misinformed about history is no excuse. because what is happening there now, is out of all proportion. Everyone can see it... you too! Just like I could see that she should have said that the tattoos weren't real. remeber.... Opinions don,t make it right. Opinions are obstacles. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by WebsterMark on 05/19/25 at 17:35:10 7E6172616A616A6176636D61040 wrote:
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by zevenenergie on 05/20/25 at 02:42:55 What you would consider proportional for Oct 7? I don't know, Israel would do well to publicly acknowledge that it is historically wrong. And they would do well to take care of the population now. Food, hospitals, humanitarian aid. Make plans for the reconstruction of Gaza. Ask foreign countries to install a peace army. And then apologize a thousand times for the structural oppression since 1950. In words and deeds over and over again. Only that would heal their collective trauma from the Second World War. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by WebsterMark on 05/20/25 at 03:02:03 Well those things are never going to happen because they have no basis in reality as I explained before. If that’s the position of the Islamic nations surrounding the area who refuse to allow refugees into their nations and to assimilate them onto their populations, then Israel will finish what it started. Wipe out every Hamas fighter, clear Gaza of any weapon or person with even a hint of a desire to kill Jews, take it over, rebuild it and manage the population. They picked a fight with a bear. They came into his cave because they were told it’s theirs but it’s not. I suggest they go elsewhere and set up a new camp and stop being pawns for countries who are just using them. And it would helpful if people like you would stop with the nonsense that Israel stole their historical homeland, that all they want to do is kill Palestinians. All this is doing is getting innocents killed. I asked you before this question. If Israel laid down all their arms, what would happen? If Hamas laid down all their arms, what would happen? Israel would be immediately attacked and destroyed. Not so with Hamas. That’s the difference. That’s why you’re on the wrong side in this. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by zevenenergie on 05/20/25 at 04:13:45 Just because I can't come up with a solution to the Middle East conflict, or because you ask difficult questions doesn't mean I'm wrong. I have been saying for many years that the nature of these kinds of problems in the world are not political, economic or military. And that they cannot be solved in this way. It is a spiritual problem. Or better said, a lack of spirituality. Look at the rise of China that arose when they started working together with the West. Now that they are going too far, to conquering the world, see how long they can keep that up. Good luck with that. America frees Europe from the Germans and prosperity explodes. Then America wants to rule the world and it is on the brink of an economic crisis because of its national debt. The Germans show remorse and make amends, and their economy grows to great heights. What fate awaits the West now that it throws all democratic values [ch8203][ch8203]overboard, Who wants to work with that? Israel is digging its grave at the moment. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by WebsterMark on 05/20/25 at 09:46:00 The US is not throwing its Democratic values overboard, quite the contrary. And Israel is digging out of its potential grave. Trying to establish peaceful relations with the Palestinians has gotten them nowhere. Palestinians don’t appear to want peace, they want to put Israel in a grave. You can’t live with people like that. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by zevenenergie on 05/20/25 at 12:44:16 So you admit that genocide is being committed instead of a war? https://www.youtube.com/shorts/ICkI-xE3iE0 |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by MnSpring on 05/20/25 at 13:33:42 293625363D363D3621343A36530 wrote:
Wonder what happened to those people that disrupted ? Did they go to jail, were they fined, did the FBI go nuts and send them to prison ? Interesting that a opinion/protest by conservatives, is totally different then the SAME THING done by UL, DFI, FDS, Socialists. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by Needles on 05/24/25 at 06:25:39 I don't know how old any of you are, but Israel is only there because they TOOK Palestine, all except Gaza. Their "Justification" was the "Bible". 6000 years ago, the Jews wandered in the wilderness. In the 1950s, they decided their wandering ended in what was Palestine, so they took it, with help from the USA. THEN they pushed the UN into freezing territorial boundaries. If you start with the idea that ALL of Israel was taken from the Palestinians, it's easier to understand the conflict. Palestine used to have Christians, Jews, and Muslims that all lived together. There are not many Jews or Christians there these days. The Muslims justify the conflict with just wanting their country back. It's Northern Ireland all over again, on steroids. If the rest of the world, including Islam AND the US just left the whole thing alone, except for war crimes, they would have to negotiate a settlement, though, ironically, Israel would likely be like Germany in the 1930s, and dictate all the terms. I got no dog in this fight. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by Eegore on 05/24/25 at 12:09:09 The current structure of the US Government is based off the same principle. Those humans alive at the time TOOK the land, culture and resources of the "Native American" tribes. The primary difference is this took place at a time when nothing else could be done about it by foreign entities. Secondary the religious component is completely different, versus being different interpretations of the same thing. The stability of the US Government is owed to their ability to fundamentally incapacitate the ability of the Native American to fight back. If we remove ethics, this is called an effective long-term resolution. The situation with Israel is unfortunate however the simple fact is until they can eradicate the primary source of effective resistance, the planet will have to deal with it. The same thing technically applies to Hamas, however they are not in any calculated position to succeed until they or their allies can reliably manufacture and hide high-efficiency biological or nuclear weapons. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by thumperclone on 05/25/25 at 05:34:27 the area has been in turmoil before there were Muslims and before Christ before there was a Roman empire |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by zevenenergie on 05/25/25 at 08:37:35 The whole world has been in turmoil before there were Muslims and before Christ before there was a Roman empire. From the moment man ate the apple, the symbol of knowledge of duality, of good and evil, he lost his unity with Being. He began to identify with thoughts, judgments, fears and desires. Paradise was not left physically, but inwardly. Man became lost in thought, cut off from the center of his consciousness, from the silent, living Now. The serpent, the voice of the ego, still whispers: “You are not enough… you must know more, have more, become more.” And so man strays further from his origin. And commits genocide before the eyes of the whole world. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by LANCER on 05/25/25 at 09:34:50 So what is the origin of man ? And what is his (our) purpose ? |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by zevenenergie on 05/25/25 at 10:24:08 767B74797F68282D1A0 wrote:
Tanks for asking :) The origin of humanity is a mystery, and being, simply existing in the present, is the starting point to approach it. From that state of being, the right action arises naturally, without force or calculation. This makes us truly responsible, because we act from clarity, not conditioning. So the real aim is to arrive at a point where we can say: “Thy will be done”, not as submission, but as alignment with what is. And that's the same as being fully yourself, all the time. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by thumperclone on 05/25/25 at 10:43:12 [quote author=342B382B202B202B3C29272B4E0 link=1747683078/0#13 date=1748187455]The whole world has been in turmoil before there were Muslims and before Christ before there was a Roman empire. From the moment man ate the apple, the symbol of knowledge of duality, of good and evil, he lost his unity with Being. He began to identify with thoughts, judgments, fears and desires. Paradise was not left physically, but inwardly. Man became lost in thought, cut off from the center of his consciousness, from the silent, living Now. The serpent, the voice of the ego, still whispers: “You are not enough… you must know more, have more, become more.” And so man strays further from his origin. the fable of creationism and the promise of paradise is an attempt to exert control over men we evolved period hopefully still evolving into something better than what we have been |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by MnSpring on 05/25/25 at 11:25:35 637C6F7C777C777C6B7E707C190 wrote:
Then you said: 405F4C5F545F545F485D535F3A0 wrote:
Which is it ? And how does that make the Jews Bad people, for defending themselves ? |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by zevenenergie on 05/25/25 at 11:29:03 5448554D504552434C4F4E45200 wrote:
If you are talking about a religion, yes, because that is actually a control system. But Jesus did not start Christianity him self. It has never been a promise but a law; Whoever is really interested in consciousness coincides with it. When you are in the hustle and bustle of everyday life, you completely coincide with thinking. But when you are through nature or a bit on your motorcycle through the mountains and you are struck by the beauty of the surroundings. Then you dissolve in, love, joy, god, consiusnes, Allah. That is the bad thing about all religions, they have placed it outside of you. That you have to achieve it, but you already are, Its just Veiled by thinking. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by Eegore on 05/25/25 at 11:36:22 That is the bad thing about all religions, they have placed it outside of you And all this time I was thinking it was the justification for killing other humans. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by zevenenergie on 05/25/25 at 11:49:51 And how does that make the Jews Bad people, for defending themselves ? You say they are bad for defending themselves. Not me. But I think you have to look very carefully whether killing children, destroying homes and infrastructure and starving the population stil has self-defense as its goal. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by zevenenergie on 05/25/25 at 11:59:19 6F4F4D45584F2A0 wrote:
Take responsebility.... Eegore That's what you, do when you justify genoside. Step out of your Christian and cultural conditioning and look at it cleanly as a child, and you find your self in shock. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by Eegore on 05/25/25 at 12:07:35 Take responsebility.... Eegore That's what you, do when you justify genoside. Step out of your Christian and cultural conditioning and look at it cleanly as a child, and you find your self in shock. I didn't know I was Christian. I justify Genocide typically by economics. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by zevenenergie on 05/25/25 at 13:30:55 Than you now its a calculated reaction. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by Eegore on 05/25/25 at 14:09:59 Than you now its a calculated reaction. I also wouldn't call it genocide. If it were then they would be killing a lot more, a lot faster. This is urban warfare. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by zevenenergie on 05/25/25 at 14:22:40 That,s your opinion, right? |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by MnSpring on 05/25/25 at 14:33:16 594655464D464D4651444A46230 wrote:
YEP, Self defense is the goal of the Jews. What percentage, of the civilian Palestine's, (not the Hamas) do you believe: Knew of the tunnels ? Knew of the hiding Terrorists and supplies in Hospitals ? Know who the Hamas Soldiers are ? How many, PROTECT Hamas, in any way they can. If the people, were NOT Hamas LOVERS, their would be: Tunnel over there, and other their, etc, etc, etc. Hospitals are being used to Hide weapons and Terrorists. The Terrorists use that building, and the one over their, and that other one, etc, etc, etc. for their headquarters. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by zevenenergie on 05/25/25 at 14:56:09 I wrote; But I think you have to look very carefully whether killing children, destroying homes and infrastructure and starving the population stil has self-defense as its goal. Did you? Look verry Carefully..... And did you see Israel being attacked Now? Or do you see Palestinians having to defend themselves against the Israelis? |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by MnSpring on 05/25/25 at 15:22:57 The world sees a group of people being attacked by TERRORISTS. The world sees a population of people, aiding, hiding, encouraging, allowing, TERRORISTS to do what ever they want. The world sees, some people, sometimes get in the way. Only the Fairy Dust Sprinkling Gullible Socialists, believe it is genocide. (Because they are told that, by the TERRORISTS) If it was genocide, it would be done by now. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by Eegore on 05/25/25 at 15:23:05 Did you? Look verry Carefully..... And did you see Israel being attacked Now? Or do you see Palestinians having to defend themselves against the Israelis? So Guy 1 punches Guy 2 because that guy's great great grandfather committed crimes. Guy 2 punches Guy 1 back 4 times. Guy 1, who punched first, is obviously the victim. He's defending himself against Guy 2 who is overreacting and abusing his strength. At most a victim of an assault should only punch back an equal amount, or 1 extra time so as to ne proportional. Not enough to make sure they aren't punched again, that's genocide. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by zevenenergie on 05/25/25 at 15:39:45 Suppose you are the biggest boy in school and you see two kids fighting Who do you help? The strongest or the weakest? Or do you intervene? It's time for the world to take action. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by Eegore on 05/25/25 at 15:47:22 Suppose you are the biggest boy in school and you see two kids fighting Who do you help? The strongest or the weakest? Or do you intervene? It's time for the world to take action. Lets say the biggest boy for decades has been helping both keep their hands off each other, but the little boy keeps killing the larger boys kids. Then celebrating the murders. Help the little boy because he's smaller? Help the bigger boy so the killing ends? Keep telling them to stop fighting? None of those options are good, but the idiot in this equation is the little boy murdering the families of the bigger kids creating fights he will never win, unless The World steps in and saves him over and over. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by zevenenergie on 05/26/25 at 00:26:36 I think that the way people in different countries perceive the conflict in Gaza is strongly influenced by how their media presents it. In the US, for example, large media companies have often shown a more pro-Israel perspective due to political, economic and cultural factors. In the Netherlands, the picture is often more critical, partly due to different editorial choices and a different political context. International organizations such as the UN, Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch have made very serious accusations against Israeli actions, including the possible commission of war crimes and genocide-like acts. The term “genocide” has a legal definition, and the International Court of Justice is now looking into it. Until there is a verdict, you can formally say that it is still under investigation, but the fact that such a lawsuit is even going on shows how serious the situation is assessed by international bodies. In the Middle East, a climate has prevailed for years that has ensured that this situation has arisen. Committing genocidal acts will only worsen this climate and Israel will increasingly suffer the consequences of appropriating the Gaza Strip in the future. After the fall of Assat, it also took a piece of Syria. This too will have consequences in the future. It is safe to say that Israel has a very selfish and aggressive style of land grabbing. You can say that this is self defense but I see another agenda shining through. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by Needles on 05/26/25 at 06:58:48 The US has traditionally supported Israel since the McCarthy-ites thought they were ushering in Armageddon. Why they wanted Armageddon is anybody's guess, but the tradition blinds many people to the atrocities committed by Israel. I don't any enmity towards Israel, but wrong is wrong, and it's not right just because your friend is doing it. BOTH sides have atrocities they need to answer for. |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by zevenenergie on 05/26/25 at 08:43:21 https://www.youtube.com/shorts/lI9PbjVIB0Q |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by Serowbot on 05/26/25 at 10:48:43 I think Webster pointed it out If Israel ceased fire, Hamas would attack If Hamas ceased fire, there would be peace If they could just all live together in a single country called Israel Judaism, Christianity, and Islam all worship the same god just in different ways ...or just get rid of god worship and live together as peaceful civilized humans This God stuff really makes a mess of things Atheism is the fastest growing not religion in the world |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by zevenenergie on 05/26/25 at 11:11:18 2036213C24313C27530 wrote:
Humanity has a common religion: Thinking We worship it, We defend our ideas tooth and nail and are prepared to commit genocide over it. We are fanatical extremists from morning till night. And we live on the same planet. If only that wicked Palestinians proveb, there would be peace..... :-/ |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by Needles on 05/26/25 at 13:22:14 "What we are doing in Gaza is a war of extermination: indiscriminate, unrestrained, brutal, and criminal killing of civilians," said Olmert, who led Israel during the 2008-09 Operation Cast Lead war on Gaza. "We are doing this not because of an accidental loss of control in a particular sector, not because of a disproportionate outburst of fighters in some unit—but as a result of a policy dictated by the government, knowingly, intentionally, viciously, maliciously, recklessly." Former Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert |
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Title: Re: Gaza how it started... Post by Needles on 05/28/25 at 13:54:24 https://apnews.com/article/icc-israel-hamas-warrants-netanyahu-palestinian-arrest-73c854d072e0a1a41b19b2cb2cdd07fa |
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