SuzukiSavage.com /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Strange start issue /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1682348986 Message started by stanabay on 04/24/23 at 08:09:46

Title: Strange start issue Post by stanabay on 04/24/23 at 08:09:46 Hi I have an 87 savage I have rebuilt over the winter, rockers, cam , gaskets, etc. I put it together and it fired right up. Needed carb tuning..no problem. Rode about 5km in small test rides, all good just running rough because of wrong jets. Start it up one day, ride down to the gas station to put air in the tyres, turn it off to fill gas, and now it won't start. It was "whirring" while trying to start, like the starter had broken a gear. Bugger. Trailer her home. Decomp was not attached.Now it is. Now the juicy part With decomp attached I get 2 or 3 thuds, like a normal start up noise, then back to whirring. Bugger. But good sign the starter gears are OK? Opened head inspection port, things moving while trying to start. Good. So now I take an extra sparkplug I have that I know is good, attach to lead and watch for spark while I crank. I ONLY HAVE SPARK WHILE THE DECOMP VALVE IS OPEN. Decomp disengage and back to whirring and no spark. disconnecting decomp no spark at all. Battery is charged and hooked up to car with jumper leads, no change. All safety switches are gone. Any ideas guys? I'm at a brick wall

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by verslagen1 on 04/24/23 at 18:18:27 2D2A3F303F3C3F275E0 wrote: Start it up one day, ride down to the gas station to put air in the tyres, turn it off to fill gas, and now it won't start. It was "whirring" while trying to start, like the starter had broken a gear. Bugger. Trailer her home. you might have a couple of broken teeth in your starter gear that just somehow lines up right to get you started. to check, remove the starter and use your finger to spin the gears. you should only be able to go one way, if you can go both ways then you found the broken tooth.

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by stanabay on 04/25/23 at 06:52:29 Have not removed starter yet. I found this though, could this be causing this strange spark issue? Startor has seen better days also

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by stanabay on 04/25/23 at 06:54:40 I didn't change this on the rebuild due to them costing way to much. Have ordered a used one now. Is this the culprit?

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by verslagen1 on 04/25/23 at 07:57:48 those would could cause strange charging issues

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by stanabay on 04/26/23 at 07:31:50 Anything else i should look at while I wait for my new stator?  Anyone?

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by stanabay on 04/26/23 at 07:38:02 Theory im running with now, is i think I read somewhere that the decompression thing controls spark while its "on" When it's "off" the job gets passed to the stator and ignition pickup, which on my bike don't look to good. Theory sound?

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by verslagen1 on 04/26/23 at 07:52:56 4245505F50535048310 wrote: Theory im running with now, is i think I read somewhere that the decompression thing controls spark while its "on" When it's "off" the job gets passed to the stator and ignition pickup, which on my bike don't look to good. Theory sound? don't think so. the TCI has a lead to the starter and retards timing while starting. the decomp is only active for a half second... not long enough to get it started.

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by stanabay on 04/26/23 at 10:57:59 Quote: don't think so. the TCI has a lead to the starter and retards timing while starting. the decomp is only active for a half second... not long enough to get it started. heres where i got my theory http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1262917566

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by verslagen1 on 04/26/23 at 18:51:51 so it's the fuses fault, did you replace the fuses?

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by stanabay on 04/26/23 at 22:01:59 Yep

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by stanabay on 05/21/23 at 06:43:28 so finally got some time to look at the bike. Starter spins both ways. Im confused how this will give me spark while the decomp valve is engaged but not after. anybody can explain it to me?

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by stanabay on 05/21/23 at 06:44:17 btw i replaced the startor, no change

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by verslagen1 on 05/21/23 at 08:01:26 7C7B6E616E6D6E760F0 wrote: Starter spins both ways. sorry, I might not have been clear.  The starter will be able to turn both ways by hand, but the gears that it engages with will not.  Remove the starter, put your finger in the hole it came out of and turn the gear.  As there is quite a bit of reduction, it will take some time to turn the gear completely around.  What you are looking for is a spot where the gear can turn both ways. Quote: Im confused how this will give me spark while the decomp valve is engaged but not after. This maybe a clue.  1st, the decomp should only be active for half a second.  Shortly before the starter engages and deactivated shortly after, max 1 or 2 revolutions.  Sparky fires every compression and exhaust stroke, so you're seeing maybe 4 sparks and no more? Ok, next rabbit hole.  Sparky fires when the mag field in the coil collapses.  So maybe a bad wire? And are you sure your "whirring" sound is not a clicking sound?

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by stanabay on 05/21/23 at 10:14:37 Yeah, i push start button, decomp opens, I have spark and "standard" starting noise thump thump, decomp closes, no spark and whirring from starter.

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by verslagen1 on 05/21/23 at 10:29:43 7C7B6E616E6D6E760F0 wrote: Yeah, i push start button, decomp opens, I have spark and "standard" starting noise thump thump, decomp closes, no spark and whirring from starter. well if it's whirring it's not turning and why would it spark?

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by stanabay on 05/21/23 at 12:51:20 Yes, that's why I'm trying to figure out. Decomp is on i have spark and starter works normal, decomp disengage and no spark and starter starts whirring

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by justin_o_guy2 on 05/21/23 at 14:09:04 Versy y is saying If it's Whirring, the motor is Not turning over. So, no spark

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by Moarpower on 05/21/23 at 16:55:12 My first thought would be broken teeth. Happened to mine. Nightmares ensued

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by stanabay on 05/21/23 at 22:50:10 Yes. My point and why I am so confused now is why would the starter work fine while the decompression engaded, but as soon as its disengage it starts whirring

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by Moarpower on 05/21/23 at 22:53:26 If could just be as simple as a bad starter, or the decomp is allowing it spin easier and make it to the bad teeth. Have you examined the starter gears yet ?

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by DragBikeMike on 05/22/23 at 02:20:33 You have a 1987 model.  That year had straight starter drive gears (no over-torque limiter).  Some folks modify those old engines to accept the newer starter drive system that utilizes an over-torque limiter.   The over-torque limiter can wear out and slip.  Any chance your bike has been modified to utilize the over-torque limiter? Does your starter drive look like this?

Title: Re: Strange start issue Post by DragBikeMike on 05/22/23 at 02:21:07 Or does it look like this?

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