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Message started by Furby on 07/15/22 at 13:21:12

Title: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/15/22 at 13:21:12

Hey all,
I just got my savage back out of storage since 2012 :'( but now I’m having problems with it starting and staying on. I’ve redone the carb and put new gas in and it’s draining my battery ( new ) since I keep trying to get it started. It gets going once I. A while with the choke on but stalls when it’s off. Don’t know what to do in terms of turns on the air fuel screw. I need your help!! I want to ride this summer but doesn’t seem like I am going to be able to

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by ohiomoto on 07/17/22 at 10:14:55

Not being able to keep the bike running has nothing to do with the air screw. You probably have a bad petcock and/or a gummed up carb (and now a low battery).

The good news is that you know it will start and run. Keep the battery topped off. If you have an original vacuum petcock, set it on prime for now and consider replacing it with a new OEM version or an OEM Yamaha raptor petcock.

Not sure what "redone" the carb means, but...

If the petcock is good, you'll have to clean the carb and possibly replace a couple of the jets and the float needle. Don't bother with the "rebuild" kits. Most of the time they don't come with the right parts and cause more problems than they fix.

Change the oil once you get it running. It may have gas in it or water from years of condensation.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by verslagen1 on 07/17/22 at 10:35:31

don't burn up your starter, let it rest in between attempts.

don't let it idle on the kickstand for long periods, while leaning, the cam doesn't get evenly oiled.

put a 2x4 under the kickstand so it's nearly vertical.

if it won't transition to the main jet, you need to clean it and the needle jet and blow out the passageways.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/17/22 at 10:57:29

Ohiomoto - Oops, by redone… I mean I cleaned the carb. Why I mentioned the air screw is That I noticed while I had the carb out that once I took out the mixture screw it didn’t have an o-ring or spring on it.
Sometimes I have to many thoughts in my head. I truly believe I need a new petcock because mine is not dealing properly on the tank too. :o

Verslagen1 - gotcha man, I will try that 2x4 trick, it starts first thing in the morning but then has trouble all the other times. Which I would think it means that it’s flooded? I’m trying to get this girl running again and feel like I’m missing some things.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/17/22 at 11:00:31

If you don't put it on Prime you're not doing yourself any favors.
Use ether. Or brake parts cleaner.
After ten years, the oil that is supposed to be in the cylinder probably isn't.
If you have already pulled the plug then whatever was going to fall in probably has, but blow it clear anyway. Spray some light lube in, spin it over with the plug out. After that if you can't get it to try, the plug may have oil on it, check it out.
The stock petcock is famous for letting gas in the oil, if it's over full on oil,it's probably got some gas in it.
The bowl on the carburetor doesn't get gas till the engine vacuum opens the petcock. It's probably hard and needs replace and you need to put a Raptor petcock, about thirty bucks, on it. If you get a cheap one the fuel lines are skinny and don't work.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/17/22 at 11:47:49

I think I need that raptor petcock for sure. I stored it and the was injured with multiple surgeries so I am sad to say I didn’t store it properly and didn’t do it any favors. If anyone has the link or part number for the petcock I’d much appreciate it.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/17/22 at 12:48:02

was injured with multiple surgeries

They sure get in the way of living, don't they? I got home yesterday from hospital.
I'm betting the cylinder is dry,read what I posted. You don't have to put the tank on to get it running. Fill the bowl, if the weather is warm and the choke is on if you twist the gas it's easy to flood. The battery has to be charged, it can be turning over and no spark happens if it drops too much. It sounds like it Otta start, but it won't.
You have a voltmeter?
Charger?
You can use brake parts cleaner to blast the crap from around the plug before you pull it to oil the cylinder.
And you can open the air filter and squirt a whiff in there or if the seat is off just a quick shot down the snorkel. Don't get crazy with it. You're just looking for a bump,then hit it again just a hair harder. If it catches you can spritz little shots in and keep it lit while the engine starts pulling fuel. I do that with every engine that is being stubborn or just parked a bit too long. I get long life out of my mower batteries. If it's been sitting a few weeks I bump it off on ether.
Heck,WD40 has a butane propellant, or used to. You get oil and fuel.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/17/22 at 14:31:07

Yeah man, hospitals suck for sure. Mine was a blown knee ( acl ) and heavy infection,6 surgeries in total with bone grafts and donor tendons. They were talking about amputation if it didn’t get better. Luckily that wasn’t the case. Hope your stay was better.
I have a charger but no voltmeter, so what were you meaning with the spark plug out? I’ve been making it start once a day basically, I’m going to do what verslagen was saying about the 2x4 when I do get it started and my air filter was clogged. I took it out for the time being but now I feel I’m getting too much air maybe?

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by verslagen1 on 07/17/22 at 15:16:47

516265756E170 wrote:

I have a charger but no voltmeter, so what were you meaning with the spark plug out? I’ve been making it start once a day basically, I’m going to do what verslagen was saying about the 2x4 when I do get it started and my air filter was clogged. I took it out for the time being but now I feel I’m getting too much air maybe?

It's starting, so that's half the battle won.
with no air filter, it's running lean and that's why you have run it on choke.
best to get a new one asap.
and it maybe why it's stumbling when you twist the throttle.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/17/22 at 15:41:12

Sounds like you're just about to win it.. Go with what Verslagen said
If it's hitting, it's firing the plug,
Play on!

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/17/22 at 15:56:36

Sounds like I’m going for a new air filter asap and we will see how it goes!!

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by ohiomoto on 07/17/22 at 17:54:01

Did you remove the diaphragm and slide when you cleaned the carb?

I didn't get mine seated correctly one time (even though it looked like it was seated right). The bike would stumble and sputter. It pulled the top, put a little grease in the grooves, reinstalled it, and it ran perfectly after.

Still sounds like a classic petcock failure, but the more ideas you have to work with the better.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/17/22 at 21:39:52

Ohio, yeah I took it all apart. I believe I’ve got it all back together properly. I will check the next time I’m working on it and see if I’ve done everything correct if these other things don’t work. I’m having high hopes!!

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/18/22 at 09:16:10

It runs on Prime just fine. If your petcock rubber is harder than a healthy one, sometimes they run okay at low rpm, when the engine is producing more vacuum, opening up the petcock and the engine is not using maximum fuel. At higher RPM you have less vacuum and you need more fuel,,
If the diaphragm is busted you are losing some vacuum and fuel can get in the oil.
No matter what, you should get a Raptor petcock on it. If I bought a new one with zero miles,I'd swap the petcock in no more than a year.

Dear Gurus

Would it be helpful for him to cap the vacuum and test on Prime?

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/18/22 at 09:55:20

I did see a post, where you take the vacuum hose off of the petcock and give a suck on the hose to see if fuel is coming through to see if the diaphragm is leaking. I tried this and it’s like I’m sucking through a straw, I don’t know if there should be back pressure with this action but it felt like there was no pressure at all :o got nervous that I was just inhaling gas fumes.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by verslagen1 on 07/18/22 at 11:48:36

0E3D3A2A31480 wrote:

Not good, is it a new hose? they do leak after awhile.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/18/22 at 13:42:16

I'm thinking the test leaves the hose on the petcock and off the the vacuum source. You want to test the petcock, so apply vacuum to the petcock and see what happens.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/18/22 at 14:26:24

Vers, it’s all old stuff. I think the test was to see if the diaphragm was leaking right?
Justin, I’m going to look into that raptor petcock tomorrow. All the shops are closed Monday so I’ll see if they have them. If you have a part # that’d be great help.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by jcstokes on 07/18/22 at 15:56:17

Sorry, I don't have a number, but it's got to be genuine Yamaha Raptor 660 and not a Chinese knock off. There are smaller raptor ones so be careful.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/18/22 at 18:30:49

I feel much more comfortable when I have the
Soon to Be Replaced
part with me when I'm buying the replacement.
I don't know that part number.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by verslagen1 on 07/18/22 at 18:40:56

use my tech section index link
go down to petcock
test your petcock
it's in there somewhere

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/19/22 at 13:08:04

So. I just took the carb back out and the air hose from the air filter is damp with fuel. Taking it apart now. Any information would be great if you’ve seen this problem before

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by verslagen1 on 07/19/22 at 14:24:54

I've seen it... usually when the rpm is too low and the valves don't close fast enough causing a little burp of fuel.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/19/22 at 14:28:31

Oh. Gotcha. So up the idle screw? maybe because I’m having issues having it start it’s spitting through or need to get do more work?
By the way, really appreciate all the help you guys are. I was part of this site way back when I first had the bike and you guys have all been awesome! Glad you’re still here!

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/20/22 at 13:55:30

That’s the plug :-/

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/20/22 at 14:29:01

One thing that I noticed is that when I did have it started for a short time, there was a lot of “rust” I’d imagine coming out from the connection from the header to the muffler. Don’t know if I’m saying that right but here is a picture of the build up.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by verslagen1 on 07/20/22 at 15:13:17

sh!t happens, but if it's blowing out... you gotta leak.
plug is rich, but if you've only been idling it... on choke... it should be.
you wouldn't want to select a plug by this.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by DragBikeMike on 07/20/22 at 15:58:53

You can see from your picture that your idle mixture screw sticks out just a bit. That indicates that you either have it grossly misadjusted, or you have the wrong mixture screw installed. See how your screw is sticking out just a bit.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by DragBikeMike on 07/20/22 at 16:00:54

If it's the wrong screw, or if you have it turned out way too far, it's not gonna idle and it WILL run rich to da max.

When correct, your screw will look like this, way down inside the hole.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by DragBikeMike on 07/20/22 at 16:06:07

Please check your screw and report its position. Turn it in until it bottoms. Use a light touch, just till it bottoms. Don't try to tighten it. Just turn it until it lightly bottoms. Report how many turns it was open. When things are correct it will be about 1-1/2 to 2 turns open.

BTW, if you want help and you appreciate getting the help, have the courtesy to perform the simple diagnostic checks advised and report the results back.

So, how many turns?

Take a picture of the screw when it's bottomed out and post it so we can see how far it went in.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by DragBikeMike on 07/20/22 at 16:11:53

If you have the wrong mixture screw, you will never get it to work. There are lots of carb kits out there that contain a bogus mixture screw. That bogus screw has a needle tip that is way too small, and the body of the screw is way too long. The screw can't throttle the fuel. Its either "on" or "off". You can never adjust the mixture with the bogus screw.

Take out your mixture screw and inspect it. Does it look like the screw shown on the bottom in this picture? If it looks like the one on the bottom, you have the wrong screw. It will NEVER work.

Please take a picture of your screw and post it.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by DragBikeMike on 07/20/22 at 16:24:30

Before you try it again, throw that fouled spark plug in the trash and get a fresh plug in there.

We look forward to seeing your pictures and hearing how things go. Good luck.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/20/22 at 16:31:42

Two turns out. Mine has never as far as I’ve owned it gone in like the one on the picture that you have supplied.
New spark plug has been put in already today.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/21/22 at 12:06:11

Most that I get is a 20 second start in the mornings,( tried to upload video but it says the 5 second video is too long ) fully charged battery, New plug, mixture screw one turn out, set to prime,choke on. 2x4 propping it up a little more. I did order a 2001 raptor petcock today $39.99 cdn. It does have new gas and fresh oil/filter change. 10/40 with ZDDP additive. Fuel filter from the petcock to the carb. No new air filter yet, they’re saying $70 for a new one. So I’m pricing them out. Might do a pod filter if I ever get this figured out.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/22/22 at 13:22:44

Fuel filter from the petcock to the carb.

Some people get away with that, but some don't. The inside diameter of the fittings on the filter restrict flow.
Try it without it,especially if it runs for a coupla minutes, then dies. That would tell me that once the thing uses the fuel in the bowl it's running out of gas.
You could get a clue by pulling the line off the carb and just see what the delivery rate is. If you're burning gas faster than it flows into the carburetor, meh, you get it.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by DragBikeMike on 07/22/22 at 15:08:38

Thanks for the pictures and data.

OK, I can see from your picture that both of your mixture screws are bogus. I would order a stock genuine Suzuki mixtrure screw......BUT........if you feel compelled to struggle with the bogus parts, use the one shown in the top of your picture.

I will try to explain why. First, let's look at the dead giveaway indicator of a bogus screw. It's this shoulder that I circled in yellow.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by DragBikeMike on 07/22/22 at 15:12:03

The stock crew does not have the shoulder, it's just threaded, like this.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/22/22 at 15:15:59

Oh boy. Thanks man. I’ll try to find a kit that has the screw

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by DragBikeMike on 07/22/22 at 15:18:01

Next, the shoulder for the o-ring must be straight. the o-ring isn't gonna work with a tapered shoulder. Correction, the o-ring isn't intended to work on a tapered shoulder, so I suspect it won't work correctly.

The screw on the bottom has a tapered shoulder. The screw on the top has a straight shoulder. The stock screw has a straight shoulder. Hence, choose the screw shown on the top of your picture, or as previously mentioned, buy a stock genuine Suzuki screw.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by DragBikeMike on 07/22/22 at 15:25:29

The screw shown in the bottom of your picture has a thinner tapered needle than the screw shown in the top of your picture. While I have no way to measure your screws, I can tell from the pictures that the needle shown at the top of your picture has a tapered needle that appears to be about the same as the stock OEM Suzuki needle shown in my picture that I posted earlier. The skinny tapered needle isn't gonna throttle the fuel, it's too small. So, you end up with a switch instead of a throttling device.

Can you see the difference between the tapered needles. You want to use the thicker needle. The one shown in the top of your picture.....OR......better yet, get a genuine Suzuki mixture screw.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/22/22 at 15:25:42

I see what you’re talking about man, I haven’t noticed that before!
I was going to ask about the spring/washer/o-ring and how that supposed to go on too. But it seems like what you’re saying is, my mixture screws both won’t work. As I said before, I’m waiting for a raptor petcock at the moment and I’m having a hell of a time finding parts that I need.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by DragBikeMike on 07/22/22 at 15:43:45

Don't be fooled by the way your engine will run on the enricher but then die out when you turn the enricher off. It will lead you to believe that it must be too lean.

The enricher circuit is sort of like a mini-independent carburetor. The enricher plunger opens up a large air passage that bypasses the throttle plate. It provides enough air and fuel to raise the engine speed for cold startup and operation. It's intended to provide a rich mixture along with plenty of air.

When you push the plunger in, it cuts off the enrichment fuel, and it also cuts off the fast idle air. Now the engine is getting only the air that flows past the throttle plate, and the fuel that comes through the idle circuit. If your idle mixture screw has that skinny little taper, it's admitting way more fuel than necessary. You end up with a grossly rich mixture. You go to adjust the crappy screw but since the taper is so skinny it has little or no effect until you bottom the screw out, at which point it goes from grossly rich to grossly lean (the switch effect).

Save yourself a ton of misery. Only use genuine Suzuki parts in this stock carburetor. The rebuild kits are junk. This old post provides some useful information on the carb kits.

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1641171298

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/22/22 at 16:05:08

I appreciate the description, that makes sense. Love the solid info.
I can see that the carb kits are junk now.
I am going to try and source out an actual mikuni kit.
I had the bike in idle today with the choke on and it still shut off after 15/20 seconds.
I found that after I have it started up ( seems to be once a day ) I have to let it sit because it just won’t start again, a little burp of life but then doesn’t fully get going.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/23/22 at 14:52:43

Strange thing happened, the bike started and ran twice for a short time today which was better than usual. Tried a third time and had a big backfire. Then went to crank it again and it was not even turning the starter. The bike was on, kickstand down. Kill switch set to run just like normal and had no connection at all with the starter.( like I kit the start button without the key on ) I pulled the battery and checked it and it had still 90% on it.
I’m charging the battery again and going to see if it’ll start back up.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by DragBikeMike on 07/23/22 at 17:04:03

I would quit torturing the thing until you have a few items squared away.

Figure out why it's not cranking, fix that problem, then let it rest until you get the new petcock and new mixture screw. The "no crank" problem might be better to address in a different post. Have you tried pulling in the clutch lever while you are trying to crank it?

While you are waiting for parts, lose that fuel filter. You don't need it and they restrict fuel flow. They also have a tendency to percolate when the engine gets hot. They cause all sorts of mysterious problems that will drive you nuts. Take it out and install a new fuel line.

While you are waiting for parts, check fuel flow to the carb. Disconnect the fuel line, put a suitable container under the open fuel line, and put the petcock on prime. See how much fuel flows. Time it. Then when you put the new petcock on you can test again and compare.

Now hook the fuel hose up to the carb and open up the drain screw in the bottom of the float bowl. Place a suitable container below the drain and put the petcock on prime. See how much fuel flows. Time it. Then when you put the new petcock on you can test it again and compare.

Try to learn as much as you can while waiting for the correct parts. Don't just keep cranking the engine and trying to start it when you already know it's not right.

BTW, that new Raptor petcock will come with a clear plastic tube over the fuel inlet. That tube is to protect the screen from damage. Make sure you remove the protective clear plastic tube before you install the petcock.

Once you know you have a good petcock, the correct mixture screw, and adequate fuel flow, it's time to try and get it running.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/23/22 at 18:54:39

Read you loud and clear. Thank you for the info.
Will let it relax for the time being and read some more info about the bike.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/24/22 at 08:31:39

that new Raptor petcock will come with a clear plastic tube over the fuel inlet. That tube is to protect the screen from damage. Make sure you remove the protective clear plastic tube before you install the petcock.

They Otta come with a
Remove before flight flag.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by ohiomoto on 07/24/22 at 09:40:18

Everything DBM said. In addition, since your air screw isn't OEM, I wonder if you ever have the correct jets, needle jet, air jets, etc...

Sometimes people mix up the air jets with the piolet and main jets, or they buy a "Kit" that contains nothing that will actually work with the LS650.

Did this bike ever run correctly? My money is on the petcock. Replace that and try again. If it continues to have issues, it might be time to take recheck the carb redo. People mess that up all of the time.

And, I would check the timing chain tensioner and starter if you can't get it to crank again. It's possible something bad happened with that backfire.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/24/22 at 11:50:43

I think I saw it has around 15,000 miles on it.
It's time to take a look in there.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/25/22 at 14:08:52

We’re kilometres an hour here. Around 13k miles

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/25/22 at 14:12:25

The bike was running smoothly a long time ago. Then with years or it being parked before I took it from family and my injury it started acting up.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/25/22 at 14:17:45

2714130318610 wrote:

We’re kilometres an hour here. Around 13k miles

Still time to have a look.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/25/22 at 14:22:52

For sure. Meaning the tensioner as mentioned? I don’t know how to check the compression, I know that’s been talked about before also so I will look that up too if these other things (fuel filter taken out, and raptor don’t work) I did see someone on here had cam chain tensioners on here. I’ll look around again. I do have video of it running but can not upload it because of file size I think

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/26/22 at 11:31:38

New petcock
Feel like I should wash out the tank. Anyone know a good way to do so? Also, I’ve noticed there is no vacuum line as the stock one. What did you guys do with the vac. Line

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by verslagen1 on 07/26/22 at 12:20:25

1D2E2939225B0 wrote:

Also, I’ve noticed there is no vacuum line as the stock one. What did you guys do with the vac. Line

plug it on the carb
cut a bit of line, fold it over and tie wrap it, or put a screw in it.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by DragBikeMike on 07/26/22 at 16:17:00

That's some gooey lookin slime on that old petcock. You said you went through the carb. Was that stuff in the carb too?

You might wanna rinse out the tank with mineral spirits. Pour in a whole gallon, rinse and drain. Then reclaim by pouring the used mineral spirits through a coffee filter. Do that several times until things clean up. It will get most of the loose stuff out of the tank. You can reuse the old mineral spirits to wash parts.

There's all sorts of YouTube vids on cleaning old fuel tanks. They all look like a huge PIA to me. Not my favorite job. Be careful. Good luck.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by TheSneeze on 07/26/22 at 21:34:29

Cleaning my old KZ tank was, well, a two month ordeal. Not trying to scare you away, just mine was BAAAAD!. It sat in So Cal for 28 years outside when I picked it up.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 07/30/22 at 23:17:00

DBM - there was a lot of goo on the petcock but there was nothing of the sort in the carb. It seems like I do need to clean it out but do you think that it’s clogging it? Trying the raptor petcock and it flows through strongly. Still having the same issues, it will start but then shut off in a about 20 seconds. if not shorter. Still waiting on being able to find a rebuild kit that is all genuine parts along with the mixture screw. I’m bamboozled atm and worried I’m going to completely screw something up.
I have followed the advise on here and haven’t been obsessively cranking it. I’ve come to the conclusion I must have messed up the carb when I was in there cleaning it.
I think I’ll try to find the thread here about tear down/ build back so I can make sure I didn’t mess anything up. I think I did something 10 years ago about a white spacer mod or something too. Trying to get my knowledge built back up here so I appreciate your patience with me thank friends!

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by ohiomoto on 07/31/22 at 06:58:19

Your best bet is to return the carb to stock. No mods, no jetting, etc. Once you get it running reliably, you can tune it IF you need to.

So pull the carb.

Take the float bowl off. Make sure the float isn't stuck closed. Measure the float height and write it down. If it's stuck, you might have found your problem, but I would still confirm you have the correct jetting. Pull the float and needle. Inspect the rubber tip of the needle.

Remove the main jet and write down the size. Take note if you have a washer under the main jet. Remove the pilot jet and take note of its size.

Now pull the top of the carb. Make sure the diaphragm was seated correctly. Pull the main air jet from the top and make a note of the size. Pull the pilot air jet and note its size.

Next, inspect the diaphragm for cracks and or leaks. Inspect the slide for excessive wear as this can cause poor performance that you might mistake for poor jetting. A worn slide should not keep the bike from running so no need to spend money on one until you get the bike running.

Remove the needle, taking note of how your white spacer (or washers), spring, and plate are oriented. Write down what needle you have if there are markings.

If in doubt, replace any and all of these parts with the stock equivalents.

The last thing you need to do before reassembling is to make sure all passages are free and clear. If it looks like the carb might have been really gummed up at some point, the passages may still be blocked.

If all of the above sounds like too much, obtain a replacement carb that is known to be good.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/31/22 at 07:57:26

You have the fuel line to the carb on your petcock?
Plugged the vacuum?
I'd be seeing if it would keep running by whiffing a little shot of ether in it when it starts to stumble ,if it keeps running by shooting lift squirts of ether, then you Know it's fuel.

But before that, hook it up,, fuel line on,petcock on,pull the bowl drain and see how much flow comes out the bowl.

If you don't have ether,any spray can that lights and isn't something you Don't want.
Brake parts cleaner ,stuff like that

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by ohiomoto on 07/31/22 at 12:33:34

I like JOGs test to make sure you are getting fuel to the float bowl.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 08/02/22 at 13:50:23

Took out the carb again. Seal was good with the diaphragm. Gas was flowing into the bowl solid from the petcock with the drain on the carb open to gauge flow.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 08/02/22 at 13:51:03

Again

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 08/02/22 at 13:51:23

Again

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 08/02/22 at 13:51:50

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by DragBikeMike on 08/03/22 at 16:51:50

What year is your bike?

Looks to me like your current jetting is in compliance. The early models used a #155 main jet and a #47.5 pilot jet. Needle seems correct too (5C16). The needle jet should be an X8.

One exception might be the pilot air jet in the top, the one you say has no markings. That's supposed to be a #70. A #70 should be 0.7mm or .028". As luck would have it, a #70 drill bit is .028" (purely a coincidence). You can check the jet by inserting the shank of a #70 drill bit. A #70 bit should just fit, a #69 should not fit, and a #71 should be loose. Your jet looks way bigger than .028" but hard to say for sure. Only way to know is to physically check it.

Look at this late model carb pilot air jet. It's a #45. See how super-teeny-weeny it is. Yours should be just a bit bigger. I think yours is wrong but as I said, only way to know is to measure it.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by DragBikeMike on 08/03/22 at 17:10:36

So now, if I am correct, you have a bogus mixture screw and probably have a bogus pilot air jet. Those two components work together to provide the correct air/fuel ratio at idle and just off idle. Since they work together, makes sense that you should replace them both with OEM components.

You mentioned you were still trying to find a carb kit. I don't understand why you don't just buy OEM Suzuki parts. There are plenty of on-line sources, plus your local Suzuki motorcycle dealer should be able to get you the parts. Why are you reluctant to purchase genuine Suzuki parts?

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 08/04/22 at 10:59:42

My bike is an 86.
Not at all against getting genuine parts ( I’d much prefer them ) I’ve put out emails and calls to dealerships for parts and all day they don’t have it. If you have any recommendations of reputable sites to order from I will gladly search on those sites. I don’t have any specific Suzuki shops around me so my only “reluctant” thought is that I buy parts that are junk. I’ve jumped on biting things before and they have turned out like junk so I’m trying to do things properly. I’ve checked mikuni’s site and I haven’t been able to find the carb kit on there.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/04/22 at 12:03:07

I'm not so sure there is a difference between a 2018 mixture screw and86.
The newer jets are smaller, trying to meet emissions regulations

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by TheSneeze on 08/04/22 at 13:34:08

I have had good luck with OEM parts from Partzilla.com

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by ohiomoto on 08/04/22 at 18:43:46

+1 on Partzilla.

My last order was lost in shipping. I emailed them and asked if they could track the package down. They promptly replied that they are shipping out a replacement order. They will arrange return shipping if the original order shows up. Good stuff.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by DragBikeMike on 08/04/22 at 19:48:05

I've always had good luck with Babbitts Suzuki Parts House. I live in the middle of the Pacific Ocean. I get parts pretty fast and haven't had any errors with Babbitts. Totally satisfied.

https://www.suzukipartshouse.com/oemparts/c/suzuki_motorcycle/parts

I checked their site for the two parts you currently know are bogus (mixture screw and pilot air bleed). They have a price listed so that generally means the part is available.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 08/15/22 at 13:38:15

Just a quick update,
I have ordered the jets and the proper air screw and awaiting delivery!
I went with partzilla, super easy ordering and they had all the parts. ( or so it says, we will see when it gets here )

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 08/18/22 at 12:04:04

Just got the parts today. Reassembling the carb now. With the new air screw

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 08/18/22 at 14:47:56

Soooooooooo, I just had a very weird thing that happened to me. I just put the carb back together and installed it. Got everything back together and tried starting it. It almost started… it wouldn’t turn on the starter!
I held start to try to get it going. When it didn’t start up, I let go and it was still trying to crank over, I hit the kill switch and that didn’t stop it either, and the key was out also!
The only thing to make it stop was disconnecting the battery!
Had anyone experienced this before?!

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by verslagen1 on 08/18/22 at 17:00:19

either 1 of 2 things...
stuck relay, give a sharp rap on the fender next to the key
or
fried decomp controller. only fix is new one.
if it's the decomp, unplugging it should stop the starter.

Title: Re: Problems starting!! HELP!
Post by Furby on 08/23/22 at 13:15:56

Truly I’m just tired of problems lol. But I’m just going to try to order new parts vers. Do you have part numbers that I can just order new stuff?
I’ve looked on partzilla for a 32910-24B10 but can’t find it. But it seems to be leading me to Decomp things so I think I’m on the right track