|
SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Politics, Religion (Tall Table) >> Showtime! /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1604407390 Message started by WebsterMark on 11/03/20 at 04:43:10 |
|
Title: Showtime! Post by WebsterMark on 11/03/20 at 04:43:10 For a lifelong political junkie, this is the every 4 year Olympics. My first Presidential vote cast was for Jimmy Carter. I don’t remember much about the early 80’s, my version of the 60’s. Lots of motorcycles, motorcycle accidents, beer, drugs, girls,....it’s mostly a blur. Thank God a wonderful woman had one serious flaw in her life, me, or I’d been worm food a long time ago. I actually voted for Bill Clinton the first time. Then I got a real job and we moved out of town by ourselves. Thrown into the deep end of a pool and being a controller of a multimillion dollar business, I realized what a bunch of BS the Democratic platform was. Taking a dollar from a business, spending .90 cents of that on administrative overhead to run some program that actually only returns.10 cents was legalized theft. I had to deal with unions which was like trying to work with the mafia. Then I had children and realized ProChoice just means ending a life for convenience sake. Hello Republicans and haven’t turned back. For all their flaws, the Republican core ideas are vastly superior to the other side and that was before the Democrats turned and charges straight towards socialism/ communism. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by Serowbot on 11/03/20 at 07:19:49 If Republican core ideas are vastly superior,.. how did Trump ever get elected? |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by WebsterMark on 11/03/20 at 07:33:51 I’m not sure you can remove the filters you’ve put in front of you to understand. Trump is far from ideal, his flaws are many and deep. But despite all those, and in fact because we know all of those, he’s a better choice. Trump is the most honest and transparent politician today. I know everything about Donald Trump, I am able to weigh those against the alternative, and find them acceptable. I know with a certainty how Joe Biden presents himself is not at all how he really is. Joe Biden is no different than many other lifelong career politician. And again like I’ve said before, my very first dividing line is pro choice versus pro life. All things being equal I would always choose the candidate most likely to restrict abortions or at least not ease current restrictions any farther than currently exist. My second choice is the one who demonstrates they understand they don’t have an automatic right to my money. Which ties into my third one closely which is the candidate most likely to leave me the hell alone let me live my life the way I want to. Trump wins on all of those points. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by Eegore on 11/03/20 at 11:42:29 I don't typically vote by party, and if it were up to me I'd remove the house of representatives and attempt a method of zero-party politics using modern technology to have data-driven policy. If I could put a group of investors and ethicists in charge of money I'd do it. I do agree with Webstermark that typically Republican policy is more fiscally responsible. While I may want change, it's not free, so in most cases Republican policy presents useable math, not pipe-dreams. As for abortion, I do not feel that women who are raped by their fathers should be forced to bear a child and be given the explanation that God wanted it to happen. I understand combatting abuse of a legalized system, but to use religion to force women to have children that could kill them during birth or as a product of rape under the "God's Will" platform is ridiculous to me. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by zevenenergie on 11/03/20 at 11:53:22 Through where I was born, I have had to deal with poverty and seen the consequences that come with it such, as crime abuse violence. illness both physical and mental. Later, coming into contact with millionaires and well-to-do businessmen through my profession, I initially thought they were doing better. Besides taking better care of themselves. I found an even bigger flaw there. An enormous arogance. They thought they could bend live to their liking and constantly talked about themselves how wonderful they were. They behaved very socially, but when it came down to it, they did not shy away from pushing everyone into the dark if they benefited from it. My conclusion was that if they could earn money from your death today, you would be on the other side of the grass tomorrow. It was only such a thin layer of civilization that it made me shiver. A network of good old boys who only thought in terms of money and smeared their opponents wherever possible. Their main priority was money, sex and publikrelations. I've seen both sides. It's the same everywhere. It is human nature. Consciously and unconsciously, we choose the people we feel most safe with, because deep down we are displaced and fearful. We say we know things, but we know nothing. We feel like nuts but we say it's going great. We don,t feel at home nor at ease. We have a void in us that we try to mask by consuming. We live from desire to desire, but never get fulfilled. And blame the other person for our unease. In this childlike state we are going to vote. No wonder it's a mess. Left or Right it makes no difference. We cannot solve anything with politics, something has to transform within us. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by WebsterMark on 11/03/20 at 12:38:12 I think you saw what you wanted to see in many of those people. Maybe not all, but many. I was born in absolute poverty as well. When my mother died when I was nine because my dad was too drunk to take her to the hospital, my two older aunts took us four kids into their small middle class house. Many older wealthy church members from the Baptist Church they went to took all of us kids to doctors, dentist, bought us clothes. They did all kinds of things for us. In my jobs, I’ve been fortunate enough to be in close contact with many extremely wealthy people and I’ve never seen anything like you’re talking about. Sure, there’s occasional d!ckhesd but they are the exception, not the rule. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by zevenenergie on 11/03/20 at 13:02:20 I think I,s butiful what you wride. And I'm pretty sure I saw what I saw. I've seen the other side too but that was the exception. It takes strength to carry wealth, that's true. But very few people are able to come to selflove and that is the only source of love for others. I say you had a tough start and I,m happy for you, people took good and loving care of you. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by eau de sauvage on 11/03/20 at 13:04:52 Stop the nightmare, I want to get off. One good thing that has come out of this madness is that it has woken people up out of their self satisfied slumber. I used to be a big fan of Zappa, still am, and he was always imploring Americans to 'don't forget to register to vote'. It's shocking that only 2/3 of Americans are registered to vote. For serious change in the US there needs to be a reenfranchisement. Whether one is a democrat, republican or somewhere on the spectrum, it's impossible to avoid the fact that his presidency has been an assault on the very democracy that is the US and this should make people of all political persuasions deeply troubled. I do agree with Webstermark that typically Republican policy is more fiscally responsible. Maybe once, but it's just branding now. Witness their blowout of the deficit to enrich the already wealthy, in the name of the ludicrous 'trickle down economics'. Not saying that deficits per se are bad, just that it is only a slogan. Watch them go back to their 'austerity' idea once the Democrats are back in power. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by WebsterMark on 11/03/20 at 13:29:19 6040424A5740250 wrote:
You’re going to have to explain you replacing the House plan in greater detail. I heard it said once, and I firmly believe this, but the idea that the US republic is based upon three separate but equal branches of government is not correct. The House of Representatives is at the top of the food chain and the other two are below it. It might not be by much but they are at the top. As far as abortion goes, if that’s the only time it was used in very rare cases like that I agree with it. I wouldn’t like it but I would understand that. But when it gets used as basically birth control and as a means to an fund an organization, no I don’t agree with. A life is a life. Sometimes life must be taken but it should be under rare circumstances and we should all lose sleep over it. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by eau de sauvage on 11/03/20 at 16:23:01 http://https://i.postimg.cc/59gcjzYX/Screen-Shot-2020-11-04-at-10-21-40-am.jpg |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by eau de sauvage on 11/03/20 at 19:01:55 Welp it's a lovely warm sunny day here to watch the election. It's not going to be a landslide anyway. Looks like Trump got Florida which he had to do but still a surprise. Could be down to the rust belt yet again. Ohio might flip which is a good sign. and Texal looks to be turning pretty blue, maybe enough to flip in 2024, but short this time. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by Eegore on 11/03/20 at 19:46:13 FL was a surprise? Not from the news I get. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by eau de sauvage on 11/03/20 at 23:47:02 I think the surprise was the margin for Florida. Once again Michael Moore called it correctly, he said the polls saying 8% were wrong, he said they are actually 4% which is within the margin of error, he called Trump an 'evil genius' and that this will be close. So we are in the nightmare scenario now where it looks like it will hinge on Pennsylvania which haven't counted their mail in ballots and Trump has already called it. No one thought it would happen but Amy Coney Barrett could very well be deciding the election. Absolutely astounding. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by eau de sauvage on 11/03/20 at 23:52:10 Here's Michael Moore predicting this... [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyn5rhRua-c[/media] |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by WebsterMark on 11/04/20 at 04:53:22 Forget about Michael Moore, he doesn’t regularly post ridiculous predictions on this forum, but you do. Now here comes the shenanigans. Two or three critical states that were always known to be battleground states will drag on for a day or maybe 10 days counting votes where the opportunity exist to plant false ballots. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by Eegore on 11/04/20 at 05:51:06 Another example showing that how the world works depends on what you are looking at. https://news.yahoo.com/york-times-fox-news-election-023900450.html |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by Tocsik on 11/04/20 at 05:56:15 I'm not on this side of SS.com often, but this is possibly one of the most civil discussions I've ever read on the Tall Table. Kudos to most so far. Let's keep it this way! We can disagree without all of the venom, name calling and other childish crap. Like many, I was a Democrat in my younger days but registered Republican as I got older (and wiser?). I work in medicine so I see a different side to the abortion issue and it's not an easy concept to legislate. Like many of the doctors I work with (I am not a doctor myself), I consider myself a fiscal conservative and more liberal on social matters. In the end, I believe in our country and think we'll pull through this, one way or another, no matter who wins this election. I believe in our country, but not all of those who live in it. Our social fabric is torn, for sure. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by WebsterMark on 11/04/20 at 06:02:06 I actually watch a lot of CNN last night. Fox was a little to enamored with their personalities and opinions. I wanted to see county by county results and John King did that better. I’ve traveled extensively across PA for past 20 years so I know it well. Also, you can go to NYTimes interactive site and get real time updates,but you have log in for a free account and you’ll be bombarded with ads. You can also go to the state of Pennsylvania site and get a breakdown by county how many votes they have left account. My quick back of the napkin calculations this morning at breakfast to me shows Trump has a slight advantage in the overall. There’s a lot of small counties with only 75% of the vote counted that he’s winning huge the question as well those offset Philadelphia, Alleghany, and whatever questionable ballots they pull in at the end. Instead of hanging chads, we’re going to have magnifying glasses looking at post marks on envelops to see if they’re legit. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by Serowbot on 11/04/20 at 09:15:51 538 has a chart of possible paths to victory for both sides. They can't see a path for Trump without both Pennsylvanian and Arizona... Trump will lose Arizona. You may be analyzing the wrong state. https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2020-election-forecast/ |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by WebsterMark on 11/04/20 at 09:42:55 538 said this wouldn’t even be close so there’s that.... Actually, CNN has had the best and clearest info as far as I’m concerned. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by Serowbot on 11/04/20 at 10:17:37 774542535445526D41524B200 wrote:
good point... |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by eau de sauvage on 11/04/20 at 13:14:02 @wm, ironically what you call 'ridiculous predictions' are in fact optimistic predictions that Americans just got conned and did not really lose their moral compass. Guess I was wrong on that one. Americans have spoken, even if Biden wins, a very large percentage of the population have not repudiated the politics that the debased GOP now represents and that bodes badly for democracy in America and Europe. Down here in Australia, it's like a calm bay in a worldwide storm. McConnell has already indicated that if Biden wins he will do everything within his power to stymie him. And remember no one knows how this current pandemic is going to pan out. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by WebsterMark on 11/04/20 at 13:43:26 5A485C5F484E4C290 wrote:
God keep McConnell safe. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by WebsterMark on 11/04/20 at 13:51:46 4A717D6D77751E0 wrote:
Good points, thanks. Food for thought however. In every nation or organization or any system that ultimately fails, crashes and burns, there’s a point at which you can look back and put your finger on that part of the timeline that was the point of no return. That time when the chance to recover and build passed. Is that where we are? I don’t know. I’ve always told our fair and balanced moderator, Sew, that he would eventually win the war. Trump was merely a four or eight year pause in the leftist’s self-destruction of the United States of America. Trump had a chance to keep things alive for four more years but he blew it. Could not turn his ego off. The best part about a person is almost always the worst part about a person. That’s a truism that applies for many of us as well. Trumps ego is what allowed him to crush Jeb Bush, Chris Christie, Marco Rubio and the rest of those clowns. His ego was the only thing that was going to defeat Hillary Again, I’ve always said he wasn’t a perfect flag bearer but he was the only one we had. He gave us 4 years and now we’re back to where we would have been with Hillary. Actually , we’re way worse off with that stupid little girl Kamala. Seriously, she acts like a child most of the time. It’s unbelievable she’s going to be president in a few months. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by eau de sauvage on 11/04/20 at 14:19:45 that stupid little girl Kamala. Seriously, she acts like a child most of the time. And this is pretty well what is wrong with America, they have a problem with people of colour and women in particular. It's a country out of balance and perpetually at war with itself. It's easy to see why an authoritarian quasi wannabe dictator like Trump is so widely supported. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by Serowbot on 11/04/20 at 14:24:38 695B5C4D4A5B4C735F4C553E0 wrote:
Hello?... Trump?.... Internationally renown manbaby?... http://https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse2.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.H9Dto9wKNlgH8DFRPkMpLQAAAA%26pid%3DApi&f=1 |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by WebsterMark on 11/04/20 at 14:27:16 20322625323436530 wrote:
BS. Nothing to do with her color. Nothing to do with she’s a woman. She’s a joke. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by Serowbot on 11/04/20 at 15:51:12 She was a top prosecutor in California... Trump was reality show billionaire. That's a joke |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by eau de sauvage on 11/04/20 at 16:00:42 This election has reaffirmed that the sentiment expressed below, in this clip from Bowling for Columbine, is alive and well. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58BDrZH7SX8[/media] |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by WebsterMark on 11/04/20 at 18:03:35 6771667B63767B60140 wrote:
No, Trump was an international real estate mega-star that you’ve know for past 25 years. You loved him until he ran as a Republican. And she screwed her way to the top otherwise she was nobody. She was an awful AG which is why she left. The Democrats rejected her for the top slot early on. She has no concept of reality. But she’s an attractive woman of color so Biden picked her. It’s a joke. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by eau de sauvage on 11/04/20 at 18:53:27 The next few weeks are going to be like a British Airways Jet. When they turn the engines off, it's still whining. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by eau de sauvage on 11/04/20 at 19:34:11 Welp, Associated Press had Biden at 264, with 6 votes to come from Nevada where he is ahead. This is without Penn. Fingers crossed. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by Eegore on 11/04/20 at 21:17:45 I'm not on this side of SS.com often, but this is possibly one of the most civil discussions I've ever read on the Tall Table. Kudos to most so far. Let's keep it this way! We can disagree without all of the venom, name calling and other childish crap. If only we had done this all along, maybe people wouldn't see value in pissing contests to run each other off. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by eau de sauvage on 11/04/20 at 21:53:20 If only we had done this all along, maybe people wouldn't see value in pissing contests to run each other off. It was so easy to do. I can't believe it's not butter! |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by Tocsik on 11/05/20 at 06:39:10 6A4A48405D4A2F0 wrote:
Yeah. It's why I avoid this particular bar. I'm here for the bikes and cameraderie. Check please! Peace out, y'all. Seriously, Peace. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by eau de sauvage on 11/05/20 at 06:47:45 @Tocsik, It all started going bad when Trump won office, he made it OK to be an openly racist white nationalist. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by WebsterMark on 11/05/20 at 07:14:20 No one on here is a f’ing racist white nationalist. That BS and people exactly like you is why we are where we are. You cannot shut down speech you don’t want to hear with labels. Kamala Harris is an awful choice as a VP. She’s childlike in her wishful thinking. That’s not a racist or bigoted comment. People don’t get a pass on their behavior based on their gender or the color of her skin. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by eau de sauvage on 11/05/20 at 07:25:58 You cannot shut down speech you don’t want to hear with labels. But you can? The lady doth protest to much, methinks. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by Serowbot on 11/05/20 at 08:01:19 :-? [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbA_Qla38Qs[/media] |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by Eegore on 11/05/20 at 09:46:44 "Kamala Harris is an awful choice as a VP. She’s childlike in her wishful thinking. That’s not a racist or bigoted comment." Right. I get this nonsense too, I am racist because I think her policy is poor in design. Nobody that calls me racist can even talk about one thing she has done, but they know for sure the only reason I could ever think she is not the ideal person to implement her own ideas is because I'm a racist or a bigot. Forget the VP of my own company is a female, and makes more money than me. I am also racist for not posting BLM stuff all over my company. I have black employees, one a manager for the last 7 years, but I'm racist because BLM isn't plastered all over my shop, my gear etc. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by Eegore on 11/05/20 at 09:52:28 "It all started going bad when Trump won office, he made it OK to be an openly racist white nationalist." I agree with this, partially. There are people that feel more empowered by having a vicarious connection to the POTUS, but that does not mean every pro-Trump citizen is automatically racist. It's like the genius I know that started visiting his 77 year old grandfather with health issues without any precautions because "Trump proved it isn't lethal". This guy is a moron, but not every Trump anti-social distancing guy is this dumb. The inability to acknowledge a grey area is a sign of argumentative/strategic weakness. People can have ideas about culture, voting rights, about a President etc. and not be racist by definition. But tossing out the racist label makes it super easy to dismiss their ideas and denigrate one's own communication to slander, childish remarks and similar. At this point for a lot of people the racist/bigot label is used to justify one's own ignorance more so than having anything to do with race or gender. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by WebsterMark on 11/05/20 at 10:20:33 It became acceptable to call people racist for judging the content of their character and not by the color of their skin when the dominant news and entertainment culture began doing so and not objecting when it was done. And it will get far worse when Kamala takes over soon. |
|
Title: Re: Showtime! Post by eau de sauvage on 11/05/20 at 14:06:00 774542535445526D41524B200 wrote:
More to the point, it became acceptable to identify with a racist narcissist. See this article for an insight...https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/nov/05/trump-narcissm-us-election-president Narcissists see what they want to see. What makes Trump more unusual is that an astonishing number of people see what they want to see when they look at him. It’s strangely apt that such a raging narcissist should function as a distorted mirror to so many, one in which they see their own fantasies reflected back at them. |
|
SuzukiSavage.com » Powered by YaBB 2.2! YaBB © 2000-2007. All Rights Reserved. |