|
SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Politics, Religion (Tall Table) >> Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1602362290 Message started by eau de sauvage on 10/10/20 at 13:38:10 |
|
Title: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by eau de sauvage on 10/10/20 at 13:38:10 @JoG I understand that you have a pineapple up your butt about 'what's wrong with insisting on proper voter ID. You know like a drivers license, and how can insisting on that be called 'voter discrimination' you fume. This is how... In 2013, the Supreme Court, in a 5-to-4 decision, struck down a key section of the Voting Rights Act, eliminating the need for a group of mostly Southern states to obtain preclearance from the Justice Department before making changes in voting practices. The state of Alabama moved almost immediately to implement a voter identification bill that had been held up in the state legislature under Section 5 of the Voting Rights Act. The state then closed more than two dozen driver’s license offices, a principal place for obtaining a proper ID. The offices closed were disproportionately in areas with large Black populations. https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/as-trump-refuses-to-say-hell-accept-election-results-republicans-press-to-make-voting-harder/2020/10/10/7cdd69be-0b08-11eb-859b-f9c27abe638d_story.html Before 2006, no state required voters to produce identification. The first was enacted in Indiana and later upheld by the Supreme Court. Today, 36 states have voter ID laws, some more strict than others. In 2012, civil rights groups filed a lawsuit against a voter ID law in Pennsylvania. In the filings, the state, in defending the law, acknowledged that there had been “no investigations or prosecutions of in-person voter fraud in Pennsylvania” and that none of the parties in the suit had any direct knowledge of investigations or prosecutions in other states. And more attempted suppression here. https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/judge-blocks-texas-governors-restriction-on-mail-ballot-drop-off/2020/10/10/70b70cfc-0aff-11eb-859b-f9c27abe638d_story.html |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by oldNslow on 10/10/20 at 14:20:24 Quote:
No. The arguments against it are asinine, disingenuous, and put forth by the folks who are benefited by having non citizens vote or by people who want to be able to cheat. Any more stupid questions? |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by eau de sauvage on 10/10/20 at 15:12:07 there are no stupid question, there are only stupid people. The arguments against it as a Trump appointed Federal Judge said is that there isn't any. The arguments against it presented in the post above which you obviously did not read, is that after requiring ID, the Republican house then proceeded to close down places where ID could be obtained. Seems pretty clear. |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by MnSpring on 10/10/20 at 16:58:22 77657172656361040 wrote:
Not even remotely close. But what would one expect from a Drongo. Now tell us all, (I can’t say, “again” because you never have answered) Tell us all, why a, "SUBJECT”, who lives in a country which has, NO FREEDOM, actually cares ? Or is it that you, just want others, to be as miserable as you ????? ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by justin_o_guy2 on 10/10/20 at 18:25:25 I've never known anyone who didn't have a photo I.D. |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by eau de sauvage on 10/10/20 at 19:02:23 @Mn, you can keep cutting and pasting the same thing as often as you wan't but as I said, it's too ludicrously idiotic to be able to answer. Sorry. Particularly risible coming from someone who lives in the wealthiest country on Earth and it does not have universal health care, and calls itself a democracy when it clearly is not. |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by eau de sauvage on 10/10/20 at 19:04:14 213E383F22251424142C3E32794B0 wrote:
So what, you're a lucky white guy in a racist country. |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by justin_o_guy2 on 10/10/20 at 19:19:29 You're someone who believes he knows things, but is clueless. You have no idea who I've known down through the years. This Racist country Elected Obama Twice.. Do you have a clue as to how many millionaires who aren't white exist here and are treated like royalty? Racist,, you poor fool,, only the racist lefties actually believe that crap.. |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by WebsterMark on 10/11/20 at 05:19:21 The Stacy Abrams style voter suppression argument is nonsense. You can’t open a bank account without ID meaning you can’t buy a house without ID meaning a bank refusing a loan on such grounds would be in violation of multiple truth/fairness in lending laws. Financial institutions have rules to follow in order to avoid money laundering, terrorist setting up accounts, etc... You can’t get on a plane without one and perhaps the irony of ironies, you can’t enter the Capital Building Or the Supreme Court and sit in the balcony to watch Congress or the Court debate voter ID laws. If Biden won and invited the leftist from this forum to kiss his ring in the Oval Office, you’ll need (multiple?) IDs to get in The White House. The is the ultimate red herring argument. There are greater realities behind Voter fraud than voter ID as far as altering the results of an election. Like Jog, I don’t know anyone without an ID or the simple means to get one. |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by WebsterMark on 10/11/20 at 05:22:32 And, my little Australian friend, you seem to have a greater interest in the USA than most foreigners jealous of this nation. So I assume you lived here or visited here for extended period time. Are you telling me you knew people who did not have an ID and had no ability to get one? |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by oldNslow on 10/11/20 at 08:53:30 I remember reading somewhere that Australia has mandatory voting. All eligible voters are required to vote, and are subject to a fine if they don't. If that's the case, how exactly do the authorities know if an eligible voter didn't vote and assess the penalty without some system of voter ID ? |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by eau de sauvage on 10/11/20 at 13:56:07 Yes voting is compulsory in Australia. When I was younger I rebelled against and and didn't vote for decades, seeing the cynicism of politics, and not wanting to be a part of it. I managed to get away with it for a long time. I did get fined once. But these days I think it's essential to have compulsory voting in a democracy. I do not think the fines should be large and they aren't large $50 at the last count, but it's enough to get people to vote who'd like to vote but simply can't be arsed. There is no voter fraud here. When I move somewhere and usually there are local council records of a move and if so they will send you a registration form to be on the local register. I don't know how it works, but I certainly wouldn't want to try and vote twice seeing that can end in jail time, I'm guessing. You vote and they cross you off a list. There's simply no incentive either in Australia or the US to vote twice. Maybe a handful of dozen people might do it in 100million votes cast but that's utterly irrelevant. In Australia there have been the occasionally dodgy ballot box and strange shenanigans, just like in America, but it's usually the right wing polititions who are implicated and if not then it favours neither side and in the end it's exceedingly rare. Fact is for all the frothing and foaming people in authority who watch this stuff have found nothing of any consequence at all. It's vote suppression that is the big thing in America simply because you do not have compulsory voting. Donald Trump who always says the small print out loud, said what we all know to be true, and that is that if all eligible voters were allowed to vote the GOP would never get elected. No way. And that would be true, if that were the case I guess in order to get elected the GOP would have to alter their policies to match the will of the people. Which is how it's meant to work. But the GOP do not want to do this so they engineer Gerrymandering, and obstructionism to thwart the will of the people. Graham Lindsay in his reversal of his opinion that they won't rush through Supreme Court judge close to an election says "as far as I can tell the president is elected for 4 years and not 31/2." However between the Death of Scalia and the death of Ginsburg, 4.7 years had passed and Trump filled both vacancies. Further McConnell tries to now justify it by saying "this time though we have the Senate as well as the Presidency" implying that he has the will of the people. Why rush through Barrett unless they know it's to thwart the will of the people. This is why if the people give Biden the Senate, they would not just have a right, but an obligation to increase the size of the court. Barrett is an ideological troll. Great article on her here. https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/10/amy-coney-barrett-nomination-character.html Look I do get that you lot have this fixation on the Democrats and you have your beliefs, but disagree or not, I find it impossible that you cannot see the long term damage that the feckless supine Republicans are doing to your democracy. Maybe you like the chaos and civil strife. I don't know the American psyche well enough to form an opinion on that. But I do know that the vast majority of Americans do not share your views, even if a lot do. Barrett herself has no scruples or principles as you can see from the article I linked to. |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by eau de sauvage on 10/11/20 at 13:59:26 More voter suppression in Texas... On October 1, Republican Gov. Greg Abbott issued a proclamation that allowed for only one drop-off location in each of Texas’s 254 counties, regardless of population or geographic size. Abbott cited election security as a justification for the order. But it eliminated multiple drop-off sites available for Texans; for instance, Harris County — the third most populous county in the country — had to shut 11 of its 12 drop-off sites. https://www.vox.com/2020/10/10/21506522/texas-drop-off-ballot-locations-abbott-harris-county |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by justin_o_guy2 on 10/11/20 at 14:13:29 Y 31233734232527420 wrote:
So what, you're a lucky white guy in a racist country. [/quote] A racist country that elected Obama twice.. You don't actually believe that no white people who usually vote republican didn't help elect him, do you? Racists aren't everywhere. And they are certainly not limited to republicans. The idiotic Bullshit that blacks can't be racist and whites are inherently racist is compounding the problem.. And it's as obviously not true as pretending that a man can get up one day, declare himself a Woman, put on a dress and He Is. Can you buy an airline pilots uniform, declare yourself a pilot, put that outfit on and now you're a pilot? Both scenarios are ridiculous. One of them you believe. Climate science Settled But sex is determined by the whims of mentally unstable people.. |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by oldNslow on 10/11/20 at 14:16:51 So you acknowledge that Australia has voter ID of some sort even though you aren't sure exactly how it works, and you are apparently OK with that. Yet the proponents of Voter ID in the country where I live (and you don't) are the bad people,and the opponents of such a system in my country are the good guys. That seems to be the gist of your post. |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by justin_o_guy2 on 10/11/20 at 14:21:02 But these days I think it's essential to have compulsory voting in a democracy. So, people who have no real desire to participate, and choose to not spend the time to research people and legislative issues, who are required to go vote, and have a crappy attitude, are angry that they Must go vote, you think they are trying to vote in a manner most beneficial for the country? You're not thinking this through.. Is it important for people to vote? Yeah,, But only people who want to are gonna educate themselves.. Why do want ignorant and/or angry people voting? That's a good question,, I think.. |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by eau de sauvage on 10/11/20 at 15:36:00 You're not thinking this through.. We have compulsory voting in Australia and how it works is that if someone is pissed off that they are forced to vote they don't vote, they just turn up have their name ticked off and that's it. Or they go into the booth and put a blank paper in the ballot. Compulsory voting does not make people who don't want to vote, fill out a complex form correctly. It is you who haven't thought it through. Or maybe you have and you realised that not having compulsory voting leave so many options and avenues for voter suppression. Trump said the small print out loud when he clearly said that if everyone entitled to vote was allowed to vote the Republicans would never get elected again. And that's cirtainly true, UNLESS they modified their platform to reflect the voters' intentions. But Republicans are not for democracy obviously. Just look at Barrett, it's been 4 years and 7 months between the deaths of Scalia and Ginsburg, yet in a four year term Trump has replaced both. Not only that but Barrett is a Federalist society hack and religious nut job who represents about 30% of the US's desires. If the electorate delivers a Senate Majority to the Democrats along with Biden, they will have a mandate to repair the US fragile almost democracy. Because the US citizens know full well that electing Biden, is not enough, they know he needs the Senate. I predicted at the beginning of the Trump Presidency that it will be a good thing for the US long term because there will be a massive correction. The Democrats have been way too timid, but after the excesses of the Trump administration they will certainly right the wrongs, and they'll have a mandate to do it. No one is going to forget Lindsey Graham saying, "hold the tape". Installing Barrett because they absolutely know the voters who are already voting do not want her, is another form of voter suppression that lasts for 40 years. Which is way the GOP are willing to sacrifice their majority in order to get her on the Court. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9lZOATVBBI[/media] |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by justin_o_guy2 on 10/11/20 at 15:58:06 We have compulsory voting in Australia and how it works is that if someone is pissed off that they are forced to vote they don't vote, they just turn up have their name ticked off and that's it. Or they go into the booth and put a blank paper in the ballot. Oh really? Those are the options are they? Casting a Bullshit vote out of spite isn't on your list? And your not so subtle implications that I would keep people from voting are getting tiresome. You clearly don't have a clue what kinda guy I am, or what my friends friends have looked like down through the years, or who I speak to when I'm out, you're so wrong about me it would be funny if it wasn't so pathetic. |
|
Title: Re: Is Voter ID voter suppression/discrimination Post by eau de sauvage on 10/11/20 at 16:21:50 Well I can't speak for other people but casting a vote for someone I didn't want or a party I didn't want 'out of spite' sounds kinda crazy to me. I mean when I do vote now I don't pore over the minutae and place candidates in the order I want and who I want my preferences to flow to because I'll just tick the box that allows the party I prefer to mark it how they deem fit. And this is pretty easy in a two party state like Australia, as it is in America. I mean most people have a clear preference for either Labor or Liberal or in the US Dems or Republicans. They say no matter who you elect you always get a politician. And if they don't like either they'll vote for a minority party or Green party. But please tell me how 'voting out of spite' works? I really don't understand it. If you vote for who you don't want then that's just cutting off your nose to spite your face. What I used to do to voice my displeasure at being forced to vote was usually to go to the polling place, have my name checked off then walk back out. That was good enough to not get a fine. In the US there's too much dark money in US politics Trump claimed to clean up the swamp but the swamp is now murkier than ever with hundreds of millions now allowed to flow into super PACs without having to identify donors. This was enabled by the Supreme Court. Yes I don't know you but I'm not really referring to you personally when I claim that the party that you prefer is a party that benefits from Gerrymandering and Voter Suppression and they also recognise that they NEED that, in order to be a minority party that calls for the overwhelming majority. I'm not naive I can see how people would selfishly want that but yet we should expect more from people with power. |
|
SuzukiSavage.com » Powered by YaBB 2.2! YaBB © 2000-2007. All Rights Reserved. |