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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Help me find out if my engine is blown /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1587501268 Message started by joshbur237 on 04/21/20 at 13:34:28 |
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Title: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by joshbur237 on 04/21/20 at 13:34:28 Okay so here the story on my bike. I bought it about a year ago with 4500 miles. it was my first bike. When I first got it the carburetor was dumping gas out the top so I sent it the mechanic and had the carb rebuilt, oil changed and the battery replaced. I everyday rode it for about 4 months, downed it a couple times. Clutch cable snapped on me while riding in second gear, put a brand new one in. Then the rod for the clutch lever snapped on a long distance trip so I brought it to a shop and got it welded. My next break down was when my petcock failed, realized it was the petcock and just turned it to prime. Rode it without issues for awhile after that and then I was making about a 150 mile trip and my bike all of a sudden died on the highway, wouldnt start back up. Got it towed to my girlfriend's house and changed the spark plug cause that's all I could think it could be having already had the carb rebuilt and that did nothing. Now the kicker is that I never had the oil changed between that point and when I got it and it's now at about 10000 miles so 5500 miles with no oil change. So really my question is, is the engine likely blown from lack of oil (none visible in the oil sight hole but there never was when I got it back from mechanic and I didnt know enough to question it) or could it be from the petcock having been on prime or some other issue?? I assumed the engine was just blown so it had been sitting at my girlfriend's house for about 8 months but I just got it back and the more I think about it the more I'm curious if I could get it to run again, the engine will still crank/turn over. Thank you very much for any help!!! |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by srinath on 04/21/20 at 13:50:21 What did it do before dying on the highway. You could have well had the cam chain jump off, or the lack/low of oil kill it. Usually carb problems occur when sitting, so do spark but again electrical problem can hit anytime. Does it have spark now ? And does it have oil. Very important to answer these 2. Presume it had gas - else you'd not have got on the highway. But then again I'd also think I'd know if it had oil before getting on the highway. This story sounds like my friend who broke a valve due to carb that had a missing vacuum line - the ting ran so lean it just burnt its valves out. Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by joshbur237 on 04/21/20 at 13:59:18 It just died, didnt really notice anything before then just suddenly died didnt bog down first or anything just cut off and died. I ended up purchasing another savage and cracked the oil filter cover so had to take the one off this bike so no oil in it now or very little havent tried to start in awhile. I did change the spark plug so I assume it had spark but I dont know how to check if it for sure does. |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by verslagen1 on 04/21/20 at 14:12:05 Oil level needs to be checked with the bike held upright, not on the kickstand. Nearly upright is ok, I put a brick under the kickstand and it's nearly upright. 5000 miles is a bit long, but if you had oil, it's ok. riding down the highway over 70 it will burn oil. The petcock is likely the issue. when they fail either they pour gas into the intake or they shut off. Next up could be the safeties, but if it were those it wouldn't crank. A blown engine would've been loud, clanking at least. Is your header blue? Maybe someone is near boston and can help you out. |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by norm92de on 04/21/20 at 14:12:17 I know this is a silly question but you do have gas. After 150 miles on prime you could simply have run out of fuel. Check the oil level. In fact change the oil and put 2-qts of fresh oil in it. After all that put a genuine Yamaha Raptor petcock on it you will not regret it. |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by joshbur237 on 04/21/20 at 14:17:49 It definitely has gas. I was only about halfway through the trip. I never tried filling the oil to the correct level however, so you think maybe that could be preventing it from starting? |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by verslagen1 on 04/21/20 at 14:19:10 6E6B776C667176363733040 wrote:
only if it were bone dry and seized up. you'll have to ask someone else how far you can ride it after forgetting to put oil in it after changing it. :o |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by norm92de on 04/21/20 at 14:20:38 low oil will not prevent it from starting. Low fuel will. :) |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by verslagen1 on 04/21/20 at 14:23:31 31302D32666D3B3A5F0 wrote:
A bad petcock will shut off even in prime. the diaphragm gets hard and that flimsy little bypass lever can't open it. |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by joshbur237 on 04/21/20 at 14:24:29 What I'm really trying to figure out is if my engine is blown or if it's some other reason for not running and I may be able to get it going again. So if the engine isnt seized is that likely not the problem or could it have gotten internal damage from low oil and then died on the highway from that? Sorry if I sound like a noob I have no idea about anything engine related really. |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by joshbur237 on 04/21/20 at 14:28:29 The petcock was still leaking oil out in prime so I believe it still had fuel. It wasnt noisy when it died on the highway however. |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by IslandRoad on 04/21/20 at 17:01:55 Dump the old gas. Install a Yamaha Raptor Petcock (put a cap on the vacuum port on the carb) Fill with fresh gas New oil filter (don't put it in on backwards - because it will fit that way) Fresh oil Check the air filter while you're at it Check if she starts (make sure the kill-switch isn't off) Does it try to start? If it doesn't try to start then chase down an electrical problem (safety switches, battery etc) If it tries to start but won't, then stop trying to start it (you'll burn out the starter) Chase down any fuel issues (tuning, float level, blocked jet etc) |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by ohiomoto on 04/21/20 at 19:06:08 5A607F727D77417C7277130 wrote:
Great advise except I wouldn't waste my money on an oil change until it starts up after you replace that faulty petcock! ;) (But make sure you add enough oil to get it at least halfway up the glass when the bike is straight up. And take note of how much oil that is. The bike holds a little less than two quarts. Hopeful you need less than a quart, quart and a half. :o ) Hopefully that's all it is. If you ran it out of oil you would have either seized it up, fried the rings, or destroyed the lower bearings. If it sized up, you would have known. It the motor would have ground to a halt and locked up the rear wheel. You would need to pull in the clutch the compensate. If you fired the rings it would have probably kept running and then refused to restart after it cooled off. Unless the piston crown failed and munched up. You would have heard that. Same with broken valves. Lower bearings just make a lot of noise, like a big hammer in the bottom of the engine, but the engine can run for a long time with bad main bearings (and cause a lot of damage to the crankshaft, rod and wrist pin in the process). |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by joshbur237 on 04/22/20 at 08:05:31 So I drained whatever oil there was in the engine today and this is what came out, only about a pint and a half of oil if I had to guess.... any way an engine could run or that or am I screwed? |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by joshbur237 on 04/22/20 at 08:16:17 If the engine seized up would it still turn over when trying to start afterwards? |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by verslagen1 on 04/22/20 at 08:31:15 6F6A766D677077373632050 wrote:
If the engine is seized it won’t turn at all. |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by joshbur237 on 04/22/20 at 08:35:53 Opened up my clutch cover today, hows it look? |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by joshbur237 on 04/22/20 at 08:36:44 ... |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by srinath on 04/22/20 at 08:41:04 CCT is good. Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by joshbur237 on 04/22/20 at 08:41:13 How do I tell if there is something wrong with my valves? |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by srinath on 04/22/20 at 08:43:04 6C69756E647374343531060 wrote:
Well likely no - but that's a pitiful amount of really crappy oil. Your problem now pointing to fuel - quantity isn't related to flow really. Also check for spark and timing of spark. Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by joshbur237 on 04/22/20 at 08:53:47 7E7F64636C79650D0 wrote:
What's cct? |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by srinath on 04/22/20 at 09:47:08 The part you took the pic of - the one in vers's sig which is what he modifies to not let it crap out - but you're fine, yours is OK, get it running then send to him to mod. CCT = Cam Chain Tensioner. Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by srinath on 04/22/20 at 09:56:00 595C405B514641010004330 wrote:
Check that they open at the right spot - turn to tdc at the top of compression stroke. That means watch the intake valve open as the piston goes down, then intake should close as piston goes up Through that whole stroke and the next stroke - piston going down ward - the power stroke - check both intake and exhaust valves are closed. Then you're getting the piston going up and the exhaust valve should open, that is the exhaust stroke. Then you're at TDC, and piston going down the intake should open. Check that first. Then, to check all valves are closing fully etc etc. Check valve clearance - TDC at the top of compression stroke, or even anywhere @ compression or power stroke the valve clearances should be in spec. Now if you have them in spec and you still suspect they're staying open etc - Take off the exhaust system and the carb and spark plug. Then on a dark night, shine a flash light in the intake - look for light in the spark plug hole and exhaust. Then shine in exhaust and look for light in intake and in spark plug hole, then in spark hole and look for light in the intake and exhaust. Remember in this check you're looking for no light - for example if your flashlight is sitting where the carb should be - and you see light where the exhaust comes out - both intake and exhaust are not closing. If you see in spark plug hole only - then intake is open etc etc. Cool. Srinath. |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by Gary_in_NJ on 04/22/20 at 10:46:56 4A4F5348425552121317200 wrote:
You seem to be doing a lot of guessing at things. If you want to actually check the top end of the engine without removing the head, then you need to perform a leak down test with a differential pressure gauge. These can be found at harbor freight or a local auto parts store. The leak down test will tell you if you have a leak at the intake valves, exhaust valves, rings or piston. No guess work involved. |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by ohiomoto on 04/22/20 at 10:47:33 It's such a stretch that the timing just went out of adjustment to the point that the bike died suddenly. Best advise here is being ignored. 140710110E0305070C53620 wrote:
5958455A0E055352370 wrote:
46475A45111A4C4D280 wrote:
766572736C6167656E31000 wrote:
it. A bad petcock will shut off even in prime. the diaphragm gets hard and that flimsy little bypass lever can't open [/quote] 22252422202239224D0 wrote:
Great advise except I wouldn't waste my money on an oil change until it starts up after you replace that faulty petcock! ;) (But make sure you add enough oil to get it at least halfway up the glass when the bike is straight up. And take note of how much oil that is. The bike holds a little less than two quarts. Hopeful you need less than a quart, quart and a half. :o ) Hopefully that's all it is. If you ran it out of oil you would have either seized it up, fried the rings, or destroyed the lower bearings. If it sized up, you would have known. It the motor would have ground to a halt and locked up the rear wheel. You would need to pull in the clutch the compensate. If you fired the rings it would have probably kept running and then refused to restart after it cooled off. Unless the piston crown failed and munched up. You would have heard that. Same with broken valves. Lower bearings just make a lot of noise, like a big hammer in the bottom of the engine, but the engine can run for a long time with bad main bearings (and cause a lot of damage to the crankshaft, rod and wrist pin in the process). [/quote] ------------------------------------------ What do each of these pictures have in common???? :-? :-? :-? Start there and then worry about the rest. |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by ohiomoto on 04/22/20 at 10:58:28 LOL so much for the highlight tag. I'll go back and fix that. |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by joshbur237 on 04/22/20 at 12:18:14 Wasnt ignoring that advice, just curious about other topics too. Gonna order a new petcock tonight, I'll lyk when I get that and try firing her up, thanks everybody!! |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by justin_o_guy2 on 04/22/20 at 13:36:40 If it's ten dollars, it's the wrong one,, Genuine Yamaha part here, |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by joshbur237 on 04/22/20 at 18:57:41 Is this the correct petcock? |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by justin_o_guy2 on 04/22/20 at 19:05:04 That's it,, |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by justin_o_guy2 on 04/22/20 at 19:14:45 I didn't check the part number. Looks right Approximate price range I paid at Yamaha shop. |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by joshbur237 on 04/22/20 at 19:18:22 Actually just found the post with the part number for it and stuff and confirmed it. Thanks! |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by eau de sauvage on 04/23/20 at 00:28:54 That CTT, looks like it's about to pop off and send your bike to heaven (and maybe you to) any minute. |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by Hiko on 04/23/20 at 00:54:32 13011516010705600 wrote:
As Above Measure how much its out looks like something needs to be done |
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Title: Re: Help me find out if my engine is blown Post by IslandRoad on 04/23/20 at 02:30:16 To answer your original question: If your bike had a catastrophic engine failure while you were riding it, you would know! ... and your valves would be the least of your problems. If you're prepared to spend around $100, then do a minor service on the bike (oil, fuel, filter etc) ... plus the raptor petcock. Then see if she fires up. You'll have a sound baseline to begin troubleshooting. And with the combined experience/knowledge/enthusiasm here on this site you'll most likely get best result possible. |
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