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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Begginer rider few questions on basic things /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1582922349 Message started by armchairbiker on 02/28/20 at 12:39:09 |
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Title: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by armchairbiker on 02/28/20 at 12:39:09 So I recently bought a 1999. Savage with 37000km on it (around 25k miles). It is in good condition overall but the previous owner left it sit for a while unused and it hasn't seen a knowledgeable mechanic in ages. Bike rides great but there are couple of things that concern me. I'm not sure how serious they are so I need your help. 1) Belt So the bike came with a new belt installed by the previous owner. When I took it home belt was firmly rubbing on the left side of the rear pulley. It also felt overly tight from what I read about the 90 degree twist technique. So i adjusted the tension and tried centering the belt. After a short ride i noticed that it floated little bit to the right. Then again little bit to the left. But not touching the edge of the pulley. I assume this is normal because of acceleration and deceleration? The pulley also moves left and right a little bit. 2) Oil level Previous owner said he put exactly 2 litres (2.1 quarts) of new oil in the engine. Which is also what the manual says should be. When the bike is placed upright the oil covers that little window on the right side of the engine. When I turn the engine on level drops to minimum. After running the engine for about 30 seconds and turn it off oil rushes back to cover the sight glass. After reading few topics on the matter I can't be sure if there is too much oil? 3) Valve clack When riding cca. 30kph (18mph) in second gear I can hear a distinct sound that can be described as sewing machine. Not an unpleasant sound but there is definite rocker movement. Is that normal? 4) Cant move from first gear at standstill The most troublesome aspect of riding so far has been the gear change. When I slowly arrive at red light in first gear i pull in the clutch and then attempt to raise the peg to go to Neutral, but I cannot. The lever is stuck in first gear. No amount of force will move it. Is that normal? When the engine is turned off switching from first to neutral feels featherweight. Previous owner said that he always stopped in second gear. And it is true: it is easier to just stay in second gear and gently push the peg down to N and roll to a stop. But there are situations where I do need to go from 1 to N. edit: 5) Petcock Almost forgot to mention the darn petcock. So when I bought the bike owner said that the petcock is broken and that it only works in RES position. ON and PRI have no fuel flow. After reading on the topic here on forum I concluded that it doesnt make any sense. The RES position requires vacuum to flow (as does ON). So if petcock is broken only PRI should work. So I inspected the petcock little closer and decided to test the vacuum port on the bottom. And it worked. When vacuum is applied I have ON (vac) and RES (no vac) working, but no PRI. So I connected a line to draw vacuum from carburator and the petcock works in two positions. The question is can the bike be reliably run with these two positions? Or am I looking for trouble? I am planning to order a new petcock but it will take time here in Europe because replacements are rare and the original costs too much money. |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by Gary_in_NJ on 02/28/20 at 12:59:11 Welcome to the forum, and welcome to the wonderful world of motorcycling. Let's get right to it.... 1) Belt - Adjust the alignment for the rear tire so the belt rides in the middle of the pulley. It would help if you get the rear tire off the ground so you could hand-spin the tire while you make small adjustments. 2) Oil level - The window is for checking the oil when the engine is off. Once started the oil flows throughout the engine/transmission and the sight-window is useless. 3) Valve clack - Normal. Sweing machine...Jetson's Flying Car...all normal. 4) Cant move from first gear at standstill - I'm thinking a clutch lever adjustment will help here. Reduce the fre play at the lever and see if it improves. 5) Petcock - Safe yourself A LOT of trouble and just replace that vacuum petcock with a Raptor unit. Problem (and problems) solved. |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by DragBikeMike on 02/28/20 at 13:15:54 Welcome aboard Armchairbiker. In answer to your questions: 1. The pulley wobble will degrade over time and eventually result in all sorts of howling coming off that drive belt. No amount of adjusting will correct the problem. You can permanently fix it for under $20. See this old post for an easy fix. http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1561964431 2. The oil level can be a sure fire indicator of petcock failure. Fuel leaks past the petcock, needle & seat in the carb, and ultimately down the chute past the piston rings and into the crankcase. The level should be between the two marks on your sight-glass. I suggest you drain and refill to the proper level with the bike perfectly upright. Give the old oil a good smell test for any sort of gasoline aroma. If you think you smell gas you probably have a petcock problem. 3. A moderate amount of clickity-clackity ticky-tacky is normal for the LS engine. 4. You should be able to shift the lever from first to neutral with very little effort. Several problems can cause the condition you describe. Clutch maladjustment or oil too heavy would be what I would look at. Since you will probably be dumping your oil that should take care of any questions about the oil. Replace it with a good quality 10W-40 rated Jaso MA2 and you should be good in the oil department. There should be some good guidance in this forum on clutch adjustment. It should be very easy to move the lever from 1st to neutral with engine idling and clutch lever pulled in. 5. Petcock? There's only one answer for that. Replace it. Don't waste time testing it or trying to repair it. It's gonna leave you high and dry. Even when these vacuum operated contraptions test OK, they still hang up and leak. You will either find yourself stuck out in the middle of nowhere, or go to start up in the morning with six-quarts of liquid in the crankcase instead of two quarts. The stock petcock simply isn't worth all the aggravation. I can't begin to tell you how many motorcycles (various manufacturers) I have repaired over the years as a result of failed vacuum-operated petcocks. Good luck with your Savage. |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by armchairbiker on 02/29/20 at 05:44:51 Thank you for your asnwers. So there is definitely too much oil in the engine. I meant to replace it anyway. That is first on the list. I already ordered a new clutch cable so when that arrives I will tinker with adjustment. There is no Raptor petcock available to me. The guy at the parts store swears that I can fit petcock from another Suzuki model. Only difference is that it has ON, OFF, RES position. So I am waiting for him to message me when he measures the width of the mounting holes to make sure it fits before I make and order. :-/ That is pretty much it for now. In the coming days I will also clean the carburettor and maybe the entire fuel tank from the inside. |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by Gary_in_NJ on 02/29/20 at 06:59:03 Use Amazon (not eBay) to purchase a Genuine Yamaha Raptor petcock. Don’t listen to your dealer on this. |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by armchairbiker on 02/29/20 at 07:14:37 Unfortunately, Amazon doesn't deliver to my country. |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by ArkansasBrian on 02/29/20 at 10:30:22 Is there a Yamaha dealership you could contact? Also, out of curiosity, what country are you in? |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by jcstokes on 02/29/20 at 10:53:35 Theres a part number for the Raptor petcock and the more knowlegable here will know it and post |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by batman on 02/29/20 at 12:10:07 Yamaha Raptor-660 -Fuel c0ck Assy -5LP-24500-01-00 OILChange liters-1.8 QTS-1.9 (WITHOUT FILTER CHANGE) liters-2.4 Qts-2.5 (with filter change |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by Hiko on 02/29/20 at 16:51:17 Highly recommend the rear pulley double row bearing modification as described above And the raptor petcock Dont understand why Suzuki has not done these themselves |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by armchairbiker on 03/01/20 at 10:30:59 So, there has been some new development. I sourced all the parts I plan on replacing including the clutch gasket. But today I noticed that the head cover cushion on the left side of the engine is soaked in oil. It doesn't leak but when I get paper towel next to it it draws a drop or two of oil. Valve covers and everything is dry. When the tank is removed I will make closer inspection. Looking at engine head schematics I suspect one of the bolts it letting through oil. 4D7E676D627F6D7F4E7E656D620C0 wrote:
Croatia, born and raised. :) I will try the Yama dealership next week. |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by jcstokes on 03/01/20 at 12:25:43 Be gentle with the rear brake, particularly in the wet. It is prone to lock up if applied hard. |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by batman on 03/01/20 at 18:02:44 armchairbiker the oil leak on the left side could be coming from the thru bolt on the front of the chrome cap( it also holds the head cap down) or the decomp shaft seal . |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by armchairbiker on 03/02/20 at 08:23:30 This is the petcock I was talking about: Click Here (https://www.biketeile-service.de/de/fahrgestell/tank/benzinhahn/fahrzeugbezogen/kraftstoffhahntourmaxfpc323.html) Not the store where I'm buying, but same model. Only here it specifically is written that it fits Savage. 7A7363647F7B7563100 wrote:
I loosened it a bit. When braking I just rest my foot on it. 7073667F737C262A120 wrote:
Ok, thanks. |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by Tocsik on 03/05/20 at 15:58:02 Check that through bolt for the head before digging too deep. You'll see it up inside the exhaust outlet. Put a small wrench on there and give it just a little pressure. This stopped my oil seep without even needing to remove the nut, clean the threads and apply RTV. But do that if simply tightening a little doesn't do the trick. On the shifting issue, also check the rods that connect the lever to the engine case. If anything gets bent, it could cause shifting issues. |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by eau de sauvage on 03/05/20 at 16:19:03 7E6D727C777E766D7D76747A6D1F0 wrote:
This is a serious problem on virtually all new S40's, a Harley muffler will sort it out. Regarding oil level, if the bike has been standing for some time then the correct oil level cold or hot, when the bike is centred, would be just barely to the top of the sight glass, a poofteenth over wouldn't matter. This is equivalent to doing the recommended warm up and wait method using the max fill line. |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by armchairbiker on 03/06/20 at 11:29:50 I bleed some 0.5 litres of oil from the engine and on the sightglass it is just under the top line. The shifting improved greatly. It is almost feather light although I still somewhat struggle with finding neutral. Perhaps it just takes practice. Clutch cable is replaced. When adjusting free play I noticed that the rod (the actuator on the clutch case) is on lower indicator mark (there are two). Does this mean the clutch is almost worn out? I've read that you can buy a longer axle that fits on the clutch basket to extend its life. But is it complicated to replace? 714A46564C4E250 wrote:
I think I understand now. It is the one on the left-forward side of the engine. I can see the head under one of the cooling fins. I will take care of it when I replace spark plug tomorrow. I cleaned carburetor and it was mostly spotless. The previous owner did take some care of the bike. But he was a strong armed man because every once in a while I find stripped screws. I replaced some on the carb. ::) I tried changing brake pads but there was also a stripped screw on the pin that holds pads in place. I will have to drill through it. :'( |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by armchairbiker on 03/10/20 at 09:55:19 Soooo, found some problems with the bike. I was going to check on the clutch push rod. So i removed the clutch cover which was glued on with some kind of sealant. Damaged clutch basket (https://imgur.com/zDCoMli) Don't know how well you can see but there is some kind of improvised shim here keeping the tensioner scissor mechanism at place (https://imgur.com/1kf3oq4) I don't know what the mechanism is for. Can't find it on any other pictures people posted online. The tensioner is around 9mm out (https://imgur.com/SPXvj7S) One of the screws holding the case broke off (https://imgur.com/xUOOG1X) But that is minor issue. |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by verslagen1 on 03/10/20 at 10:26:20 6B786769626B63786863616F780A0 wrote:
That's the german version of the extended adjuster mod. I would guess the bolt is too long and that is why there's an odd shim. I would replace the basket, we've seen one mod to the clutch assembly that shredded the basket on a high power savage. As far as your slipping is concerned, might of been an adjustment. The clutch lever must have freeplay. As well as the lever on the case. If there is no freeplay it will slip. I generally choose the clutch throwout rod to have between 12 and 12.5mm sticking out of the clutch pack. |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by armchairbiker on 03/10/20 at 10:53:22 The clutch lever is on the lower mark on the case. Two nuts on the new cable have to go all the way up the threaded rod to reach the lever and on the handlebar cable adjuster is also way out. Also when I engage first gear I hear rpm drop from standstill. So I assumed that different push rod would place the lever between the marks and solve the issue. That is when I opened the case. :( So I will have to order new basket. |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by badwolf on 03/10/20 at 13:11:29 The damage to the clutch basket and the cam chain tensioner mod are most likley related.( might be a good story there from someone ) Post a picture of the whole side with the cover off, we might spot something . |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by armchairbiker on 03/10/20 at 13:34:54 I will take more pictures tomorrow. There is also a visible impact on the side of the oil filter chamber and a scratch lower next to the basket. My guess is something snapped off and rotated few times around the case. |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by badwolf on 03/10/20 at 15:10:46 Sounds like the tensioner plunger came out! Your lucky someone got it running again, most times they get tossed after that happens. |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by armchairbiker on 03/16/20 at 07:50:41 Sorry. Had trouble finding time to work on the bike. https://ibb.co/CQHmQV5 https://ibb.co/3M6SLMR |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/16/20 at 08:42:37 Can't help wondering how much vibration is caused by different bolts in the clutch.. At least put the two stock bolts opposite each other.. |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by Gary_in_NJ on 03/16/20 at 08:48:05 The one non-stock bolt, the one towards the top of the case, appears to have wear marks. Is there sign of wear inside the case? |
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Title: Re: Begginer rider few questions on basic things Post by armchairbiker on 03/16/20 at 11:47:11 I noticed the non original bolt but not the wear on the upper one. Seems very strange now. There are no scratch marks on that part of the cover. I'll replace all of them together with the basket. |
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