|
SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Politics, Religion (Tall Table) >> Naval base shooting, where were the good guys /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1575705981 Message started by eau de sauvage on 12/07/19 at 00:06:21 |
|
Title: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by eau de sauvage on 12/07/19 at 00:06:21 Just noticed this sentence in a report on the shooting... It was the second shooting at a Navy base this week and sent sailors scrambling to lock the doors of their barracks or flee the base altogether. https://www.nytimes.com/2019/12/06/us/nas-pensacola-shooting.html Which made me think, if this is the effect that a random surprise shooting has at a Navy base, then one wonders what the point is in training teachers to be the ones to confront gunmen? |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by justin_o_guy2 on 12/07/19 at 00:45:51 I've not been participating because I'm tired of dealing with the advanced levels of stupid, but pointing out to you that they were in training, and In that building Uhh, The students weren't allowed to be armed. No guns in the classroom.. It's a military base And a no gun zone in the classroom.. Genius,, fukking genius.. |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by Eegore on 12/07/19 at 01:11:35 Military bases have armories. They do not, and as far as I know have never let all enlisted personnel carry at all times. This does not mean a military base or sections of a military base is a no gun zone. Enlisted personnel are not issued individual firearms that they carry with them all day, only specific professions do this, such as MP's. Guns are allowed in the education areas, if you are authorized to carry. |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by WebsterMark on 12/07/19 at 05:55:04 The article is on their paid website and I already buy enough fiction so I see no need to spend money on more. As someone who writes quite a bit for work, the phrase "sent sailors scrambling " and the word "flee" are used specifically to paint an image in your mind that the writer intended. Could it had been written "sailors moved quickly to more secured areas" and "others evacuated the base" ? Could have been. Were you there? Did you witness it? Have you seen numerous incidents so that you could determine if this particular group acted more panicky, scrambling and fleeing, than average compared to others? |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by eau de sauvage on 12/07/19 at 13:55:04 @JoG, as Eegore pointed out, it maybe a class room but it's on a fcking navy base, I'm sure there's more security there than a school. The point is that this shows the futility of trying to stop a random angry teenager from killing a bunch of people if he wants to follow what others have done, and there appears to be a steady supply. IOW I'm simply saying that expecting teachers to deal with armed intruders who could appear at any time is never going to tackle the problem of gun violence in schools. |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by pg on 12/07/19 at 13:58:27 2C3E2A293E383A5F0 wrote:
Unlike yourself I have a right to carry and I do... Best regards, |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by justin_o_guy2 on 12/07/19 at 14:16:31 The point is that this shows the futility of trying to stop a random angry teenager from killing a bunch of people if he wants to follow what others have done, and there appea No, not at all. Had a few people in close proximity to the killer had been armed, the outcome would likely have been much different. Question If You had been there, would You have wanted a weapon, or is being vulnerable and defenseless how you like it? Go ahead. Tell me More guns isn't the answer.. That's Exactly what stopped it. People with guns.. |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by thumperclone on 12/07/19 at 16:50:12 7A656364797E4F7F4F77656922100 wrote:
tell that to the family of the ups driver killed by the cops in Miami trained in firearms...... |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by Eegore on 12/07/19 at 17:01:27 "tell that to the family of the ups driver killed by the cops in Miami trained in firearms...… " US military kill each other in friendly fire. Should we consider arming them to be too risky and disarm them as well? Lifeguards have drowned, trained swimmers, maybe we shouldn't let people near the ocean..... |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by justin_o_guy2 on 12/08/19 at 14:20:08 Y 495548504D584F5E515253583D0 wrote:
tell that to the family of the ups driver killed by the cops in Miami trained in firearms......[/quote] The problem here is you're so twisted that you actually believe that is a real argument. Cops screwed up. Good Guys ACCIDENTALLY shoot good guys. The idea is Bad guys avoid starting nuts with a gun when they aren't sure about their victim being unarmed. For the people who actually allow scientific evidence to direct their thinking, note, gun ownership and concealed carry have been increasing. Gun violence Decreasing EXCEPT where lefties are in control. Guns are restricted. Law Abiding people are disarmed. Gun violence is outta sight. But you lefties are unwavering. You're just in love with big government. You disgust me. |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by Serowbot on 12/08/19 at 14:32:36 26393F3825221323132B39357E4C0 wrote:
Let me know when it gets as low as Australia... |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by pg on 12/08/19 at 15:03:18 786E79647C69647F0B0 wrote:
One thing Australian does well is they have a merit based immigration system. I suppose an island in the middle of the ocean helps.... :-? Best regards, |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by Eegore on 12/08/19 at 16:31:29 "Let me know when it gets as low as Australia... " Let me know when Australia comes close to inner city gang activity and Cartels. Those weapons will end up the hands of civilians one way or another. |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by justin_o_guy2 on 12/08/19 at 16:46:25 7264736E76636E75010 wrote:
Let me know when it gets as low as Australia...[/quote] There ya go.. black and white, You do know Americans aren't subjects But you tyrants want it that way. Admit the POINT. Lefties scream More guns More violence But the EVIDENCE says otherwise. So, deflect away. Whatever it takes to hide from the obvious. Your ways are proven to be failures. |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by pg on 12/09/19 at 05:00:41 Back to original topic. Those are some sinister a$$holes when they record the event so they may rejoice at a later time. Best regards, |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by justin_o_guy2 on 12/09/19 at 07:42:33 Murderous crazies WILL murder. Now the government is pushing against Frikken KNIVES,, including your kitchen knives. Dull points are the new normal. Failed thinking , making people more vulnerable to attack, only leads to more violence. Look at where the highest per capita concealed carry permits are. Look at the crime. Now, go pretend it Isn't so. Maintain freedom to protect yourself And Crush crime. You lefties demand a 100% perfection rate to say it was successful. BULLSHIT, life isn't that black and white. Seatbelts don't always save people But they are a really good idea. Helmets help.. But.. And having a gun in a bad situation doesn't mean you won't get shot. But, can anyone say If I had been in the classroom when he started shooting, I would not have wished I had a gun? Answer the question, lefties.. Do you want to be vulnerable and unarmed? If your car didn't come from the factory with seatbelts, would you install some? Why? If you would not want a gun when someone started shooting, why would you want a seatbelt? You obviously don't want to be protected. Toss th helmet. They are for sissies. |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by Eegore on 12/09/19 at 07:51:42 "Back to original topic." What post wasn't about this topic? |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by Serowbot on 12/09/19 at 07:56:28 36292F2835320333033B29256E5C0 wrote:
Sure,... and if I were in a car accident, I would wish I were wearing full leathers and FF helmet, and armored gloves. ...but I don't drive that way, and I don't want to. If there were no speed limits, and no traffic rules, and no police, no insurance, and no licensing... I probably would... begrudgingly... In a Mad Max world, we'd all wear armor and carry guns... It's not my ideal world. Why strive for dystopia?... |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by Eegore on 12/09/19 at 07:59:33 "Now the government is pushing against Frikken KNIVES,, including your kitchen knives. Dull points are the new normal." This is entirely incorrect. Unless of course you consider all governments to be US Government. If using the UK as an example of dulling knives then by that logic I will use China's government to say "the government" has made knives illegal. The government has made all knives illegal !! See how that works? https://knifeup.com/knife-laws/ |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by Eegore on 12/09/19 at 08:06:23 "If there were no speed limits, and no traffic rules, and no police, no insurance, and no licensing... I probably would... begrudgingly..." Well that's not at all the comparison. Nobody is saying to allow open carry and also eliminate every gun law. (Except MnSpring indicated "every" gun law is illegal) The question is if your car, given the current laws, did not have seatbelts, would you have some put in? An easier way of examining this is asking if there were no seatbelt laws, would you wear one anyway? If assaulted, would you want the best means of protecting yourself, your family, or those around you? If a firearm was the best method, would you want it? None of those questions however will address gun free zones and their impact on safety. Bottom line is "gun free" zones do not increase safety, as mass shooters do not follow them. I would be open to information that indicates that murderers stop when they see a sign. Another issue is considering any area that won't allow 100% of the people inside it to be armed is "gun free" because that is not accurate. A nightclub that prohibits people consuming alcohol to carry guns, is not a gun free zone. |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by Serowbot on 12/09/19 at 08:39:44 I look at gun free zones as an issue of policing. In an area where many people are gathering, especially children... designating it as "gun free" allows security to consider the act of carry as criminal, and enables them to legally detain this person. These are areas where the number of people make a tempting target for a mass shooter, and hamper security. Stopping a shooter in these places quickly and safely is nearly impossible. A ten second spray of bullets would cause devastating harm before any defense could be made, and returned fire would endanger too many bystanders. Therefore,.. keeping guns out is the only solution. It's not perfect, but this is the culture we live in. The "gun free zone" is not to stop the shooter from bringing the gun,.. it's to allow security to identify the shooter. They can look for suspicious bulges, packages, behaviors, etc... |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by MnSpring on 12/09/19 at 08:49:17 4C6C6E667B6C090 wrote:
And where was it I said that ? |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by verslagen1 on 12/09/19 at 09:14:07 The facts are pretty obvious, outside police responded within 90 seconds. No teachers, not even mp's. |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by Eegore on 12/09/19 at 11:49:09 (Except MnSpring indicated "every" gun law is illegal) And where was it I said that ? We already went through this. You didn't say it, you presented it in part of an article. To clarify MNSpring did not type himself the phrase "every gun law is illegal" he has presented the concept by providing information on this forum that has stated it. That is an exception to the standard presentation of material that has said we could enforce current gun laws, something MnSpring has typed. |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by Eegore on 12/09/19 at 11:53:09 "I look at gun free zones as an issue of policing. In an area where many people are gathering, especially children... designating it as "gun free" allows security to consider the act of carry as criminal, and enables them to legally detain this person." I look at "gun free" zones as an area where nobody has access to a weapon, including security and staff. For instance at a medical center I worked in the facility went "gun free" so nobody, including security could carry a weapon. So at schools some staff could be armed in accordance to your version of "gun free", such as security ? |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by justin_o_guy2 on 12/09/19 at 15:04:25 293F28352D38352E5A0 wrote:
However you're looking at it, bunches of dead kids and teachers are a testament to how well it works. Haven't seen a shooting at a school with a sign out front saying Teachers and staff are armed and trained in the defense of our students. A few miles away such a school exists.. Very comforting to see. Your way has been a total failure. No Gun Free zone sign needs to exist for teachers to be looking for indicators of a kid with a gun. Look at crime where Law Abiding Citizens are carrying. It's dropping. Look at lefty shitholes. Murder and mayhem in lefty places. But what America NEEDS is more of your failed ideology. |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by srinath on 12/10/19 at 05:59:03 School shootings are a bit of a different set of phenomenon. Some of them were the bully, and here Obama's "not create a school to prison pipeline" of not putting this crap on someone's records and hence scarring them for life - yea, seriously, I think Parkland was this. Some of the shooters were being bullied. This is sad, if they see bullies getting punished or atleast taken out of the way, this should have been prevented. Some of them were weirdos who weren't bullied. This was also easy to identify, most of their friends knew, said so and never got acted upon, thereby discouraging such feedback. About the lefty crapholes with stringent gun laws being crime infested, do we have any evidence they weren't crime infested crapholes before gun laws ? I would guess not. Gun laws did nothing to gun violence to those because city level gun laws make no sense unless you wall off the city after fishing out every gun in there, and don't let any one with a gun back in there by metal detectors and cops at the gates of the city. Yea, we're gonna need a wall around every gun free city. Stupid Idea. Cool. Srinath. |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by MnSpring on 12/10/19 at 07:44:24 527270786572170 wrote: (Except MnSpring indicated "every" gun law is illegal) WOW, first eegore said the above. then back pedaled saying: "You didn't say it", Yet implied I did, only, because I posted a article. "you presented it in part of an article" Then said, "because those words repeated were", (according to eegore), a exception to the standard presentation. it was something, "MnSpring has typed.". Which is not true, because it was, 'cut and paste'. (Kinna like the triple negatives eegor uses often) I wonder, did eegore learn how to spin, deceive, and deflect from tt and clones. or did tt and clones, learn that from eegore ? |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by pg on 12/10/19 at 07:54:37 10330E2D2F34333A5D0 wrote:
The learn it from Saul Alinksy…… Best regards, |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by pg on 12/10/19 at 07:55:32 18383A322F385D0 wrote:
I was referring to the posts about Australia. Best regards, |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by Eegore on 12/10/19 at 16:08:57 "because those words repeated were", (according to eegore), a exception to the standard presentation." That is wrong, re-read it. That is not what I said. You are the only person here who has indicated the All or Every gun law is illegal. You also have stated we should enforce the laws already in existence. Other people have said we should enforce the laws in existence, yet no other person has referenced, provided, mentioned, or otherwise indicated that every, or all gun laws are illegal. What's so hard to understand about that? Most people agree that current gun laws should be enforced, you have provided one exception to that. |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by srinath on 12/11/19 at 06:02:44 If this sorta crap keeps happening, foreign actor based shooting, Trump will milk the fruck out of it. Cool. Srinath. |
|
Title: Re: Naval base shooting, where were the good guys Post by srinath on 12/11/19 at 07:35:42 Add to this, the general Irritation Greta Thunberg's preachy "how dare you" crap and its annoying a lot of us senior citizens. And this from the people who agree with the science. Cool. Srinath. |
|
SuzukiSavage.com » Powered by YaBB 2.2! YaBB © 2000-2007. All Rights Reserved. |