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Message started by justin_o_guy2 on 08/08/19 at 19:57:56

Title: I read it,,
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/08/19 at 19:57:56

And, Lo and BEHOLD
it looks like I wrote some of it

https://bustednuckles.com/2019/08/08/read-it-and-weep-gun-grabbers/


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Read It And Weep Gun Grabbers
Posted on August 8, 2019
Someone who might actually have a little experience with Constitutional Law just dashed your dreams against the rocks of reality.

It might behoove everyone to read this and let this sink in,

Judge Andrew Napolitano: Second Amendment bars many gun restrictions being proposed after mass shootings
By Judge Andrew P. Napolitano |

Last weekend’s mass murders in El Paso, Texas, and Dayton, Ohio, have produced a flood of words about everything from gun control to mental illness to white nationalism. Most of those words have addressed the right to keep and bear arms as if it were a gift from the government. It isn’t.

The Supreme Court has twice ruled in the past 11 years that the right to keep and bear arms is an individual pre-political liberty. That is the highest category of liberty recognized in the law. It is akin to the freedoms of thought, speech and personality.



That means that the court has recognized that the framers of the Constitution did not bestow this right upon us. Rather, they recognized its preexistence as an extension of our natural human right to self-defense and they forbade government – state and federal – from infringing upon it.

It would be exquisitely unfair, profoundly unconstitutional and historically un-American for the rights of law-abiding folks – “surrender that rifle you own legally and use safely because some other folks have used that same type of weapon criminally” – to be impaired in the name of public safety.

It would also be irrational. A person willing to kill innocents and be killed by the police while doing so surely would have no qualms about violating a state or federal law that prohibited the general ownership of the weapon he was about to use.

With all of this as background, and the country anguishing over the mass deaths of innocents, the feds and the states face a choice between a knee-jerk but popular restriction of some form of gun ownership and the rational and sound realization that more guns in the hands of those properly trained means less crime and more safety.

Can the government constitutionally outlaw the types of rifles used by the El Paso and Dayton killers? In a word: No.

We know this because in the first Supreme Court opinion upholding the individual right to keep and bear arms, the court addressed what kind of arms the Second Amendment protects. The court ruled that the Second Amendment protects individual ownership of weapons one can carry that are of the same degree of sophistication as the bad guys have – or the government has.

The government? Yes, the government. That’s so because the Second Amendment was not written to protect the right to shoot deer. It was written to protect the right to shoot at tyrants and their agents when they have stolen liberty or property from the people.

If you don’t believe me on this, then read the Declaration of Independence. It justifies violence against the British government because of such thefts.

Governments are the greatest mass killers on the planet. Who can take without alarm any of their threats to emasculate our right to defend our personal liberties?

In theory, all of this was known by President Trump when he addressed the nation and attributed the weekend slaughters to mental illness, the freedom to express hateful ideas on the Internet and violent video games. He should have consulted his lawyers before he spoke.

Federal law prohibits records of mental health problems, unless they result in involuntary institutionalization, from entering the government’s databases that are consulted in background checks. And the Supreme Court has already ruled that the government cannot censor, ban or punish opinions expressed on the Internet or games played there.

Snipped for brevity.



We know that some among us love to hate. That is their right, but they have no right to act violently beyond their perverse thoughts. And all people have the right to defend against such violence by using guns to do so.

The president also offered his support for “red flag” laws. These horrific statutes permit police or courts to seize guns from those deemed dangerous.

Red flag laws are unconstitutional.The presumption of innocence and the due process requirement of demonstrable fault as a precondition to any punishment or sanction together prohibit the loss of liberty on the basis of what might happen in the future.

In America, we do not punish a person or deprive anyone of liberty on the basis of a fear of what the person might do. When the Soviets used psychiatric testimony to predict criminal behavior, President Ronald Reagan condemned it. Now, the president wants it here.

Snipped again for brevity.

The government can no more interfere with Second Amendment rights than it can infringe upon any other rights. If this were not so, then no liberty – speech, press, religion, association, self-defense, privacy, travel, property ownership – would be safe from the reach of a fearful majority.

That’s why we have a Constitution.

All italics and bolded items are my emphasis.

You can read the entire opinion article at Fox News here..

So there you have it.

Now STFU with your gun grabbing fantasies.


Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by T And T Garage on 08/08/19 at 21:22:54


4C5355524F4879497941535F14260 wrote:
And, Lo and BEHOLD
it looks like I wrote some of it

https://bustednuckles.com/2019/08/08/read-it-and-weep-gun-grabbers/


Bustednuckles
Documenting The Death Of America
Search
Search
Main menu
Skip to primary content
Home
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Post navigation[ch8592] Previous
Read It And Weep Gun Grabbers
Posted on August 8, 2019
Someone who might actually have a little experience with Constitutional Law just dashed your dreams against the rocks of reality.

It might behoove everyone to read this and let this sink in,

Judge Andrew Napolitano: Second Amendment bars many gun restrictions being proposed after mass shootings
By Judge Andrew P. Napolitano |

Last weekend’s mass murders in El Paso, Texas, and Dayton, Ohio, have produced a flood of words about everything from gun control to mental illness to white nationalism. Most of those words have addressed the right to keep and bear arms as if it were a gift from the government. It isn’t.

The Supreme Court has twice ruled in the past 11 years that the right to keep and bear arms is an individual pre-political liberty. That is the highest category of liberty recognized in the law. It is akin to the freedoms of thought, speech and personality.



That means that the court has recognized that the framers of the Constitution did not bestow this right upon us. Rather, they recognized its preexistence as an extension of our natural human right to self-defense and they forbade government – state and federal – from infringing upon it.

It would be exquisitely unfair, profoundly unconstitutional and historically un-American for the rights of law-abiding folks – “surrender that rifle you own legally and use safely because some other folks have used that same type of weapon criminally” – to be impaired in the name of public safety.

It would also be irrational. A person willing to kill innocents and be killed by the police while doing so surely would have no qualms about violating a state or federal law that prohibited the general ownership of the weapon he was about to use.

With all of this as background, and the country anguishing over the mass deaths of innocents, the feds and the states face a choice between a knee-jerk but popular restriction of some form of gun ownership and the rational and sound realization that more guns in the hands of those properly trained means less crime and more safety.

Can the government constitutionally outlaw the types of rifles used by the El Paso and Dayton killers? In a word: No.

We know this because in the first Supreme Court opinion upholding the individual right to keep and bear arms, the court addressed what kind of arms the Second Amendment protects. The court ruled that the Second Amendment protects individual ownership of weapons one can carry that are of the same degree of sophistication as the bad guys have – or the government has.

The government? Yes, the government. That’s so because the Second Amendment was not written to protect the right to shoot deer. It was written to protect the right to shoot at tyrants and their agents when they have stolen liberty or property from the people.

If you don’t believe me on this, then read the Declaration of Independence. It justifies violence against the British government because of such thefts.

Governments are the greatest mass killers on the planet. Who can take without alarm any of their threats to emasculate our right to defend our personal liberties?

In theory, all of this was known by President Trump when he addressed the nation and attributed the weekend slaughters to mental illness, the freedom to express hateful ideas on the Internet and violent video games. He should have consulted his lawyers before he spoke.

Federal law prohibits records of mental health problems, unless they result in involuntary institutionalization, from entering the government’s databases that are consulted in background checks. And the Supreme Court has already ruled that the government cannot censor, ban or punish opinions expressed on the Internet or games played there.

Snipped for brevity.

Then the president condemned hate. Do you believe his condemnations? He has, after all, praised the white supremacists at Charlottesville, Virginia, in 2017 as "good people," even though one of them pleaded guilty to the first-degree murder of a young woman, and even though, as a candidate and later as president, he argued that the southwest United States was being "invaded" and "infested" by Hispanics.

That white supremacy ideology – "let's repel the Hispanic invaders because the feds won't do so" – resonates in the manifesto of the man accused of being the El Paso killer, which he published about 20 minutes before the shootings. That ideology is far more widespread than most Americans realize. The FBI recently demonstrated as much. This form of hatred of people because of their immutable characteristics breeds violence.


We know that some among us love to hate. That is their right, but they have no right to act violently beyond their perverse thoughts. And all people have the right to defend against such violence by using guns to do so.

The president also offered his support for “red flag” laws. These horrific statutes permit police or courts to seize guns from those deemed dangerous.

Red flag laws are unconstitutional.The presumption of innocence and the due process requirement of demonstrable fault as a precondition to any punishment or sanction together prohibit the loss of liberty on the basis of what might happen in the future.

In America, we do not punish a person or deprive anyone of liberty on the basis of a fear of what the person might do. When the Soviets used psychiatric testimony to predict criminal behavior, President Ronald Reagan condemned it. Now, the president wants it here.

Snipped again for brevity.

The United States is not New Zealand, where a national legislature, animated by fear and provoked by tragedy, can impair fundamental liberties by majority vote. In America, neither Congress nor the states can outlaw whatever handguns or rifles they want to outlaw or infringe upon the right to own them.

The government can no more interfere with Second Amendment rights than it can infringe upon any other rights. If this were not so, then no liberty – speech, press, religion, association, self-defense, privacy, travel, property ownership – would be safe from the reach of a fearful majority.

That’s why we have a Constitution.

All italics and bolded items are my emphasis.

You can read the entire opinion article at Fox News here..

So there you have it.

Now STFU with your gun grabbing fantasies.



I added context.  Turns out Napolitano's no fan of trump's.

Interesting opinion piece, but that's about it.  There are already restrictions on arms in this country.  It's not unconstitutional.

Suffice it to say - something's gotta change - what we have now is not working.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/08/19 at 22:01:55

I only read your BULLSHIT until I find a lie.

Boom
Didn't have to go far.

has, after all, praised the white supremacists at Charlottesville, Virginia, in 2017 as "good people," even though one of them pleaded guilty

You intentionally misconstrue.
You're a liar
Who could probably pass a polygraph.
You probably actually believe what you said
But it's not true.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/09/19 at 04:35:14

Then the president condemned hate. Do you believe his condemnations? He has, after all, praised the white supremacists at Charlottesville, Virginia, in 2017 as "good people," even though one of them pleaded guilty to the first-degree murder of a young woman,

Shocking I know, but yet another lie told from our Chicago friend. As has been said, if you repeat a lie enough, weak minded fools will believe and repeat.

I know this is a waste of time, but why don't you show us or provide the video showing the single sentence where Trump said "White supremacist are good people".

I triple dog dare you.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by T And T Garage on 08/09/19 at 05:00:58


554A4C4B5651605060584A460D3F0 wrote:
I only read your BULLSHIT until I find a lie.

Boom
Didn't have to go far.

has, after all, praised the white supremacists at Charlottesville, Virginia, in
2017 as "good people," even though one of them pleaded guilty

Well, genius, that quote was from Napolitano's complete op-ed.

If you're going to cut & paste, you may want to read the entire thing....

You intentionally misconstrue.
You're a liar
Who could probably pass a polygraph.
You probably actually believe what you said
But it's not true.



Oh, gee, jog - that hurts.

I mean, you're the same guy that bought into Sandy Hook being a false flag - and remember your views on 9/11?

So, golly - your opinion means so much.....<<<<sarcasm

LOL

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by T And T Garage on 08/09/19 at 05:02:32


033136272031261935263F540 wrote:
Then the president condemned hate. Do you believe his condemnations? He has, after all, praised the white supremacists at Charlottesville, Virginia, in 2017 as "good people," even though one of them pleaded guilty to the first-degree murder of a young woman,

Shocking I know, but yet another lie told from our Chicago friend. As has been said, if you repeat a lie enough, weak minded fools will believe and repeat.

Hey, mark - FYI, that quote is from Napolitano.  Didn't you actually read his entire article?

Wow - ignorance.

I know this is a waste of time, but why don't you show us or provide the video showing the single sentence where Trump said "White supremacist are good people".

I triple dog dare you.


Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by Eegore on 08/09/19 at 05:30:49


"The court ruled that the Second Amendment protects individual ownership of weapons one can carry that are of the same degree of sophistication as the bad guys have – or the government has."

 This is fundamentally untrue as the US Government has a ton of armament US citizens may not legally own.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/09/19 at 07:32:30

I know this is a waste of time, but why don't you show us or provide the video showing the single sentence where Trump said "White supremacist are good people".

I triple dog dare you.


Guess my triple dog dare is gonna go unchallenged....

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by T And T Garage on 08/09/19 at 07:44:32


6B595E4F48594E715D4E573C0 wrote:
I know this is a waste of time, but why don't you show us or provide the video showing the single sentence where Trump said "White supremacist are good people".

I triple dog dare you.


Guess my triple dog dare is gonna go unchallenged....



Hey, mark - you're daring the wrong guy.

You see, what I posted is from Napolitano's complete op-ed.

Here ya go, sport:

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/judge-andrew-napolitano-a-few-words-about-guns-and-personal-liberty


Stop being willfully ignorant.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by MnSpring on 08/09/19 at 08:03:18


574946474A574C51230 wrote:
You see, what I posted is from Napolitano's

Aw-sum Deflection, What's that 'H' word again.

The question was, NOT, what someone else, 'said', they said.

Well, if someone believes every word C.U. and R.M. says,
they probably have been Lied to so many times,
they believe the lies.

See how the UL Propaganda works !







Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by T And T Garage on 08/09/19 at 08:13:25


2D0E331012090E07600 wrote:
[quote author=574946474A574C51230 link=1565319476/0#8 date=1565361872]You see, what I posted is from Napolitano's

Aw-sum Deflection, What's that 'H' word again.

Tell me mn.... how is posting an op ed from someone hypocritical?

I'd love to hear an explanation...!

The question was, NOT, what someone else, 'said', they said.

Well, if someone believes every word C.U. and R.M. says,
they probably have been Lied to so many times,
they believe the lies.

See how the UL Propaganda works !

Well mn - this was posted on your beloved fox.... so.... now they post "UL propaganda?

LOL - you're funny!






[/quote]

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/09/19 at 08:44:41


534D42434E534855270 wrote:
[quote author=6B595E4F48594E715D4E573C0 link=1565319476/0#7 date=1565361150]I know this is a waste of time, but why don't you show us or provide the video showing the single sentence where Trump said "White supremacist are good people".

I triple dog dare you.


Guess my triple dog dare is gonna go unchallenged....



Hey, mark - you're daring the wrong guy.

You see, what I posted is from Napolitano's complete op-ed.

Here ya go, sport:

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/judge-andrew-napolitano-a-few-words-about-guns-and-personal-liberty


Stop being willfully ignorant.
[/quote]

You've said the same thing. Stop being willfully ignorant.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by T And T Garage on 08/09/19 at 08:47:45


5E6C6B7A7D6C7B44687B62090 wrote:
[quote author=534D42434E534855270 link=1565319476/0#8 date=1565361872][quote author=6B595E4F48594E715D4E573C0 link=1565319476/0#7 date=1565361150]I know this is a waste of time, but why don't you show us or provide the video showing the single sentence where Trump said "White supremacist are good people".

I triple dog dare you.


Guess my triple dog dare is gonna go unchallenged....



Hey, mark - you're daring the wrong guy.

You see, what I posted is from Napolitano's complete op-ed.

Here ya go, sport:

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/judge-andrew-napolitano-a-few-words-about-guns-and-personal-liberty


Stop being willfully ignorant.
[/quote]

You've said the same thing. Stop being willfully ignorant.[/quote]


No, I didn't - now you're lying.

I've said that he was quoted as saying "there are fine people on both sides".

I have interpreted that he means there are good white supremacists.


Now, take your dare and aim it at Napolitano and admit that you were wrong in blaming me for the quote.

Or do you have zero honor?

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/09/19 at 08:48:21

A nutjob in Springfiled, MO was walking towards a Walmart in bidy armour and carrying gun with hundred rounds or more. Dozens more lined up for the slaughter! Nope! An off duty fireman with a concealed carry permit held him at gunpoint until police arrive.

Now, stories first reported in the news are almost always wrong but let's follow this to see if a gun carrying law abiding citizen saved lives.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/09/19 at 08:54:01

No, I didn't - now you're lying.

I've said that he was quoted as saying "there are fine people on both sides".

I have interpreted that he means there are good white supremacists.

If that's your interpretation, you are as usual uninformed due to you one sided news sources.

Are you sure if I went back and did a search, I wouldn't find quotes from you repeating the "fine people" lie??? The fact you said you think he said there are good white supremacist leads me to believe I would.

However, on the off chance you did not fall for that lie like you have on so many others, I will happily apologize and tear my clothes and repent in dust and ashes.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by T And T Garage on 08/09/19 at 08:54:40


625057464150477854475E350 wrote:
A nutjob in Springfiled, MO was walking towards a Walmart in bidy armour and carrying gun with hundred rounds or more. Dozens more lined up for the slaughter! Nope! An off duty fireman with a concealed carry permit held him at gunpoint until police arrive.

Well, gee, where was he in Dayton???  What about El Paso??

The "good guy with a gun" mentality is DOA - pun intended.

Now, stories first reported in the news are almost always wrong but let's follow this to see if a gun carrying law abiding citizen saved lives.





So.... no honor it is.

You and jog make a cute couple.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by T And T Garage on 08/09/19 at 08:56:46


596B6C7D7A6B7C436F7C650E0 wrote:
No, I didn't - now you're lying.

I've said that he was quoted as saying "there are fine people on both sides".

I have interpreted that he means there are good white supremacists.

If that's your interpretation, you are as usual uninformed due to you one sided news sources.

Answer this mark - did trump say "there are fine people on both sides"?

If yes, then everything else is moot in you little argument.

Are you sure if I went back and did a search, I wouldn't find quotes from you repeating the "fine people" lie??? The fact you said you think he said there are good white supremacist leads me to believe I would.

Have at it hoss.

However, on the off chance you did not fall for that lie like you have on so many others, I will happily apologize and tear my clothes and repent in dust and ashes.


I look forward to your apology.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/09/19 at 09:11:47

Answer this mark - did trump say "there are fine people on both sides"?

Yep, he did. Question: what were the 'sides' he was referring to?

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by T And T Garage on 08/09/19 at 09:18:04


4B797E6F68796E517D6E771C0 wrote:
Answer this mark - did trump say "there are fine people on both sides"?

Yep, he did. Question: what were the 'sides' he was referring to?



The protesters - the "unite the right" carrying their torches and those that protested them.


Hey - where's my apology?

No honor once again?

Are you going to acknowledge that I simply cut and pasted Napolitano's op-ed?

LOL - of course not!!

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/09/19 at 09:29:43

The protesters - the "unite the right" carrying their torches and those that protested them

Nope. Wrong answer.

I think perhaps I'd better do some searches on your comments from the Charlottesville thing cause your history of lying is staggering so I'm not going to believe you until I check.  I think its more than likely you said Trump called Nazis fine people. You  already incorrectly think he called white supremacists fine people.

But not searching now cause I'm gonna go play golf this afternoon.

Regarding the Napolitano cut and paste thing, i didn't read the original article JOG posted. I know who he is but i dont recall hearing him speak other than a sentence or two. I've never read anything he's written.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by T And T Garage on 08/09/19 at 09:36:12


516364757263744B67746D060 wrote:
The protesters - the "unite the right" carrying their torches and those that protested them

Nope. Wrong answer.

LOL - what?  Who the hell was he talking about???

Here ya go, mark:

Speaking in the lobby of Trump Tower at what had been billed as a statement on infrastructure, a combative Trump defended his slowness to condemn white nationalists and neo-Nazis after the melee in central Virginia, which ended in the death of one woman and injuries to dozens of others, and compared the tearing down of Confederate monuments to the hypothetical removal of monuments to the Founding Fathers. He also said that counter-protesters deserve an equal amount of blame for the violence.

“What about the alt-left that came charging at, as you say, at the alt-right?” Trump said. “Do they have any semblance of guilt?”

“I’ve condemned neo-Nazis. I’ve condemned many different groups. But not all of those people were neo-Nazis, believe me,” he said.

“You had many people in that group other than neo-Nazis and white nationalists,” Trump said. “The press has treated them absolutely unfairly.”

“You also had some very fine people on both sides,” he said.





I think perhaps I'd better do some searches on your comments from the Charlottesville thing cause your history of lying is staggering so I'm not going to believe you until I check.  I think its more than likely you said Trump called Nazis fine people. You  already incorrectly think he called white supremacists fine people.

As I said - Have at it hoss... I look forward to your apology, but i won't hold my breath.

But not searching now cause I'm gonna go play golf this afternoon.

Regarding the Napolitano cut and paste thing, i didn't read the original article JOG posted. I know who he is but i dont recall hearing him speak other than a sentence or two. I've never read anything he's written.


And yet you just automatically blame me for what he wrote?

Pathetic.  No apology, no acknowledgement, no honor.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/09/19 at 10:09:27


And yet you just automatically blame me for what he wrote?

Pathetic.  No apology, no acknowledgement, no honor.

No apology yet. I will if it's deserved its just you are a liar so I don't believe you.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by T And T Garage on 08/09/19 at 10:11:59


5D6F68797E6F78476B78610A0 wrote:
And yet you just automatically blame me for what he wrote?

Pathetic.  No apology, no acknowledgement, no honor.

No apology yet. I will if it's deserved its just you are a liar so I don't believe you.



No honor.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/09/19 at 10:20:12

You’re a liar. I don’t trust what you say. I check and get back to you.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by MnSpring on 08/09/19 at 10:20:34

“You also had some very fine people on both sides.”

So every single person on the Right was a Nazi or racist white supremacist.
EVERY SINGLE ONE ! They were ALL in the 1-2% on the Far Right.

And antifa, and all the other, groups on the Left.
NON of them were on the fringe.
ALL, were in the 30-40 % to the left.

And the word, ’SOME’, has no meaning.

How’s that, Socialism, working in IL.
(Hea still waiting for some to send me a bobber)
If Socialism works so good,
gotta get me soma that !


Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by T And T Garage on 08/09/19 at 10:25:30


6B595E4F48594E715D4E573C0 wrote:
You’re a liar. I don’t trust what you say. I check and get back to you.



LOL - don't bother mark - the last thing on Earth that I need is anything from you.  You have zero honor.

Go pay way too much to hit a little white ball on grass....

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by T And T Garage on 08/09/19 at 10:26:12


6A497457554E4940270 wrote:
“You also had some very fine people on both sides.”

So every single person on the Right was a Nazi or racist white supremacist.
EVERY SINGLE ONE ! They were ALL in the 1-2% on the Far Right.

And antifa, and all the other, groups on the Left.
NON of them were on the fringe.
ALL, were in the 30-40 % to the left.

And the word, ’SOME’, has no meaning.

How’s that, Socialism, working in IL.
(Hea still waiting for some to send me a bobber)
If Socialism works so good,
gotta get me soma that !


I don't expect to you to understand.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/09/19 at 10:28:00

Lefties
They have such good ideas
That they have to be Forced on people.

Yes, TT, you're a liar.
You choose to pretend Trump said something he didn't say.
Even that cuck Jake Tapper admitted that.
You can pretend whatever you want, and churn up the appropriate snowflake moral outrage butthurt that would be justified if it were true, but that doesn't make it true.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by T And T Garage on 08/09/19 at 13:55:11


617E787F62655464546C7E72390B0 wrote:
Lefties
They have such good ideas
That they have to be Forced on people.

Yes, TT, you're a liar.

Got any proof?

You choose to pretend Trump said something he didn't say.

Napolitano made that quote, not me, sport.

Even that cuck Jake Tapper admitted that.
You can pretend whatever you want, and churn up the appropriate snowflake moral outrage butthurt that would be justified if it were true, but that doesn't make it true.

Well, then you must have a beef with fox - they're the ones' that posted Napolitano's op-ed.

Burn.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/10/19 at 05:17:06

Hint: Do not do a search on this site....  It's pathetic how much time all of us waste on here. Charlottesville occurred two years ago... .I'm not investing that much time searching the thousands of post we've made. Again, it's embarrassing to go back in time on here. We've all written the equivalent of a decent sized book!....

What I found in a brief search was clearly my Chicago friend equates Nazi's and white nationalist as basically one and the same as I think most people would. Unlike his benefactor, Sew, I did not find an absolute statement that says "Trump said Nazis are fine people" but I did not search every post and read every comment for the past two years.  However, I think given TT's statement a few post above, he clearly believes Trump said white nationalist are fine people. Given his repeated errors in other matters such as Giffords/Palin association, I think in a court of law if brought up on charges did he believe the fake news assertion that Trump call Nazi's fine people, he'd be found guilty.

Now, to this demand of his I apologize. I'm not exactly sure what it is he's pining for....   No, I did not read the long cut and past from that Judge guy. As far as I can tell TT, you are demanding an apologize because I assumed a couple of sentences from that articles of the Judge's that you cut and pasted was condoned and agreed to you by you. Is that the basis for your objections?

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by Serowbot on 08/10/19 at 07:40:20

Let's say you were planning on going to the Charlottesville protest innocently, without knowing it was a Nazi,white supremacist rally, intended to cause trouble and violence.
You just like statues of white guys on horses.
You're one of the "nice people on both sides" that Trump will later speak of.

The event was organized by Jason Kessler, a former journalist and a member of the Proud Boys, an ultra-nationalist group.
- but you don't know who he is,.. so you're still innocent.

News agencies are rushing to Charlottesville to cover the event and anticipating riots and violence.  They are reporting anticipated violent clashes.
Police are beefing up security in anticipation.
- You might start getting a clue here.
- but you think,.. "No, these are good people, maybe it's the "other" guys that might start a little trouble.

The day before the event,... marchers descended on the University of Virginia carrying torches and yelling slogans "white lives matter", "Jews will not replace us",  and "blood and soil",
-if you are still planning to attend the event,... you are clearly attending an event led by a white supremacist, that is planning a confrontation.

You now know this is an event planned by a white supremacist,.. intended to be confrontational. The press are everywhere, police everywhere. The evening before, you saw a torch bearing mob, chanting racist slogans.
- Can you still be a "fine person"... and still attend this Nazi led event?...

Could you innocently walk into a nudist camp and not notice everyone around you is naked?...
How long does it take to get a clue?.
:-/



Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/10/19 at 08:40:57

Let's say you're planning on going to DC to protest Trump's 2nd term. Antifa and other groups who historically have instigated violence against anyone in their path have announced their intention to protest.

Can you still be a fine person and attend this event?

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by Serowbot on 08/10/19 at 09:21:35

You're equating the protesters of violent racist groups  to violent racist groups.
Antifa is fighting back... They are not the problem


- 2017, out of 65 terrorist incidents , 37 were tied to racist, anti-Muslim, homophobic, anti-Semitic, fascist, anti-government, or xenophobic motivations.

- Two-thirds of the terror attacks in the United States last year were carried out by right-wing extremists.

- Every racist act of terror in the US this year was done by a White supremacist connected person




Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by MnSpring on 08/10/19 at 09:38:59


3F293E233B2E23384C0 wrote:
Antifa is fighting back... They are not the problem  

WOW, you giving a group of people,
a PASS !!!!!!!


A scenario:
A group of people, are protesting something,
someone, 'identifies' them as Antifa,
Some turn over cars, set fires, break windows, loot, block traffic, beat people up, etc, etc, etc.

Someone else says:
"Some good people on both sides"

Does that mean, EVERYONE, on that side is a POS.
And Anyone saying, "...some..." is a POS ?

Or could it be, their were some their, who have been meeting in a group, for 70 years, (and never thrown one rock) that call themselves, Antifa ?








Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by MnSpring on 08/10/19 at 09:53:09


2137203D25303D26520 wrote:
- Every racist act of terror in the US this year was done by a White supremacist connected person  

OK, so this act:

Connor Betts, the 24-year-old Dayton shooter, endorsed communism
Who said/tweeted:
“Make Racists Afraid Again” and “Kill All Fascists.”
"a photo that suggested slashing the tires of Border Patrol agents."
“I want socialism, and I’ll not wait for the idiots to finally come around to understanding.”
“3 Guilt Free Ways to Kill Fascists,”


Was not a 'racist act of terror in the US ' ?

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by Serowbot on 08/10/19 at 10:24:32

If these are things he actually said,... he seems to have chosen his location and victims in opposition to his beliefs.
This was an area he frequented,... people in his peer group,.. his own sister.
He didn't target a Trump rally.
His killings do not appear to be ideologically motivated.

The El Paso shooter drove 800 miles to get a bigger Hispanic body count.
The synagogue shooter targeted Jews
The crazy Trump supporter, pipe bomber targeted Democrats and minorities.
Black churches, gay bars...
All targets chosen based on ideology of race and hate.

In Dayton this does not appear to be the case.
More a lone nut that couldn't get a girlfriend.
His political ideology was not a factor.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by MnSpring on 08/10/19 at 10:25:15


023037262130271834273E550 wrote:
A nutjob in Springfiled, MO was walking towards a Walmart in bidy armour and carrying gun with hundred rounds or more. Dozens more lined up for the slaughter! Nope! An off duty fireman with a concealed carry permit held him at gunpoint until police arrive....

Golly Gee, CNN and the like,  NO 24/7 stories,
Sure they reported once about 55-year-old Philip Michael Attey II.
But they left a bunch out about the interview with detectives.
"Attey said he is an anti-gun activist and that he believes his statements made to the Walmart clerk in front of a customer "only helps his cause which is for Walmart to stop selling firearms,"

Why did they leave that out ?
Is it because it does not drive the FEAR the UL's want ?

Here is from the page of:
https://abcnews.go.com/US/man-detained-walking-missouri-walmart-armed-rifle-wearing/story?id=64870120

(If you want to read it, hurry before it is taken down)

"That man was identified as 55-year-old Philip Michael Attey II and during a subsequent interview with detectives, Attey said he is an anti-gun activist and that he believes his statements made to the Walmart clerk in front of a customer "only helps his cause which is for Walmart to stop selling firearms," police said. "


Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by Serowbot on 08/10/19 at 10:34:02


023037262130271834273E550 wrote:
A nutjob in Springfiled, MO was walking towards a Walmart in bidy armour and carrying gun with hundred rounds or more. Dozens more lined up for the slaughter! Nope! An off duty fireman with a concealed carry permit held him at gunpoint until police arrive....


Yes, the good guy with a gun subdued a "shooter" that wasn't shooting.

I could have done that with a feather duster... ;D

PS... I'm not trying minimize this nut's actions,... it was terror,... and should be prosecuted as such.
... just saying  he wasn't being a physical threat at that time, and it doesn't take a great deal of courage to draw on a guy that ain't shooting at you.
That said,.. the fireman did the right thing.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/10/19 at 11:08:27

Antifa is fighting back... They are not the problem

Oh come man! Be serious. Just fighting back??? Did you see Trump's inauguration? Your rose colored glasses are fogged up!

Imagine you're a history professor or just an amateur historian who feels it was setting a bad precedent to tear down 100+ year old statues and you wanted to express your point of view.

You basically said if you were someone who had an issue with tearing down these statues. your right to protest is secondary to another group's right because a third group took the position that they're going to lump you in with that 2nd group which you had nothing to do with.

That's a ridiculous position.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by Serowbot on 08/10/19 at 11:23:56

Do you really think a history professor would stay around in a group of people spewing racist rhetoric?...
Any sane person would leave, and say I don't associate with these type of people.  
This is not the protest I thought it was.
These people are sick.
By staying, you are lending legitimacy to them.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/10/19 at 12:35:19

It’s an absolute fact there were and will be protestors targeting Trump with only violence on their agenda. If you want to pretend you’re an ostrich and bury yourself to those fact, nothing I can do about that but by siding with the protesters you are condoning violence?

You have no idea who or how many were at that protest, how large of a physical space it occupied, could statue protesters see the whole picture etc...  You’ve lumped them in and declared them racist.

A couple years ago, there was a motorcycle show downtown St Louis same weekend as the women’s march. At that protest, I saw horrible, awful signs about wishes of violence towards Trump, his wife and at least one sign about the mental capabilities of his youngest son.

So using your logic, everyone who stayed at that march is equally guilty by association of inciting violence etc...?

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by Serowbot on 08/10/19 at 12:45:50

You seem to be worried about the wrong people... :-?

6A7C6B766E7B766D190 wrote:
- 2017, out of 65 terrorist incidents , 37 were tied to racist, anti-Muslim, homophobic, anti-Semitic, fascist, anti-government, or xenophobic motivations.

- Two-thirds of the terror attacks in the United States last year were carried out by right-wing extremists.

- Every racist act of terror in the US this year was done by a White supremacist connected person

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by MnSpring on 08/10/19 at 13:35:10


7B6D7A677F6A677C080 wrote:
In Dayton this does not appear to be the case.
His political ideology was not a factor.

So someone saying:
“Make Racists Afraid Again”
“Kill All Fascists.”
"a photo that suggested slashing the tires of Border Patrol agents."
“3 Guilt Free Ways to Kill Fascists,”

And, (Drum roll now)
“I want socialism, and I’ll not wait for the idiots to finally come around to understanding.”

Is not a, "political ideology" ?

As to: If these are things he actually said
Look it up, very easy to find from several sources.

As tt often has said:
'Look it up yourself, or are you to lazy'



Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by MnSpring on 08/10/19 at 13:38:01


6274637E66737E65110 wrote:
- Every racist act of terror in the US this year was done by a White supremacist connected person

Don't believe that statement.
Can you provide some proof of it.
From a Legitimate source.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by Serowbot on 08/10/19 at 14:20:48


41625F7C7E65626B0C0 wrote:
[quote author=6274637E66737E65110 link=1565319476/30#41 date=1565466350]- Every racist act of terror in the US this year was done by a White supremacist connected person

Don't believe that statement.
Can you provide some proof of it.
From a Legitimate source.
[/quote]

'Look it up yourself, or are you to lazy'



Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/10/19 at 14:24:53

I give up. Every single person who showed up at that protest is a white supremacists. Anyone who questions removing from public view 100 year old statues, pictures, books you find questionable have the moral equivalency of David Duke. There is no room for anyone in your tent other than your 63 million like minded pure souls.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by Serowbot on 08/10/19 at 14:34:21

Las Vegas neo-Nazi charged with plot to bomb gay club, synagogue
https://abcnews.go.com/US/las-vegas-neo-nazi-charged-plot-bomb-gay/story?id=64895586
"The FBI arrested and charged an alleged Las Vegas neo-Nazi with plotting to bomb a synagogue and gay club in the city on Thursday.

Conor Climo, 23, who worked as a security guard, allegedly was found to be in possession of bomb-making materials and was "communicating with individuals who identified with a white supremacist extremist organization using the National Socialist Movement to promote their ideology," according to the FBI.
"

So, let's be afraid of Antifa... the people that fight these people...
Can't you see Trump's subterfuge?.... Of course not, because it's yours too.
White supremacists are the problem,... get rid of them and Antifa goes away.  Happily...

Look,...
- White supremacists want to get rid of blacks, Mexicans, Jews, gays, Muslims, Buddhists, Arabs, Hindu's, Asians, Indians....
- Antifa wants to get rid of White supremacists...

Which one is in the right?.
Who do you agree with?...
Which is not racist?...
How can you side with racists and not be racist?...
How can you object to violence against the most violent racist terrorists in America, without acknowledging that these people are violent racist terrorists? ...

Antifa is just saying,.. we will hit back...we will make you afraid to hit us.    

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/10/19 at 16:33:47

Antifa is just saying,.. we will hit back...we will make you afraid to hit us.  

You’re fooling yourself into believing that.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by MnSpring on 08/10/19 at 18:52:54


2335223F27323F24500 wrote:
- Antifa wants to get rid of White supremacists...   

For the Violent antifa groups, that includes,
EVERYBODY else, that stands in their way,
from getting, Gimme, Gimme, Gimme.

Hey, I know, send a couple of the violent antifa groups to the inner city of Chicago.
Let them lay down the law in the low income high rises !!!!!

;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D




Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/11/19 at 04:32:41


7D6B7C61796C617A0E0 wrote:
You're equating the protesters of violent racist groups  to violent racist groups.
Antifa is fighting back... They are not the problem


- 2017, out of 65 terrorist incidents , 37 were tied to racist, anti-Muslim, homophobic, anti-Semitic, fascist, anti-government, or xenophobic motivations.

- Two-thirds of the terror attacks in the United States last year were carried out by right-wing extremists.

- Every racist act of terror in the US this year was done by a White supremacist connected person


Here, watch carefully.  https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8WzMZxT-41k

Notice all your heroes dressed in black covering their heroic faces saving the Republic by (I'm sorry what did you call it? Oh yea, 'fighting back' ) by beating the $hit out of a reporter known to cover their events.

I'm guessing this attack didn't make it into any of your statistics above. Similarly, again using your logic, anyone else there who planned on participating in a protest are guilty by association and should have immediately set aside their right to protest and left upon seeing or hearing about this event.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by T And T Garage on 08/11/19 at 11:38:40


506265747362754A66756C070 wrote:
Hint: Do not do a search on this site....  It's pathetic how much time all of us waste on here. Charlottesville occurred two years ago... .I'm not investing that much time searching the thousands of post we've made. Again, it's embarrassing to go back in time on here. We've all written the equivalent of a decent sized book!....

Then stop lying about what I said, or show me proof.

What I found in a brief search was clearly my Chicago friend equates Nazi's and white nationalist as basically one and the same as I think most people would. Unlike his benefactor, Sew, I did not find an absolute statement that says "Trump said Nazis are fine people" but I did not search every post and read every comment for the past two years.  However, I think given TT's statement a few post above, he clearly believes Trump said white nationalist are fine people. Given his repeated errors in other matters such as Giffords/Palin association, I think in a court of law if brought up on charges did he believe the fake news assertion that Trump call Nazi's fine people, he'd be found guilty.

Now, to this demand of his I apologize. I'm not exactly sure what it is he's pining for....   No, I did not read the long cut and past from that Judge guy. As far as I can tell TT, you are demanding an apologize because I assumed a couple of sentences from that articles of the Judge's that you cut and pasted was condoned and agreed to you by you. Is that the basis for your objections?


The thing is, mark - it doesn't matter.  You only see what you want/wish to see.

I C&P the complete op-ed form Napolitano - you and jog didn't even bother to read his entire column.  Not my fault you don't know the difference.

I agree that trump is indeed a white nationalist.  He may not be a nazi, but the right-wingers are in bed with them for sure.  I don't seem to remember david duke endorsing mitt romney, do you?

It's just blatantly obvious who and what trump is.

You choose to look the other way, I don't.

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by MnSpring on 08/11/19 at 13:44:34


392F38253D28253E4A0 wrote:
I could have done that with a feather duster... ;D

So you always carry a, Feather Duster, with you ?

:-? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-?

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by Serowbot on 08/11/19 at 13:53:03


70536E4D4F54535A3D0 wrote:
[quote author=392F38253D28253E4A0 link=1565319476/30#37 date=1565458442]
I could have done that with a feather duster... ;D

So you always carry a, Feather Duster, with you ?

[/quote]
Pretty sure they sell them in Walmart

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/12/19 at 05:50:51

Antifa is fighting back... They are not the problem
Maybe your heros picked up some supplies they used to attack this in Walmart's Superhero aisle.....



Here, watch carefully.  https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8WzMZxT-41k

Notice all your heroes dressed in black covering their heroic faces saving the Republic by (I'm sorry what did you call it? Oh yea, 'fighting back' ) by beating the $hit out of a reporter known to cover their events.

I'm guessing this attack didn't make it into any of your statistics above. Similarly, again using your logic, anyone else there who planned on participating in a protest are guilty by association and should have immediately set aside their right to protest and left upon seeing or hearing about this event. [/quote]

Title: Re: I read it,,
Post by WebsterMark on 08/12/19 at 14:40:54


546661707766714E627168030 wrote:
Antifa is fighting back... They are not the problem
Maybe your heros picked up some supplies they used to attack this in Walmart's Superhero aisle.....



Here, watch carefully.  https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8WzMZxT-41k

Notice all your heroes dressed in black covering their heroic faces saving the Republic by (I'm sorry what did you call it? Oh yea, 'fighting back' ) by beating the $hit out of a reporter known to cover their events.

I'm guessing this attack didn't make it into any of your statistics above. Similarly, again using your logic, anyone else there who planned on participating in a protest are guilty by association and should have immediately set aside their right to protest and left upon seeing or hearing about this event.

[/quote]

I'm not letting you off the hook Mr. Serowbot. These are your heroes in action.

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