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/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Politics, Religion (Tall Table) >> Tell Us Again /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1557446525 Message started by T And T Garage on 05/09/19 at 17:02:05 |
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Title: Tell Us Again Post by T And T Garage on 05/09/19 at 17:02:05 How trump doesn't incite violence? president donald trump was on a riff about border control agents working to prevent migrants from crossing the border while speaking at his Wednesday night rally in Panama City Beach, Fla. “You have hundreds and hundreds of people and you have two or three border security people that are brave and great — And don't forget, we don't let them and we can't let them use weapons. We can't. Other countries do. We can't. I would never do that. But how do you stop these people?" the president said. As the president posed that question — a rally attendee in the crowd shouted: “shoot them.” The president paused and instead of condemning the remark he said: “That’s only in the panhandle, can you get away with that statement." The crowd erupted in cheers and laughter — after another brief pause, trump repeated: “Only in the panhandle.” Are you fukcing kidding me??? America will be great again when this moron is out of office. |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by oldNslow on 05/09/19 at 17:18:27 Quote:
January 20,2025 Feel better now ;D |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by Eegore on 05/09/19 at 18:01:54 How does acknowledging that a specific geographical location in the US is more likely to make a statement about shooting somebody qualify as "inciting" violence. By my definition inciting an act requires more than condemnation or speaking against it. Legally I can not be convicted of inciting a crime by having no opinion of it, or acknowledging that it can happen in a specific location more often that another. |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by T And T Garage on 05/09/19 at 20:39:27 516F6E62706C6D030 wrote:
I sure hope not. I don't think so. I have more faith in America than to think that we'll elect trump again. |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by T And T Garage on 05/09/19 at 20:41:06 08282A223F284D0 wrote:
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by Eegore on 05/09/19 at 20:46:34 Ok but the initial claim is he incites violence and the example given is one where he doesn't condemn shooting people. Again we can't be convicted of inciting something we observe or do not condemn, there are other required parameters. I don't believe Trump met those parameters with his statements in this thread. Not condemning violence does not mean your inciting it. Even if you don't like the person failing to condemn. |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by T And T Garage on 05/09/19 at 20:50:40 7555575F4255300 wrote:
Fair enough, I concede - perhaps not the best choice of words. But to make light of shooting people at the border is no less damaging than inciting violence in my opinion. He's stirring up these types of people who don't need any stirring... Truly deplorable... |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by Eegore on 05/09/19 at 20:54:04 "But to make light of shooting people at the border is no less damaging than inciting violence in my opinion." Ahh yeah that makes more sense. |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by MnSpring on 05/10/19 at 06:47:31 More hypocrisy from the tt 455B545558455E43310 wrote:
Gosh, not a problem when a, ‘comedian’, walks around with a severed bloody head likeness. Not a problem when a, ‘artist’, paints derogatory photos, and hangs them in windows. Not a problem when a ‘comedian’ says, ’someone should shoot him’. Not a problem when a, ‘comedian’, trashes, every show. Not a problem when all sorts of ‘Hollywood Elite’s, say really nasty things. Non of those are, ‘inciting’, violence’. And of course, all those are totally, ’Sane’, talk/practices. (Sane if one is a UL, FDS, Socialist) Who say: I am free to say/do, what ever I want to Condemn the POTUS. Yet you, cannot say ANYTHING, to support the POTUS. |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by Eegore on 05/10/19 at 08:05:06 "Gosh, not a problem when a, ‘comedian’, walks around with a severed bloody head likeness." This is a good point. If someone had a severed head of an immigrant at the rally I am sure the inciting violence route would have been taken. An effigy in my opinion is an effigy and should be equal in weight as to who it represents. |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by WebsterMark on 05/10/19 at 08:05:36 So leftist chasing Senators out of restaurants, protesting in front of conservative commentators homes, and shouting down speakers doesn't incite violence? Not to mention referring to Trump as Hitler and supporters as Nazis. Wouldn't anyone traveling back in time kill Hitler as a youngster given the chance? |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by Eegore on 05/10/19 at 08:16:17 So leftist chasing Senators out of restaurants, protesting in front of conservative commentators homes, and shouting down speakers doesn't incite violence? That's the same type of activity as conservatives assaulting patrons of Red Hen restaurants and making death threats to owners and staff. Those are both examples of inciting violence, however I do not think effigy or complacency apply to that term. Just as with holding an effigy human head, chasing people out of restaurants, or making threats should, to me, be equal in assessment and not political. |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by T And T Garage on 05/10/19 at 12:52:48 112324353223340B27342D460 wrote:
Yeah, if you read my response to Eegore, you'll see that I conceded that I used the wrong simile. Maybe you should address the fact that trump made light of a guy suggesting that we shoot people at the border, mark- unless you're OK with that. Are you? |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by MnSpring on 05/10/19 at 16:39:58 3B252A2B263B203D4F0 wrote:
Would that be anything like the V.P. of the USA saying: "you want to keep someone away from your house, just fire the shotgun through the door." |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by pg on 05/10/19 at 16:49:46 ^^^ Checkmate Best regards, |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by T And T Garage on 05/10/19 at 18:01:24 01221F3C3E25222B4C0 wrote:
Would that be anything like the V.P. of the USA saying: "you want to keep someone away from your house, just fire the shotgun through the door." [/quote] No, mn, it's not the same at all. Once again, you take it out of context. Read on: In February 2013, Biden gave an interview to Field & Stream magazine on the subject of gun violence and gun control. He was asked about the regulation of the very popular AR-15 semi-automatic rifle and its uses in hunting, self-defense, and target practice. Biden played down the use of such a weapon in hunting, saying: “If you have to go up into the Poconos and go bear hunting or deer hunting with that weapon, and you need a clip that has 30 rounds in it, then you shouldn’t be hunting. You’re a danger to yourself. If you can’t get the bear or the deer in four or five shots, you’ve got a problem.” When the interviewer asked “What about the other uses, for self-defense and target practice?”, the Vice President responded as follows: Well, the way in which we measure it is — I think most scholars would say — is that as long as you have a weapon sufficient to be able to provide your self-defense. I did one of these town-hall meetings on the Internet and one guy said, “Well, what happens when the end days come? What happens when there’s the earthquake? I live in California, and I have to protect myself.” I said, “Well, you know, my shotgun will do better for you than your AR-15, because [if] you want to keep someone away from your house, just fire the shotgun through the door.” Most people can handle a shotgun a hell of a lot better than they can a semiautomatic weapon in terms of both their aim and in terms of their ability to deter people coming. We can argue whether that’s true or not, but it is no argument that, for example, a shotgun could do the same job of protecting you. Now, granted, you can come back and say, “Well, a machine gun could do a better job of protecting me.” No one’s arguing we should make machine guns legal. The quotation included in the meme is therefore authentic, but a couple of contextual points should be noted. First, Biden was speaking favorably about the use of a shotgun for self-defense in comparison with the use of an AR-15. He was not promoting shotguns in a television commercial nor recommending their use on his own initiative. He was making a broader point about what he perceived as the limited justifications for owning and using an AR-15 rifle after having been asked about the issue of self-defense specifically. Second, the quotation from the meme was actually an instance of Biden paraphrasing himself, recalling an online forum in which he had earlier participated. It’s not clear which conversation Biden was recalling, but it might have been one hosted by Parents magazine on 20 February 2013, which attracted news coverage for similar remarks the vice president made about the preferability of a shotgun over an AR-15. A Facebook viewer submitted the following question: “Do you believe that banning certain weapons and high-capacity magazines will mean that law-abiding citizens will then become more of a target to criminals, as we will have no way to sufficiently protect ourselves?” Biden responded to say: If you want to protect yourself, get a double-barrelled shotgun, have the shells, a 12-gauge shotgun, and I promise you, as I told my wife — we live in an area that’s wooded and somewhat secluded — I said “Jill, if there’s ever a problem just walk out on the balcony here, walk out, put that double-barrelled shotgun and fire two blasts outside the house.” I promise you, whoever’s coming in is not — you don’t need an AR-15. It’s harder to aim, it’s harder to use, and in fact you don’t need 30 rounds to protect yourself. Buy a shotgun. Buy a shotgun. You see mn - in context, the meaning is much different. Now all trump did was make light of an idiot who thinks we should shoot people at the border. That's all the context you need. He didn't have the balls to condemn the statement. He said "only in the panhandle can you get away with saying that..." He thought it was funny.... Is that what you think we should do, mn - shoot people at the border? Do you think it's funny? |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by T And T Garage on 05/10/19 at 18:03:33 7661676B6474060 wrote:
Seems you missed the green again pro golfer. Read my response to mn. You're in double bogey land... |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by pg on 05/11/19 at 03:51:10 He is wrong on many levels. One should never implore it is acceptable to discharge a firearm in that circumstance. A double barrel shotgun is not ideal for home defense, certainly not better than an AR. The only story that is more ludicrous is Cheney shooting a guy in the face with a shotgun. Best regards, |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by WebsterMark on 05/11/19 at 04:50:53 Not sure about that. If I knew someone was coming at me with violent intent, I think I'd rather have a shotgun than an AR. You not as likely to miss and whT you do hit, certainly isn't coming forward anymore. I read a great study once that laid out a convincing case that a .22 mag is the best for self-defense in the home, specifically a semi auto. No recoil so second shot is on target. Unless you're shootiing everyday, that first shot with a .9mm or .45 after months and months is quite a shock. This study had access to a lot of data and noted shots after the first were all over the place. Plus a .22 mag won't go through two walls and outside. |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by MnSpring on 05/11/19 at 05:49:57 756B646568756E73010 wrote:
YEP, just a waiting fro your SPIN. Gee, Biden is forgiven, for saying something so STUPID. Why ? Because it was in a interview, with a bunch of other, STUPID statements. Yet your TDS, refuses to let you see, the, 'context', of Trumps reply. |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by MnSpring on 05/11/19 at 06:12:34 Your both right. All Shotgun, Rifle, Handgun, Cal or Gauge’s are correct. It is the one, that YOU, use, are familiar with, and shoot the best. Their was ALWAYS, discussion on what firearm, cal/gauge is ‘best’. Their will ALWAYS be, discussion on which firearm, cal/gauge is ‘best’. (Ford/Chev - Suzuki/Harley - Rem/Win - etc.) My recommendation for the the, ‘Best’, gun/cal/gauge, (and the same recommendations of millions of other gun people) IS, the ‘Gun’ YOU shoot the best ! People like tt, and the rest of the Gun Grabbers, like Biden. Do not have the first clue, of how TOTALY Outrageous that statement was. “just fire the shotgun through the door” ‘Just fire off two shots into the air’ Stupid, Stupid, Stupid, Stupid, Stupid, Stupid. !!!!!!! Know what your target is, and beyond. Yet, was Biden, actually, “Inciting Violence”, by, Telling, Encouraging people to be, STUPID ? And one more time for the tt and like. Shooting, ANY gun through a door, would be the same as driving your S-40 at 80MPH, with your, EYES CLOSED, on a curvy mountain road. |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by MnSpring on 05/11/19 at 07:56:23 4B555A5B564B504D3F0 wrote:
This is what Biden SAID. “Well, you know, my shotgun will do better for you than your AR-15, because you want to keep someone away from your house, just fire the shotgun through the door.” YET, all the, UL/FDS/ 'Spin Doctors', Added the word 'IF'. “Well, you know, my shotgun will do better for you than your AR-15, because [if] you want to keep someone away from your house, just fire the shotgun through the door.” Not a problem saying, 'this is better than that', everyone does that. Problem is Biden, SAYING/BELIEVING/TELLING everyone: "...you want to keep someone away from your house, just fire the shotgun through the door." Sure does sound like, "inciting violence". Yet because, it's, 'Uncle Joe', go ahead, give HIM, a pass for being. STUPID. Expound about, 'context', again ! ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by pg on 05/11/19 at 13:36:53 162423323524330C20332A410 wrote:
This reminded me of a scene from an old movie. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxQNYPYFq1c[/media] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxQNYPYFq1c Incidentally, I prefer a G19. Best regards, |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by T And T Garage on 05/13/19 at 06:23:00 43605D7E7C6760690E0 wrote:
YEP, just a waiting fro your SPIN. Gee, Biden is forgiven, for saying something so STUPID. Why ? Because it was in a interview, with a bunch of other, STUPID statements. Yet your TDS, refuses to let you see, the, 'context', of Trumps reply. [/quote] There was no "context" to be had by trump. He made light of it mn. Period. |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by T And T Garage on 05/13/19 at 06:24:07 44675A797B60676E090 wrote:
This is what Biden SAID. “Well, you know, my shotgun will do better for you than your AR-15, because you want to keep someone away from your house, just fire the shotgun through the door.” YET, all the, UL/FDS/ 'Spin Doctors', Added the word 'IF'. “Well, you know, my shotgun will do better for you than your AR-15, because [if] you want to keep someone away from your house, just fire the shotgun through the door.” Not a problem saying, 'this is better than that', everyone does that. Problem is Biden, SAYING/BELIEVING/TELLING everyone: "...you want to keep someone away from your house, just fire the shotgun through the door." Sure does sound like, "inciting violence". Yet because, it's, 'Uncle Joe', go ahead, give HIM, a pass for being. STUPID. Expound about, 'context', again ! ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D [/quote] I posted the entire quote. You seem to be the one spinning - nice job! |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by MnSpring on 05/13/19 at 09:04:44 312F20212C312A37450 wrote:
Yea, you did. And it was STUPID then, and is still STUPID. Why are you giving him a pass ? Are you one of those in the numerous photos, where he was, fondling ? |
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Title: Re: Tell Us Again Post by T And T Garage on 05/13/19 at 09:59:29 00231E3D3F24232A4D0 wrote:
Yea, you did. And it was STUPID then, and is still STUPID. Why are you giving him a pass ? Are you one of those in the numerous photos, where he was, fondling ? [/quote] Well, mn - just read the entire context of the interview. Not hard to see why this is yet another nothingburger. Well, not for most people, anyway. |
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