|
SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Politics, Religion (Tall Table) >> Show me the stupid..... /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1501727462 Message started by raydawg on 08/02/17 at 19:31:02 |
|
Title: Show me the stupid..... Post by raydawg on 08/02/17 at 19:31:02 Ask Forest, stupid is as stupid does...... What a buffoon. I have serious concerns about this policy, but that CNN bozo must think he is so smart.....haha! http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/08/02/immigration-stephen-miller-jim-acosta-trump-215451 |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by WebsterMark on 08/03/17 at 04:18:19 What possible concerns could you have? If you owned rental property, you'd want to make sure whomever moved in could pay the rent and not end up costing you money right? |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by pg on 08/03/17 at 04:50:13 7 minute clip of the exchange. ;D [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLRM50WyYkQ[/media] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLRM50WyYkQ Best regards, |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/03/17 at 04:54:31 I have serious concerns Suchazz? |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by WebsterMark on 08/03/17 at 05:13:19 That video is why these press updates shouldn't be televised. Reporters want to be stars. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/03/17 at 05:50:06 Where is it written that failed policy must not be changed? I don't CARE what someone's Feeling s are regarding the nebulous concept of What America is About.. I think it's incredibly odd that the people who resist change in policy that injure s America are so ready to adopt New Attitudes toward things that were so normal. Where were these jerkwads on Religious Freedom and the baker? Absolutely ZERO grasp of reasonable and right and wrong. Sadly, that idiot has Americans who cheer him. And I couldn't stomach the show Mighta made a minute.. listening to ignorant emotionalism as it is used as cover for some Great Good affects my stomach.. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by T And T Garage on 08/03/17 at 07:44:02 First and foremost, Miller's rebuttal contained a disavowal of the poem that is found at the base of the Statue of Liberty. "I don't want to get off into a whole thing about history here, but the Statue of Liberty is a symbol of liberty lighting the world," Miller said, adding, "the poem you are referring to, which was added later, is not part of the original Statue of Liberty." In reality, the poem was written for the unveiling of the statue by poet Emma Lazarus, who donated it to an auction to raise money for the pedestal. Not only was Miller's assertion factually incorrect, but it was also just a terrible look for the White House; the Statue of Liberty is an icon of the United States' inclusiveness and serves as a symbolic beacon to all those who seek asylum. The second piece of information that Miller got wrong, however, is far more consequential. "Right now it's a requirement that, to be naturalized, you have to speak English," Miller said, dripping with condescension, "so the notion that speaking English wouldn't be part of our immigration system would be very ahistorical." Speaking fluent English is not - nor has it ever been - a requirement to become a naturalized citizen in the United States. According to the United States Citizen and Immigration Services, "A naturalization applicant must only demonstrate an ability to read, write, speak, and understand words in ordinary usage," which means that applicants can have "noticeable errors in pronouncing, constructing, spelling, and understanding completely certain words, phrases, and sentences" and still pass. Put quite simply: you don't have to be a native speaker to become an American. Individuals can also receive an exemption from this clause for a variety of reasons, including having lived in the country for a certain span of time and being over a certain age, or having a disability. In the wake of the press briefing, many organizations were quick to issue press releases that condemned Miller's words. But the executive director of the Anne Frank Center, Steven Goldstein, said it best: "His subpar knowledge of American history, as reflected in Emma Lazarus' poem, means he couldn't pass President Trump's new immigration test. Therefore, Stephen, please leave." Chelsea Hassler - Yahoo http://www.yahoo.com/news/2-comments-white-house-made-023023045.html |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by WebsterMark on 08/03/17 at 08:27:05 From Wikipedia: A ceremony of dedication was held on the afternoon of October 28, 1886. In 1903, a bronze tablet that bears the text of Emma Lazarus's sonnet, "The New Colossus" (1883), was presented by friends of the poet. Until the 1986 renovation, it was mounted inside the pedestal; today it resides in the Statue of Liberty Museum, in the base. So from this and elsewhere I've read, of course Miller was correct. The poem was added later. In the bigger picture, this is yet another example of how conservative thought is the adult in the room. Liberals will protest common sense limits placed on policies which have the best of intentions, but with disastrous consequences. I believe firmly 'to whom much is given, much is expected' and that we are our brothers keeper, but in both cases, it does no good to destroy the very thing that enables our nation to reach out to others in need. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by raydawg on 08/03/17 at 08:38:17 437176676071665975667F140 wrote:
We have seen the party in power use laws, and policies, to their own benefit, like the IRS, etc, recently. I get the point that the things listed will much improve a persons chance to success here, that is a no brainer. I guess I am thinking the liberals would use this type of reasoning to put up quotas, etc, of who could enter, so they can build a society to their whims. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by WebsterMark on 08/03/17 at 08:48:14 they do that now to a degree. bringing in those who've gone through the worst of situations and then setting them up as victims because republicans won't give them everything they want is a way to guarantee a high percentage of their votes. the consequences don't impact their lives. You think Nancy Pelosi lives next to the skill-less, broke, diseased, radicalized immigrants she demands we allow in? |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/03/17 at 08:51:27 You think Nancy Pelosi lives next to the skill-less, broke, diseased, radicalized immigrants she demands we allow in? As if such an obvious point would make a lefty think. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by raydawg on 08/03/17 at 09:11:07 665453424554437C50435A310 wrote:
That is my concern Web..... They already use this power to decide "who" in education, gets in, and what they teach. Public AND private business need to adhere to their set agenda, via some quota matrix they devise under the banner of fairness.... Look, they want to tell us where to pee, or withhold funding if we don't agree to their mandates. But of course if you try that with sanctuary cities where democrats say stuff it, etc, to the laws now. Look how they use the courts to supersede what the masses want, uh, for our own good, as deplorable is too stupid to knows.... I want less power at the federal level, not more. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/03/17 at 10:56:54 Public AND private business need to adhere to their set agenda, via some quota matrix they devise under the banner of fairness... Capital is invested to make money. Not to create jobs or engender a situation that would be deemed Fair. Decent people avoid creating Unfair where possible, and we have rules for commerce. Or maybe I didn't understand what you said.. it could be clarified. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by T And T Garage on 08/03/17 at 11:06:24 4B797E6F68796E517D6E771C0 wrote:
Um... context web... CONTEXT: Fundraising for the statue had begun in 1882. The committee organized a large number of money-raising events.[81] As part of one such effort, an auction of art and manuscripts, poet Emma Lazarus was asked to donate an original work. She initially declined, stating she could not write a poem about a statue. At the time, she was also involved in aiding refugees to New York who had fled anti-Semitic pogroms in eastern Europe. These refugees were forced to live in conditions that the wealthy Lazarus had never experienced. She saw a way to express her empathy for these refugees in terms of the statue.[82] The resulting sonnet, "The New Colossus", including the iconic lines "Give me your tired, your poor/Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free", is uniquely identified with the Statue of Liberty and is inscribed on a plaque in the museum in its base.[83] |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by raydawg on 08/03/17 at 11:11:46 Ok, lets go back to those days, put everything in context, with a time stamp, etc.... White guys ruled, period. Selective outrage is just that. Pick and choose, make a square peg fit a round hole, why..... Because we care, we are compassionate, and preach tolerance, well, selectively, I mean, if you earn it and are worthy, GEE, sorta like the same criteria for immigration, whoa..... |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/03/17 at 11:18:14 Immigration LAW isn't made by poets. Great warm fuzzy feelings aren't what rational adults use as decision making guideposts. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by raydawg on 08/03/17 at 11:18:27 657A7C7B6661506050687A763D0F0 wrote:
Here Jog, I was trying to say using business, as a means to satisfy a belief, be it sexism, or racism, etc, through goverment sanctioned doctrine, and policies, to make things "fair" is promoting one ideology, over another, wholesale, which, is then used as a tool to get folks to vote that party policies. A business that has never been charged with any discrimination, but must prove it hasn't, by adopting these programs, or face consequences.... It can put a unfair burden on those businesses, as well. It quickly becomes a tool for those holding power. Does that make any sense? |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by T And T Garage on 08/03/17 at 11:20:15 283B233E3B2D3D5A0 wrote:
You should try to stick to the issue at hand - namely, the moron presidential spokesperson who thought it was cool to rewrite history. But hey - it's your post - far be it from me to tell you how to run it. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by raydawg on 08/03/17 at 11:22:12 445A555459445F42300 wrote:
You should try to stick to the issue at hand - namely, the moron presidential spokesperson who thought it was cool to rewrite history. But hey - it's your post - far be it from me to tell you how to run it. [/quote] Uh, you just did...... Comprehension much? Oh look, silly me..........again. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/03/17 at 11:24:05 You wake up and see you've been doing something wrong. Do you Rewrite History and stop being an idiot or are you obliged to continue in an exercise in stupidity? See how easily I counter lefty ideology? |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by T And T Garage on 08/03/17 at 11:26:18 3E2D35282D3B2B4C0 wrote:
OK then, how about questions? So?...Um... that's not the point of this post, is it? Was the president's spokesperson right or wrong about the poem? |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by WebsterMark on 08/03/17 at 12:23:19 From Wikipedia: A ceremony of dedication was held on the afternoon of October 28, 1886. In 1903, a bronze tablet that bears the text of Emma Lazarus's sonnet, "The New Colossus" (1883), was presented by friends of the poet. Until the 1986 renovation, it was mounted inside the pedestal; today it resides in the Statue of Liberty Museum, in the base. So from this and elsewhere I've read, of course Miller was correct. The poem was added later. Do you or anyone else have anything that is different from this? I found these same dates in several places. I can't say I remember hearing the poem was added later, but I have hear/read stuff how the poem doesn't really match the original meaning behind the statue. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by T And T Garage on 08/03/17 at 12:36:39 625057464150477854475E350 wrote:
Did you purposefully ignore this? Also from Wiki: Fundraising for the statue had begun in 1882. The committee organized a large number of money-raising events.[81] As part of one such effort, an auction of art and manuscripts, poet Emma Lazarus was asked to donate an original work. She initially declined, stating she could not write a poem about a statue. At the time, she was also involved in aiding refugees to New York who had fled anti-Semitic pogroms in eastern Europe. These refugees were forced to live in conditions that the wealthy Lazarus had never experienced. She saw a way to express her empathy for these refugees in terms of the statue.[82] The resulting sonnet, "The New Colossus", including the iconic lines "Give me your tired, your poor/Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free", is uniquely identified with the Statue of Liberty and is inscribed on a plaque in the museum in its base.[83] Therefore, in essence, this poem has always been associated with the Statue of Liberty. Miller was NOT correct. The poem was integral to getting funding for the statue. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by WebsterMark on 08/03/17 at 12:46:26 So I took some time to read up. The poem was one of many items used to raise funds. It was all but forgotten about after the dedication. Some 15 years later, it was 'found' again and a cause undertaken to put it on a plaque which 'repurposed' the statue. Why? I found that prior to 1890, individual states regulated immigration into the country. In 1892, (6 years after the statue was dedicated) Ellis Island became the entry point for not just New York State, but primarily for the nation. So, it seems that the meaning behind the statue did in fact change over a relatively short period of time because the island it was on was used as an immigration point. Had the statue been set in lower Manhattan, it would probably still retain it's original meaning which was a celebration and thanks for the freedom and democracy spread by the USA. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by WebsterMark on 08/03/17 at 12:52:41 Therefore, in essence, this poem has always been associated with the Statue of Liberty. Miller was NOT correct. The poem was integral to getting funding for the statue. No. In a few people's minds, that was true because of it's location. For the population as a whole and for the artist who created it, that was not it's intent. The poem was not integral to the funding for the statue, it was funding for the pedestal. Granted, that might be like splitting hairs. What I can't find is how much money the poem raised at the original auction. Can anyone? |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by T And T Garage on 08/03/17 at 12:58:47 6E5C5B4A4D5C4B74584B52390 wrote:
Well, sorry to break this to you but the Statue of Liberty is NOT on Ellis Island..... You really should know that if you're going to comment..... smh. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by WebsterMark on 08/03/17 at 13:09:14 nice try, but that's not what I meant and you know it. The statue is on an island right next to it. I know that, you know that, everyone knows that. In fact, what I just did proves the effectiveness of the Statue being co-opted for the immigration cause. You're just trying to divert from the fact liberals have confiscated the original meaning of the statue. Now, watch what happens in the news. Small details will be left out of this story or flat out lied about in order to make Miller and the Republicans seem wrong. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by verslagen1 on 08/03/17 at 13:10:59 Quote:
|
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by WebsterMark on 08/03/17 at 13:12:12 When the American Committee for the Statue of Liberty ran out of funds for the Statue's pedestal in 1884, newspaper publisher Joseph Pulitzer came to the rescue. Through urging the American public to donate money towards the pedestal in his newspaper New York World, Pulitzer raised over $100,000 in six months- more than enough money to ensure the pedestal's completion. As an article published in New York World on March 16, 1885 argued, We must raise the money! The World is the people's paper, and now it appeals to the people to come forward and raise the money. The $250,000 that the making of the Statue cost was paid in by the masses of the French people- by the working men, the tradesmen, the shop girls, the artisans- by all, irrespective of class or condition. Let us respond in like manner. Let us not wait for the millionaires to give us this money. It is not a gift from the millionaires of France to the millionaires of America, but a gift of the whole people of France to the whole people of America. The article's appeal was so popular that by August 11, 1885, the World collected over $100,000 in donations - most donations being about $1 or less. Roughly 125,000 people contributed to the completion of the pedestal thanks to Pulitzer's crusade. In thanks, the World published the names of each person who made a contribution (no matter its size), an act that also advanced the sales of Pulitzer's newspaper. Pulitzer died on October 29, 1911. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by WebsterMark on 08/03/17 at 13:15:45 Creator / originator Joseph Pulitzer, The New York World Summary / objectives To raise enough funds ($200,000 in 1885, equivalent to $2.3million today) to build a pedestal for the Statue of Liberty to stand on. Background The Statue of Liberty was a gift from France to America and was to be placed on a pedestal on New York harbour paid for by America. When the statue reached New York, the New Yorkers had not managed to raise enough funds because the wealthy philanthropists and the government were not willing to fund it. The statue lay in crates for over a year and it was a great shame for New York. Other cities, such as Boston and Philadelphia, were willing to fund it but only in exchange for the statue. Joseph Pulitzer stepped in and, through his newspaper The New York World, ran a fundraising campaign targeted to working-class Americans and promised a reward. He promised to publish the name of every individual who donated on the front page of The World, no matter how small the amount. There was a clear reward system: any donation of $1 received a 6-inch replica of the statue and it was a 12-inch statue for each $5 donation. People saw others give so they gave too, it was a ripple effect. By autumn 1885, within six months of launching the appeal, over 120,000 people had donated over $100,000, $2.3million today, with most donations being under $1. Not only that but his paper’s circulation increased by 50,000. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by WebsterMark on 08/03/17 at 13:23:19 I can't find anything with how much the poem raised. Guessing if 120000 people donated $100,000 many under a $1, it could not have been very high. Again, further evidence that the poem had little or nothing to do with the statue or pedestal from a big picture point of view. It was co-opted at a later date. And I don't think most Americans object to that happening. I think many object to that co-opted message; that we turn a blind eye to the realities that our nation's character is being changed from within due to the current policy of immigration without assimilation. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by T And T Garage on 08/03/17 at 13:45:39 102225343322350A26352C470 wrote:
Well, he IS wrong. Funny though - if you really research the fundraising, you'll see that it was done by Pulitzer. He opened it up to the entire city. So in effect, the majority of the money for the statue's home came from.... wait for it.... IMMIGRANTS! How about that? Ain't America great?!? |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by raydawg on 08/03/17 at 14:13:52 Was it great.....? You could have slaves. Guns. Hunt till extinction. Take land away from natives. Challenge pukes to a duel to solve problems. Yeah, let's go back to that time again. What's that you say... We evolved to a nation of laws for a common good, oh. Why? Because some things, then, don't lend themselves to the same meaning, or intentions, as they were, in a different time and era, You know, like marriage, etc. The poem is nothing more than a semblance, when things were less complicated, you know, like no PC dogma encroaching free speech. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by WebsterMark on 08/03/17 at 14:16:00 As usual, you're missing the point. Yes, I'm sure that's why she wrote the poem. No one disputes that. But this would be like taking the Black Lives Matter symbol (if there is one) and putting it on Rev. Martin Luther King's statue. The two ideologies do not have much in common. And he is not wrong. Not sure how you can say that. (actually, I'm very sure why you can say that...) He opened it up to the entire city. So in effect, the majority of the money for the statue's home came from.... wait for it.... IMMIGRANTS! That's a pretty big leap of logic. Are you sure you want to hang your hat on that? |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by WebsterMark on 08/03/17 at 14:18:54 The paper kept a running tally of contributions, and between March-August 1885 it chronicled every donation to the Statue of Liberty fund. On 22 March, Philip Bender, from Jersey City, wrote that his family was donating $2.65, including his children: "Philip and Eliza Bender, 50 cents each; (children) - Anna, 25 cents; Frannie, 25 cents; Leonard, 10 cents; Frank, 15 cents; Alice, 10 cents; Ralph, 10 cents; Carri, 10 cents; Miss Nicey 25 cents." On 30 May, Jonathan Sooville, the mayor of Buffalo, donated his $230 annual salary, while 43 wealthy New Yorkers each offered $250. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by T And T Garage on 08/03/17 at 14:40:54 784A4D5C5B4A5D624E5D442F0 wrote:
|
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by T And T Garage on 08/03/17 at 14:42:34 596B6C7D7A6B7C436F7C650E0 wrote:
Well web, I stand by what I wrote: On August 11, 1885, the World announced that $102,000 had been raised from 120,000 donors, and that 80 percent of the total had been received in sums of less than one dollar. |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/03/17 at 14:49:38 So, what do you guys say? Shall we design immigration policy around an idea that someone thought looked good in a poem or should it maybe be designed around logic? |
|
Title: Re: Show me the stupid..... Post by MnSpring on 08/03/17 at 18:17:13 7B646265787F4E7E4E76646823110 wrote:
Considering, ‘WE’, should be Just Like, all other, ‘Civilized’, Nations. Concerning H.C. (As is VERY, often stated) (By the B.S. Supporters) Then perhaps it would be good to be the same, as all other, ‘Civilized’, Nations. Concerning, ‘Immigration’. Where in, a person emigrating, Becomes a, ‘Citizen’, of the Nation they are emigrating to, and takes on the ways, of the people living in that Nation. And if, they, ‘If sneak in’, are immediately Deported ! (Or if, Mexico, just, disappear) |
|
SuzukiSavage.com » Powered by YaBB 2.2! YaBB © 2000-2007. All Rights Reserved. |