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Message started by Mekh on 10/29/16 at 04:48:58

Title: Main jet advice
Post by Mekh on 10/29/16 at 04:48:58

Cleaning my carburetor and intended to rejet it, since I plan to be using a Raask pipe. Allthough only if I find a good Baffle to use.

Current jetting:
Main 130 !?
Pilot 47.5
Pilot air 0.6
Washer thickness 2.5mm (0.98'ish inch)
Stock exhaust
52m above sea level

Going by the jetting articles I expected a larger main jet, so what size jets could I expect to need for a semi-open Raask pipes?

Just looking for a decent starting point.

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by Dave on 10/29/16 at 17:22:44

I really have no idea what the gasoline in your area requires for jetting, and I also don't know what altitude you ride at. Both of those things will affect the jetting.

With the crappy ethanol fuel we have in Kentucky....a 150 main is the smallest that we can use at the 500' - 1,000 feet elevation where I live. I have ridden it up to 6,000 feet with that jetting....although it is probably running a bit rich at the higher elevations with the 150 main.

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by batman on 10/30/16 at 00:06:49

Mekh, The main jet if stock should be 147.5 a good all around jet seems to be a 50 pilot jet and a150 main,but the raask may need somewhat higher do to it being less restrictive and because of your low elevation may be the next larger jets 52.5 and 152.5, or the 55/155 jets,or a combination ,like 50/155. you should start with pilot jet and tune the mixure screw first,then the washer reduced by 1/4,1/3 but not more than 1/2 ,so as to stop mid range surge, if any. Then change the main for best full throttle performance.Don't make more than a single change at one time ,if the bike starts running badly you will then know what to undo.Jets should run you 30-50dkk each.

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by Dave on 10/30/16 at 03:14:50

The jetting for the Savage sold in other parts of the world are not the same as the US.......other folks from the EU have reported their stock jets to be different, and the numbers are always smaller than what was used in the US models (except CA). In addition some EU carbs have an electric switch on the carb that is activated at full throttle....and nobody has found any documentation that tells what it is....we believe it retards the timing at full throttle to help eliminate detonation.

Here is the chart we have for stock jetting......and it states the jetting for the EU is similar to the California (CA) models.

http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?board=tech;action=display;num=1098869040

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by Kris01 on 10/30/16 at 09:06:01

It would be interesting to document what jets were installed in each year for each country.

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by batman on 10/30/16 at 09:20:52

Do to the smaller? jet needle /needle jet, he might better start with a 50 pilot /145 main and work up if needed.

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by Sarge on 10/30/16 at 11:06:41

Just for the record, the jetting chart in the Tech Section and referenced by Dave appears to have originally come from the Suzuki Repair manual. If the column labeled "CA Models" is supposed to include the California (not Canadian)Models, it is incorrect. My 2003 Savage came with 52.5 pilot and 145 main. Others have reported the same (see post by HefyJefy on 07/08/16 for example). ;)

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by Mekh on 10/30/16 at 15:24:38

Thanks a lot for all the tips and pointers on where to start. I think I better get a few different sizes of jets, but at least I probably dont have to start with 132.5 and so on now.

No wonder the header pipe was blackish blue. I better inspect the piston and exhaust valves thoroughly, when I take it apart.

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by batman on 10/30/16 at 18:18:08

The pipe can blue from running lean or to rich. I'm betting on lean in your case,but a Raask will compound the problem.Yes you should get a large assortment of jets. I wouldn't worry about the piston or valve damage from running the stock jets ,the bike is set up very lean from the factory and that only blues the header pipe.

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by Yoshi on 10/31/16 at 15:38:55

The 86 and 87s use to come jetted rich at 55 and 155, my 02, 03 and 96 came with 52.5 and 147.5 stock.

I think 52.5 and 152.5 was a perfect setup with no intake and a pretty opened muffler but im in Ny

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by LANCER on 11/01/16 at 12:40:24

1607162F232D2734352D2F460 wrote:

I agree this is a good starting point, but with the Raask I would not be surprised that a 155 main is needed.
And do not leave out the needle setting, with the Raask it should be half of the white plastic spacer...or 3 washers.

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by Mekh on 11/02/16 at 12:45:33

I'm completely baffled/surprised with the numbers coming up here, considering the jetting I was driving with (and actually thought it drove well with). Then again, I have nothing to compare it with yet.

I think I'll get myself a set of pilot and main jets, so I can play with it.

I just kinda feel that it's a huge step going from a 130 main jet to a 150+ jet in one go :)

Lancer:
The washers you mention... Are they ordinary stainless washers and if so, what size are they?
Asking just in case I want to find someone myself... metric sizes around here, so just to have an idea.

Edit: Do I remember right that you are selling jet sets also?

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by Dave on 11/02/16 at 13:12:53

The washers we use are #4 Machine Screw size - but that is a US standard....and not a metric system.

You might be able to find a metric washer that is small enough to fit in the recessed hole in the slide, and over the needle. You want enough washers to be about half the height of the white plastic spacer that is on the slide right now. (If your slide has several notches on the needle....just lower the clip a notch which will be raising the needle).

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by verslagen1 on 11/02/16 at 13:35:02

6C444A49210 wrote:

I just kinda feel that it's a huge step going from a 130 main jet to a 150+ jet in one go :)

There was a discussion years back concerning Euro vs. USA jet sizes.
The numbers are different because of different measurements.
And I forget the actual details (so eaoe)
USA might be actual thru hole size
vs. EU might be flow rate cc/sec.

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by stewmills on 11/02/16 at 13:42:26

506B6671606C77716A626F70030 wrote:

I have some #4 at home. If I remember, I'll get out the digital mm caliper and see what they measure.

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by stewmills on 11/02/16 at 16:09:46

I found brass #4 washers. If this is the correct #4, mm measurements are below. Note that the measurements are exact, I just had to lay it down in the first image and it just looks like an inaccurate position.

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by stewmills on 11/02/16 at 16:10:16

Inside

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by stewmills on 11/02/16 at 16:11:14

Thickness

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by Mekh on 11/02/16 at 22:48:41

Thanks a lot.
/thumbsup

Seems like a 3mm metric washer should work:
ID: 3,2 mm
OD: 7 mm
t: 0,5 mm

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by LANCER on 11/05/16 at 19:52:57

143C3231590 wrote:

Thanks a lot.
/thumbsup

Seems like a 3mm metric washer should work:
ID: 3,2 mm
OD: 7 mm
t: 0,5 mm

Yes I do sell washers like these and the jets you need.
If you have not already found them and want a set just PM me.

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by Mekh on 11/06/16 at 01:00:04

I'm considering and investigating possibilities right now... Cam shaft and rocker being busted and all.
I'm seriously considering getting the cam from you, but dasm customs taxes may make it too expensive. :(

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by Mekh on 11/06/16 at 01:39:12

Customs example:
Assuming a combined price of repaired cam and, jets, washers etc at around 2500 DKK... and 200 DKK for freight.

http://https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/295041/Billeder/SuzukiSavage/Rate.PNG

Customs calculator with setting for motorcycle parts:
http://https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/295041/Billeder/SuzukiSavage/Customs.PNG

Resulting price (Given that it's caught in customs):
http://https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/295041/Billeder/SuzukiSavage/Rate02.PNG

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by LANCER on 11/06/16 at 05:17:02

It is my understanding that the fees and taxes are all based on the insured and declared value on my end.
I have, at the request of others, decreased that declared/insured value, and as far as I know that decreased what they had to pay.
The downside is that if for some reason the package was lost in transit the reembersement would be for that lower insured value.
That is very slight risk as I have never lost a package yet in more than 10 years of sending packages all over the world to every continent except Africa.
If you want to do that I will do it.
I don't have an issue doing that because the Performance Camshaft is made using a used cam, and I can claim it as a used part in all good conscience even though it has been repaired Better than New.

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 11/06/16 at 19:08:55

Regardless of condition, it Is a refurbished, Used part.
Lumpier and shinier than the old one.

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by LANCER on 11/06/16 at 22:23:50

57484E4954536252625A48440F3D0 wrote:

Regardless of condition, it Is a refurbished, Used part.
Lumpier and shinier than the old one.

Yep, that's what I said. [ch128513][ch128526]

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by ohiomoto on 11/07/16 at 04:43:42

Are we still talking main jets here???? :-? :-?

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by Dave on 11/07/16 at 04:49:07

32353432303229325D0 wrote:

Are we still talking main jets here???? :-? :-?

The last few posts have jumped to the damaged camshaft....and the cost/tariffs required to ship the parts to Denmark....as discussed in this thread.
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1478354612

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by d3adrock on 12/20/19 at 11:34:02

Can this bike be rejet without taking the carb out?

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by verslagen1 on 12/20/19 at 11:45:43

71267471677A767E150 wrote:

Can this bike be rejet without taking the carb out?

yes, both the main and the pilot jet can be replaced by removing the bowl while the carb is on the bike.
You may need a little more room to drop the bowl. And you can do that with a ratchet strap around the bat box to pull it back a little.

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by IslandRoad on 12/20/19 at 16:16:47

I'm gonna add a little tip here for removing the jets with the carb in place:

The jets are soft brass, and the slot for the screwdriver runs across the hole in the jet, and they can stick, and you need to get the screwdriver into a narrow channel. I'd suggest making sure you have a small screwdriver that is in good condition (a clean edge). I bought one that is also narrow (it doesn't have the flare on the end that most do). I only use it for replacing jets. My girlfriend picked it up one day to undo a screw on a door or something - that was the day she learned the rules about my tools ;D

It might seem like a small thing, but if you're going top poke around in the carb in situ, you don't want to bodgy anything up, otherwise you'll be removing it anyway to repair the stuff you mashed outta shape. 8-)

Aaaand ... as others have said before, swap the carb-bowl screws with some SS allen key screws (and put some anti-seize on them) while you're there. It makes life easier later.

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 12/21/19 at 06:19:18

396E3C392F323E365D0 wrote:
Can this bike be rejet without taking the carb out?

Can it be, sure. Should it be is the question. If the carb was recently serviced, and you are simply swapping one jet for another for fine tuning, then yes that’s one way to do it.

However, getting the carb off of the bike is a good time to inspect all of the o-rings, check the float height, the condition of the seat and give it a basic cleaning.

Honestly, when your at the point of rotating the carb to remove the float bowl, you’re also at the point of removing it from the bike.

Title: Re: Main jet advice
Post by IslandRoad on 12/21/19 at 13:18:26

Gary makes a really good point. As a newbie, who was re-jetting, I messed around with jets a few times with carb installed. When I finally did the spacer mod, I pulled the carb. I put it off because some people on the forum made it sound like it was really difficult ... it's really not.

Ya start out a bit apprehensive because you have to 'persuade' it back into the rubber boot. But once you realise that rubber is tough it becomes easy.