|
SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Add lightness... /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1476816434 Message started by Armen on 10/18/16 at 11:47:09 |
|
Title: Add lightness... Post by Armen on 10/18/16 at 11:47:09 With all the thinking about drilling the cam sprocket to adjust cam timing, I ended up with a sprocket sitting here looking way too stock :o So, poked a few holes in it for good luck. Basically, I'm doing this bike in the spirit of the 50's Italian single cylinder road racers where lightness was as important as horsepower. The good news is that I didn't have to be precise about it to use the holes for cam timing changes. |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by stewmills on 10/18/16 at 12:05:14 "Add lightness..." Hmmmm.....is that even possible? I guess you can't REMOVE lightness, can you? This is a brainteaser for sure... |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by norm92de on 10/18/16 at 12:05:39 That ought to knock .001 second off the quarter mile times. ;D |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by norm92de on 10/18/16 at 12:07:25 Another thought. Did you ever put a whiz wheel on the crankshaft to check your new cam timing? |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Armen on 10/18/16 at 13:17:27 Hey Norm, My new OohBabyOoohBabyOooh bumpstick is on it's way from Lancer. Have a new cam chain. Have to modify the tensioner. And finish farting around with the valve cover. Then I'll assemble and check the cam timing. |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 10/18/16 at 13:42:06 Don't think lightness is an add on.. it may be just semantics, but I'm leaning toward removing heaviness. |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by norm92de on 10/18/16 at 14:17:36 Armen, Do you know how Suzuki reads the cam timing? Is it at a certain amount of lift or when the .oo4"clearance is taken up? Norman. |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by verslagen1 on 10/18/16 at 14:40:08 Everybody knows swiss cheese tastes better cause of the holes, so he's making the gears taste better. :-? |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by verslagen1 on 10/18/16 at 14:47:24 http://www.webcamshafts.com/ |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by norm92de on 10/19/16 at 07:02:30 Versy, That is a great site. Lots of good detailed info. :) |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Armen on 10/19/16 at 18:43:39 Another .001 second off with this one :o |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Kris01 on 10/19/16 at 19:11:53 I love when Armen posts pictures. The parts are always full of holes! ;D |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by hinow41 on 10/19/16 at 19:21:31 http://https://cdn.meme.am/instances/64622027.jpg |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Armen on 10/19/16 at 19:27:09 Drill 'em all, let God sort 'em out ;D |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Armen on 10/22/16 at 11:10:37 .0127 Psychological Horsepower added... Started by polishing the part that contacts the cam lobe, then quickly lost my mind ::) |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by norm92de on 10/22/16 at 13:21:38 It'll look as pretty on the inside as it does on the outside. ;D |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by verslagen1 on 10/22/16 at 13:46:45 66554A4249270 wrote:
Well that'll keep you from stomping on the brakes |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Ruttly on 10/22/16 at 14:08:03 Shiney rockers to keep that beautiful wiesco piston company They will sing in perfect harmony |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Ruttly on 10/22/16 at 14:27:16 Are you going to remove counter balancer too ? Ya know give it a real thumper feel ! I think it would give it more off idle snap , not having to spin all that extra weight |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Armen on 10/22/16 at 15:54:46 Thanks ;) Hey Ruttly, Leaving the balancer. It'll have plenty of 'feel'. Already lost 2 lbs of rotating weight with this flog: |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Ruttly on 10/22/16 at 16:54:43 Yes I remember you doing that , will it need to be rebalanced ? Wish I had done that to my engine ! |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Armen on 10/22/16 at 17:58:08 Hopefully not. Removed exactly the same amount from each section. Beauty of a CNC program ;) |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Dave on 10/23/16 at 02:14:36 7E59585840552C0 wrote:
I have looked at several stock flywheels, and I can't see any evidence that they were ever balanced at the factory. There are no drill holes or grind marks or welded on weights.....and in theory it is a round disc that should not be out of balance. |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Ruttly on 10/23/16 at 03:34:20 Dave, I never had that side apart when I split my main cases to reseal it , so I never realized how stinking heavy the flywheel is. I have never seen that amount of weight on an engine before !? |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Dave on 10/23/16 at 09:20:49 And....the crank is heavy, the rotor for the charging system is heavy, and the counterbalancer is heavy! It sure does "look" like there is an excess amount or rotating mass on this bike.....but we won't really know until someone installs a lighter flywheels and puts a few thousand miles on it. |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Ruttly on 10/23/16 at 10:20:00 All that was done on purpose by Suzuki for big torque and controllable rpms , remember these are beginners bike to help build confidence in new riders and then us old farts & Ryca changed that ! |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Armen on 10/23/16 at 11:48:39 Ruttly, Weight of flywheel has no bearing on torque output. It does, however, have an affect on how smooth the bike feels, how slowly it accelerates and decelerates. I lighten flywheels for a local Ducati shop. The sportier models have semi-light flywheels. The touring models have real boat anchors. Heavier flywheel makes the motor less twitchy on the highway. Nicer idle. Less responsive. Suzuki did a neat trick way back when with a flywheel that would disengage at higher revs. Gave a nice relaxed low end, and snappier acceleration. Installed a lot of lightened flywheels on Airhead BMWs. Snappier acceleration. Easier shifting. A little buzzier on the highway. Looking at al the tonnage on a Savage powertrain, I'm sure it won't be horrible losing 2 lbs. I also left a lot of mass on the perimeter to keep some of the flywheel effect while losing 2 lbs on the overall motor weight. Only time will tell. Spent another chunk of time this week on wiring and mounting an aluminum fender. |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by gizzo on 10/23/16 at 14:55:31 21120D050E600 wrote:
Looks like some kind of obscure surgical instrument! ;) |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Ruttly on 10/23/16 at 19:42:46 Armen , one of my next projects I have lined up is a vintage BSA 500 flat tracker. bored to 585 with a Venolia piston with the mx cam, rockers lightened , clutch basket lightened , stator only goes 1/3 of the way around for less drag ,spark only set up , lots of vintage trick stuff. All the kinda stuff you appreciate. Oh yeah and a original Ceriani road race set of forks, originals are very rare and pricey, seen them sell for up to 2k with the dampener which I also have but won't be used on this bike. |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Armen on 10/23/16 at 19:48:16 WooHoo, Ruttly!!! Sounds like a ton of fun! Good on you ;) What are you doing in terms of crank ventilation? |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Ruttly on 10/23/16 at 20:28:07 Have a ram air idea to create the vaccuum thru oil fill cap and check valve at top vent. So faster I'm going the greater vaccuum , in theory . Super simple & very light weight, check/pcv valve would be only moving part. What do you think ? Just can't bring myself to drill into my beautiful header! |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by LANCER on 10/23/16 at 20:52:57 436465657D68110 wrote:
:)I have a set 0f Ceriani F0rks that have never been 0n the r0ad, ever. 40mm I believe. I g0t them f0r a ridiculously l0w price. |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Ruttly on 10/23/16 at 21:37:50 Lancer , They are worth bucks :) I got a friend really drunk one night and gave him 200 & Betor front end & some other BSA parts and made him throw in a set of plastic fork protectors , ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D Can you here me laughing ? Was tempted to put it on the RYCA tracker ! Just didn't seem right on a jap bike. |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by LANCER on 10/23/16 at 21:52:56 47606161796C150 wrote:
I w0uld like t0 put the set 0n REX but have n0t f0und the right setup f0r it. These forks are pretty l0ng with a l0t 0f range 0f m0ti0n, like y0u find 0n dirt bike forks. I have had difficulty finding a front disc setup that w0uld w0rk 0n it t00. I think I might send the forks & wheel t0 RYCA Shawn and have him create a brake system f0r it. It w0uld be w0rth the $$$$$. I have had a THING f0r Ceriani's since I had my G0ldstar, which came with a set. I sure d0 miss that bike. |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Ruttly on 10/24/16 at 05:42:33 Oh yeah I forgot about that , in that deal I got the front wheel with disc, caliper,master cylinder,braided hose so I could run TT races too ! ;D ;D ;D 30 years later I'm still laughing! Probably my best con job to date !!! |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by LANCER on 10/24/16 at 06:50:52 Well, I just happened to be looking on eBay at the right time a few years back and saw this set for sale. A fella had bought a bike shop and these were stuffed back in the corner of a shelf and he just had no use for them. They were obviously an older vintage and he was cleaning house so they had to go. They had never been used, the mount bolt was badly rusted from just sitting, the legs were a bright orange color (though badly scuffed from time), and he put them up for a set price of $150. I was shocked at the price but confirmed they were Ceriani by the label at the bottom of the leg, and so I SCOOPED THEM BABIES UP ! I took them to a machine shop and had them remove the old rusted mount and press in a new one. A new guy in the shop got the job and he promptly bent the thing during the press! Yep. Fortunately the trees were not damaged in the process. For his ERROR the boss assigned him to machine a new mount bolt and install it...all under the watchful eye of the boss. He did a nice job of it too. |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Ruttly on 10/24/16 at 19:07:45 Lancer, If they are a long fork & orange are most likely from a late 70s or early 80s KTM, Penton/KTM used a lot of Ceriani forks. Still fetch a good price for someone doing a restore. Very nice forks , top of the line back then ! |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Armen on 10/25/16 at 17:43:19 Continued wankology: Standard rear axle nut was so tall it threatened to trench the muffler. First I switched to 2 Stainless jam nuts and trimmed the axle. Then I made the mistake of typing '16x1mm titanium nut' into Ebay and one came up. Knocked the corners off on the lathe. Buffed up a bit on the polishing wheel. Gizmo gram scale says 20 grams less than stock. And no rust or corrosion. |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Serowbot on 10/25/16 at 18:16:03 I gained myself a zillionth of a second with this one... 8-) Lever end holes!... ;D http://i600.photobucket.com/albums/tt82/serowbot/rerun/holes002.jpg http://i600.photobucket.com/albums/tt82/serowbot/rerun/holes003.jpg |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Armen on 10/25/16 at 18:20:33 I'm jealous :o |
|
Title: Re: Add lightness... Post by Serowbot on 10/25/16 at 18:24:41 16253A3239570 wrote:
Rocked your world, didn't it?... ;D ;D ;D Makes a good deer whistle, too!... ;D |
|
SuzukiSavage.com » Powered by YaBB 2.2! YaBB © 2000-2007. All Rights Reserved. |