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/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Politics, Religion (Tall Table) >> Who did he like..... /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1473967571 Message started by raydawg on 09/15/16 at 12:26:11 |
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Title: Who did he like..... Post by raydawg on 09/15/16 at 12:26:11 Glad Powell doesn't know me from jack..... Seems this guy loves gossip. For such a smart man, why did he push for the war in Iraq ? |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by thumperclone on 09/15/16 at 12:35:01 the wmds they didn't find |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/15/16 at 13:19:16 Lies TO us, from people who we had some trust for, are effective. Powell wasn't so strongly partisan. He was possibly the most patriotic of the DC crowd I saw, second only to Ron Paul. HE was lied to, so he Believed that Action was Necessary. It's not Only the sheeple who are deceived. When he got briefings that were created or Massaged to achieve bringing him into a place where he Believed that military action was needed to protect America, he just did what anyone would do. He supported action. He , like the American People, was Duped. Time spent looking into how he feels about that will take your desire for kicking a pointy cowboy boot up hizzass away. It Did for me. I think he's probably a genuine good guy. |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by old.indian on 09/15/16 at 13:27:20 I agree that he was conned like the rest of us.... Rumm-dumm and Dickie Draft Dodger silenced every one who didn't go along with their cherry-picked "intelligence"..... |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by WebsterMark on 09/15/16 at 13:38:38 Yea right.....like you guys knew any better. The vast majority though they were there. |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by verslagen1 on 09/15/16 at 13:48:48 And Hellery said "I only said yes cause he gave me money" |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/15/16 at 14:52:17 6E5C5B4A4D5C4B74584B52390 wrote:
Hey, dikkhead, where did I say I knew that when he was lying to us? That's what eventually came out. I USED TO BE pissed at him. |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by pg on 09/15/16 at 15:43:28 Are the late night shows having a field day with his e-mails? http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2016/09/14/top-insults-colin-powell-hacked-emails/90378154/ "I would rather not vote for her," Powell wrote. "A 70-year-old person with a long track-record, unbridled ambition, greedy, not transformational, with a husband still d---ing bimbos at home. Best regards, |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by Serowbot on 09/15/16 at 16:04:06 Here's the thing... well, a thing... Correct,.. Powell was lied to... he was given the same misinformation that Hillary, and the rest of Congress got. The purpose of this manipulation of facts, was to get approval for war in Iraq. Approval that would cost us dearly in so many ways. So they lied.... It wasn't Powell's fault,.. it wasn't Hillary's either. ... but, you give Powell a pass... In tell ect ual Dis hon est y... (I'm breaking it down for you)... ;D Hy po cris y... (I'm breaking it down for you)... ;D |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by pg on 09/15/16 at 16:22:03 5442554850454853270 wrote:
Holding a black man accountable for his decisions is.... (powell or obama) Ray cisss... Hy po cris y... (Yes, this is same argument often used by the left as well as you Bot)... Best regards, |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by raydawg on 09/15/16 at 17:04:28 The man passes on second hand information on people he never met, but relies on what others said.... He is a gossip and a fool, but sadly, most of them are dupes trying to be somebody..... It's a drug to them. Funny, we question others, but not ourselves.... I say the guy is a charlatan..... However, he had me fooled ;D |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/15/16 at 17:17:34 You SURELY don't think he got his information from the janitor at the bus station, do you? He was USED, and if you study him you'll learn he was PISSED . Who was lied to by intelligence and who was In the Know is hard to say. My guess is that the war hawks had the truth and lied to the people who wouldn't be willing to invade without good reason. Powell is a good man, I believe. He served bubs and dems, didn't really have a Side, other than America. |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by raydawg on 09/15/16 at 17:46:16 Sorry buddy, his wiliness, as it appears to me in these emails, shows a man who likes to talked negative about other people.... This is a character default, in my book. Also, one who exhibits such a trait, is easily led. I am not talking about constructive criticism, or defending ones POV, or rebutting someone else, POV .... It looks like cheap gossip, plain and simple. BTW, those defending those who chose to go in Irag, blaming faulty info, others didn't buy it, and were made out to be the "bad guys", if you remember. I don't want to rehash the war, as everyone now has, or thinks they do, 20-20 hindsight.... We can't undo the past, we must move on. |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by LostArtist on 09/15/16 at 19:07:02 55465E43465040270 wrote:
remind you of anyone? yet some say Trump's our only hope!!! we are doomed without Trump. He'll just end up as another puppet. at least Pence isn't another Chenney We'll be fine, with either Clinton or Trump, if you actually want change, vote 3rd party, send a message, yelling about it here isn't going to matter |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/15/16 at 19:58:04 Initially, I wasmad at him, too. After I did some digging I decided he was lied to. |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by WebsterMark on 09/16/16 at 03:58:09 You guys toss the word "lie" around like Sew foolishly tosses the words racist or Hitler. A lie is purposely knowing with certainty what you are relaying is false in order for personal gain. That wasn't the case. Did they make mistakes in their analysis? Yep. Did their ideology get in the way? Yep. If that's your definition of what a lie is, then 90% of what we say is a lie. Powell didn't lie to anyone and neither did Bush. |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/16/16 at 04:03:38 I think Bush lied,, |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by raydawg on 09/16/16 at 05:56:59 It was about control, the USA, it always is. And lie is no excuse for the wrong descion. A general is schooled in making the right choices based in their own fact findings.... As I said, others knew the truth, yet? Hey I was fooled too, by T I am just a grunt and not entrusted with a whole bunch of responsibility |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by WebsterMark on 09/16/16 at 06:01:44 352A2C2B3631003000382A266D5F0 wrote:
So the President of the United States knew for sure the intel was wrong. He knew with certainty the conclusions were wrong because the facts were not facts at all, but he lied and said they were. Really? He lied? |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/16/16 at 06:05:26 So, the General is supposed to go, establish the facts, and determine the course of action? And what of The CIA? Is he supposed to disregard the intelligence briefings and just somehow ascertain the truth independently? When the Agenda is to attack, and people above the cia TELL THEM that they will gather Intelligence that will support an invasion, and they do that and give it to people who Would Not WANT to invade, but, because of the lies, are left with no other rational choice, they get on board. I say Bush was well on board with creating Intelligence to justify the invasion. Suggest you spend Time reading what Powell said after it became apparent that he had been duped into supporting a war. |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/16/16 at 08:21:03 https://consortiumnews.com/2013/02/04/colin-powell-conned-or-con-man/ If read from the position of Not knowing if Powell is guilty, concluding he is will be difficult. Given information from sources whose Jobs it was to establish the facts, TOLD These Are the Facts, what would you do? He did try to use Curveball. All in all, I think it's a situation where there isn't enough hard evidence to know that Powell knowingly, willfully pushed us into war. I do think Bush and Cheney are guilty, along with the named CIA figures who prepared the reports. https://consortiumnews.com/2013/02/04/colin-powell-conned-or-con-man/ |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by Serowbot on 09/16/16 at 08:28:58 013334252233241B37243D560 wrote:
So the President of the United States knew for sure the intel was wrong. He knew with certainty the conclusions were wrong because the facts were not facts at all, but he lied and said they were. Really? He lied?[/quote] Yes... he knew... “In making the case for war, the Administration repeatedly presented intelligence as fact when in reality it was unsubstantiated, contradicted, or even non-existent. As a result, the American people were led to believe that the threat from Iraq was much greater than actually existed. ... There is no question we all relied on flawed intelligence. But, there is a fundamental difference between relying on incorrect intelligence and deliberately painting a picture to the American people that you know is not fully accurate.” — Statements and implications by the President and Secretary of State suggesting that Iraq and al-Qa’ida had a partnership, or that Iraq had provided al-Qa’ida with weapons training, were not substantiated by the intelligence. — Statements by the President and the Vice President indicating that Saddam Hussein was prepared to give weapons of mass destruction to terrorist groups for attacks against the United States were contradicted by available intelligence information. — Statements by President Bush and Vice President Cheney regarding the postwar situation in Iraq, in terms of the political, security, and economic, did not reflect the concerns and uncertainties expressed in the intelligence products. — Statements by the President and Vice President prior to the October 2002 National Intelligence Estimate regarding Iraq’s chemical weapons production capability and activities did not reflect the intelligence community’s uncertainties as to whether such production was ongoing. — The Secretary of Defense’s statement that the Iraqi government operated underground WMD facilities that were not vulnerable to conventional airstrikes because they were underground and deeply buried was not substantiated by available intelligence information. — The Intelligence Community did not confirm that Muhammad Atta met an Iraqi intelligence officer in Prague in 2001 as the Vice President repeatedly claimed. - Senate Intelligence Committee |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/16/16 at 09:52:21 Bush told the people who were Supposed to gather information to get information that would justify the war. Why do you think I have stated over and over that Bush should be in jail? I'm NOT saying that it was or wasn't His idea. Read the article I linked. |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by WebsterMark on 09/16/16 at 10:22:42 Using those standards Sew, did Obama lie when he said if you like your plan, you can keep your plan? Did Hilary lie when she said she never sent classified emails? (well, yes, that's a no brainer, forget I said that...) The point is, both of what you and Jog show as evidence of willful lying is far more likely to be wishful thinking clouding judgment. Seriously, what's the difference between Bush believing selected statements from intelligence reports and directing subrogates to give him specific information which tended to support his predisposed belief from Obama ignoring pleas that Obamacare would fail to accomplish it's goal, would drive up cost and that young healthy people would not sign up in the numbers he repeatedly said they would. Did Obama lie or was he blinded by his desire for success? |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/16/16 at 11:32:04 Why is it about Obama now? Of COURSE Obama lied. Hillary lied. Bush lied. You started out with Powell. And THAT is not so easy to discern. Bush, please read carefully, Sent people out to obtain information that would be something he could hide behind in order to invade Iraq. He didn't ask for objective truth. He wanted intelligence that he could point to and pretend that we were in danger. Again, read the linked article. e point is, both of what you and Jog show as evidence of willful lying is far more likely to be wishful thinking clouding judgment. Seems to me that you're unable to read what is clearly stated and accept it for what it is. I am OBVIOUSLY intellectually dishonest and a right wing warmonger. I'm not able to see it , no matter how obvious it is, if a bub is wrong,, and by wrong, I Don't mean Ooopsies, I made a mistake. I mean Criminally Wrong. |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by thumperclone on 09/16/16 at 12:11:43 good thing trump doesn't lie "its true" |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/16/16 at 12:22:47 Who says trump doesn't lie? Web said eriously, what's the difference between Bush believing selected statements from intelligence reports and directing subrogates to give him specific information which tended to support his predisposed belief Interesting mix of alleged facts. believing selected statements from intelligence reports He didn't Believe them, he knew they were tainted, he just wanted to Use them to Manufacture Consent. Ohh, the BayBees! They threw the BayBees on the floor, Total lie. Our media, used, again, to create an uproar and make people angry. and directing subrogates to give him specific information which tended to support his predisposed belief He didn't have a Belief. He NEEDED the intelligence community to provide information that he could use to justify doing what he wanted to do. And just exactly how is it okay to direct the intelligence community to dig up information that would justify an action? The intelligence community is supposed to find out what IS HAPPENING, and then we respond. If someone sponsors a scientist and asks him to study a drug and determine whether or not it's safe and effective, BUT, tells them the outcome they want, do you think that scientist would be objective or, in order to keep the boss happy, skew the results to make sure the boss is happy? And when the intelligence community benefits from war, then what are the odds that they can't find information that would justify the action the boss wants? Enhanced Interrogation anyone? How many times would they have to waterboard me before I started making stuff up? Zero,, just tell me they are able and willing to do it, unless I Confess. You're probably a lot tougher.. |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by WebsterMark on 09/16/16 at 13:52:49 Jog, I don't say you're lying about your false 9/11 conspiracy crap, I just say you're wrong. Shoild Sew and I call you a liar? |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/16/16 at 14:02:28 No more so than I should call you liars. You're both wrong. Bush, Obama, Hillary, they lied, willfully, intentionally. Powell? Hard to say.. |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by pg on 09/16/16 at 14:23:18 Is this thread about who knew supposedly knew what? :-? I'm going to say everyone last one of them had solid intelligence. :-/ Best regards, |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/16/16 at 14:26:19 I disagree. It's not a new concept Harry Reid Wants Donald Trump to Get Fake Intelligence Briefings ... Time Magazine › harry-reid-donald-trum... Jul 28, 2016 - “Fake it, pretend you're doing a briefing, but you can't give the guy any information” ... being “extremely careless” in handling classified information while she used a private email server ... Harry Reid To Intel Community: Give Donald Trump Fake Briefings ... Huffington Post › entry › harry-reid-tru... Jul 27, 2016 - “Fake it, pretend you're doing a briefing, but you can't give the guy any information.” “This guy, he's ... Harry Reid: CIA Should Give Trump Fake Briefings | US News U.S. News & World Report › articles › h... Jul 28, 2016 - Harry Reid: CIA Should Give Trump Fake Briefings ... grant R How better to get everyone on board than lie to someone who isn't WANTING a war things that would get an endorsement? Did the decision makers also know that the tearful report of Iraqi soldiers throwing babies from incubators was a lie, while the news was getting the masses upset and ready to back invasion? Am I alone remembering that? |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by pg on 09/16/16 at 14:30:40 The thread was talking about people in there elected / current positions as opposed to people running for office. Do you really think they are going to give pertinent classified material to candidates? Maybe stupid crap, but nothing of any real importance. Best regards, |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/16/16 at 14:35:56 You tell me what Reid meant to accomplish. Johnson didn't know what Aleppo was, so maybe there are No briefings. So, where did that stuff come from? Ohh, look.. × ALLNEWSVIDEOSIMAGESMAPSSHOPPINGBOOKSFLIGHTSAPPSSEARCH TOOLS Politics: the Briefings of United States Presidential Candidates ... www.faqs.org › ... › Pa-Po Thereafter, the new chief executive will receive intelligence briefings on a regular basis in the form of the presidential ... Why do presidential nominees receive classified briefings? - CBS ... CBS News › news › why-do-presidential-... Aug 4, 2016 - ... this year have suggested the other party's candidate should not receive any classified intelligence. Clinton and Trump will soon receive classified briefings. Here's how ... Washington Post › the-fix › 2016/07/29 Jul 29, 2016 - At some point, perhaps as early as next week, federal agents will sit down with Donald Trump and tell him classified information about the government and our foreign-policy efforts. ... On the Republican side, there are similar calls to ban Hillary Clinton from being briefed ... Top stories Libertarian Party wants Johnson to get national security briefings New Mexico Political Report - 21 hours ago Libertarian Party asks for national security briefings The Hill - 1 day ago Libertarian Ticket Requests National Security Briefings (VIDEO) Newsy - 18 hours ago Could Candidate Donald Trump Be Denied National Security ... NBC News › politics › 2016-election › c... Jul 29, 2016 - Calls have increased for Republican nominee Donald Trump to be denied national security briefings ... U.S. Intelligence Officials Carry On Tradition Of Briefing Presidential ... NPR › 2016/05/09 › u-s-intelligence-offi... May 9, 2016 - Let's turn to presidential politics and the tradition of giving candidates top-secret intelligence briefings. Donald Trump Will Soon Get Classified Briefings. How Worried ... Mother Jones › politics › 2016/05 › dona... May 5, 2016 - Candidates first started receiving intelligence briefings during the 1952 election, on the orders of ... Classified Intelligence Briefings for Presidential Candidates ... abcnews.go.com › Politics › story Aug 5, 2016 - Both presidential candidates are now eligible to receive classified intelligence Now, you were saying? |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by pg on 09/16/16 at 14:46:48 Ok, let's ask them who really killed JFK? In all honesty whatever intel they may receive is likely to be heavily redacted and they may get just enough info to form some kind of opinion that has a small amount of merit. Does Johnson and Stein get any info, I may be wrong but I doubt it. Best regards, |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/16/16 at 15:03:49 Ohh Godddarn, really? If you don't like what I show you, you run for a new topic? Admit that you got TAUGHT. all of you, web, pg, stop pretending, face it. Bush lied Web, own it. Sew, Obama LIED, own it Candidates get intelligence briefings, pg, get over it. Hillary doesn't lie. Hillary IS a lie. Okay, NEW GAME.. If Reid had to suggest that trump get no real information, then WHAT KINDA INFORMATION MUST TYPICALLY BE GIVEN? I know, that requires coming to a conclusion, |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by WebsterMark on 09/17/16 at 06:09:10 Nope, I don't think so. I think in both those examples, Bush with intel and Obama with healthcare, they were seeing what they wanted to see, looking through rose colored glasses, so to speak. A lie is different. A lie is told to protect you, purposely inflicts harm on another. A lie has selfishness at it's heart. That's different. Not that Bush and Obama didn't like about other stuff, of course they did. Hilary on the other hand, lied about the video in order to protect herself and Obama, she lied about the emails to protect herself, she lied about only using one device etc..... That woman is a walking lie. There's a major difference between those examples, Bush, Obama and Hilary. Like I said Jog, you don't lie when you falsely go on an on about nonsense conspiracies like 9/11, contrails, God knows what else. You're wrong, you refuse to see the truth, but you're not necessarily lying. I have said upon occasion that once presented with irrefutable facts, if you continue to repeat your point of view, you're lying. The one I remember the most is your "Fox news sued for the right to lie". That's demonstrably proven false, but you probably keep repeating it. Are you lying? I think that's a grey area. I know you well enough to know certain beliefs are part of your core, you're not going to change. I have the same thing in my own way, as do all of us on here. But lying is different. Hilary lied, Bush & Obama did not, in those examples I gave. |
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Title: Re: Who did he like..... Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/17/16 at 06:16:51 Web, I think you've been presented with sufficient evidence to understand that Bush wasn't confused about anything. HE DEMANDED that the intelligence community PROVIDE intelligence he could use to go to war. Believe what you want about Obama. |
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