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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1473286458 Message started by zuluwhiskeycharlie on 09/07/16 at 15:14:18 |
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Title: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by zuluwhiskeycharlie on 09/07/16 at 15:14:18 Hey all, I am new to bikes in general and I am not sure if this problem I am seeing is due to my lack of understanding of bikes overall or specific to my setup on the savage. I have such luck getting help/ answers here I though this would be a great place to try and solve my problem. So, I start the bike in neutral and it idles at around 1700-1800, I can bring down to about 1000-1100 with choke pushed all the way in. I can press the foot shifter into first gear with the clutch pulled all the way in, but when I go to release the clutch the bike shuts off. If I release the clutch ever so slowly I can watch my rpms slowly drop. Please help me understand why this is happening, is it user error, something that needs adjusting, electrical? Thanks. |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by cheapnewb24 on 09/07/16 at 16:15:39 Sidestand switch? :-? If you have the sidestand down in gear, it will kill the motor. In fact, you can use it for a kill switch. Back when my neutral switch was bad (and I probably still will), I'd simply kick down the stand in gear to park. I don't even need to touch the kill button. Maybe if there's something going on with that switch, it would explain it. I take it that it's not stalling from load. :-? Idle speed should be adjusted when warm. It tends to be kinda variable. There's a little fingerscrew on the carb to adjust idle speed. You can even adjust it at a red light. Giving it a little enrichment (choke out one or two clicks) may increase your cold idle speed. That's normal. Just keep it running at a reasonable idle speed (high enough to keep up oil pressure, low enough for control and minimal overheating or clutch drag) and you'll be fine. You don't necessarily need a tach. You can listen and feel for it to some extent, especially if you know how fast it's supposed to run. Go for a happy but relaxed sound. Not hyper, not dying... relaxed, secure, and happy. Here's what 1000 rpm sounds like. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rq_W5xhtjBw [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rq_W5xhtjBw[/media] And 1100 rpm https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WLURU50G-o [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WLURU50G-o[/media] I'm currently suffering from savagecharliefoxtrot or something, so we'll see what the others have to say. |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by Ruttly on 09/07/16 at 18:08:26 I think they call that stalling the bike ! |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by cheapnewb24 on 09/07/16 at 18:10:59 Ruttly may have a point. If you're a new rider.... ::) ;D Give it some gas and GO! (Just don't wreck yourself! :-/) A little gas... ease out on the clutch. Nice and easy. Don't jerk, Don't burn up the clutch. These bikes are like manual transmission cars. You can kill the motor if you are too quick to pull out and/or don't give enough gas. You should be able to ease out slowly and putt-putt right down the driveway idling. |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by zuluwhiskeycharlie on 09/07/16 at 18:11:30 Thanks for your input, I have bypassed the sidestand safety so I dont think that is it, also I have done the clutch mod from RYCA. How would I check if it is stalling from load? Additionally, is rpm supposed to be closer to 1000 or closer to 2000, just curious if my tach is actually reading correctly? |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by Kris01 on 09/07/16 at 18:16:40 5F504950524D4C564E405C464D4457494C40250 wrote:
Try releasing the emergency brake first! ;D Tach should read 1100-1200. |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by cheapnewb24 on 09/07/16 at 18:17:07 Stalling from load? Give it gas and GO! (Be careful, don't wreck. :-/) |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by cheapnewb24 on 09/07/16 at 18:17:52 7C455E440706370 wrote:
Try releasing the emergency brake first! ;D Tach should read 1100-1200.[/quote] LOL! ;D |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by zuluwhiskeycharlie on 09/07/16 at 18:20:37 It is very possible I am just stalling the bike I guess, is there a certain rev range to match/hold for the clutch to grab when I release the handle, or should the clutch grab cleanly without adding any throttle when at Idle? |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/07/16 at 18:26:27 If you're not gassing it and letting the clutch out, You're stalling it. Don't wind it up like you're running fifty, just blip the gas, and as you feel the engine slow down as the clutch engages, add gas, |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by cheapnewb24 on 09/07/16 at 18:28:24 Do you have you're license or permit yet? Get out on your driveway where you can move about securely and not run into anything and play with it. It works like this. When the clutch grips, the engine either pulls it or it dies. Probably not good to drag it down below idle speed for prolonged periods (wanna keep oil pressure up). For your purposes, it's not complicated. The Savage is a low revving engine. It can putt about like a riding mower. It's kinda like a lawnmower on two wheels! When you're on the four-lane doing 60 mph, you wanna keep your revs up, but for the driveway, you can just putter about. ;) |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by cheapnewb24 on 09/07/16 at 18:29:32 Feel for it. ;) |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by zuluwhiskeycharlie on 09/07/16 at 18:33:59 Cool! Thanks for the advice I was a little apprehensive about adding throttle, afraid I would torque wheelie over and promptly die straight away before I could even get it to the road. |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/07/16 at 18:40:39 I'm thinking you have never driven a standard car.. Give it Some gas, not steady, blip it, FEEL as the clutch engages, Don't twist the gas and let go of the clutch. It's OKAY to squeeze the clutch back in if you get uncomfortable. It's not a rocket. Liftoff Is Not inevitable. YOU decide When and How Fast. |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by cheapnewb24 on 09/07/16 at 18:41:15 Naw, You probably won't pop a wheelie and die. I can't say for sure I've ever pulled a wheelie on my Savage (or any motorcycle), and I've goosed it a little. Some have pulled wheelies, sometimes on purpose, sometimes not. I kicked her sideways once goosing it on damp asphault with an 8 year old tire. :o I'm 6 ft 1 in, over 200lbs. Be easy on it till you get used to it, and you'll be fine. |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by cheapnewb24 on 09/07/16 at 18:50:56 So, you're worried about this, huh? ;D https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbtNISzo6OM [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbtNISzo6OM[/media] Another tip... Keep your foot covering (not pressing) the rear brake. Pressing the rear brake may help save you from a bike back flip. I ride most of the time with my foot over the brake. Good for control in the twisties and emergencies. Be careful though...The rear tire locks easily, and skidding the rear tire can lead to a high-side crash. Just ask my sprained knee about how that works. If you're gonna crash, learn when to let the bike crash. You can only fight it for so long before you risk serious injury. There's a split second where you have to make the decision to let the bike do what it wants. If you just calmly let the crash happen, you're less likely to hurt yourself. My mistake was fighting it. I stuck my foot out to hold the bike up. I should have known when it was time to fall down cleanly. Instead, I buckled my knee sideways and sprained it. It's been giving me trouble since. |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by cheapnewb24 on 09/07/16 at 19:07:28 An example of a rear-wheel-lock-caused highside crash. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBZWjwHgveY [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBZWjwHgveY[/media] It's generally more violent than a lowside crash, where the bike cleanly slides out from under you. I've had lowsides too.... and rode away with no more than scrapes injury-wise. |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by Chase on 09/08/16 at 04:05:16 If you know anyone that rides ask them to come check bike out make sure a experienced rider can get it to move before doing any maintenance. Then if they get it to move have them go over how they got it to move. THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH BEING NEW your just late to the party is all. They may give you some crap but it's all in fun. |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by RaleighGuy on 09/08/16 at 09:58:23 zuluwhiskeycharlie, Even if you don't use the throttle at all, you should be able to sit on the bike with it idling, put it into 1st gear and while you ever so slowly let the clutch go, it should begin to roll down your driveway. I mean, let that clutch go very, very, very slowly. Like as slow as the basement door opens in a horror movie. DID I MENTION TO LET IT GO VERY SLOWLY??? Anyway, as you let the clutch go little by little, you'll begin to feel it pulling the bike forward. If you let go a little bit too fast, the engine will die. If you let go just a little bit and hold it still, the bike won't move at all because the clutch hasn't "engaged" quite yet. And like JOG said, "It's OKAY to squeeze the clutch back in if you get uncomfortable." Once you let the clutch engage 20 or 50 or 2000 times, you really learn how far you can let it go without killing the engine. And as you learn where your particular clutch engages, then you can begin to give the Savage a little bit of gas as it "takes a hold" of 1st gear and let's you go smoothly out of the driveway and down the road a piece. ;D |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by Ruttly on 09/08/16 at 12:23:00 I don't think crash videos are a good way to encourage a new rider !! |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by stewmills on 09/08/16 at 13:02:35 Don't let the bike scare you. It has a good bit of low end torque and when you start to feel the clutch grab and the bike starts to move, it feels like when you let the clutch go completely it is going to take off like a rocket. It won't race off. 1st gear is geared pretty low and although the engine may sound like it is winding up you are moving about as fast as a 3 year old can run (unless you have a really fast kid!). Once you fully release the clutch, let your throttle hand do the speeding up and slowing down, don't milk the clutch to repeatedly engage and disengage the clutch 'half way' to slow you down if you're hesitant. Remember that unless you are in the process of changing gears or starting from a complete stop, a clutch (like many water valves) should be either fully "on" or "off". Riding a clutch partially engaged for an extended period of time and slipping it over and over for extended periods of time is not good for it. On or Off. On or off. |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by Riley on 09/08/16 at 17:11:32 There is almost no chance of pulling a wheelie on a savage even if you redline first and dump the clutch. |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by stewmills on 09/08/16 at 17:49:18 I bet Cheapie has done it...or will one day soon ;D |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by ohiomoto on 09/09/16 at 05:44:23 7D46434A562F0 wrote:
I agree, but with a little bit of work and a little skill... :) 092C3B281E1A084D0 wrote:
http://suzukisavage.com/yabb2.2/Attachments/Savage_wheelie.jpg |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by RaleighGuy on 09/09/16 at 05:59:10 333425372D292C2C33400 wrote:
-------------------------------------------- ZWC, that's a very good point stewmills just made. I most definitely was NOT suggesting you ride around for long periods of time with the clutch half engaged. That is a good way to shorten the life of your clutch. But I never really learned to drive a manual transmission car when I was younger so the first motorcycle I ever owned was really scary for me to operate. I had to learn a lot about how a clutch worked before my old Honda Nighthawk 250 would move more than a few feet. Now, the smarter and more experienced guys here on the forum might disagree with me, but in my humble opinion, it's not going to hurt anything (or at least it won't cause serious damage to your bike) for you to sit on the bike with it running, put it in first gear, let the clutch out very slowly and try your best to learn how far you have to let that lever out before it begins to tug at the transmission and pull you forward. Once you get to that point on the lever, pull it back in and try it again. Try that exercise 10 or 20 times until you can predict where the clutch grabs the gears (and therefore, it engages). But like stewmills said, just don't leave it half way engaged for more than a few seconds at a time or you'll start smelling something really awful. Do you have anyone you know who already rides? I think a 60-second demonstration using a clutch would be invaluable for you. And please let us know how you're progressing. |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by Drestakil on 09/09/16 at 07:07:26 It's a little late in the season but still might be able to take the Motorcycle Safety Course if you haven't already. I started riding back in the '70s and took the course last year with a friend looking to get his license. It was fun. You'll learn all about the the clutch friction zone. https://www.msf-usa.org/ |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by stewmills on 09/09/16 at 07:33:36 RaleighGuy is on point. You do have to spend the time to learn and feathering the clutch is just part of what you have to do to get used to the feel. You're not going to kill your clutch for the short time you need to learn to ride, just don't make a habit of riding the clutch once you get stable in your riding skills. +1 on the MSF Course. I learned a lot more there than I ever thought I would...and you get to learn wearing out their bikes and clutches, not yours ;) |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/09/16 at 07:38:04 With zero experience, I'd expect to drop it a time or three. |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by stewmills on 09/09/16 at 07:54:06 283731362B2C1D2D1D25373B70420 wrote:
Got to wally world and buy two cheap bean bags. Tie one to each handlebar end. Now you can fall over and over into a nice, soft cushion and no one nor the bike gets hurt 8-) (kidding...don't really do this) |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by smokin_blue on 09/09/16 at 10:03:48 +500 on the MSF course. If you are new to bikes then get yourself into some form of formal training course. Assuming you are in the US the MSF courses are great and worth it. The costs and risks are not worth learning to ride in traffic via trial and error. Go after the formal education. Then ride the wheels off it. |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by KennyG on 09/09/16 at 10:09:44 The Harley Davidson Riders Edge Program is really terrific for learning to ride a motorcycle. For either the beginner or someone who has been off of 2 wheels for a number of years the program will sharpen your safety skills. With Harley you will pay a little more, but in this case you will get your money's worth. Kenny G :) |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by gizzo on 09/10/16 at 22:00:47 29222F2B3A242F3D28787E4A0 wrote:
IMO, cheapie's well intentioned "advice" should be taken with a pinch of salt and ideally seen as entertainment value only. He doesn't have the credentials to give advice on riding OR wrenching. covering the rear brake for emergencies? You're more likely to cause an emergency by stabbing the rear in panic. Front brake rules. Know when its time to drop it? Are you for real? No-one I know goes out riding, gets to a point where they decide "oh well I give up. I guess ill crash now". You keep on riding until you aren't anymore. Cheapies mistake wasn't trying to hold on too long, was getting into that fix in the first place. and ssh!t happens, but your better off staying upright. I'd choose the sprained ankle over a smashed collarbone or worse if I were in that pickle. Going down is the worst option. Last time I looked, Keith Code didn't advise dropping the bike... |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by stewmills on 09/11/16 at 14:25:49 Gizzo has an appropriate perspective. In my MSF course, they never taught when to ditch or drop the bike. In fact, if you dropped the bike during my course, you failed immediately, period! IIRC, they taught that proper braking distribution is 80% front and 20% rear. Also, the clutch is your friend most often in an emergency. Some situations are better served with just pulling the clutch in and letting the bike recover, and IF braking is needed you don't have the engine trying to drive the bike forward fighting the braking. Good riders know this, new riders need to learn it! |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/11/16 at 16:30:52 Seriously, what's the point? |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by ohiomoto on 09/12/16 at 05:37:46 I'm sensing a common theme that I see in a lot of threads on here. The OP=3 posts The rest of us=3 pages! lol Unless of course it's cheapnewb. The it's 3 post us and 3 pages him. :) |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/12/16 at 05:56:16 786761667B7C4D7D4D75676B20120 wrote:
After so long, no updates, no Thanks, I tried that, No Nuthin.. |
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Title: Re: Bike Shutoff When Release Clutch? Post by RaleighGuy on 09/12/16 at 07:13:51 ZuluWhiskey??? Where are you?? Dinner's on the table, come home!! |
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