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Message started by kecuki on 07/20/16 at 20:41:13

Title: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by kecuki on 07/20/16 at 20:41:13

Hi,

so I recently changed oil in my 99' Ryca, used original Suzuki 10W40 oil and K&N-137 filter, but now when I start the bike, there is white smoke after 30seconds - 1 minute and smells really bad. I didn't idle it more than 1 minute, then shut it off... did that maybe 6 times?

Last try, white smoke was almost not present, so I tried if it actually runs ok, but... it runs, but has almost no torque. I shut it of after 30 seconds and walked back to garage.

Any ideas?

I guess I will need to tow it to mechanic :-/

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by verslagen1 on 07/20/16 at 21:02:34

You gotta oil leak, either the rings are gone or the valve seals.
And check the oil level, is the oil gone?
suzuki oil has no zddp in it.
also, check the oil filter, the hole goes towards the case.
if you can't push the cover on with 1 finger, then the filter is in backwards.

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by Ruttly on 07/20/16 at 21:06:48

Did you change oil filter too ? Did you put the filter in backwards. You better check it !!! Very common and very costly mistake . Good luck !

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by kecuki on 07/20/16 at 21:20:36

143332322A3F460 wrote:

Did you change oil filter too ? Did you put the filter in backwards. You better check it !!! Very common and very costly mistake . Good luck !

I'm sure I put it the right way...

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by kecuki on 07/20/16 at 21:40:15

Before change, bike was running good, so it seemed. Kind of rough and noises were kinda too "hard", though. I just bought it, so I don't know anything about it...

Oil is not gone, still can see it through the window.

What's up with the ZDDP?

687B6C6D727F797B702F1E0 wrote:

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by verslagen1 on 07/20/16 at 21:52:53

4D4345534D4F260 wrote:

You need to read this...
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1344399573

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by kecuki on 07/20/16 at 23:52:38

Ok, thanks... But the question now is, should I buy and add ZDDP to it, or should I drain the oil I put there (Suzuki Performance 10W40 Motorcycle)?

3B283F3E212C2A28237C4D0 wrote:

[quote author=4D4345534D4F260 link=1469072473/0#4 date=1469076015]Before change, bike was running good, so it seemed. Kind of rough and noises were kinda too "hard", though. I just bought it, so I don't know anything about it...

Oil is not gone, still can see it through the window.

What's up with the ZDDP?

You need to read this...
http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1344399573[/quote]

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/21/16 at 00:53:43

Did you Touch Anything else, ?
Simply changing oil will not affect How it runs.
Even if you Did put the filter inbackwards it would Run, just like before, until it stopped..

This is not oil related. What else did you do?

Or, it's some kinda coincidental failure.

Did you pull the plug?

What year model?

Miles?

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by Armen on 07/21/16 at 02:56:38

Usually oil burning makes a very dark colored smoke. White smoke is usually water. Water is a product of incomplete combustion. You'll often see white smoke on start/warm-up until the engine and the oil warm up.
Did it get rained on real bad or did you hose off the bike?
Try draining the carb float bowl into something that you can see the gas. I use the white cap from an aerosol can. You'll be able to see if there is water or dirt in the fuel.
A bad load of gas, or some water will make it run lousy.
-Armen

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/21/16 at 04:18:38

Did you wash the bike?
Get gas?
How full is the oil window?

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 07/21/16 at 05:48:52

I once over filled my tractor with oil. I filled it with two quarts of oil and my wife called me in for dinner. I finished dinner and when out and added two quarts of oil - again. Smoked like mad.

Oil and filter change in the LS motor should be 2 quarts. How much did you add.

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/21/16 at 07:37:51

Maybe he got it.

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by kecuki on 07/21/16 at 12:13:41

Hi guys. Thanks for all of the answers.

I put ~2 quarts, it's little below the "minimum" line if I check through the window, but I didn't run it enough to warm it up properly.

I didn't touch anything else. Bike is in dry garage, didn't hose it.

When I start it up, it runs and sounds ok, apart for the white smoke after while and terrible smell. Riding on 1st gear with no throttle for less than 20yards was ok too, but adding throttle caused coughing and almost stall, not good noises too. I shut it off immediately after that.

Bike is 1999, Ryca build, ODO says 700 miles but that's not the real mileage. I bought it used from decent looking guy who built it.

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by verslagen1 on 07/21/16 at 12:16:45

So what petcock are you running?

Did you ever do the petcock test you were recommended to do?

How many miles have you put on it?

252B2D3B25274E0 wrote:

Hi guys,

I bought recently Ryca CS1 bike (1999 Savage), and after riding it for couple of times, I noticed the petcock is set to "PRI" position (pointing to the rear of the bike). However, to my knowledge (and according to the manual), it should never be kept in this position, and should be used only to "refill" the carburator. So I set it to "ON" (pointing to the ground), but the bike would not run properly and would stall soon after starting up. It just felt like the engine can't breathe. I noticed many people on this forum replaced the stock petcock, so I wonder if this is sign of faulty petcock or something else is wrong? I returned it to the "PRI" position and bike seems to be running well.

Thanks for your responses and have a nice day!

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by kecuki on 07/21/16 at 12:48:43

100 miles since I bought it. I still have the original petcock, as I was not home last 2 weeks, so I didn't get around to change it, nor I was riding. I only changed the oil. After change, I tried petcock in different positions, no effect.

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by Gary_in_NJ on 07/21/16 at 13:00:14

545A5C4A54563F0 wrote:
Hi guys. Thanks for all of the answers.

I put ~2 quarts, it's little below the "minimum" line if I check through the window, but I didn't run it enough to warm it up properly.

I didn't touch anything else. Bike is in dry garage, didn't hose it.

When I start it up, it runs and sounds ok, apart for the white smoke after while and terrible smell. Riding on 1st gear with no throttle for less than 20yards was ok too, but adding throttle caused coughing and almost stall, not good noises too. I shut it off immediately after that.

Bike is 1999, Ryca build, ODO says 700 miles but that's not the real mileage. I bought it used from decent looking guy who built it.

When you did the oil change did the oil have a fuel smell?

If the petcock is in fact bad fuel will leak past the rings and contaminate the oil. The fuel in the oil will burn-off at a very low temperature, causing smoke.

The petcock mod is probably a good move because it's a matter of when it will fail, not if.

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by verslagen1 on 07/21/16 at 14:03:32

555B5D4B55573E0 wrote:

If the diaphragm has failed, it will flood the intake with gas causing the white smoke. Keep tabs on the oil level cause gas will get in there and dilute the oil.

Do the petcock test!
check the vac line for gas.

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/21/16 at 14:51:20

Save trouble,swap petcock, change oil, know that engine is safe.

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by kecuki on 07/31/16 at 17:48:35

So I finally got around to check my bike again and to do the petcock test (I travel a lot). First, I idled the bike on stand for a while and rode it slowly on 1st gear without throttle less than 20 yards (3 minutes top) to warm it up and to check the oil level. There was no smoke, but bike smelled bad. I put mirror to the exhaust end and there was nothing on the mirror. Right before I shut it off (or after I did it), there was a little of white smoke coming out. As the smell was getting really bad, I didn't do the petcock test. This is how the oil looked like through the window:

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by verslagen1 on 07/31/16 at 17:54:45

It's either foaming, or is contaminated.

doe it look brown? water.

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by kecuki on 07/31/16 at 17:55:57

water from where? bike was nowhere near water.

Would that explain the bad smell? And the other symptoms?

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by verslagen1 on 07/31/16 at 18:00:55

The bad smell is probably your pipe wrap... it does that.

It shouldn't be foaming at that level.

is that vertical or on the KS?

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by kecuki on 07/31/16 at 18:08:58

It's as vertical as I could hold it. You might be right about the pipe wrap, it's not the cleanest one.

I just realized I changed the decompression lever linkage 2 weeks before changing the oil... Might that be related?

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/31/16 at 18:09:06

First, I idled the bike on stand for a while

That's not a good plan.
The cam starves for oil.

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by kecuki on 07/31/16 at 18:10:13

a while = 30 seconds on the stand

3E2127203D3A0B3B0B33212D66540 wrote:

First, I idled the bike on stand for a while

That's not a good plan.
The cam starves for oil.

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by stewmills on 07/31/16 at 21:02:35

IIRC, the decomposition is only needed to relieve pressure so the cylinder can start moving to crank, and after that it serves no purpose when the bike us running. It may be possible that you have a linkage too short letting pressure leak out or air and moisture in, but that's just me spitballing because I don't see how that would cause smoking unless water or moisture was getting in there.

I would make sure the decomp isn't stuck open or something like that just to rule it out.

I don't know how pipe wrap works, but if it is new and uses that glue stuff like comes with exhaust repair kits could some of it have dripped into the header/muffler joint and it burning out?

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by BSTON on 08/01/16 at 11:50:43

Pipe wrap wouldn't cause the bike to sputter and stall when the throttle is opened up though...

I'm curious how a petcock would allow fuel to get into the oil. Does it completely flood the carb and let fuel flow into the motor?

If there's a situation with improper combustion wouldn't this show on the sparkplug? It seems like something that would be easy to check.

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by verslagen1 on 08/01/16 at 12:10:48

78696E75743A0 wrote:

I'm curious how a petcock would allow fuel to get into the oil. Does it completely flood the carb and let fuel flow into the motor?

There are 2 paths... thru the carb and thru the vac line.

Thru the carb means the float valve is bad or leaking.
Thru the vac line occurs when the petcock diaphragm has failed.
this leaks into the vac port of the carb and into the intake.

In both cases, depending on the slant of the bike, it could go into the airbox or engine. once in the engine it will go past the rings and into the case.

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by batman on 08/01/16 at 14:56:26

Let's face it your "good looking guy " might have been smart enough to read the ryra instructions,and put the bike together but he didn't know enough to about savages to put a raptor on it,he put the petcock on prime and sold it to you !For less than $30 he he could have had it running right!

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/01/16 at 15:29:59

It's Okay if you don't understand. But to choose to ignore people who have years of experience and know what the OEM Petcock does, isn't okay. Oil is cheap, the petcock is easy to swap.
Don't buy the cheapest one online. You Will get what you pay for.
Get a real one.

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by kecuki on 08/13/16 at 23:42:22

So, bike is running again... The problem was actually indeed in the faulty spark plug. And the smell was indeed from the oil soaked into pipe wrap, thanks verslagen1 for the tip.

@batman was right too, pepcock is set to prime because the vacuum line is capped ::)

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by justin_o_guy2 on 08/14/16 at 15:41:40

You don't have any reserve. Out of gas, walking.

Title: Re: Bike stopped working after oil change
Post by batman on 08/14/16 at 20:21:38

Be aware that with the stock petcock you have .6 gal reserve but the raptor only gives you .4 gal due to a shorter suction tube .