SuzukiSavage.com /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> buy old or new? /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1468884380 Message started by Antje on 07/18/16 at 16:26:20

Title: buy old or new? Post by Antje on 07/18/16 at 16:26:20 Hi All- I just found this forum- you are so dedicated. I appreciate it!!!! I am trying to decide between 2 bikes- Suzuki s40/savage.- old vs. new The dealer here in Maine has a 2013 S40 left over stock with 30 mi. at $4000. I like it- LOVE the color. The  biggest pro for me would be having a new bike and being able to ride a few years without (hopefully) mechanical failure.  In the past that didn't seem to hold me back, but I don't have much time to ride as it is and I don't want to loose that, tinkering with the bike. Even though I think this is a great deal, it is too much $ and I will have to take out a loan for that - doable- I have done it before for the BMW K75 I owned in the past. I found a 2001 savage that has a few scratches and dent on the tank.  The R rear blinker has scratches and seems to be held in place by black tape. The owner only has had it since April and been riding it to work. He got it from his buddy’s mom. It had been sitting a few years.  She had bought it from a dealer- used or new- I don't know.   It rides very nice.  But it did stall on me twice downshifting and coming to a stop.  The guy called me later, he turned the idle up a little and seemed to take care of the problem. The other thing I noticed was a very faint high pitch sound just idling. He said the sound has been there since he owned it and thought it came from the muffler compressing the exhaust quite radically.  I see all these comments about mufflers and I forgot to take a picture of the bike- don't know if it is stock.   It needs a new rear tire- pretty worn and the front looks a little cracked in the grooves. He would take $1500 for it.  I got an estimate of around $600 from the Maine dealer to get the tires changed and an overall service, checking everything, IF nothing else turns up it should be good to go for this year and hopefully next.  IF other things need fixing- that would suck. AND it is still a 15 year old bike with sealing’s and gaskets starting to get brittle and leaking..... I know in the past I would have gone for the older bike- it might be age (52) or not enough time, I do want a reliable bike! I do know that I would be so much more relaxed about the older bike, since it already has scratches.  I will not be upset should it get wet or if the garage is occupied that it might have to sit outside a few weeks.  I will get a cover.     I feel like I have been out of the bike-word too long (12 years) to make a completely informed decision. What do you think- old vs new? IF you are still up for reading- I give you my history so you know where I am coming from: Started to ride in 1997. 1981 Suzuki GS 450  put on close to 4000mi the first year. 1985 Yamaha Virago 700 - loved the looks and feel but had starter problems and got sick of it- got a 1995 BMW K75- loved the dependability and ride. But still liked the cruiser as well and got a 1987? Honda Shadow 700.   Loved it as well- great change of feel and position between the two bikes. At that time I had a few mechanics I would go to and they loved to show me what they did, teach me about my bikes, but most of the services I would have them do.   Had to sell the K75 in 2003 to pay the plumber-building a house.... And the Shadow went in 2004 as I got in a relationship where the partner was not into bikes- got a kayak instead. But over the years I was temped a few times. Seeing a 2006 Suzuki GZ250 for sale on our street corner got me thinking. I test drove it and decided it was way too small.  I tried a 2006 Kawasaki Vulcan 500, but it felt too bulky. Now I tried these 2 suzuki S40/Savage and think this is the right size, weight and power for me.

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/18/16 at 17:36:16 IF you have cash, walk in with$2800.00. See what happens, be willing to walk away. Ask him if he would rather have his money tied up in three, soon to be four year old merchandise or turn it back into operating capital. If he jacks you for 3500, go to 3,000.. I would hope to see that go.  Surely you can ride away for 3200. 4,000 isn't exactly beating.. and if you're not willing to be doing the maintenance,  new is better. I went new just because I was intimidated by the idea of working on a bike. If Icould do it over, id get used.. Ohhh, wait! I am soon to get that chance!

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by sauvage on 07/18/16 at 17:47:26 Yeah, good advice from JoG. It's good that you like this bike already because I have noticed that there are many almost new ones for sale which says to me that it attracts people due to it's romantic look, and it is a very fun bike to ride, but they either aren't really into riding bikes, or they don't really like it very much after a while. Therefore you can basically get a new bike that has already lost it's $1500-2000 that it loses as it rolls out the showroom door.

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by oldNslow on 07/18/16 at 18:03:45 IMO 1500 + 600 for tires and whatever your dealer calls an "overall service" is too much money for a bike that old that is making a noise that concerns you, and that doesn't sound as though it was taken care of all that well by it's previous owners. If you want a bike to ride while you study up on what these particular bikes need in the way of regular maintenance( and be aware that your dealer may not be as knowledgeable as some of the folks on this forum) I recommend you figure out a way to buy the new one. If you are looking for a project and an education on Savages/S40s then the 2001 sounds like just the ticket. But I think you need to get most of that 600 dollars for tires and whatever, knocked off the asking price for that to be worthwhile.

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by Antje on 07/18/16 at 18:29:43 Wow, I never thought about getting the price lowered from the dealer.  I just figured $4000 was already pretty good, since the bike was around $5800 new. Thanks

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by Todd James on 07/18/16 at 18:55:41   Did you check Craigs List ? There are several S40's in Maine listed in the $2,000 range that are around ten years old.

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by Antje on 07/18/16 at 19:08:10 Todd, I checked.  They seemed to all be in NH. But I saw a 2012 that is not clear where exactly it is- I dropped an email to find out. Thanks Antje

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by verslagen1 on 07/18/16 at 19:54:35 Check nada.com or kbb.com for prices. and I would deduct the price of tires. and as far as dealer service goes, they'll check everything, but adjustment is extra. It probably could use an oil change, filters, valve adjust just so you know you're at ground zero. The how-to's are in the tech section, check out the index. If the brake fluid is tinted, make plans to change it. The battery is another thing to think about.

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by jcstokes on 07/18/16 at 20:08:12 If you like the colour of the new bike, and the price is acceptable, go for it. You can always try some negotiation if you wish, remembering that some are better at this sort of thing than others. Just remember you will be negotiating with a professional negotiator. See if you can get some sort of warranty at no extra charge. At least get them to throw in the things that Verslagen mentioned, particularly a NEW battery if you decide to pay anything near the asking price.

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/18/16 at 20:34:12 did stall on me twice downshifting and coming to a stop.  The guy called me later, he turned the idle up a little and seemed to take care of the problem. The other thing I noticed was a very faint high pitch sound just idling. He said the sound has been there since he owned it and thought it came from the muffler compressing the exhaust quite radically. If it's been run at low idle, that's bad news. The stock mufflers do whistle like a VW. YOU can get a loan, use the cash, buy the bike.

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by Antje on 07/18/16 at 20:37:32 Thanks a bunch for all the suggestions. Yes, the new bike comes with the 1 year Suzuki warranty. and The dealer is going over the bike again.  Great idea to check about the battery. And I just looked through all the 2500 Maine listings on cragslist- there were a few S40 hiding with different headings.... just wrote a few emails The 2001 is deffinatly out of the running. I'll post a picture of what I will eventually end up with :)

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by TallElf on 07/18/16 at 20:44:49 I just pulled a 2001 with 8600 miles for $1050.   It needed tires and the very next day fell ass backwards into a pair mounted and balanced for 100 bucks.  Granted they were an off brand. Called full bore made in korea.. But hey.. They havent drifted in the gravelly corners in pa.  Ill take it.   Depending on your level of comfort with wrenches and time available.. It seems like you may wanna shop around for used.. And get one in better conditio.   Or go for the new o e and just letter rip

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by hotprops on 07/18/16 at 21:57:26 you know the new one is/will be, $4000 ,plus shipping ,assembly ,dealer pack ,tax title and on and on . if you can really put one in your garage for 4k with a warrentee   buy it.. a 2013 model are/is usually dealer used stock by now with no warrentee. he wants to get you back in the showroom   with your checkbook and a stiffy. fyi he is into that bike for at-least $4700 with all/any spiffs.i do like the orange black color.

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/18/16 at 22:13:48 A businessman understands cash flow. Depending on HIS particular situation, he may take a loss just to get cash back into the business. Asking someone if they want to turn something back into operating capital can move it your way.

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by jcstokes on 07/19/16 at 01:42:37 JOG, if I ever buy anything, I must remember that "operating capital" ploy.

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/19/16 at 01:48:24 Works on dusty stuff on hardware store shelves. I got a 2" Bulldog hitch for ten bucks..

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by jcstokes on 07/19/16 at 02:02:12 Antje, the stock IRC tyres aren't much to write home about. If you do buy the new one, don't push the limits, particularly in the wet. Once you have a couple of thousand miles up consider replacing the rear, the front isn't as bad. Popular value for money choices on this site are Shinko and Kenda. The techies here will soon advise on size, i.e 140/90 15.

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by Dave on 07/19/16 at 04:12:07 If you love working on motorcycles, tinkering, and you enjoy having wrenches in your hand almost as much as having the grips in your hands while riding......then you can get a really good deal on a used Savage.  It likely will need the head plug removed and replaced if it has not been done, if it has 10,000 miles or more you are going to need the cam chain tensioner looked at, the Raptor Petcock is always a good thing to install so you don't have problems with the vacuum operated petcock, the bolts at the front/rear of the cylinder can weep oil, it will probably have old tires on it unless they have already been replaced....etc. If you don't have tools and a nice place to work.....you most likely are better off getting a new bike.  Just be wary of the dealers that hate working on the Savage, and don't understand how to keep it running.  This forum is very good at diagnosing problems that come up. Dave

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by Antje on 07/20/16 at 17:56:01 After expanding my craigslist search I found a number of interesting bikes. I will check out one tomorrow: 2007 4200 mi. decent tires, new battery and looks in great shape on the photo. Got its yearly check up.  It is the wife's bike and she doesn't want to ride any more. Asking $1650. I am crossing my fingers that it really is as nice as it sounds.   8-) If I get it I just have to figure out how to get it in the truck.  Scrounging in the wood piles to get 2 planks long enough.

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by stewmills on 07/20/16 at 18:11:55 Back up to a ditch!  Or, go rent a little haul. It's worth it for a good deal you don't wanna miss.  Luck!

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by Antje on 07/21/16 at 20:42:24 I got the 2007 S40.  4200 mi. It is nice and clean.  But I think the carburetor could use a little cleaning. Oh, and just a little backfiring.   I did back the truck against a hill to load and unload the bike.  Glad it made it into the garage pretty easily. Tomorrow I will have a tight squeeze to register it between appointments....Will be riding this weekend 8-) Thanks for all your help!

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by stewmills on 07/21/16 at 21:03:45 Nice!  Welcome to the cult...I mean club  ;) Carb probably won't hurt by a good once over. You need to read and understand the white spacer mod and also remove the brass plug to get to the air mix screw. Read up and ask questions. Once in the carb you don't want to damage the plunger or plunger parts. And some parts like the dimpled thingy go in a certain side up. If you do anything smart, do these two. Go to the marketplace and buy Dave's stainless allen screw set to replace all of the carb screws while it is off. And get a set of JIS screwdrivers. If you have any carb screws that are stuck, you'll strip them out trying too hard with a standard US phillips. They're different! Ask me and Dave how I know  :o Looks of the header pipe it may be running a bit lean.

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by Antje on 07/21/16 at 21:15:26 The bike also came with the clymer manuel. I will read up and try to understand the carburetor I'll check out the screws and tools Do you think the discoloration means it runs lean? :)

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by jcstokes on 07/21/16 at 21:16:16 Since there's plenty of wood in you garage, make up a piece about 8"x 8" and 2 3/4" you will have a good little packer you can put under the stand to check your oil level, some use a brick. Bike must be level or near level to check the oil according to the handbook. There are errors in Clymer, and a thread in the tech section which points these out.

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by stewmills on 07/21/16 at 21:22:30 The bluing sometimes occurs from getting a bit hotter than normal. Nothing to worry about...you'll hear other comments about pipe coloring and lean jetting. Some rejet, some just adjust the air mix screw...just depends on your bike and elevation, etc.  Just get familiar with the bike, and if it runs good enjoy it for a while before tearing into it. Keep hanging around here and everyone here will keep you on the up and up. Great folks here.

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by Antje on 07/21/16 at 21:24:18 Great- I easily can make a block to get the bike level. And I don't see the tools in the Marketplace.  They must be out right now....

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by hotprops on 07/21/16 at 22:32:20 welcome you will have fun, the guys hear really know there stuff listen and learn. i did. one of the best spots on the interwebs

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by jcstokes on 07/22/16 at 00:17:59 If you are referring to the stock tool kit, it's not that much to write home about either. The open end spanners and the screwdriver may have uses. The pliers next to USELESS, I never got the belt tensioner thingy in mine and I brought new. The tube spanner well????? Do what Zippi says and enjoy it for a while before embarking on tuning and so on.

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by stewmills on 07/22/16 at 06:58:39 Here's the link to Dave's allen screw set: http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1443182703 As for the JIS screwdrivers, they aren't sold in our marketplace, sorry.  You'll need to get them locally or either order. They aren't super cheap, but worth it to not strip critical screws. I think I paid $25 for 4 of them. Something like this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hozan-JIS-4-JIS-Screwdriver-Set-NEW-3rd-Gen-New-/311263643964?hash=item4878c2493c:g:YWIAAOSwBLlU6-yi Oh...and if you don't have one, an impact driver (see pic) from Home Depot (mine carries one) can come in handy breaking loose some of the external carb screws as well as others that are stuck. It's a happy balance between smacking it hard enough to break the screw loose but not so hard you bend and bang things up.

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by old.indian on 07/22/16 at 08:25:56 Before you start on the carb, you might want to drain the tank and replace with fresh gas and a dose of carb cleaner.  Worth a try....

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by zipidachimp on 07/22/16 at 23:23:46 ooooooooooooooh!!!!!!!!! I see a blank canvas, very envious!!!

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by batman on 07/23/16 at 10:04:39 Looks like you scored a great bike for the price,and super low miles for it's age ! congrats!

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by Antje on 07/28/16 at 17:37:51 I have been driving about 400 mi and it is running much nicer with fresh gas! When I bought it I noticed that the headlight vibrated a lot. It turned out to be actually broken off the base. Good thing I had duct tape with me. It held up all right. I stopped at the mechanic that helped me with my bikes 19 years ago. I was glad to see he was still working. He ordered a new headlight for me and also new rear blinkers. Someone had put tiny blinkers on. I want to be more visible. When he puts those on he will also do an oil change. I plan to hang around and learn something about my bike.  ::) :)

Title: Re: buy old or new? Post by old.indian on 07/28/16 at 17:57:22 Nice thing about the S40 is that you can do quite a bit your self.   I was at a dealer's today and most of the new bikes are almost impossible for a shade tree mechanic to work on....   (The new Ducati scramblers are tempting, and that metallic green Truxton was something to drool over.....)   :)

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