SuzukiSavage.com /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for fix /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1466875115 Message started by DavidOfMA on 06/25/16 at 10:18:34

Title: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for fix Post by DavidOfMA on 06/25/16 at 10:18:34 The head plug on my 2007 S40 appears to be leaking again -- a slow leak that first appears on the engine bolt just to the left of the exhaust port. I had it replace at 9,000 miles, now at 15,000. Because it's tiny, and because I don't really want to spend the $$$ the stealership will charge to replace it again and am not up to the task of doing it myself, I'm considering trying a seal rejuvenator like this to see if it expands the plug enough to stop this small leak: https://www.amazon.com/ATP-AT-205-Re-Seal-Stops-Bottle/dp/B000NVW1LM?ie=UTF8&redirect=true&ref_=pd_lpo_k2_dp_sr_1 Several Amazon users have put it in motorcycles with no ill effects. My only real concern is the wet clutch. It's not petroleum based, and the reviews on Amazon make it seem safe. Anyone tried this, and if not, have any ideas about whether it will affect the clutch? By the way, one of the bikes that the Amazon user put this sealer in was a 1993 Kawasaki Voyager XII. I have not idea how they are built, though since the head plug is plastic and not rubber, it's a moot point. Thanks, David

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by norm92de on 06/25/16 at 11:48:54 If I were doing it I would give Mr. Versy a call. Put his head plug in and forget about further leaks. :)

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by batman on 06/25/16 at 14:02:25 I agree with Norm,I would be leery ,the motor cycles your talking about may have been Harley's which have separate motors and tranys  which would allow use in their motors.If you had a shop do your last plug they didn't put sealer around it because their manual doesn't call for it ,and it leaking again. You really should do it yourself ,100"s of us have .

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by Dave on 06/25/16 at 14:07:53 The seal conditioner won't really do anything to the head plug....it is more plastic than rubber.  But you really don't want that seal conditioner working on all those other rubber seals.....like the pulley seal, crank seals, decompressor lever seal, shift shaft seal, etc. Are you sure it is the head plug....and not the nut/bolt that is under the exhaust port? If it is the head plug.....live with it until you can't....then it is time to do it one more time and use the Versy for the next and final time.

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by DavidOfMA on 06/25/16 at 19:23:34 Thanks for all your responses so far. I'm not totally sure that it's the head plug. If I clean the oil up with carb cleaner and then look at it after a short run, I see oil on the nut/bolt that you can see if you look into the hole in the cylinder block next to the exhaust port. Is the head plug directly over this bolt? If so, how can I tell for sure if the oil is coming from the head plug or from the nut being loose? If it's from the nut and not the head plug, will I have to remove the head cover anyway to retorque it? I know many people on this board have replaced the head plug, but reading through the threads on the job, I find it daunting. Just replacing the cam chain tensioner with the verslavvy took me several hours, and this looks like a much more complex job. Or am I overestimating its difficulty? Thanks again, David PS: I ordered the Verslagen head plug. Thanks, I didn't know these had gone beyond "experimental."

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by justin_o_guy2 on 06/26/16 at 01:50:14 If you have done the chain , this is the same thing.. just gotta do the plug, it's under the head cover. That's not difficult. Time consuming.. And a hassle.Spreading the goo, clamping down the head cover, pass after pass on the bolts... gakk..

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by DavidOfMA on 06/26/16 at 06:28:12 How can I tell, before I resort to pulling things apart, whether the leak is from the head plug or the cylinder nut undernearth it?

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by Dave on 06/26/16 at 06:54:52 I would put a small piece of cloth in the hole, and go for a short ride.  I don't think the cloth will burst into flames.  The goal is to see if the oil is getting on the top of the cloth, or coming from underneath. There was one member who carefully cleaned the area, then was able to apply a neat coating of RTV to the bottom side of the head plug and got it sealed.  If you didn't do this very carefully....it could make a really big mess!

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by DavidOfMA on 06/26/16 at 14:15:50 Good idea, using a piece of cloth. Sprayed the area down again with carb cleaner, will do a short run tomorrow. If it's the head plug, I'll try the RTV-on-the bottom trick as a short-term fix. Any idea what the other member used to spread the sealant? Too cramped to get a finger in there, but you'd need to get it to adhere to the plug bottom and surrounding metal with no gaps. The plug bottom is flush with the metal around it. Should it be? Thanks, David

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by batman on 06/26/16 at 14:41:15 dave,try a popsicle stick,If it turns out to be the head bolt you'll still have to pull the top and remove the plug to get to the headbolt.

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by Dave on 06/26/16 at 18:39:08 If you can get a syringe with a curved tip....fill it with the RTV and apply it where you need it.  Or a syringe with a piece of tubing on the end....you may need somebody to squeeze the syringe while you carefully operate the tube end.

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by DavidOfMA on 06/27/16 at 02:04:29 Another good idea. I have a small syringe with a hose. Then there's also this, which is supposed to wick into cracks and apparently is oil resistant (though it's only rated to 300F): https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0018PW15I If it's the plug, nothing to lose by trying these external attempts, just a bit more mess to clean up later if it fails.

Title: Carb cleaner fix for head plug leak? Post by DavidOfMA on 07/02/16 at 09:05:25 A follow-up: I did the rag-in-hole test Dave suggested and found very little oil leaking this time. Then I thought: carb cleaner melts plastic and the "rubber" head plug, Dave said, is mostly plastic. I wonder if some of it wicked into the spaces where the plug was leaking and melted a seal. So, with nothing to lose, I sprayed the heck out of it with carb cleaner, waited a couple of days, and took it out for another ride with a rag in the hole to catch any drips. Not a drop! It seems unlikely this "carb cleaner fix" for the head plug leak will last indefinitely, but until it leaks again, I don't see much reason to tear things apart. Versy head plug is on the way, so I'll have it when I need it. Thanks for all your advice! David

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by justin_o_guy2 on 07/02/16 at 10:42:44 Versy head plug is on the way, so I'll have it when I need it. That's wisdom in action. People who are planning on replacing the chain in a year should be shopping and buy one and drop it in a jar and cover it with oil. Get the gasket and sealer, and not be hoping for parts to get in at the last minute.

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by ero4444 on 07/05/16 at 15:31:01 >> I wonder if some of it wicked into the spaces where the plug was leaking and melted a seal. So, with nothing to lose, I sprayed the heck out of it with carb cleaner, waited a couple of days, COOL - thanks, I will try this.  Not ready for any bike surgery, but it would be nice if the fins would stay clean for a while.

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by batman on 07/05/16 at 15:47:13 Progress through chemistry?

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by DavidOfMA on 09/12/16 at 06:21:29 More progress through chemistry: The head bolt that sits under the head plug was also weeping a small amount of oil, and to "get me through the season," I applied some high-temp wicking Loctite. (Loctite 294) So far, 900+ miles later, including 2 hours in 90F+ stop-and-go traffic and several hours at 75mph, no leaks! My temporary fix may be permanent, at least until something else goes wrong where I actually do have to tear down the engine.

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/12/16 at 06:55:49 Fixed is fixed! I didn't know a Wicking version existed. Did you remove the nut and clean oil off?

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by DavidOfMA on 09/12/16 at 09:06:52 To clean and tighten that nut, I'd have to take off the cylinder head cover and the rubber plug, both of which I wanted to avoid. This stuff is oil-tolerant and wicks into the threads. It also is high-temp. I tried another version that was not advertised as high-temp or oil tolerant first, and the leak came back after the first hot-weather ride.  If I ever do need to remove that nut I may need to heat it first, but that's easy. I also tested this stuff to see what happens if it mixes with oil. It just dissolves and doesn't seem to deposit itself onto metal surfaces, so I'm not concerned about a little bit leaking past the threads into an oil passage.  Very cool product!

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/12/16 at 11:17:36 http://www.adhesivecentral.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=LT-22041&gclid=Cj0KEQjwpNm-BRCJ3rDNmOuKi9IBEiQAlzDJH3cgnd2_l0yYLrpSkJt2dkm0hA8nNL88MGisUA8IaTUaAkEz8P8HAQ Yikes,  Milspec, over $100.00 each.. LOCTITE 220 Mid Strength, Wicking, Mil-Spec Blue Threadlock 50ml - Free Ship USA Condition:      New Quantity: 1 6 available $19.99 + Free Shipping Mild strength,  otta be enough.

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by DavidOfMA on 09/12/16 at 11:34:52 The stuff I used cost me about $20 for 50ml on Amazon. This was my second attempt. The first, using the Permatex equivalent of the loctite product you linked to, failed when the engine got too hot. This stuff won't melt until it reaches 450F, and it seems to displace oil - it's described as oil tolerant. That's why I chose it.

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/12/16 at 11:47:42 The second one is about twenty bucks.. Sounds like a hekkuva fine item to have around. How did you even find it? Usually you hafta know something exists before you can find it.

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by DavidOfMA on 09/12/16 at 11:56:28 I searched around Google and Amazon for variants of search strings like "fix hairline engine crack" until I found a Permatex threadlocker product that fills small defects in porous castings. Then, after that worked briefly and then failed, I searched for "threadlocker high-temp oil-resistant" and eventually found that one. It took a while!

Title: Re: Head plug leaking again, hair-brained idea for Post by justin_o_guy2 on 09/12/16 at 13:58:52 That's cool, very cool. Clever use of search terms.

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