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/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> The Cafe >> EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1458825946 Message started by engineer on 03/24/16 at 06:25:45 |
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Title: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by engineer on 03/24/16 at 06:25:45 I picked this up in another motorcycle forum. http://www.cycleworld.com/2016/03/23/epa-proposes-legislation-to-ban-aftermarket-exhausts/ The article is concerned about bikes used in competition but it would also apply to street machines. |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by DesertRat on 03/24/16 at 06:47:45 not sure how they could, the push back from the free market would be epic. or maybe this is a shakedown ??? |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/24/16 at 11:17:22 Yeah, the free market is just killing them as they regulate our power plants out of existence. Is a Dyna aftermarket? Can't I run a muffler on my car from the muffler shop or do I have to get it from the dealership? Time to ditch them, along with the energy and education and several other alphabet agencies. |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by jcstokes on 03/24/16 at 15:52:56 There's an organisation in the US called SEMA, which has helped aftermarket and antique car people in the past. Perhaps you could google it, and a phone call or email to your congressman can also help. |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/24/16 at 17:19:58 That's not how it works now.. Legislators have allowed the unelected regulators power to create regulations that are restrictive and effectively law. And then people wonder why I point stuff out. |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by Kris01 on 03/24/16 at 18:20:36 ALL aftermarket mufflers? I'd like to see the language in this bill. |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by r80rt on 03/24/16 at 18:38:04 If it makes ya grin, there's a law against it. |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/25/16 at 18:22:00 266C642620540 wrote:
Can you elaborate? |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by oldNslow on 03/25/16 at 18:50:49 Kris01 wrote: Quote:
I think this is the relevant section: From Title 42-THE PUBLIC HEALTH AND WELFARE CHAPTER 85-AIR POLLUTION PREVENTION AND CONTROL SUBCHAPTER II-EMISSION STANDARDS FOR MOVING SOURCES Part A-Motor Vehicle Emission and Fuel Standards The following acts and the causing thereof are prohibited- (1) in the case of a manufacturer of new motor vehicles or new motor vehicle engines for distribution in commerce, the sale, or the offering for sale, or the introduction, or delivery for introduction, into commerce, or (in the case of any person, except as provided by regulation of the Administrator), the importation into the United States, of any new motor vehicle or new motor vehicle engine, manufactured after the effective date of regulations under this part which are applicable to such vehicle or engine unless such vehicle or engine is covered by a certificate of conformity issued (and in effect) under regulations prescribed under this part or part C in the case of clean-fuel vehicles (except as provided in subsection (b) of this section); (2)(A) for any person to fail or refuse to permit access to or copying of records or to fail to make reports or provide information required under section 7542 of this title; (B) for any person to fail or refuse to permit entry, testing or inspection authorized under section 7525(c) of this title or section 7542 of this title; (C) for any person to fail or refuse to perform tests, or have tests performed as required under section 7542 of this title; (D) for any manufacturer to fail to make information available as provided by regulation under section 7521(m)(5) of this title; (3)(A) for any person to remove or render inoperative any device or element of design installed on or in a motor vehicle or motor vehicle engine in compliance with regulations under this subchapter prior to its sale and delivery to the ultimate purchaser, or for any person knowingly to remove or render inoperative any such device or element of design after such sale and delivery to the ultimate purchaser; or (B) for any person to manufacture or sell, or offer to sell, or install, any part or component intended for use with, or as part of, any motor vehicle or motor vehicle engine, where a principal effect of the part or component is to bypass, defeat, or render inoperative any device or element of design installed on or in a motor vehicle or motor vehicle engine in compliance with regulations under this subchapter, The bills listed in the cycle world article would add language specifically excluding competition vehicles. Without that language it's a matter of how the above is interpreted and how "moving sources"(of air pollution) are defined I think. |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/25/16 at 18:54:39 I can't see how mufflers would be included. Catalytic converters, yeah, but the muffler does nothing to affect the amount or quality of anything that comes out of the motor. |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by oldNslow on 03/25/16 at 19:20:15 4B545255484F7E4E7E46545813210 wrote:
You're right. But the original article says this: "Proposed legislation from the Environmental Protection Agency is aimed at stamping out the use of aftermarket exhaust systems." They're not talking about just mufflers. And this is the EPA we're talking about. I would expect them to argue that the muffler is an integral part of the "exhaust system" and as such can't be modified. Years ago I'd have said that without a doubt they'd loose that argument, but now I'm not so sure. Remember "Cash for Clunkers"? I sure as he*l didn't see that one coming down the pike :o |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/25/16 at 20:54:15 You know how many people WORK replacing factory systems with identical in function, but different manufacturers, and therefore Aftermarket exhaust systems? Or maybe that's the reason.. kill more jobs. Obsolete older cars. If it's gotta be a dealership job,many old cars would be totaled. |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by verslagen1 on 03/25/16 at 21:04:18 being most of these bikes are made or have parts sourced in the orient... the american thing to do is to allow aftermarket. |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/25/16 at 21:26:23 the american thing to do Isn't something that I have seen a lot of in recent decades |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by cheapnewb24 on 03/25/16 at 21:58:40 >:( Not happy... How many good old cars and trucks-- potential classics one day-- got trashed in Cash-for-Clunkers? I'm a fan of the first generation Ford Rangers. Used to be everywhere. How many do you see now. :( Pollution can be a problem, and noise too, but can't they just leave people alone? Why do the noise/pollution control freaks have to win so much? ( Or do they?) Running this country is supposed to be about deal making, problem solving, and reasonable compromises so that everybody is happy. I take it that Trump is the kind of guy to fix that problem. :-? A deal-maker |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by DesertRat on 03/25/16 at 23:16:24 307A723036420 wrote:
;D ;D ;D :) |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/25/16 at 23:35:25 ) Running this country is supposed to be about deal making, problem solving, and reasonable compromises so that everybody is happy. So far from reality... |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by jcstokes on 03/25/16 at 23:39:57 Ok, so I'm thousands of miles away and unfamiliar with your systems, but the "cash for clunker" was, as far as I'm aware, successfully opposed by the Sema organisation. OK so www.sema.org |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/25/16 at 23:51:31 No, it happened. People traded in cars that they were Planning on trading in a year or two later. New cars left the lot, then, a downturn followed. It's just another example of government trying to accomplish something. Phhhht, they should all go on vacation and stay. |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by Dave on 03/26/16 at 05:52:54 252C3C3B20242A3C4F0 wrote:
The cash for clunkers certainly happened in this area. Cars/trucks were traded in that qualified, and I was told (didn't witness it myself), that the dealer was required to add something to the oil and start the engine......then let the engine run until it seized so the car could never be used again. Although I would not support a ban on all aftermarket exhaust systems - I would support a plan like some states have that require reasonable limits on how loud a street driven motorcycle can be (or car/truck/semi). It doesn't make any sense for the DOT to set sound limits on new vehicles that adds a lot of money to what a new bike costs (have you seen how complex the mufflers are on new bikes?)......then the new owner spends hundreds of dollars just to replace it with something really loud. My wife and I went hiking in the Blueridge/Cherohola area of TN, and we could be 3 miles away from the road and hear the Harley's with open pipes bellowing up the road. |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by oldNslow on 03/26/16 at 07:28:50 They made the stuff right here in Rochester NY. Castle is a company based here that manufactures all sorts of automotive and industrial chemicals. Brake cleaner, carb cleaner, penetrating oil, spray lubes, carpet and upholstery cleaners etc. https://pubs.acs.org/cen/business/87/8732bus3.html |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/26/16 at 11:29:10 Cash For Clunkers Cars Killed Using Sodium Silicate - Business ... Business Insider › henry-blodget-this-is-t... Aug 3, 2009 - All this car-killing, in turn, is driving the price of old engines and parts through the roof (for people who ... What Happens to Traded-In Cars in Cash for Clunkers? - TIME Time Magazine › content › time › article Aug 4, 2009 - The cash-for-clunkers program is plenty messy even ... What Happens to the Clunkers Traded In? ... Dealers then turn the car on and rev the engine to let the ... any leftover parts must be destroyed, and the government is ... Just a reminder: Cash for Clunkers requires destroying perfectly ... Hot Air › archives › 2009/08/01 › just-a-... Aug 1, 2009 - The Cash for Clunkers program is stupid for a lot of reasons. ... A perfectly good and useful machine destroyed for political .... The video of the Volvo engine being ruined You can decide why... |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by justin_o_guy2 on 03/26/16 at 19:38:25 Goes beyond the exhaust http://www.thenewspaper.com/news/48/4894.asp |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by cheapnewb24 on 03/26/16 at 20:13:07 Hey! Who deleted my post! >:( What did I say wrong this time!!!! >:( (By the way, if you delete this post, I'll just put it back ;) :P) |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by oneoff on 03/26/16 at 21:27:14 post 4 |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by oneoff on 03/26/16 at 21:28:32 5 |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by oneoff on 03/26/16 at 21:34:42 6 |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by oneoff on 03/26/16 at 21:34:56 7 |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by oneoff on 03/26/16 at 21:35:05 8 |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by oneoff on 03/26/16 at 21:35:17 9 |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by oneoff on 03/26/16 at 21:35:28 10 |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by Oldfeller on 03/27/16 at 11:16:22 Got enough to get your PM working yet? |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by DesertRat on 03/27/16 at 12:49:33 OldFeller, He got enough. Was looking to sell me a seat. But hasn't been back on since the initial exchange. :( |
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Title: Re: EPA wants to ban all aftermarket mufflers Post by cheapnewb24 on 03/28/16 at 10:46:03 Strangely enough, I just found the post I thought was deleted. Okay.... :-/ |
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