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SuzukiSavage.com
/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl General Category >> Rubber Side Down! >> Engine trouble after warm up /cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1451949014 Message started by 4putt on 01/04/16 at 15:10:14 |
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Title: Engine trouble after warm up Post by 4putt on 01/04/16 at 15:10:14 My engine has been running great for the past 3 yrs. Always drive it a couple of miles on good days. Lately it has been giving me fits.... It starts cold immediately. Runs and idles fine at first. As soon as it has warmed up a bit, maybe 3-5 minutes, it's trouble. Seems to start missing. Not the steady firing sound. If I open up the throttle it gets better. This pattern continues with more throttle required to run smooth. Eventually it gets worse and eventually dies. Once it dies, it won't start. If I let it sit over night to cool down, it starts immediately. After 3-5 mins we're back to the same trouble. I have: overhauled the carb (bath),and checked the valve clearances. I'm pretty much stumped presently. Never had an engine act like this. Could a coil act up like this or some other electrical element? Any suggestions are appreciated. Mods include: Supertrapp muffler, rejetting, chain drive, bigger seat. |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by verslagen1 on 01/04/16 at 15:26:19 43475E525D5D330 wrote:
what does this mean? 5 miles across town? 25 miles at a loping pace? 50 miles ripping down the superslab? 5 miles daily across town and your battery is dead. what jets have you fitted? |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by 4putt on 01/04/16 at 16:04:28 Well actually down and back to the mailbox about 2 miles. Since the act up I don't do much more. Don't want to get stranded. Battery seems fine. When cold it starts right up. Forgot to mention it's an '03 Savage. Don't remember the jet upgrade. I bought them from one of the members here maybe from the Carolinas. That was 3-5 yrs ago at least. It has run great since. |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by verslagen1 on 01/04/16 at 18:11:54 If that's all you do, then you need a trickle charger to keep it up. It may even be down enough to cause your problem. |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by justin_o_guy2 on 01/04/16 at 18:19:44 Battery seems fine. When cold it starts right up. I understand that that's how you feel about it. I see why. I also know these guys and these bikes. Based on your description of how much you ride and the difficult to diagnose problems a marginally charged battery can cause, suggest you go with the advice. The petcock can do bizarre things, too. |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by 4putt on 01/04/16 at 19:37:33 I'll put a charge on it tonight. It'll be great, if that is all it is. Thx. |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by gizzo on 01/04/16 at 22:25:44 After you've done that and if it makes no difference, see if someone can loan you their ignition box. Those can break down as they heat up and quit working intermittently. No idea whether any Savage owners have had ths one, just throwing it out there. Check the fuel cap is venting air. A blocked vent and vacuum in the fuel tank might be to blame too. Pull off the fuel line to the carb, put the tap on prime and let the fuel run out. Should hear the cap whistling as the fuel pours out. Hope it's an easy fix. |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by Dave on 01/05/16 at 03:55:22 Do you still have the stock vacuum operated petcock? This sounds like the symptoms that result when the diaphragm starts leaking fuel into the vacuum line. |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by 4putt on 01/11/16 at 09:25:33 Thanks for all the suggestions. Am waiting for a new battery to arrive. Should be this week. I did charge up my battery and ran some tests again. One thing I forgot to try was removing the gas cap to eliminate a plugged tank vent. When I remembered about it, I realized I couldn't remove the cap with the key in the ignition. Did pull the petcock vacuum hose off when it started acting up. I plugged it with my thumb and didn't see any change. Had a voltmeter across battery terminals to see if any change. 13.4 volts showed while running when I first started it. Once it started acting up it had dropped some, but still at 12.2 V. Other things I noticed were: existing battery is 3 yrs old (Big Crank, not a name brand). Spark plug shows running rich. Probably why it starts right up when cold. May remove another ring from my Supertrapp. . Rectifier is around $200. Hope it's not that. Only have 3500 miles on it. I'll keep my fingers crossed. Thx again Verslagen1, Justin_O_guy2, Gizzo, & Dave. |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by Dave on 01/11/16 at 10:40:34 2A2E373B34345A0 wrote:
That is not sufficient to rule out the petcock being a potential problem. You need to do the entire test.....link listed below. http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1251932429/1 |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by 4putt on 01/25/16 at 09:22:46 Finally got back to my bike. Installed a new Yuasa battery. Ran without the gas cap to eliminate a plugged tank vent. Same results. I have been reading other posts. Deltaplanet used the term "loping" when describing his engine idle problems. That describes mine pretty well. I was wondering about the chain tensioner I've seen that mentioned plenty. Thought of that because when the "loping" starts it reminds me of a friend's car that had a racing cam. Its idle sounded similar. I still have the stock tensioner. Any chance that could be involved? |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by oldNslow on 01/25/16 at 10:48:54 Have you definitely ruled out the OEM petcock as the source the problem, as Dave suggested ? If not I'd go there first. The cam chain tensioner ( it's actually the adjuster that is a problem on these bike) is the least likely of the things mentioned to be causing your problem. Least as in pretty close to zero chance that it's got anything to do with it. |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by Kris01 on 01/25/16 at 11:50:50 Are you saying the engine lopes as in runs fine one second, stumbles the next, rinse, repeat? Sounds like a carb issue to me. |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by Steddy58 on 01/25/16 at 17:00:15 I had a problem similar to this where it would run ok then start missing for a while then give up, after cooling down for a few hours it would start up again and do the same thing and it was the pickup coil which after heating up started misbehaving - I'm not saying this is your problem and there are a few easier things to check out first (fuel as in petcock,carb etc ) just keep it in mind if you run out of ideas. |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by 4putt on 02/20/16 at 08:51:13 Thx for all the suggestions. Just to update..... Have taken the petcock out of play, I believe. Haven't run out 2 tank fulls of gas though. I feel much like a fool riding around on a bike with engine issues. I run the petcock on Prime and plug the vacuum line to the carb. Then added another line to the carb and plugged it. Was able to find a pick up coil for cheap and eliminated that. The float valve arrived and replaced it. That actually gave me some encouragement. It took a lot longer to act up, but did. I know I'm running rich. No matter how cold it is. It fires right up without choking. That tells me rich at idle. Plus the plug (which I also replaced) shows rich . My main jet is 150. The pilot jet is a 55. Stock spacers. I'd like to try something less for the pilot. I found out the stock one (which has vanished after two housing moves) was 52.5. I'd like to try going smaller than 55. Would also like a source for jets besides my dealer. Any help there would be appreciated. The weather is incredible here for February. I'm looking forward to tasting bugs. Thx |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by verslagen1 on 02/20/16 at 10:07:06 595D44484747290 wrote:
removing a ring will make it richer. add rings to lean it out. |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by 4putt on 02/21/16 at 08:55:19 Thx for that Verslagen. I thought removing one would make more flow. But as you pointed out. It's opposite of my thinking. Good thing is. I did find more of those discs searching for the old jets. Any help on finding a jet source? |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by justin_o_guy2 on 02/21/16 at 09:25:13 May remove another ring from my Supertrapp. I'm thinking I might add a couple, open it up, breathing better. I hope you got the High Temperature Anti Sieze. Mine became impossible to mess with. |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by 4putt on 03/04/16 at 05:11:52 Update. Does appear to have been the carb. I was able to get another stock pilot jet. Ran it yesterday for over 10 mins on the stand and no engine miss. Will try to find time to put the wheels on the ground today and ride around. If this is it, I'm guessing the richness at idle eventually made for poor plug function. Hitting the throttle then burned it off. ???? Haven't ventured to adding any discs to the Supertrapp yet. I like to do one thing at a time. Was able to loosen all the screws though and did get some anti seize to add anyway. All looking good now. Thx for all the suggestions. |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by Dave on 03/04/16 at 05:42:58 4F4B525E51513F0 wrote:
I hate to sound like a broke record - but this time of year a lot of folks seem to be starting their bikes up and running them - without riding them. The bike makes very little oil pressure at idle speeds.....especially when the bike is cold and the idle speed is lower than when the bike is warmed up. Also the cam doesn't seem to get enough oil to the exhaust side cam lobe or rocker - which is uphill when the engine is on the side stand. It is not recommended that you start your bike and let it idle on the side stand....you are potentially doing more harm than good. If you can't ride the bike in the winter, drain the fuel from the carb, and put the battery on a tender once a month, and wait for spring to come when you can go for a ride. Here is a link to a discussion...this bike only had 3,800 miles on it and the exhaust lobe on the cam and rocker were badly worn form idling on the side stand. http://suzukisavage.com/cgi-bin/YaBB.pl?num=1447331708 |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by 4putt on 03/04/16 at 10:28:12 Thx for the warning Dave. I do have it on a level bike stand though, not the side stand. |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by oldskoolsoldier on 03/06/16 at 22:32:00 I've been having the same issues. My bike will start up cold just fine. I can only run it about a mile before it starts dying without gas. About another half mile later and I can't get it started again. I just replaced the petcock because it had been leaking gas. I thought that would solve the problem, but it's still acting up. Where do you think I should start looking for an answer? I really don't want to take the carbs apart, but it looks like that may be what I need to do. Any suggestions? |
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Title: Re: Engine trouble after warm up Post by KennyG on 03/06/16 at 23:00:48 Old Skool, Check that the gas cap is venting properly. Kenny G |
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